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Real Name Brooks   
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Nickname Zor
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Homepage http://
Signed On Aug 22, 1999, 05:01
Total Comments 179 (Novice)
User ID 404
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Videos

87. Re: Star Citizen Videos Mar 10, 2015, 14:01 Zor
 
Perhaps, but that's a different point and one that doesn't detract from the analogy I made. My point was simply regarding length of development time despite other variables. I don't see any point besides the inflammatory to debate or make assumptions that they're going to run out of cash before they finish their project while they're literally still raising money.

BTW, I like your Total Annihilation avatar

This comment was edited on Mar 10, 2015, 14:22.
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Videos

84. Re: Star Citizen Videos Mar 10, 2015, 11:21 Zor
 
jdreyer wrote on Mar 10, 2015, 02:40:
Zor wrote on Mar 9, 2015, 23:47:
yet, as an example, Diablo 3 took 10 years for Blizz to develop.

2-3 years is certainly possible for a AAA game... just not all of them. Nothing wrong with either length of time, as long as it gets done and done well.

Not sure Diablo 3 is the best analogy.

1. D3 was not developed continuously over that time. The initial version was canceled in 2005, and they had to restart from scratch, IIRC.

2. Blizzard had literally billions of dollars from WoW to fund development. There was no chance at all that running out of money would be the reason the game didn't ship.

There is a non-zero chance that RSI will run out of money, and the longer things stretch out, the greater that becomes. That's what I'm saying. That being said, I don't think that % is very large ATM, but it's growing.

Your claim that it's not a good analogy is simply, in my opinion, because it soundly defeats your point. It's a perfectly valid analogy, despite any breaks in development, and unlimited funding certainly does not guarantee a game will either get finished or be worth a dime when and if it is finished. And just because one game does succeed after a lengthy development cycle doesn't mean any other given game with a long cycle will. There is so much diversity and so many different variables in the process that each game is developed that there is simply no use in trying to forecast failure. If you look at Diablo 3 and compare it's development history to Diakatana or Duke Nukem Forever or Colonial Marines, it should have, by all rights, been as enormous a failure but it wasn't. It all boils down to management and talent and the will to succeed despite the problems faced over time. Just because so many companies have failed to do this doesn't give people the authority to say they all will until proven otherwise. What's the point?
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Videos

83. Re: Star Citizen Videos Mar 10, 2015, 11:11 Zor
 
nin wrote on Mar 10, 2015, 09:15:
Dmitri_M wrote on Mar 10, 2015, 03:52:
Star Citizen seems to have cornered the market of guys with large disposable incomes that don't follow games development closely yet still remember a time when they played Elite in their bedroom as teens. I think they hear about star citizen, blindly get excited and just pay, then get back to their other non game related lives/hobbies.

Pretty much. It astounds me anyone will defend it, at this point. "But guise! It'll be wahsome!", etc etc, as well...


It astounds me that anyone feels the need to attack it, at this point. "But guise! It'll fail for sure because it's not done already!"

Hindsight is, as ever, 20/20. Why don't we let it fail or succeed first before we try to play prophet and call people names because they have hope and feel like contributing? (and I'm generalizing, not saying you, nin, called anyone names)

I don't, won't, and have not stood on the mountain top claiming that this game will without a doubt succeed and can't fail, but I also feel no need to doubt it's chance of success just because it's still in development. In my experience and knowledge of the industry, CIG is facing a project that is larger in scope than just about anything so far attempted, and I feel like they're on track for an appropriate development cycle. It's no shock that it's going to require an impressive amount of time and patience to get it done right. I was prepared for that the day I made my first pledge, and I really don't get why so many who have pledged weren't.
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Videos

74. Re: Star Citizen Videos Mar 9, 2015, 23:47 Zor
 
yet, as an example, Diablo 3 took 10 years for Blizz to develop.

2-3 years is certainly possible for a AAA game... just not all of them. Nothing wrong with either length of time, as long as it gets done and done well.
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Videos

70. Re: Star Citizen Videos Mar 9, 2015, 19:17 Zor
 
jdreyer wrote on Mar 9, 2015, 18:23:
Zor wrote on Mar 9, 2015, 16:26:
harlock wrote on Mar 9, 2015, 15:52:
Zor wrote on Mar 9, 2015, 15:17:
This is amusing.. just how old do you think I am?

prepubescent
Well then I guess Blue should take that as a compliment as to the reach his website is making into various demographics.

