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Morning Legal Briefs

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31. Re: Morning Legal Briefs Apr 17, 2019, 14:46 eRe4s3r
 
jdreyer wrote on Apr 16, 2019, 22:16:
Mr. Tact wrote on Apr 16, 2019, 09:22:
So, are you saying you want an EU which can't impose rules and regulations across the entire union? Wouldn't that pretty much defeat the purpose?

Listen, don't get me wrong. I understand exactly what you are saying. I even agree with you about the problems that exist. However, my spin is your idea of how things should work are not practical. You have to expect to take some bad with the good. Is it perfect? Not even close. Is it better than 27(or 28) nations always acting separately and in their own specific interests. It sure seems like it has been.

Life sucks and in the end, you die.
A shitty EU > third Holocaust

Climate change will kills us long before that. And the way it's going, EU will be debating the dimensions of the rescue vessels toilets while everyone else has already left the planet. And then as a compromise, they will add no toilets at all. Because that is the condition the EU is operating at right now. Compromises that completely destroy any progress and vision for the future.

 
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30. Re: Morning Legal Briefs Apr 16, 2019, 22:16 jdreyer
 
Mr. Tact wrote on Apr 16, 2019, 09:22:
So, are you saying you want an EU which can't impose rules and regulations across the entire union? Wouldn't that pretty much defeat the purpose?

Listen, don't get me wrong. I understand exactly what you are saying. I even agree with you about the problems that exist. However, my spin is your idea of how things should work are not practical. You have to expect to take some bad with the good. Is it perfect? Not even close. Is it better than 27(or 28) nations always acting separately and in their own specific interests. It sure seems like it has been.

Life sucks and in the end, you die.
A shitty EU > third Holocaust
 
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The land in Minecraft is flat, Minecraft simulates the Earth, ergo the Earth is flat.
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29. Re: Morning Legal Briefs Apr 16, 2019, 15:19 Mr. Tact
 
eRe4s3r wrote on Apr 16, 2019, 14:43:
The founding purpose of the EU was historically for it to never be a political union. It should be an economic alliance and nothing more.
Well, I'd argue the founding purpose was to avoid another major war in Europe, but that's neither here nor there. I'd have to do some research to figure out how the political and economic portions came together. I might have to do that, the history of what powers the EU has and how they changed are certainly a factor in the overall situation. You might be right, perhaps it would better if it was only an economic alliance. I suspect there is a reasonable argument why having a political portion is important, but I don't know what it is off the top of my head.
 
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28. Re: Morning Legal Briefs Apr 16, 2019, 14:43 eRe4s3r
 
Mr. Tact wrote on Apr 16, 2019, 09:22:
So, are you saying you want an EU which can't impose rules and regulations across the entire union? Wouldn't that pretty much defeat the purpose?

Listen, don't get me wrong. I understand exactly what you are saying. I even agree with you about the problems that exist. However, my spin is your idea of how things should work are not practical. You have to expect to take some bad with the good. Is it perfect? Not even close. Is it better than 27(or 28) nations always acting separately and in their own specific interests. It sure seems like it has been.

Life sucks and in the end, you die.

The founding purpose of the EU was historically for it to never be a political union. It should be an economic alliance and nothing more. And if it doesn't move in that direction the Italian exit (although there is a lot of hot air involved there) will just be another stepping stone to its collapse. I simply do not accept that we should take the EU as it is, it needs to be changed now, not expanded, not be making more laws. The longer we wait, the more catastrophic it will be when it collapses. And that's a question of when, not IF. The refugee issue and the complete collapse of Dublin II will never go away.
 
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27. Re: Morning Legal Briefs Apr 16, 2019, 09:22 Mr. Tact
 
So, are you saying you want an EU which can't impose rules and regulations across the entire union? Wouldn't that pretty much defeat the purpose?

Listen, don't get me wrong. I understand exactly what you are saying. I even agree with you about the problems that exist. However, my spin is your idea of how things should work are not practical. You have to expect to take some bad with the good. Is it perfect? Not even close. Is it better than 27(or 28) nations always acting separately and in their own specific interests. It sure seems like it has been.

