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id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms
 [Oct 07, 2011, 9:33 pm ET] – Share – Viewing Comments

Kotaku asks the musical question "Why Was The PC Launch of Rage Such A "Cluster!@#$"?," getting answers from id on the topic, who express frustration with problems that were largely caused by driver issues. Along the way they also address how the game being designed for consoles holds back the PC edition. "You can choose to design a game around the specs of a high-end PC and make console versions that fail to hit the design point, or design around the specs of the consoles and have a high-end PC provide incremental quality improvements," John Carmack tells them. "We chose the latter." He also bluntly addresses why this makes sense for id (emphasis Kotaku's):
"We do not see the PC as the leading platform for games," Carmack added. "That statement will enrage some people, but it is hard to characterize it otherwise; both console versions will have larger audiences than the PC version. A high end PC is nearly 10 times as powerful as a console, and we could unquestionably provide a better experience if we chose that as our design point and we were able to expend the same amount of resources on it. Nowadays most of the quality of a game comes from the development effort put into it, not the technology it runs on. A game built with a tenth the resources on a platform 10 times as powerful would be an inferior product in almost all cases."
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61. Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Oct 8, 2011, 00:40 CannibalBob
 
Well it's nice and all for id to come out and say this stuff (ok, it's not all that nice at all), but the real question here is:
Will they fix the game? Should we expect patches, and to what extent? Are they still dedicated to the PC, or should we expect the same story for Doom 4?

All I've seen so far is them point fingers at the video drivers - How come other games have gotten along fine with those drivers? Did they never test the game on the PC? Why did they never talk with the driver makers (nvidia, ati) and get this stuff sorted out before hand? Did they give nvidia/ati a preview copy of Rage and work with them?

It's a pity; if Rage had a smooth launch, the video card manufacturers would've made more money (people buying new cards due to good game reviews), and obviously id would make more in sales. Simply saying "oh the PC isn't leading anymore" and then not trying anymore definitely guarantees the PC will stay in that state.

Why is Carmack talking about audiences anyway? Why does he care? He's a game designer; he enjoys making great games. It's obviously the upper management who gave him orders for the design direction, and he has to follow that. I'm not blaming Carmack for anything - he's just doing as ordered. The issue is obviously a lack of testing; it was the upper management who decided "yeah, this game was tested enough and is ready for release. No, we don't need to delay the PC release and put more resources into fixing it." 		 
"If you like it, they will stop making it" - Herblock's Law
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    Date Subject Author
  1. Oct 7, 21:39 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms  Wallshadows 
  3. Oct 7, 21:42  Re: id On RAGE Shataan
  4. Oct 7, 21:45   Re: id On RAGE Mashiki Amiketo
  2. Oct 7, 21:40 Sucks  Quboid 