Alas, even when I was that young, I never behaved the way you do in a public forum.

You've been around since 2003 at least. You should know by now that Harlock (and his previous incarnations) is our trollet laureate.
Since '98 or '99, yeah. Hadn't really bothered with the comments section until very recently though, so no I really am not up to speed on the community. It certainly hasn't disappointed in the troll category.

As for the point of "the progress is slower than perhaps it should be" I just like to suggest that the only people who should have any say in that are the ones responsible for making it. Since that is not us, who are we to judge? There is no set formula for how long a game should take to create, in any genre.

The only constant is impatience and disappointment. People are certainly within their right to be impatient and be disappointed in how long it's taking. However, that is precisely what they signed up for if they pledged. It's up to each and every backer to have the patience to deal with an open development model.

I just try to imagine what the vitriol would be like for, say, Massive Entertainment if they were openly developing the (already delayed) The Division. But, they're under closed development, and thus beyond the reach of public trolling and constant scrutiny unless you happen to be the ones paying their bills.

This comment was edited on Mar 9, 2015, 19:23.
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Videos

64. Re: Star Citizen Videos Mar 9, 2015, 16:26 Zor
 
harlock wrote on Mar 9, 2015, 15:52:
Zor wrote on Mar 9, 2015, 15:17:
This is amusing.. just how old do you think I am?

prepubescent
Well then I guess Blue should take that as a compliment as to the reach his website is making into various demographics.

Alas, even when I was that young, I never behaved the way you do in a public forum.
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Videos

60. Re: Star Citizen Videos Mar 9, 2015, 15:17 Zor
 
harlock wrote on Mar 9, 2015, 09:51:
Zor wrote on Mar 9, 2015, 01:22:
harlock,

What difference does my age make?

because as a tiny little child, you assume that the world works in magical ways ... but in reality, the world works quite differently

for example, you do not have the "right" to tell other people they dont have the "right" to speak their mind... for one thing there is that old document called the "constitution", and for another thing - you are just some kid, whining and pouting

nobody gives a shit about you or your ideas of what peoples "rights" should be... the legal system has absolutely nothing to do with this

you have no power, no authority, no ability to make decisions about what other people should be doing... so grab your blanky and your bottle, sit down and shut the fuck up

This is amusing.. just how old do you think I am? What's all this about power and authority on an internet forum? You think grandstanding and insulting someone earns you any of that, much less respect?

And now, at your convenience, you've decided to change the words of the conversation and alter the context to fit your own reality and argument. I never said people didn't have the right to "speak their mind." You can't quote me on that, since I never said it. But what you're failing to distinguish is that people here haven't been simply speaking their minds about this. Speaking your mind is called offering an opinion. If someone who is in no way involved in the day to day process of creating something, and yet decides on their own how that something should be made or how long it should take to do so, I call that making disingenuous proclamation. How would you like it if you had a thousand people screaming on the internet at you telling you you're doing your job wrong and making your product incorrectly in an industry where each and every project can and will have as unique a development process as each title is different from one another? You cannot rubber-stamp game development and if you think you have a right to demand that it is so, then I have no idea from what logic you're basing that on.

And how in the world do you cite the constitution during a debate over the amount of time it should or shouldn't take to develop a video game? Seriously?

By all means, continue to knee-jerk another tantrum-filled insinuation that I'm of a certain age that you feel superior to.
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Videos

59. Re: Star Citizen Videos Mar 9, 2015, 14:59 Zor
 
Wraith wrote on Mar 9, 2015, 05:26:
Zor wrote on Mar 9, 2015, 01:36:
FPS gameplay has always been in the core design.
No it hasn't you ditzy twat, there's ZERO mention of it in the Kickstarter. It's just another of Robert's feature-creep additions so he doesn't have to get on with releasing the actual game.

This thing is going to tank hard. Not only did he choose totally the wrong engine for a fucking space game, but the online infrastructure he's going to need will be insane - except he's putting all the money into building endless fucking ships so he can keep the pyramid scheme running.

Make no mistake - I hope that, in the end, this fuck is held accountable. Because the failure of this boondoggle will destroy crowdfunding.

Ahem, Wraith, this is from kickstarter.com
http://i.imgur.com/wuSonXv.png

See where it says IN FIRST PERSON? That's the first line. Good lord, it took me 10 seconds to Google that.

