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On PC Battlefield 1943

Message to the PC Gamer(s) Following BF1943's Development on the EA Forums follows-up on the reaction to news that the PC edition of Battlefield 1943 will trail the console versions by a couple of months. The post by DICE's Gordon Van Dyke reassures PC gamers that "this is to give us the proper development time to create a proper PC version of Battlefield 1943 and not a console port. To the contrary of some less informed fans out there this is in no means an intentional ploy to punish our PC fans. And is in fact quite the opposite, we want to make the best damn PC version we can for our PC fans!" He refers to PCs "requiring additional features, support, technical consideration, and can't just be thrown out there using copy/paste." On that topic, Planet Battlefield (thanks Ant) relates a translation of a Swedish interview revealing that DICE is considering dropping some console features for the PC editions, taking a hard look at regenerating health, regenerating ammo, and the 24-player limit for multiplayer games.

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70. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 13:12 Verno
 
More like intimately familiar with playing on cracked servers and running legitimate servers, but thank you for admitting that through this I must have more knowledge on the subject than yourself.

I have no problem admitting your knowledge of pirating games exceeds my own, you are welcome to that title sir. Now excuse me while I alt tab to uTorrent.

This comment was edited on Apr 28, 2009, 13:12.
 
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69. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 13:10 vrok
 
A cracked BF server is missing stat tracking, that's it.
Actually that's not it. You will never ever get a full game of say Project Reality going on a cracked server. Never going to happen. Why? The people that bother playing on cracked servers don't care about mods because they don't even like the game. Clan war? Not going to happen on a cracked server.

For all you know regenerating health could be a perfect fit for the franchise or a total disaster. You have no way of knowing without experiencing the game.
Actually I do. DICE admitted that regenerating health was one of the reasons the most liked BF class, the medic, was removed. Without medics, there will be less teamplay. Also, all three classes will have anti-tank capabilities, exceeding mere grenades in BF1942, further removing teamplay and dependency on more players than yourself. Why? To cater to the ridiculous player limit.

As it stands you are prejudging the game and even despite that enormous fucking stupidity on your part, the game developer is still listening to you for some reason. So they throw you a bone and you spit it back in their face.
What can I say, I'm an angry cunt. I'll reward them after the fact, not before. But I'll still say no as long as it has to be bought through the EA store. Not repeating that mistake again.

Glad to hear you're intimately familiar with pirating the Battlefield series and running cracked servers as that's the only way you would know without "using Google lol".
More like intimately familiar with playing on cracked servers and running legitimate servers, but thank you for admitting that through this I must have more knowledge on the subject than yourself.

This comment was edited on Apr 28, 2009, 13:12.
 
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68. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 12:44 Verno
 
It was the second game in the series and DICE hadn't used up all the faith put in them at that time. Just some. It was also developed by DICE Canada, whose worthlessness was not yet apparent at the time.

Subjective and doesn't address my point.

This statement doesn't make sense. MMOs are MP games.

Yes it does. MMO's require incredibly complex server setups, even a basic WoW emulated server is missing easily half of the features versus a real one. A cracked BF server is missing stat tracking, that's it. You don't even need it for unlockables since those can be cracked too.

I'm sorry actual knowledge seems mysterious to you when all you know is Google. And no, they're not making the PC MP better. They have currently made it worse and are now considering tweaking it closer to the original BF experience. Enormous fucking difference. There's no advancement of features to be seen so far. Just less backtracking. However, it's true that given enough steps forward again that maybe we'll eventually reach a better BF game in general, though I seriously doubt that. My condemnation of the game, as you put it, only stands given current knowledge of the game. Not future possible changes to make the game cater less to non-gamers and more to gamers again.

I'm sorry you can't sound like less of a condescending shit but hey none of us are perfect! You have not even played the game. For all you know regenerating health could be a perfect fit for the franchise or a total disaster. You have no way of knowing without experiencing the game. The only real negative you could cling to is the 24 player limit. As it stands you are prejudging the game and even despite that enormous fucking stupidity on your part, the game developer is still listening to you for some reason. So they throw you a bone and you spit it back in their face.

Unlike you I only discuss subjects I have intimate knowledge about.

Glad to hear you're intimately familiar with pirating the Battlefield series and running cracked servers as that's the only way you would know without "using Google lol".
 
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67. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 12:21 Jerykk
 
It took Deus Ex years to sell a million copies, why are you always distorting facts?

Distorting facts? I only said it sold a million copies, which it did. Whether it took weeks or years, it still sold a million copies which is a lot more than BG&E, Psychonauts, Sacrifice, Planescape: Torment, etc, ever sold. Also note that DX got a sequel. If it was a complete and utter flop, a sequel probably wouldn't have been made.

