On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking

A BioShock 2 article on Kotaku hears from BioShock 2 creative director Jordan Thomas about a couple of ways the gameplay in the underwater shooter sequel departs from the original game. One of the areas being changed is vita-chambers, which can be turned off in the sequel, and as Jordan explains, the vita-chamber exploits from the first BioShock are mitigated by the little sisters healing some of their big daddies' health while you are being reanimated. They also discuss how it will be impossible to backtrack to areas after they are completed, which Jordon confesses is more due to technical limitations than a design decision: "We came down to having to choose between supporting backtracking and much more interesting, readable features ...and decided to invest in things we thought people would actually notice. We also got some knock-on benefits like shorter loading times because of the way the memory was structured once backtracking was no longer an issue." He also explains how any unresolved little sister/big daddy conflicts will not be lost due to lack of backtracking, as they will be added to subsequent levels. Thanks nin.
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Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 14:23
16.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 14:23
Jan 13, 2010, 14:23
 
Verno wrote on Jan 13, 2010, 14:23:
I used to use a greasemonkey script to do that but it eventually broke and I've been too lazy to look at the code. Maybe I'll get around to that tonight.

Yeah, Camaro's script broke with either FF 3.0. or 3.5

Creston
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15.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 14:23
15.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 14:23
Jan 13, 2010, 14:23
 
I used to use a greasemonkey script to do that but it eventually broke and I've been too lazy to look at the code. Maybe I'll get around to that tonight.

On the other hand Darksiders is so fun that I will probably forget by 7.

This comment was edited on Jan 13, 2010, 14:23.
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14.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 14:17
14.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 14:17
Jan 13, 2010, 14:17
 
nin wrote on Jan 13, 2010, 14:15:
When I'm stressed at work, it helps to lash out at idiotic ramblings on Blues.

Yeah, that really helps the situation around here.

There's always a few dipshits who think that bitching at other posters, no matter what, somehow makes them really edgy.

Ah, for the joys of an ignore button.

Creston
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13.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 14:15
nin
13.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 14:15
Jan 13, 2010, 14:15
nin
 
When I'm stressed at work, it helps to lash out at idiotic ramblings on Blues.

Yeah, that really helps the situation around here.
12.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 14:13
12.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 14:13
Jan 13, 2010, 14:13
 
When I'm stressed at work, it helps to lash out at idiotic ramblings on Blues. There's sure never a short supply to be found here
11.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 14:02
11.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 14:02
Jan 13, 2010, 14:02
 
Jesus christ people, this has nothing to do with technical limitations of the hardware, otherwise Bioshock wouldn't have done it.

You're a very angry poster, you need a vacation sir
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10.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 13:51
10.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 13:51
Jan 13, 2010, 13:51
 
Maybe some day we can have a true sequel to SS2 instead of these dumbed down consolized mass market dog turds.
9.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 13:48
9.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 13:48
Jan 13, 2010, 13:48
 
Yes, in Bioshock it was possible to return to almost every previous level even from the very end of the game. A nice technical feature that could be used for bragging rights, but totally useless and inconsequential from an actual gameplay standpoint. Not to mention the fact that it was annoying to do so, since you'd get a 20-30+ second load between every level.

The fact that people are actually attacking 2K for the removal of this feature that their research showed people barely ever used, and that most people even on this site probably barely ever used, despite the fact that it's an incredibly complex feature to implement, which inherently takes away the quality of other features in the game, is absolutely mindboggling.
8.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 13:43
8.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 13:43
Jan 13, 2010, 13:43
 
Riker wrote on Jan 13, 2010, 13:38:
I'm not sure I understand what's being said here. By backtracking, do they mean within levels? I don't recall ever having a reason to backtrack in BioShock, so is this really an issue? In the Metroid games, backtracking is a big part of the experience, but if BioShock 2 isn't being designed that way, I don't know what the problem is.

No, they mean being able to return to levels you've already completed.

Creston
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7.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 13:38
7.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 13:38
Jan 13, 2010, 13:38
 
I'm not sure I understand what's being said here. By backtracking, do they mean within levels? I don't recall ever having a reason to backtrack in BioShock, so is this really an issue? In the Metroid games, backtracking is a big part of the experience, but if BioShock 2 isn't being designed that way, I don't know what the problem is.
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Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 13:35
6.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 13:35
Jan 13, 2010, 13:35
 
Jesus christ people, this has nothing to do with technical limitations of the hardware, otherwise Bioshock wouldn't have done it.

Some of you guys have no concept of the difficulty actually required in creating a game. Enabling backtracking requires a ridiculous amount of level design and technical work to implement, without much benefit.

"Nothing wrong with backtracking", you say? Bullshit. Backtracking, as 2K reasonably explains, was barely ever actually used by people playing the game, yet was immensely expensive to implement because of the level design, gameplay, scripting, and other considerations.


I'd much rather them focus on improving the game in other areas that actually affect things people actually do then spend all this time and effort implementing something that their own research shows people barely ever used.
5.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 13:16
5.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 13:16
Jan 13, 2010, 13:16
 
Overon wrote on Jan 13, 2010, 12:56:
Nothing wrong with backtracking. It lets you explore the area IF YOU SO CHOOSE. But once again, we can thank consoles and their limited RAM for their lowest common denominator standards that spill over to the PC version as well. But it's not a huge deal.

The console versions of Bioshock let you backtrack, didn't they? I think they're just too lazy to worry about the hassle of the save system (since you have to make everything persistent.)

I actually backtracked a lot, because I'd hoard all my ammo and other stuff from level to level. Plus, being able to backtrack makes the entire game FEEL like you're in an actual city, as opposed to just wandering around random levels.

Creston
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4.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 13:09
4.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 13:09
Jan 13, 2010, 13:09
 
I know I should be upset over the loss of feature but in the first game I did so little of it that it's really not a feature I will miss anyways. So here is my half-hearted anger: Blank Blank Blank
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Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 12:59
3.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 12:59
Jan 13, 2010, 12:59
 
Jordon confesses is more due to technical limitations than a design decision
It's almost as if he is NOT talking about the PC design. Seems we can certainly start blaming 2k for stupidity, now as before. It's like they can't learn or they unlearn everything.

Stupidity is something 2k seems to strive for, it's their goal and they seek out, sadly they never have to go very far to find it.
Scorpio Slasher: ... What about you boy, what do hate?
Marcus: ... Bullies. Tiny d*ck egotists who hurt people for no reason, make people lock their doors at night. People who make general existence worse, people like you.
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2.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 12:56
2.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 12:56
Jan 13, 2010, 12:56
 
Nothing wrong with backtracking. It lets you explore the area IF YOU SO CHOOSE. But once again, we can thank consoles and their limited RAM for their lowest common denominator standards that spill over to the PC version as well. But it's not a huge deal.
1.
 
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking
Jan 13, 2010, 12:46
1.
Re: On BioShock 2 Vita-Chambers and Backtracking Jan 13, 2010, 12:46
Jan 13, 2010, 12:46
 
The more I hear about this game, the less appealing it sounds.

Creston
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