Star Citizen is, as Roberts calls it, going to be a First Person Experience. An FPS framework for that experience is critical to their goals, not only for the PU, but for the gameplay and story of Squadron 42.

It is extremely easy to be informed of the facts if you want to bother with it.
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Videos

37. Re: Star Citizen Videos Mar 9, 2015, 01:36 Zor
 
verybad1 wrote on Mar 8, 2015, 19:34:
Zor wrote on Mar 8, 2015, 19:08:
it still amazes me that people feel they have the right to say how long Star Citizen should or should not take to develop. As if you have ANY say in the matter whatsoever.

The length of time it takes to make a game is not something you can hold to any expectation and make any kind of sense at all. So just stop.

As a customer, or potential customer, we've got the right to say how long we want to wait for a product, AND for what product we want.

Adding a FPS module to this game will obviously add more time to the waiting period that some contributors expected when they paid money for a modern space fighting game, not necessarily wanting a FPS...

It makes me laugh when people think it's fine to change what you're paying for after you've paid for it. If you're willing to take one in the rear from them that's fine, doesn't mean everyone else has to.

When initially announced, it was described as more of a modern version of Wing Commander style game. Now what is it?

lol, wait... let me get this straight. You have a right to say how long CIG can take to build this game? Are you suddenly their publisher? No, you're not.

FPS gameplay has always been in the core design. They have to do what they're doing now to even achieve the basics. If you bothered to be more informed about the game then you wouldn't make up shit like you're doing to justify your complaints.

I just don't get it..... CIG makes it so people have the opportunity to pledge their money so that CIG can make this game, in their vision, and in precisely however long it takes to do it, and people feel entitled to decide how long that should be because, reasons, or because they're just tired of waiting already. If you have pledged and you're not happy with how it's going then you WERE NOT PAYING ATTENTION TO WHAT YOU PLEDGED FOR. END. OF. LINE.
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Videos

36. Re: Star Citizen Videos Mar 9, 2015, 01:22 Zor
 
harlock,

What difference does my age make? Besides, the point is no one gives a shit about anyone's arbitrary amount of time that people have decided it should take to build this or any other game.

Developing a game takes more time than most people are capable of dealing with, which is why MOST games are developed in complete secrecy and under the umbrella of publishers.

Star Citizen is being developed under the magnifying glass of customer awareness from start to finish and it will take exactly as long, and no less, to build as it takes for them to get it right or at least until the developers are happy with it. You know why? Because that is EXACTLY what a community of nearly a MILLION people have ENABLED them to do. So who, exactly, are you to bitch about it? If you aren't capable of dealing with this new frontier of game development, then a) don't back it and b) stop trolling it and if you've already backed it then c) sit back, relax, play your existing games, and wait for good things to come. Sheesh.
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Videos

22. Re: Star Citizen Videos Mar 8, 2015, 19:08 Zor
 
it still amazes me that people feel they have the right to say how long Star Citizen should or should not take to develop. As if you have ANY say in the matter whatsoever.

The length of time it takes to make a game is not something you can hold to any expectation and make any kind of sense at all. So just stop.
 
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News Comments > Source Engine 2 Announced

3. Re: Source Engine 2 Announced Mar 3, 2015, 19:53 Zor
 
NamecaF wrote on Mar 3, 2015, 19:52:
HL3 to be the Source Engine 2 launch title makes sense. Fingers crossed?

I sure hope so. Well, I hope for a new grand slam: Portal 3, Half Life 3, Left 4 D3ad.. 3. See what I did there
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen at $73M; Rental Equipment Credits Controversy

62. Re: Star Citizen at $73M; Rental Equipment Credits Controversy Feb 22, 2015, 02:32 Zor
 
jdreyer wrote on Feb 21, 2015, 20:51:
Can you buy REC?

No.
 