  5. Oct 7, 21:46  Re: Sucks PropheT
  6. Oct 7, 21:51 Re: id On RAGE Dades
  7. Oct 7, 21:59 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Pankin
  8. Oct 7, 22:01  Re: id On RAGE Draugr
  10. Oct 7, 22:04  Re: id On RAGE zincthallinide
  9. Oct 7, 22:02 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Creston
  11. Oct 7, 22:07 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms qsto
  12. Oct 7, 22:09  Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  15. Oct 7, 22:13   Re: id On RAGE Fibrocyte
  151. Oct 8, 14:10    Re: id On RAGE shponglefan
  14. Oct 7, 22:12  Re: id On RAGE Creston
  17. Oct 7, 22:22   Re: id On RAGE qsto
  18. Oct 7, 22:30    Re: id On RAGE TurdFergasun
  13. Oct 7, 22:11 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Creston
  16. Oct 7, 22:16  Re: id On RAGE sxotty
  19. Oct 7, 22:32   Re: id On RAGE Overon
  103. Oct 8, 06:45    Re: id On RAGE Eldaron Imotholin
  120. Oct 8, 11:16     Re: id On RAGE Fibrocyte
  250. Oct 12, 21:34    Re: id On RAGE  Beamer 
  24. Oct 7, 22:44   Re: id On RAGE Creston
  25. Oct 7, 22:46    Re: id On RAGE Teddy
  26. Oct 7, 23:00     Re: id On RAGE Elricsi
  35. Oct 7, 23:31      Re: id On RAGE Teddy
  37. Oct 7, 23:32       Re: id On RAGE  PHJF 
  47. Oct 7, 23:57        Re: id On RAGE ^Drag0n^
  39. Oct 7, 23:33    Re: id On RAGE Jerykk
  113. Oct 8, 09:27    Re: id On RAGE WaltC
  130. Oct 8, 12:09     Re: id On RAGE Creston
  205. Oct 8, 23:14    Re: id On RAGE sxotty
  20. Oct 7, 22:34 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Retired
  23. Oct 7, 22:43  Re: id On RAGE  Capella 
  48. Oct 7, 23:58  Re: id On RAGE Rendris
  21. Oct 7, 22:38 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms mlw
  22. Oct 7, 22:43 Unforgettable vs Instantly forgettable JohnBirshire
  27. Oct 7, 23:08 Re: id On RAGE DangerDog
  28. Oct 7, 23:11 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Parallax Abstraction
  31. Oct 7, 23:18  Re: id On RAGE swaaye
  32. Oct 7, 23:26   Re: id On RAGE Creston
  29. Oct 7, 23:15 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms cronik
  33. Oct 7, 23:26  Re: id On RAGE DNForever
  38. Oct 7, 23:33   Re: id On RAGE  Mr. Tact 
  40. Oct 7, 23:34    Re: id On RAGE rist3903
  72. Oct 8, 01:19     Re: id On RAGE Elf Shot The Food
  42. Oct 7, 23:41    Re: id On RAGE DNForever
  44. Oct 7, 23:50     Re: id On RAGE gilly775
  97. Oct 8, 05:54   Re: id On RAGE Fibrocyte
  101. Oct 8, 06:12    Re: id On RAGE Luke
  125. Oct 8, 11:55    Re: id On RAGE DNForever
  54. Oct 8, 00:18  Re: id On RAGE  The Pyro 
  30. Oct 7, 23:16 Re: id On RAGE swaaye
  34. Oct 7, 23:28 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Esoteric
  36. Oct 7, 23:32 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms ^Drag0n^
  51. Oct 8, 00:10  Re: id On RAGE Creston
  52. Oct 8, 00:14   Re: id On RAGE ^Drag0n^
  56. Oct 8, 00:27    Re: id On RAGE Creston
  53. Oct 8, 00:16   Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  55. Oct 8, 00:25    Re: id On RAGE Creston
  41. Oct 7, 23:38 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Dr. D. Schreber
  43. Oct 7, 23:46  Re: id On RAGE Jerykk
  45. Oct 7, 23:52 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Doombringer
  46. Oct 7, 23:55 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms  theyarecomingforyou 
  49. Oct 8, 00:04 Re: id On RAGE Turd Ferguson
  50. Oct 8, 00:08 Re: id On RAGE Umbragen
