necrosis wrote on Jan 19, 2012, 22:37:
FFXI runs without Steam and it is fully intentional. Steam is nothing more than a downloader for that game... and not even a full one. After downloading the game with Steam (in less than a hour) you need another 6-8 hours of updates (through the FFXI updater).

You're totally right, I forgot to make an exception for MMOs because I have Aion, APB, and Global Agenda through Steam and I just used the launcher most of the time I think. But I still think what I wrote is true of most games on Steam.

Sepharo wrote on Jan 17, 2012, 19:45:

Dev wrote on Jan 17, 2012, 01:54:

Jerykk wrote on Jan 17, 2012, 01:32:
I don't think there are any intentional cases of Steam games running without Steam.

There are. Someone made an argument in a blues thread about being able to do it with most games on steam, so I decided to test it out. I tested about 50 of my collection of games and only found a couple that would work properly. So the guy's argument was false about "most." Many of them crapped out with errors when trying to do so, a couple would let you play to some degree after the errors, and a couple would let you play normally without steam. I don't recall exactly, but I have the impression they were more indie type games. Which is why I think its because they didn't bother to integrate the steam authorization system into the exe. I'm not going to go back and test it again though.

It's hard to prove intention but I'd have to agree with Jerykk here. Any Steam game that runs without Steam is likely a happy accident not an intentional effort to work without Steam. But that goes both ways too, those same games likely didn't have any work done on them to force them to run with Steam either.

FFXI runs without Steam and it is fully intentional. Steam is nothing more than a downloader for that game... and not even a full one. After downloading the game with Steam (in less than a hour) you need another 6-8 hours of updates (through the FFXI updater).

Dev wrote on Jan 17, 2012, 01:54:

Jerykk wrote on Jan 17, 2012, 01:32:
I don't think there are any intentional cases of Steam games running without Steam.

There are. Someone made an argument in a blues thread about being able to do it with most games on steam, so I decided to test it out. I tested about 50 of my collection of games and only found a couple that would work properly. So the guy's argument was false about "most." Many of them crapped out with errors when trying to do so, a couple would let you play to some degree after the errors, and a couple would let you play normally without steam. I don't recall exactly, but I have the impression they were more indie type games. Which is why I think its because they didn't bother to integrate the steam authorization system into the exe. I'm not going to go back and test it again though.

It's hard to prove intention but I'd have to agree with Jerykk here. Any Steam game that runs without Steam is likely a happy accident not an intentional effort to work without Steam. But that goes both ways too, those same games likely didn't have any work done on them to force them to run with Steam either.

on wikipedia about EA Orgin -- "Sharing of personal information." This section gives me the willies.

I truly have zero interest in installing this game client app.

Dev wrote on Jan 16, 2012, 14:29:

CJ_Parker wrote on Jan 16, 2012, 13:57:
Cute. Another one who believes they even give a fuck about the PC sales...

Oh you mean that tiny little category in their financials that tends to equal or beat any other major platform in their breakdown?

Please don't bring facts into this. It complicates things.

Jerykk wrote on Jan 17, 2012, 01:32:
I don't think there are any intentional cases of Steam games running without Steam.

There are. Someone made an argument in a blues thread about being able to do it with most games on steam, so I decided to test it out. I tested about 50 of my collection of games and only found a couple that would work properly. So the guy's argument was false about "most." Many of them crapped out with errors when trying to do so, a couple would let you play to some degree after the errors, and a couple would let you play normally without steam. I don't recall exactly, but I have the impression they were more indie type games. Which is why I think its because they didn't bother to integrate the steam authorization system into the exe. I'm not going to go back and test it again though.

This comment was edited on Jan 17, 2012, 03:28.

This is the case for some steam games too. You can launch them without steam launched first. It just depends on how much integration they have with steam, if they bothered to integrate steam's ticket authentication system, or are using it purely as a distribution platform.

The cases of games running without Steam tend to be bugs. Skyrim, for example, ran without Steam initially but that was fixed in a patch. Portal 2 can be run without Steam, but you have to launch it via a .map file directly. I don't think there are any intentional cases of Steam games running without Steam.

As for Origin, it's true that it doesn't its own proprietary DRM scheme, so games use the same DRM that retail copies use. On the other hand, some people prefer this, as it allows more flexibility. You can install the game wherever you want and don't have to run a third-party client while running the game.

I still prefer Steam due to the numerous benefits it offers but I do wish it were more flexible in how you install and run your games.

Jerykk wrote on Jan 16, 2012, 23:36:

Meh. I'm not installing Origin. At least not until it's at least as bug-free and unobtrusive as Steam, and right now it's not even in the same hemisphere.

Actually, for non-EA games, Origin is less obtrusive than Steam. After installing a game, you literally never have to launch Origin again.

This is the case for some steam games too. You can launch them without steam launched first. It just depends on how much integration they have with steam, if they bothered to integrate steam's ticket authentication system, or are using it purely as a distribution platform.