This isn't a charity and they said they're considering making concessions.

Exactly. This isn't a charity. They aren't making free PC games here. They're making PC ports so they can milk games for every last penny. If they want gratitude, they need to go above and beyond their own business interests by doing things like making PC-exclusives. As it is, they simply ignore PC ports until the end of projects and then delay the ports with the excuse that they're putting effort into it. They should have been doing this during development.

Sorry time to grow up and realize the situation you've made Jerykk. Can't blame anyone but yourself.

Wait, so if I didn't exist, consoles would not have a much larger audience because they are much more convenient and accessible than PC gaming? And they wouldn't receive so much marketing and hype? Darn.

It's not an MMO, there is no way to guarantee sales other than MP.

There's no way to guarantee sales ever. The best things you can do are 1) Make a good game, 2) Remove all obstacles to enjoyment of that game (like DRM), 3) Market the game so people know it exists. Unfortunately, most publishers usually fail at all three when it comes to PC gaming.

DRM isn't going to get people to buy a game. Dark Athena has yet to be cracked and it's been out for weeks. If DRM creates sales, shouldn't Dark Athena at least be on the top 10 sales charts or something? Even if only for a week? Conversely, Demigod has no copy-protection but it debuted at number 3 on the NPD charts. In fact, most of the games on the top 10 charts have been cracked and are fully playable online.

This comment was edited on Apr 28, 2009, 12:29.
 
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66. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 12:02 vrok
 
BF:V was technically a mod for BF1942 but it was still a game all by itself.
It was the second game in the series and DICE hadn't used up all the faith put in them at that time. Just some. It was also developed by DICE Canada, whose worthlessness was not yet apparent at the time.

Also the tired old "lol pirates would've never bought it anyways!" is getting long in the tooth.
I never claimed it applies to all games suffering from piracy. I'm claiming that the BF franchise is one of the few that it applies to because it actually provides substantially more value in owning a legitimate copy than a pirated copy. Unlike most games.

It's not an MMO, there is no way to guarantee sales other than MP.
This statement doesn't make sense. MMOs are MP games.

I'm sorry looking at Google is too hard for you but even if we take your argument then its all the more reason for them to make the PC MP better like they say they're going to.
I'm sorry actual knowledge seems mysterious to you when all you know is Google. And no, they're not making the PC MP better. They have currently made it worse and are now considering tweaking it closer to the original BF experience. Enormous fucking difference. There's no advancement of features to be seen so far. Just less backtracking. However, it's true that given enough steps forward again that maybe we'll eventually reach a better BF game in general, though I seriously doubt that. My condemnation of the game, as you put it, only stands given current knowledge of the game. Not future possible changes to make the game cater less to non-gamers and more to gamers again.

How would you know?
Unlike you I only discuss subjects I have intimate knowledge about.

This comment was edited on Apr 28, 2009, 12:28.
 
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65. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 11:48 Verno
 
why oh why won't PC gamers buy the DRM-laden shit EA has been putting out lately?

If they stop putting DRM in their titles I'm sure people will find some other excuse not to purchase them. Doesn't have enough content! Here you go, heres a ton more content! It's too expensive!!!! Ok we'll make it $20. WHERES THE SDK?! Ok here's an SDK.

Basically the whining never ends around here.
 
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64. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 11:41 RP
 
Sorry time to grow up and realize the situation you've made Jerykk. Can't blame anyone but yourself.

rofl curse Jery for ruining PC gaming. That asshole.

or are too demanding on the PC platform these days, sorry no more exclusives

why oh why won't PC gamers buy the DRM-laden shit EA has been putting out lately? If you've played PC games for 10+ years, it's evident that many (certainly not all) games have regressed in the areas that count. As such, my game purchases have declined dramatically. SimCity 4 --> Societies. BF42 --> Heroes/BF43. DX1 --> DX2. Blah blah.

This comment was edited on Apr 28, 2009, 11:43.
 
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63. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 11:05 Verno
 
Can't really take the discussion seriously when you're just going to be silly. BF:V was technically a mod for BF1942 but it was still a game all by itself. Also the tired old "lol pirates would've never bought it anyways!" is getting long in the tooth. It's not an MMO, there is no way to guarantee sales other than MP. I'm sorry looking at Google is too hard for you but even if we take your argument then its all the more reason for them to make the PC MP better like they say they're going to.

Most cracked servers function like ass as the BF series is very demanding on the server and its bandwidth

How would you know?
 