  57. Oct 8, 00:29 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms ThatMonkey
  60. Oct 8, 00:38  Re: id On RAGE ^Drag0n^
  58. Oct 8, 00:34 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms mlw
  65. Oct 8, 00:59  Re: id On RAGE EddieTheHack
  67. Oct 8, 01:03   Re: id On RAGE KilrathiAce
  74. Oct 8, 01:29    Re: id On RAGE ^Drag0n^
  68. Oct 8, 01:05   Re: id On RAGE  PHJF 
  73. Oct 8, 01:27    Re: id On RAGE ^Drag0n^
  81. Oct 8, 02:43   Re: id On RAGE Jerykk
  59. Oct 8, 00:37 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms crypto
>> 61. Oct 8, 00:40 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms CannibalBob
  62. Oct 8, 00:42  Re: id On RAGE Jerykk
  63. Oct 8, 00:49 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms HorrorScope
  64. Oct 8, 00:54 Re: id On RAGE KilrathiAce
  66. Oct 8, 01:02 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms StingingVelvet
  69. Oct 8, 01:09 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Jim
  70. Oct 8, 01:10  Re: id On RAGE RamataKahn
  71. Oct 8, 01:18 Re: id On RAGE AnointedSword
  75. Oct 8, 01:57  Re: id On RAGE grudgebearer
  77. Oct 8, 02:04   Re: id On RAGE vrok
  88. Oct 8, 03:53    Re: id On RAGE SectorEffector
  76. Oct 8, 02:00 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms shiho
  78. Oct 8, 02:08  Re: id On RAGE Pineapple Ferguson
  79. Oct 8, 02:19   Re: id On RAGE StingingVelvet
  93. Oct 8, 05:02    Re: id On RAGE eRe4s3r
  99. Oct 8, 06:00     Re: id On RAGE Fibrocyte
  100. Oct 8, 06:09      Re: id On RAGE  Prez 
  102. Oct 8, 06:12      Re: id On RAGE yuastnav
  104. Oct 8, 07:02      Re: id On RAGE eRe4s3r
  128. Oct 8, 12:06       Re: id On RAGE Creston
  220. Oct 9, 04:26        Re: id On RAGE eRe4s3r
  80. Oct 8, 02:36 Re: id On RAGE goatman
  82. Oct 8, 02:45 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms  Ant 
  85. Oct 8, 03:00  Re: id On RAGE Mashiki Amiketo
  83. Oct 8, 02:57 Re: id On RAGE Acleacius
  84. Oct 8, 02:59 Re: id On RAGE  El Pit 
  86. Oct 8, 03:27 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Beaner
  87. Oct 8, 03:27 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Bhruic
  89. Oct 8, 04:03  Re: id On RAGE Razumen
  90. Oct 8, 04:28   Re: id On RAGE Jackplug
  98. Oct 8, 05:57    Re: id On RAGE .Drifter
  92. Oct 8, 04:40   Re: id On RAGE Bhruic
  112. Oct 8, 09:10    Re: id On RAGE Kevin Lowe
  116. Oct 8, 09:42     Re: id On RAGE Lesaonar
  121. Oct 8, 11:17     Re: id On RAGE WaltC
  127. Oct 8, 12:05      Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  91. Oct 8, 04:36 Re: id On RAGE Illumin
  94. Oct 8, 05:13 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms ibm
  95. Oct 8, 05:22 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Tinmann840
  96. Oct 8, 05:54  Re: id On RAGE  Prez 
  105. Oct 8, 07:10 Re: id On RAGE nofb
  106. Oct 8, 08:00  Re: id On RAGE Viranth
  107. Oct 8, 08:11 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms wonkawonka
  108. Oct 8, 08:17  Re: id On RAGE  Prez 
  109. Oct 8, 08:34 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Retired
  110. Oct 8, 08:46  Re: id On RAGE Bhruic
  111. Oct 8, 09:07   Re: id On RAGE Spektr
  114. Oct 8, 09:34 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms netnerd85
  115. Oct 8, 09:37  well... Shataan
  117. Oct 8, 10:24 Re: id On RAGE ^Drag0n^
  118. Oct 8, 10:29  Re: id On RAGE Zuckuss
  119. Oct 8, 11:00   Re: id On RAGE WaltC
  122. Oct 8, 11:35    Re: id On RAGE Matshock
