And no, I am no DRM advocate, I hate DRM, but this DRM works and has no detrimental effects on legit customers. Its much better than having to insert a disc all the time, having some bloatware like Steam that drives other publishers to make similar, even worse stuff like that, or always on Internet DRM, or account forced bullshit.

Dades wrote on Nov 11, 2011, 00:20:

Spaced wrote on Nov 11, 2011, 00:03:
I don't have to prove myself or my expertise to you and I won't be baited into it either. You've chosen what you want to do with the facts and have decided to go down a path of speculation and assumption. It would be pointless to try and continue proving something to you that has already been proven. You're riding on speculation and arguing against problems that don't exist and haven't happened. I'm happy to sit back and watch you argue with yourself over unrelated issues and speculation? lol

Indeed, how dare I bait you to support your opinion with something other than vague assurances and a forum post. I don't need to speculate on anything because I'm not the one dealing in absolute certainty. When you make absolute assertions it's not to everyone else to prove you wrong. I'm more than happy to entertain many possibilities but there is so much precedent for DRM systems affecting legitimate owners that it cannot be ignored just to help you save face. They can't add a version increment and remove all of that risk. Obviously to you it's acceptable but to the rest of us who don't hate other human beings for downloading software it's not, particularly when many of us are customers ourselves.

Spaced wrote on Nov 11, 2011, 00:03:
I don't have to prove myself or my expertise to you and I won't be baited into it either. You've chosen what you want to do with the facts and have decided to go down a path of speculation and assumption. It would be pointless to try and continue proving something to you that has already been proven. You're riding on speculation and arguing against problems that don't exist and haven't happened. I'm happy to sit back and watch you argue with yourself over unrelated issues and speculation? lol

You have put no thought into the potential problems that can arise through normal usage due to hardware and software platforms changing either.

DRM should never have the potential to impact the gaming experience.

Or, you can read this thread on blues where a user had experience with their games DRM giving them problems as legit customers. Again, just because YOUR experience is different, it doesn't invalidate all others.

Again, with others and 'the past'. Have you reviewed their forum beyond the one thread? Notice anything?

As 'offended' by it as you seem to be, it sure seems to be an effective approach. It addresses the problem directly and offers several solutions for legal users that I've already stated.

This approach may be one of the best methods to come about on the PC in a very long time (implemented the way it has been in this game). And as a gamer, I'm happy to use it since it means no problems or hoops to jump through for me as a legal user.

Dades wrote on Nov 10, 2011, 13:01:
That's not accurate, your assumption is based on a single forum thread and a press bite from the developers. Bohemia knows its Fade system has affected its customers in the past

There are many examples of similar systems exhibiting similar problems or causing issues down the road when new versions of things like operating systems and platforms change. That's why people bring it up, this isn't high school debate club. It's a legit concern based on experience. I have no idea why are so ardently defending this, there are far better ways to deal with piracy and getting a little gotcha on the pirates is just an immature way that doesn't really address the problem nor offer a solution.

It's an updated version of the same system they have been using for a long time now.

Spaced wrote on Nov 10, 2011, 12:26:
Lol again. I don't have to assume anything. I'm basing my comments on exactly -what happened- to that pirate and available reports on their forum from legal users (who never encountered the problem). There's no assuming involved. If that's extreme to you, so be it.

And again, you keep bringing up other DRM systems instead of addressing -the results- of this one. lol

Dades wrote on Nov 10, 2011, 07:16:
You are just assuming it does everything the developer says it does and that anyone who says otherwise is a filthy pirate. The truth rarely lies at the edges of extremes. You want to believe it works and never affects anyone because you've typed 8000 words arguing about it and can't admit that systems like this can and have in the past affected people who paid for their games.

Spaced wrote on Nov 9, 2011, 23:11:
Yup, you're not paying attention either, lol. Comments like this are actually pretty amusing. You bring up -other- DRM systems again, just like the others, refusing to even address the topic of -this- DRM system, boast about how they are all cracked, then proclaim DRM as worthless. Re-read the news blurb and the comments if you must.

Muscular Beaver wrote on Nov 10, 2011, 03:08:

Dev wrote on Nov 9, 2011, 19:42:

bfg9000 wrote on Nov 9, 2011, 19:22:
I have been playing Arma2 since release and have never had problems with FADE. You don't even need to have the CD inserted.
A DRM that has no negative effect on legit users? In this day and age?
Nothing short of a miracle.

Just because YOU didn't have problems, doesn't mean every other user has the same experience. I see that a lot in online forums, people assuming their life experience must be the same as everyone elses, and if something did or didn't happen to them it must be the same for all.

There are a lot of problems with Bohemia games, but this is not one of them. After I saw all those forum posts with people having this "problem", and when they got told that they are most likely using a pirated copy, they never answered again, nor ever posted again.
If someone really had this problem with a legit copy, they would have insisted that it is a bug, but no one ever did.
Also I have been playing Bohemia games with that copy protection for over 10 years now on about 20 different systems, and never have come across a bug that could even remotely resemble their copy protection - and Ive seen a LOT of bugs.

Dev wrote on Nov 9, 2011, 19:42:

bfg9000 wrote on Nov 9, 2011, 19:22:
I have been playing Arma2 since release and have never had problems with FADE. You don't even need to have the CD inserted.
A DRM that has no negative effect on legit users? In this day and age?
Nothing short of a miracle.

Just because YOU didn't have problems, doesn't mean every other user has the same experience. I see that a lot in online forums, people assuming their life experience must be the same as everyone elses, and if something did or didn't happen to them it must be the same for all.

Prez wrote on Nov 9, 2011, 23:54:
I think the point is it will be cracked eventually.

But as right as the devs are for wanting to be paid for their work, schemes like this run the risk of doing more harm than good in the long run.

Dades wrote on Nov 9, 2011, 19:55:
Maybe you aren't paying attention because pretty much every DRM system ever conceived has been cracked, even the vaunted Ubisoft DRM with thousands of online checks and database code inserts. Once the game has shipped you can't go back and insert better DRM. This DRM doesn't work because it's not preventing piracy and only causes confusion, its that simple. DRM inconveniences people who spend money more than people who don't and the rest of the time it is mostly a worthless effort. The best DRM is a great multiplayer side, spend the time and money on that which will also make a better game for your customers.