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News Comments > Space Hulk: Deathwing Trailer

2. Re: Space Hulk: Deathwing Trailer Feb 13, 2015, 10:02 Zor
 
is this actually going to be an FPS or is it like that top-down turn based game from last year?  
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News Comments > Valve on the Future of High Performance Graphics

2. Re: Valve on the Future of High Performance Graphics Feb 4, 2015, 10:01 Zor
 
wonder if one of these live demos will be in some shape or form related to an IP Valve owns... c'mon Gabe! Show us the Freeman!  
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News Comments > Out of the Blue

3. Re: Out of the Blue Jan 20, 2015, 11:21 Zor
 
because, EXPLOOOOOOOOOOOOOSIONS! *wicked air guitar*  
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News Comments > Morning Consolidation

1. Re: Morning Consolidation Jan 20, 2015, 11:19 Zor
 
OMG i want that claptrap!!! AHHHHH!!!  
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News Comments > Star Citizen Status Report

70. Re: Star Citizen Status Report Jan 13, 2015, 09:21 Zor
 
ok, Kosumo, has your life been filled with nothing but success? You have never failed at anything or done something that didn't quite live up to par for whatever reason?

I'm willing to bet that's not the case. No one is perfect, and no one scores a home run with everything they do in life. Just because someone has success and then fails doesn't mean they can't achieve future success and/or learn from mistakes.

I personally loved Freelancer and I've never read anything on that which you claim of him being "moved on." What I have heard from him is that Microsoft and Digital Anvil did not agree on a lot of things including funding and time and thus there were things that did not happen with the game. His ambition was beyond the tech of the time, from what I understand. Despite that, it was still a good game, imo.

Yes, I have seen the Wing Commander movie. I also know a bit behind the scenes about it, such as the fact he was only given 8 months to make it. I think what he was able to pull off, while a shadow of what it could have been, was surprising given the limited time and budget.

But why do people keep bringing up someone's ability at making a movie when discussing his current role of making a computer game? That just doesn't make sense to me.

But, you really don't want me to take you seriously I guess, since you're making childish shots at his person with the "outfit" comment.
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Status Report

67. Re: Star Citizen Status Report Jan 12, 2015, 23:49 Zor
 
The added features were things he always wanted to do if he had the funds to do so. The base game is still going to happen, and it doesn't bother me at all if it takes a bit longer because they're going to be able to make it even better and more advanced than they would have been.

When i backed the game I had no doubt that it was going to be several years before it would be close to any sort of beta. I'm patient, and I know that I want to see him create his complete vision that he had from the start, which he now has the money to do. I'm excited that they're able to do things they couldn't have hoped for like procedural damage and such, and Hollywood quality performance capture.

You say "release Star Citizen and work on the ship boarding and all the other stuff" but it's all that other stuff that is what makes it Star Citizen. All that other stuff is what will set it apart and truly make it special. I backed the game and will be patient with them because I want all that stuff, whatever and however long it takes to get it done right. There's plenty of other stuff to play while I wait.
 
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News Comments > Star Citizen Status Report

65. Re: Star Citizen Status Report Jan 12, 2015, 19:15 Zor
 
SpectralMeat wrote on Jan 12, 2015, 18:25:
jdreyer wrote on Jan 12, 2015, 17:57:
SpectralMeat wrote on Jan 12, 2015, 16:12:

Edit: I just dislike the direction he runs his business with the `mo money `mo money `mo money mentality instead of the let's focus on finishing the damn game.
If he has a killer game in the making he will be making money with it years after it's released with expansions, new ships etc.
But he seem to be focused on riding the hype train get as much in funding as possible instead.

I get what you are saying, but that's what Chris does. He's the front man. He's the ideas man. And this game is extremely ambitious, and that takes money. So, he's raising that money. He's got 200 people working for him to make the game. No one is forcing you to buy those $10K ships, so how are you affected? Those whales are funding the game for us minnows. And they're making content, showing demos, releasing alpha code, it's being iterated, etc. etc. This is not DNF where you'd wait literally years for a few screenshots in PCG. They show weekly progress. Are they delayed? Yes, just like 80% of all software projects ever.
and why is the delay?
Is it because they have programming issues or is it because the space ship game we've helped them kickstart turned into a swiss army knife of a game.
Wouldn't you rather play the beta version right now and have the first person module added in later as a dlc, than wait another year or two before we even see any actual "game"
Who knows by the time this all should be finished they will add another 20 features to the game that will keep it from being finished another few years.

That's software development. There are delays, that's just how it goes, but it doesn't mean anything is awry.

There only fault, I guess, is making this an open project and not completely closed from public consumption until they're done. Yet they can't do that with a crowd funded project. So, do you see the catch 22? You just have to suffer the wait and try and be a part of the development, as they are intending. Did you know Diablo 3 took an estimated 10 years to develop? World of Warcraft an estimated 7? Shit takes time, and delays are simply a reality in a creative process.
 
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