  123. Oct 8, 11:36    Re: id On RAGE {PH}88fingers
  124. Oct 8, 11:50     Re: id On RAGE Dmitri_M
  126. Oct 8, 11:56     Re: id On RAGE DedEye
  129. Oct 8, 12:06      Re: id On RAGE DNForever
  132. Oct 8, 12:17     Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  133. Oct 8, 12:21     Re: id On RAGE Creston
  136. Oct 8, 12:38     Re: id On RAGE Bhruic
  140. Oct 8, 12:51      Re: id On RAGE {PH}88fingers
  141. Oct 8, 12:55       Re: id On RAGE netnerd85
  147. Oct 8, 13:22        Re: id On RAGE MoreLuckThanSkill
  148. Oct 8, 13:27         Re: id On RAGE netnerd85
  152. Oct 8, 14:34          Re: id On RAGE Ray Marden
  162. Oct 8, 16:08           Re: id On RAGE Creston
  170. Oct 8, 17:37            Re: id On RAGE Ray Marden
  143. Oct 8, 12:58       Re: id On RAGE Bhruic
  131. Oct 8, 12:16  Re: id On RAGE Creston
  134. Oct 8, 12:25   Re: id On RAGE Bumpy
  135. Oct 8, 12:33    Re: id On RAGE Creston
  137. Oct 8, 12:39     Re: id On RAGE DNForever
  138. Oct 8, 12:49      Re: id On RAGE {PH}88fingers
  139. Oct 8, 12:50      Re: id On RAGE  PHJF 
  142. Oct 8, 12:56      Re: id On RAGE Animals for Crackers
  153. Oct 8, 14:36      Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  165. Oct 8, 17:03       Re: id On RAGE DNForever
  166. Oct 8, 17:07        Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  167. Oct 8, 17:18         Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  172. Oct 8, 17:45          Re: id On RAGE Dmitri_M
  173. Oct 8, 18:02           Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  174. Oct 8, 18:12            Re: id On RAGE Dmitri_M
  183. Oct 8, 20:28             Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  188. Oct 8, 21:10              Re: id On RAGE siapnar
  196. Oct 8, 22:26               Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  201. Oct 8, 22:40                Re: id On RAGE siapnar
  175. Oct 8, 18:38          Re: id On RAGE Creston
  184. Oct 8, 20:31           Re: id On RAGE DNForever
  185. Oct 8, 20:38           Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  186. Oct 8, 21:02            Re: id On RAGE Creston
  187. Oct 8, 21:03           Re: id On RAGE siapnar
  189. Oct 8, 21:11            Re: id On RAGE Creston
  190. Oct 8, 21:15             Re: id On RAGE siapnar
  192. Oct 8, 21:48             Re: id On RAGE  theyarecomingforyou 
  194. Oct 8, 22:20              Re: id On RAGE Creston
  198. Oct 8, 22:34               Re: id On RAGE Ray Marden
  209. Oct 8, 23:36                Re: id On RAGE  theyarecomingforyou 
  211. Oct 9, 00:03                 Re: id On RAGE Creston
  212. Oct 9, 00:18                  Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  215. Oct 9, 01:09                   Re: id On RAGE Creston
  216. Oct 9, 01:24                    Re: id On RAGE ^Drag0n^
  217. Oct 9, 01:49                     Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  218. Oct 9, 01:53                    Re: id On RAGE zirik
  224. Oct 9, 05:07                     Re: id On RAGE  theyarecomingforyou 
  226. Oct 9, 06:05                      Re: id On RAGE yuastnav
  193. Oct 8, 22:15             Re: id On RAGE Ray Marden
  195. Oct 8, 22:23              Re: id On RAGE Creston
  202. Oct 8, 22:41               Re: id On RAGE Ray Marden
  204. Oct 8, 23:11                Re: id On RAGE Creston
  208. Oct 8, 23:34                 Re: id On RAGE Ray Marden
  210. Oct 9, 00:02                  Re: id On RAGE Creston