Life sucks and in the end, you die.
 
Truth is brutal. Prepare for pain.
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26. Re: Morning Legal Briefs Apr 16, 2019, 02:31 eRe4s3r
 
Mr. Tact wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 16:22:
So, basically you are simply against the idea of the EU altogether, right? That's fine. It certainly has pros and cons. And deciding if the cons are worth the pros, is not easily quantifiable and would be a matter for debate. I'd be surprised if anyone could reach a purely objective answer to the question.

I am actually for an unified Europe with unified political structure with 27 major federal states that are the now nations, and each nation can define minor federal states within it's boundaries to make decision making efficient (that'd be the "optimal" setup for the EU).

But what we have currently is a cluster of 27 nations that each want something different, and that results in compromises which hurt us tremendously. I give you a great example. Climate change. We have some nations in the east that don't give a fuck and block all directives that affect them negatively (economically), we have some in the west (Portugal, Italy, Spain) that will become uninhabitable in regions according to the projections. They want changes and they want them quickly.

The compromise the EU reached is to do nothing. And that isn't as working compromise if one side of that table faces LITERAL extinction and the EU says "not our problem" because it only affects 3 of 27.

Don't let my emotionally driven rage confuse you, I am well aware that the EU has good sides, but the older I get the more I understand how it works and the longer I live the more i see that the EU does very little that is actually good for citizens. (GDPR is a good example too, absolutely great idea, but horrible execution of the actual law with so many wishy washy statements and blurry definitions that it will take decades for courts to figure out wtf that text is even supposed to mean)

 
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25. Re: Morning Legal Briefs Apr 15, 2019, 17:08 Cutter
 
Simon Says wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 16:09:
Cutter wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 15:35:
If humanity can achieve matter replication and cold fusion before it implodes then you can have your UFP.

Nonsense, we're already post scarcity. Scarcity atm is maintained through artificial means. Basically the need for income and the supply demand mechanics.

We produce enough calories for 12 billion people ( 2000 per pop ). Yet 36 millions die of starvation each year. We have almost 800 millions obese. Hundreds of millions live with less than 600 calories, almost a billion live with less than 1600. That's supply and demand for you.

We produce 5 times the needed clothing, yet hundreds of millions live in rags while billions have way too many clothes ( me included ).

We construct enough shelter for everyone, yet most of the biggest buildings we do build have an average useful lifespan of 10 to 20 years before we scrap them and rebuild.

Need I remind you the world pop is set to plateau at 11-12 billions before going back down?

Without the need for income, we could cut half the jobs tomorrow with automation. Or make people work half as many hours. Further cutting bullshit jobs, jobs that would be useless in a tradeless and currencyless economy, duplication of jobs because of competition instead of cooperation and other means. We could cut an additional 10 fold of what would be left after automation.

1/20th of the current work hours would be necessary to produce the exact same amount of service/goods. Everyone working 20 times less hours through the year.

BTW, did you know that almost 1 tenth of the current total work hours are from charity?

We could work less, use less resources and energy and still enjoy the living standards we enjoy now.

Make no mistake, we're already there, no need for cold fusion or replication. That's a fairy tale.

Hogwash, Sir! All the heavy work, building, mining, etc. all has to be done by hand = mostly. People don't want to do that for no money. And there's a finite amount of resources available and it takes time, money and a lot of effort to procure and/or produce them. There is a finite amount of top soil and fresh water. Desalination is impractical and expensive. And on and on it goes. So no, it's not even close to post-scarcity. Even every city in the first world is always crying it's broke and every government carries massive debt and deficits. That's light years off from free energy and machine you can ask to produce virtually anything and it does.
 