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62. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 10:35 vrok
 
It cost less to develop because it was practically nothing more than a mod for BF2. Have you even played it?

Googling for stuff and getting hits? Really? That's your proof? Lists of cracked servers that may or may not actually exist? You may as well google for BF2 demo downloads and server lists and claim the demo is/was cannibalizing BF2's sales. It's ridiculous. Most cracked servers function like ass as the BF series is very demanding on the server and its bandwidth, and I already listed a bunch of reasons why cracked servers can't compete with legitimate servers for players that actually like the game. And that's even though cracked servers can be played on for free.

Pirates that don't like the game and therefore pirate it but never buy it, as the extra value is meaningless to them, don't mean anything and never did. The same applies to cheap non-pirates that don't really like the game enough to justify buying it instead of playing the demo over and over. There will always be pirates/cheapskates that refuse no matter how much more value a legitimate copy provides. They don't matter. They were never potential customers. Nothing was lost. This is how piracy applies to the BF franchise. It cannot be compared to a singleplayer title with or without tacked on MP. In this sense it's more like an MMO and comparing homebrew servers with the real deal and DICE can always choose to go even further in that direction with, say, BF3.

This comment was edited on Apr 28, 2009, 10:58.
 
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61. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 08:44 Verno
 
BF2142 cost less to develop and as such it's only fair that it sold less

How did it cost less to develop? If you're referring to the 5 ads they sold then that's a big stretch. Searching for Battlefield or BF2 torrents turns up over a million results so yeah I'd say piracy is a problem for them too. Over 107,000 results for "battlefield cracked server" and the top results are all indexes with many of them. While I don't agree with him that piracy is the be all and end all root of problems on the PC, you can't brush it away either.
 
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60. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 07:38 vrok
 
Too many people either pirate games or are too demanding on the PC platform these days, sorry no more exclusives.

How does this apply to the BF franchise? It doesn't. BF2142 cost less to develop and as such it's only fair that it sold less. Piracy had nothing to do with it, people just stuck with BF2. Every other BF game was a success without any doubt, even BFV. Then for no reason DICE turned casual/console and hasn't come back since.

Other developers like Crytek getting their SP focused games heavily pirated has nothing at all to do with the BF franchise as the BF franchise is pretty much infinitely more value for your money. Not to mention that it's harder to pirate with cracked servers and the like, and even then will never reach the potential of legitimate servers using features such as stats, mods, clanwars, etc. There's no comparison. I can tell you right now that CoD4 fucking up with the way they handled levels (stats) directly resulted in more pirated copies used to play online than there would've been if it had all been tracked in a manner closer to BF2.

This comment was edited on Apr 28, 2009, 07:44.
 
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59. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 28, 2009, 06:48 Dades
 
It took Deus Ex years to sell a million copies, why are you always distorting facts? It was a commercial failure as a game. It was loved by critics and gamers but unfortunately did not succeed at retail.

I'd be grateful to DICE if they designed BF3 as a PC-exclusive. That would be an act worthy of gratitude because they'd be taking a risk by potentially reducing their profits. All for the sake of quality and the fans.

This isn't a charity and they said they're considering making concessions. Too many people either pirate games or are too demanding on the PC platform these days, sorry no more exclusives. You get your token MMO titles, maybe a Valve/Blizzard/Activision game and that's about it these days. Sorry time to grow up and realize the situation you've made Jerykk. Can't blame anyone but yourself.

This comment was edited on Apr 28, 2009, 06:53.
 
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58. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 27, 2009, 21:50 Jerykk
 
Beyond Good and Evil. Deus Ex. Psychonauts. Just a few great games that were considered poor sellers.

DX sold a million copies. That's pretty good for an obscure PC game that came out in 2000.

Anyway, I don't really see PC gamers should be grateful for BF1943. It's a delayed console port that might have some design choices tailored specifically for the PC. It's also a port of a console mini-remake of a PC game that came out 7 years ago.

I'd be grateful to DICE if they designed BF3 as a PC-exclusive. That would be an act worthy of gratitude because they'd be taking a risk by potentially reducing their profits. All for the sake of quality and the fans.

I was grateful to CD Projekt Red for releasing the free Enhanced Edition patch for The Witcher. I was grateful to Valve for releasing extra content for TF2 and L4D. I was grateful to Intel for making the CoD4 and WAW map packs free.

I'm not grateful that EA took a PC series, turned it into a console series, dumbed it down and are now releasing a delayed console port with the remote possibility of some design choices actually being changed for the PC audience.