While what you are saying is good for the consumer, its more of an example of EA's lack of client support, my guess is that they are preventing other companies from integrating closely with origin. If I'm an game company and I see Origin only being capable of distribution, and I see steam that can handle authentication so I don't see a need for a separate layer of DRM, I'm more likely to go for steam.

Meh. I'm not installing Origin. At least not until it's at least as bug-free and unobtrusive as Steam, and right now it's not even in the same hemisphere.

Actually, for non-EA games, Origin is less obtrusive than Steam. After installing a game, you literally never have to launch Origin again.

*********************************************************************

Hello Dumbass Who Bought From Origin,

Thank you for contacting Electronic Arts.

I appreciate your interest in Battlefield 3. But you already have another ticket open with similar issue and that has been escalated to higher level. So they will contact you via email regarding this issue.

I know nothing can really measure up to what you feel, but please allow me to offer you this Discount Code (EA-SUCKS-ASS) that should allow you a 15% Discount on Origin. The code can be redeemed at: http://store.origin.com and is valid for 30 days on released games (except Pre-orders and new releases).

In case of any further questions, please feel free to get in touch with us anytime. You can also visit our website and review our extensive self-help knowledgebase (http://help.ea.com).


Regards,
Guy From India,
Electronic Arts - World Wide Customer Experience


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Hello Guy From India,

I do realize I have another case for this issue. The reason I am contacting you is because nobody seems to care. I haven't heard anything in the week since the first ticket was created. I do appreciate your quicker response. Is it possible for you to have somebody involved with the other case contact me? It seems I'm still getting nowhere fast. Since my character was wiped I really don't care to play BF3 until this is resolved and I fear it will not be.

Also I don't want to sound ungrateful but I wouldn't care to use the 15% off code. If this issue is not resolved fairly I will never purchase another product from EA's Origin service. If EA intends to compete with the other digital distribution services it needs to put the proper customer service into place to care for customers who have purchased their products. At this time I'm not seeing that to be the case.

Thank you in advance for escalating this issue to somebody who can restore my character's stats.

Sincerely,
The Idiot Who Bought From Origin

Meh. I'm not installing Origin. At least not until it's at least as bug-free and unobtrusive as Steam, and right now it's not even in the same hemisphere. It's tempting just for BF3, but really not worth it. There's plenty of other games out there and I don't have time for many of them anyway. As for ME3, I'll watch the cutscenes on Youtube and spare myself all the planet-scanning and repetitive chest-high-wall fights. That shit is just tedious.

CJ_Parker wrote on Jan 16, 2012, 13:57:

Cute. Another one who believes they even give a fuck about the PC sales...

Naive to think EA doesn't have sales in mind with every effort they make. Why do you think we're seeing these retarded exclusive games platforms (Origin) and draconian DRM schemes on PCs? Here's a clue: it's not because they don't care about sales. They're just making all the missteps that have failed media corporations time and time again in the past, thinking they will get a different result.. like lunatics. ^_^

CJ_Parker wrote on Jan 16, 2012, 13:57:
Cute. Another one who believes they even give a fuck about the PC sales...

Oh you mean that tiny little category in their financials that tends to equal or beat any other major platform in their breakdown?

This comment was edited on Jan 16, 2012, 16:00.

Cute. Another one who believes they even give a fuck about the PC sales...

If that was the case, they wouldn't be fucking with this origin crap.

netnerd85 wrote on Jan 16, 2012, 01:04:
Steam could suddenly start charging a fee for the Steam Client and the way they are heading, they probably will. Gabe LOVES mico-transactions, the SINGLE most EVIL thing EVER.

Yes, because Gabe just can't wait to fuck with the goose that lays golden eggs...

Creston

descender wrote on Jan 16, 2012, 09:34:
Oh well, I wasn't even looking forward to this game because of how overrated and disappointing ME2 was... so I guess now I don't even have to accidentally buy it when it's on a steam sale.

Suck for you EA.

Cute. Another one who believes they even give a fuck about the PC sales...

Btw, I love how Priestly tries to imply that Steam is somehow hampering the customer with this : "Steam has adopted a set of restrictive terms of service which limit how developers interact with customers to deliver patches and other downloadable content."

Rather than make sure that if you buy a game on Steam, you can also get the DLC from there, so you don't wind up with the EA downloader clusterfuck that was present in DA:O and ME2.

Creston

best possible experience = EA control

Dear game publishers:

One intrusive game client is bad enough and that already pushes my buttons.

I definitely dont want 2 game clients.

InBlack wrote on Jan 16, 2012, 06:32:
I have stopped caring about Bioware games ever since the Dragon Age 2 fiasco. To each his own, but Im skipping their games unless they somehow manage to repeat the Dragon Age 1 success. (From a pure gameplay/fun factor perspective)

Same here. Dragon age 2 killed every ounce of respect I had for them. That game was so cut-and-paste, so empty, so soulless and simplified, consolized and mainstreamed that if that is their idea of the future, I want no part of it.