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24. Re: Morning Legal Briefs Apr 15, 2019, 16:22 Mr. Tact
 
So, basically you are simply against the idea of the EU altogether, right? That's fine. It certainly has pros and cons. And deciding if the cons are worth the pros, is not easily quantifiable and would be a matter for debate. I'd be surprised if anyone could reach a purely objective answer to the question.  
Truth is brutal. Prepare for pain.
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23. Re: Skyrim Creation Club Launches with Survival Mode Apr 15, 2019, 16:16 eRe4s3r
 
Mr. Tact wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 13:34:
eRe4s3r wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 13:06:
It would only be a democracy if there were European elections where we can vote for or against anyone and not just German politicians if we are German...
This is simply the nature of the way a representational democracy works. I assume when the elections are held for the Bundestag you only vote for representation of your constituency, not all of them.

Yes, but you can also assume that the Bundestag does not make laws for anyone but Germans. Whenever it goes beyond this call you should imo lament that equally loudly.
 
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22. Re: The Android's Dream by John Scalzi Apr 15, 2019, 16:13 RedEye9
 
Mr. Tact wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 15:19:
Burrito of Peace wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 14:55:
+1 for the Scalzi reference.
Thank you, it looked familiar but I couldn't quite place it and didn't bother to Goggle it.
I even put it in the Subject line for added obscuration. Wink
 
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21. Re: Morning Legal Briefs Apr 15, 2019, 16:09 Simon Says
 
Cutter wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 15:35:
If humanity can achieve matter replication and cold fusion before it implodes then you can have your UFP.

Nonsense, we're already post scarcity. Scarcity atm is maintained through artificial means. Basically the need for income and the supply demand mechanics.

We produce enough calories for 12 billion people ( 2000 per pop ). Yet 36 millions die of starvation each year. We have almost 800 millions obese. Hundreds of millions live with less than 600 calories, almost a billion live with less than 1600. That's supply and demand for you.

We produce 5 times the needed clothing, yet hundreds of millions live in rags while billions have way too many clothes ( me included ).

We construct enough shelter for everyone, yet most of the biggest buildings we do build have an average useful lifespan of 10 to 20 years before we scrap them and rebuild.

Need I remind you the world pop is set to plateau at 11-12 billions before going back down?

Without the need for income, we could cut half the jobs tomorrow with automation. Or make people work half as many hours. Further cutting bullshit jobs, jobs that would be useless in a tradeless and currencyless economy, duplication of jobs because of competition instead of cooperation and other means. We could cut an additional 10 fold of what would be left after automation.

1/20th of the current work hours would be necessary to produce the exact same amount of service/goods. Everyone working 20 times less hours through the year.

BTW, did you know that almost 1 tenth of the current total work hours are from charity?

We could work less, use less resources and energy and still enjoy the living standards we enjoy now.

Make no mistake, we're already there, no need for cold fusion or replication. That's a fairy tale.
 
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20. Re: Morning Legal Briefs Apr 15, 2019, 15:53 jdreyer
 
Cutter wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 15:35:
If humanity can achieve matter replication and cold fusion before it implodes then you can have your UFP.

Indiana man would be happy if he could just replicate his pr0n collection.

I guess his dad didn't like "Big Bad Grannys."
 
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The land in Minecraft is flat, Minecraft simulates the Earth, ergo the Earth is flat.
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19. Re: Skyrim Creation Club Launches with Survival Mode Apr 15, 2019, 15:52 jdreyer
 
Simon Says wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 15:03:
Burrito of Peace wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 14:57:
Simon Says wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 14:52:
Burrito of Peace wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 13:53:
This was a good thread to read. If anything, it reinforced to me that the idea of something like the United Federation of Planets would never work with the human race.

This has NOTHING to do with the UFP. Comparing the politics of a post-scarcity economy without trade nor currency in an entirely different culture based on cooperation with the crapshoot politics of the artificial scarcity economy we have now in a culture based on competition is like trying to compare an orange vs a pigeon.

You miss the point. The point is that humans, as a race, are far, far too self-centered and monetarily oriented in the real world to approach even the nascent idea that would start something like the UFP.

If anything, we're going to end up like the Orions.

Agreed, but that's a relative cultural ( nurture ) factor, not a fixed "human nature" factor.

You might also want to read this: https://www.amazon.com/SuperCooperators-Altruism-Evolution-Other-Succeed/dp/1451626630

Basically like psychopaths, but opposite. Do stuff like donate as many organs as they can to the needy, run in front of trains to save people, etc.
 