This comment was edited on Apr 27, 2009, 22:58.
 
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57. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 27, 2009, 18:27 LittleMe
 
Well, imo, DICE was kicking Valve's and everyone else's ass big time in the multiplayer FPS scene with the BF series until BF:Bad company and their now console-centric games. What they did still has not been replicated by anyone else successfully (except perhaps Operation Flash Point)

We are consumers and we don't mind good marketing but a good game is most important to us. This is the dream world in which I live and how money leaves my wallet. I make the rules, as a consumer. My dollar is my vote. My keyboard is my voice. I'm not calling DICE assholes or anything but will reject and denounce a game designed to be easily played by 12 year olds or grandma in her retirement home.
 
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Perpetual debt is slavery.
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56. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 27, 2009, 16:15 Verno
 
If a PC game sells poorly, it's probably because it's a pisspoor game

Beyond Good and Evil. Deus Ex. Psychonauts. Just a few great games that were considered poor sellers. Not everything is so cut and dry, you don't just "make gud game it sell lots!!!!!!".

It's not because a few guys who are bored at work said the game would suck on a forum somewhere.

Negative word of mouth can have tremendous impact on a title and it usually starts on forums. No one is saying this is true 100% of the time but it certainly happens.

This comment was edited on Apr 27, 2009, 16:15.
 
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55. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 27, 2009, 16:04 Creston
 

It might very well be crap, but a lot of times games are judged like this, "gonna be a crappy console port," and disregarded, then they come out and are actually GOOD, but no one plays or purchases them because they all prejudged it on forums, and then the game sells poorly, and the company says "why did we bother paying extra attention to the PC?"


Right, because the 200 people that bitch about a PC game on a few forums on the internet make a MASSIVE difference in sales for a game. Rolleyes

You heard it here first, folks. If Bluesnews plus a few other forums slag a game, it won't sell any copies!

What?

If a PC game sells poorly, it's probably because it's a pisspoor game, or (if it was a Crytek game) it was pirated by 384 million people. It's not because a few guys who are bored at work said the game would suck on a forum somewhere.

Creston
 
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54. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 27, 2009, 15:58 Creston
 
Regenerating health AND regenerating ammo? What the fuck is this, a sandbox? That has to be the dumbest design decision ever. I think they'd better remove that from the PC version, otherwise it's going to get a massive backlash.

Regenerating ammo... Harvey Smith just came in his pants.

Creston
 
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53. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 27, 2009, 15:32 StingingVelvet
 
At some point people will have to accept that PC games aren't making enough money to justify PC exclusive versions. There are some exceptions and some big blockbuster titles but even many of these are getting multiplatform releases. It's not just a console vs PC thing, it's that publishers don't want to make just console or just PC titles, they want them on both to maximize profits.

Whether this requires dumbing down or not is totally on a game by game basis. Just because something is multiplatform does not make it inherently awful. That's like saying all DLC is bad because horse armor was. Yes there have been some bad multiplatform releases, that doesn't mean they will all be horrible. Especially in this case the devs are going out of their way to remove console specific features for PC gamers.

You get your cake, you eat it too then you bitch about it. This is why the PC gaming community sucks. Bunch of self entitled little babies, always demanding more more more and wanting it cheaper. If they included a sack of money with the game I am sure people would still complain that they got large bills instead of twenties.

The man speaks the truth, like a prophet. I am constantly saddened by the anti-PC statements made in gaming media and on gaming forums, but PC gamers really bring it on themselves... the spoiled sense of entitlement is really terrible, as is the constant whining.
 
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52. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 27, 2009, 13:47 Verno
 
Fair enough, good reply RP.  
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51. Re: On PC Battlefield 1943 Apr 27, 2009, 13:47 vrok
 
Especially in this case the devs are going out of their way to remove console specific features for PC gamers.
No. They claim to be considering. Big difference.

You get your cake, you eat it too then you bitch about it. This is why the PC gaming community sucks.
They're considering the above because of previous bitching. Continued bitching (maybe not my bitching, but someones ) can certainly help push them in the right direction. Way better than doing nothing and accepting mediocrity. DICE deserves no faith from the BF community the way they've been handling things since the release of BF2.

About as ridiculous as condemning this game when you have not even played it.
About as ridiculous as telling people what they have and haven't done? Regardless, you don't need to play the game to tell how its (lack of) features will impact gameplay. Especially if you enjoyed and even specialized in the features in BF1942 that are now missing/changed in BF1943 for no other reason than to make it accessible to super moms and non-gamers.

This comment was edited on Apr 27, 2009, 14:00.
 
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