  197. Oct 8, 22:33              Re: id On RAGE  theyarecomingforyou 
  168. Oct 8, 17:19         Re: id On RAGE DNForever
  144. Oct 8, 13:06 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Johnny L
  146. Oct 8, 13:19  Re: id On RAGE Bhruic
  149. Oct 8, 13:31   Re: id On RAGE  Beamer 
  154. Oct 8, 14:51    Re: id On RAGE Johnny L
  161. Oct 8, 16:04    Re: id On RAGE Creston
  169. Oct 8, 17:35     Re: id On RAGE Ray Marden
  171. Oct 8, 17:41      . Ray Marden
  156. Oct 8, 14:59   Re: id On RAGE Johnny L
  157. Oct 8, 15:27    Re: id On RAGE Bhruic
  158. Oct 8, 15:35     Re: id On RAGE Johnny L
  213. Oct 9, 00:29      Re: id On RAGE Bhruic
  221. Oct 9, 04:27       Re: id On RAGE Johnny L
  222. Oct 9, 04:36       Re: id On RAGE Johnny L
  223. Oct 9, 04:54       Re: id On RAGE Johnny L
  159. Oct 8, 15:40     Re: id On RAGE Johnny L
  178. Oct 8, 19:54    Re: id On RAGE  Beamer 
  145. Oct 8, 13:14 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Johnny L
  150. Oct 8, 13:43 Re: id On RAGE Fletch
  155. Oct 8, 14:53  Re: id On RAGE Animals for Crackers
  160. Oct 8, 15:58 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms KilrathiAce
  163. Oct 8, 16:48 Re: id On RAGE AnointedSword
  176. Oct 8, 18:43  Re: id On RAGE saluk
  164. Oct 8, 16:59 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Brutal
  177. Oct 8, 18:52 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Paketep
  180. Oct 8, 19:58  Re: id On RAGE CJ_Parker
  181. Oct 8, 20:19   Re: id On RAGE Slashman
  179. Oct 8, 19:57 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Omni
  182. Oct 8, 20:21 Re: id On RAGE  Mr. Tact 
  191. Oct 8, 21:34 Re: id On RAGE Creston
  207. Oct 8, 23:21  Re: id On RAGE Retired
  199. Oct 8, 22:36 Re: id On RAGE [VG]Reagle
  200. Oct 8, 22:37 Re: id On RAGE Creston
  203. Oct 8, 22:43  Re: id On RAGE Krovven
  206. Oct 8, 23:20   Re: id On RAGE Retired
  228. Oct 9, 11:20  Re: id On RAGE  Beamer 
  229. Oct 9, 11:23   Re: id On RAGE  Beamer 
  230. Oct 9, 12:22    Re: id On RAGE yuastnav
  235. Oct 9, 13:48     Re: id On RAGE  Beamer 
  237. Oct 9, 15:00      Re: id On RAGE zirik
  236. Oct 9, 14:58   Re: id On RAGE zirik
  214. Oct 9, 00:32 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Dades
  219. Oct 9, 03:28 Re: id On RAGE Kastagir
  225. Oct 9, 05:46  Re: id On RAGE Jerykk
  227. Oct 9, 10:36   well..... Shataan
  231. Oct 9, 12:22 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms ^Drag0n^
  233. Oct 9, 13:00  Re: id On RAGE yuastnav
  234. Oct 9, 13:25   Re: id On RAGE ^Drag0n^
  232. Oct 9, 12:39 Re: id On RAGE Retired
  238. Oct 9, 19:21 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms  theyarecomingforyou 
  239. Oct 9, 23:26 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms ^Drag0n^
  240. Oct 10, 02:08  Re: id On RAGE Eldaron Imotholin
  243. Oct 10, 18:12   Re: id On RAGE ^Drag0n^
  241. Oct 10, 14:15 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms  theyarecomingforyou 
  244. Oct 10, 19:28  Re: id On RAGE Ray Marden
  245. Oct 10, 20:47   Re: id On RAGE Zuckuss
  242. Oct 10, 17:47 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms Eldaron Imotholin
  246. Oct 11, 03:22 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms ^Drag0n^
  247. Oct 12, 02:29  Re: id On RAGE Jackplug
  248. Oct 12, 19:31 Re: id On RAGE Vio
  249. Oct 12, 21:06 Re: id On RAGE "Cluster!@#$" and Lead Platforms  Mr. Tact 
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