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The land in Minecraft is flat, Minecraft simulates the Earth, ergo the Earth is flat.
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18. Re: Morning Legal Briefs Apr 15, 2019, 15:35 Cutter
 
If humanity can achieve matter replication and cold fusion before it implodes then you can have your UFP.
 
Avatar 25394
 
"Put the pick in there, Pete, and turn it round real neat."
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17. Re: The Android's Dream by John Scalzi Apr 15, 2019, 15:19 Mr. Tact
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 14:55:
+1 for the Scalzi reference.
Thank you, it looked familiar but I couldn't quite place it and didn't bother to Goggle it.
 
Truth is brutal. Prepare for pain.
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16. Re: Skyrim Creation Club Launches with Survival Mode Apr 15, 2019, 15:03 Simon Says
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 14:57:
Simon Says wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 14:52:
Burrito of Peace wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 13:53:
This was a good thread to read. If anything, it reinforced to me that the idea of something like the United Federation of Planets would never work with the human race.

This has NOTHING to do with the UFP. Comparing the politics of a post-scarcity economy without trade nor currency in an entirely different culture based on cooperation with the crapshoot politics of the artificial scarcity economy we have now in a culture based on competition is like trying to compare an orange vs a pigeon.

You miss the point. The point is that humans, as a race, are far, far too self-centered and monetarily oriented in the real world to approach even the nascent idea that would start something like the UFP.

If anything, we're going to end up like the Orions.

Agreed, but that's a relative cultural ( nurture ) factor, not a fixed "human nature" factor.

You might also want to read this: https://www.amazon.com/SuperCooperators-Altruism-Evolution-Other-Succeed/dp/1451626630
 
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15. Re: Skyrim Creation Club Launches with Survival Mode Apr 15, 2019, 14:57 Burrito of Peace
 
Simon Says wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 14:52:
Burrito of Peace wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 13:53:
This was a good thread to read. If anything, it reinforced to me that the idea of something like the United Federation of Planets would never work with the human race.

This has NOTHING to do with the UFP. Comparing the politics of a post-scarcity economy without trade nor currency in an entirely different culture based on cooperation with the crapshoot politics of the artificial scarcity economy we have now in a culture based on competition is like trying to compare an orange vs a pigeon.

You miss the point. The point is that humans, as a race, are far, far too self-centered and monetarily oriented in the real world to approach even the nascent idea that would start something like the UFP.

If anything, we're going to end up like the Orions.
 
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14. Re: The Android's Dream by John Scalzi Apr 15, 2019, 14:55 Burrito of Peace
 
RedEye9 wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 14:12:
You have to be invited into the UFP, either that or you'll find a Nidu 'Glar-class' destroyer parked in low earth orbit with a planet cracker locked and loaded.

“You've got nice a nice planet here. It would be a shame if something happened to it”

+1 for the Scalzi reference.
 
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13. Re: Skyrim Creation Club Launches with Survival Mode Apr 15, 2019, 14:52 Simon Says
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 13:53:
This was a good thread to read. If anything, it reinforced to me that the idea of something like the United Federation of Planets would never work with the human race.

This has NOTHING to do with the UFP. Comparing the politics of a post-scarcity economy without trade nor currency in an entirely different culture based on cooperation with the crapshoot politics of the artificial scarcity economy we have now in a culture based on competition is like trying to compare an orange vs a pigeon.
 
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12. The Android's Dream by John Scalzi Apr 15, 2019, 14:12 RedEye9
 
Burrito of Peace wrote on Apr 15, 2019, 13:53:
This was a good thread to read. If anything, it reinforced to me that the idea of something like the United Federation of Planets would never work with the human race.
You have to be invited into the UFP, either that or you'll find a Nidu 'Glar-class' destroyer parked in low earth orbit with a planet cracker locked and loaded.

“You've got nice a nice planet here. It would be a shame if something happened to it”
 
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Filmmaker John Waters advice for elders: "Whenever any magazine says, 'What photographer do you want to shoot you?' I always just say, 'The one that has the biggest retouch budget!
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