Send News. Want a reply? Read this. More in the FAQ.   News Forum - All Forums - Mobile - PDA - RSS Headlines  RSS Headlines   Twitter  Twitter
Customize
User Settings
Styles:
LAN Parties
Upcoming one-time events:

Regularly scheduled events

Dawn of War II Q&A

Dawn of War II is an attempt to save real time strategy on Fidgit offers a conversation with Jonny Ebert about Warhammer 40,000: Dawn of War II, and how Relic is looking to save their favored RTS genre from extinction. Topics include their bold step away from the base building a resources of the first Dawn of War, how non-RTS junkies have reacted to the changes, balance tweaking, how beta testing went, changes to units and how they are handled, the use of that GFWL "skill" matchmaking for multiplayer, races, plans for DLC, why they are only shipping with seven multiplayer maps, and more. Here's part of his explanation of rethinking the genre: "Most genres, like first person shooters and massively-multiplayer and free-to-play games, the ones that are experiencing strong growth, were constantly working to simplify themselves and make themselves more approachable, where RTS is going in the opposite direction. It seems like each one was more complicated than the last. The other genres were having constant breakthroughs in pacing, reward structure, drawing players systematically into the experience, whereas RTS had stayed the same across the board. To us, it felt obvious that we were falling behind for a reason. We decided we needed to simplify the entry point but retain the depth at the back end."

View
17 Replies. 1 pages. Viewing page 1.
< Newer [ 1 ] Older >

17. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 19, 2009, 00:14 Z9000
 
There are 5 problems with TLR outside it running horribly on Xbox 360:

1) Botching a group when leader dies (even if there is another leader in group).
2) The god like finger of raidlock (bosses seek your lowest HP union, you can't really "tank" unless you make your tank group the least HP which can work).
3) The apparent pot luck of command options (which are actually controlled by experienced players but confusing to new).
4) Many things missed on Disk 1 can screw your ability to open all achievments, and even cause major misses in content and abilities on disk 2.
5) Battle Rating is your enemy (but it makes the game fun in a different way. Seems to have been tossed in when they got done and needed to try and make it more challenging). BR is also a gauge that makes bosses harder the higher it gets, so you can level the BR so fast that the boss fights are almost impossible (One fight in particular can be made impossible).

Battle Rating is the level of your army to some extent. What it really means is that you have encountered monsters and it goes up. The way to play this game is avoid all encounters, fight only quest monsters, and power level on a few select mobs that you schedule for maximum upgrades to your unions before your Battle Rating (the real enemy) gets too high. Dodging and ducking through the whole game becomes it's own fun in a way.

I would like the ability to directly equip all my army members. Maybe the PC version or TLR2 will have it.

The thing that draws me to the game is this alternate way to play it. The character classes are mysterious. Party make ups yield completely different command options. It's been fun exploring them.

The PC version is going to have some major changes made to it. The Xbox is a horrible platform for this game, even installed to hard drive. Whether it's the Unreal engine or not, 5 frames per second during fight scenes is a enough to test the patience of anyone (when you have 18 players and 20+ monsters fighting, I usually play my PSP until it resolves, as I have seen this fight 1000x).

Once you get over it's short comings, approach the game like many are now, you start appreciating some of the features that are good. Like the completely open sand box world that operates like a small MMO as far as entering zones when you want and spawning rare/ultrarare spawns. A crafting system that is complex and completely made up of crafting items obtained from killing monsters, finishing quests, or mining. The really good music, personalities, and the 100+ recruitable people (you can only field 18 max) to use. There are 50+ formations that a union can use, many unlocked by finding items, questing, and also dictated by party make ups (extremely complex). The races and history (lore) of the game is there to some extent. With some rehashing of the problems, a sequal would be pretty damn good. Many are posting this is the best RPG for any console, of this generation. So there are those who like it.

I like the Remnant idea in the story and there are some cool points in the game. But at the end of the day character/party craft, boss fights, and the features mentioned in the above paragraph are the big things keeping me re-playing this game. Now days most the games coming out are either ones I have played 100x already, or ones that I have played 100x already. It's nice to have something different and soak it up... Even if it's a diamond in the rough, that some gamers aren't willing to uncover.

This comment was edited on Feb 19, 2009, 01:52.
 
PS3 resurgance by GOW3 - Check! Mass Effect for PS3 - Check! Diablo 3 for consoles? I say "For sure"!
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
16. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 18, 2009, 14:35 Caveman
 
Oh god the Last Remnent, I found the game abysmal. What's even more shocking is it's from Square, who is reknowned for it's high quality JPRGs, but Last Remnent isn't even worth a rental.  
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
15. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 18, 2009, 02:37 Z9000
 
Besides Steam's apparent business plan seeming to want to turn PC gaming into a huge Xbox live type service, the problem with the approach DoW2 seems to be taking, is selling something along the lines of an extended demo... Then you get the rest of the game via downloads. Kinda defeats the purpose of buying a box game. Ah well, wake me up in a year when I can buy most PC games again.

As for the New Kings Bounty, it was pretty good but isn't it missing the whole "find the grail" part like it's namesake had? Kings Bounty was basically the precursor game of the early 80s, to Heores of Might and Magic. I haven't really dug into it like I want to, still messing with The Last Remnant play throughs.

This comment was edited on Feb 18, 2009, 02:52.
 
PS3 resurgance by GOW3 - Check! Mass Effect for PS3 - Check! Diablo 3 for consoles? I say "For sure"!
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
14. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 18, 2009, 02:21 RTSNut
 
Tom Chick said that, not Egbert.  
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
13. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 23:31 RP
 
Gamersgate was selling it for $20 last month. Had I known they were dropping their client, I would've bought it.

I'll wait for the inevitable gold edition that includes the upcoming expansion pack.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
12. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 23:19 Caveman
 
Yea King's Bounty is really fun, from the demo at least...haven't tried the full game, still waiting for a price drop, game is still $40 on D2D.  
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
11. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 22:50 Jerykk
 
So tired of RTS---time for a good TBS (Turn based strategy) game to come out, where planning and strategy actually come into play rather than who can click the fastest and mine resources the fastest, over and over and over again and can do it in their sleep to exploit the game and win.

King's Bounty.
 
Avatar 20715
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
10. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 22:28 RP
 
Heh, just wait until Halo Wars sells 5 million copies and we get nothing but cross-platform RTS games as every publisher tries for the next Halo Wars.

WiC and DoW II = RTT = extremely fun to play online.

But if you really want to get technical, The Sims is very much an RTS game. With that in mind, does the RTS genre need saving, or only a certain segment of it?

SupCom sold a million or so units, ya? Still one of my favorite RTS games,
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
9. Multiplayer balance... Feb 17, 2009, 22:26 JohnBirshire
 
Is where this game is going to succeed or fail. If Relic is even half as committed to it as Blizzard, the I'm going to buy Dawn of War II.

I am worried already however, as the majority of players on the Dawn of War II forum's are stating that almost everybody is playing Tyranid, and if you aren't playing them and your opponent is, you lose.

Hopefully Dawn of War II doesn't end up with both players using the same race, same units, and same tactics every single game like *cough* Command and Conquer 3. *cough*
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
8. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 22:09 Creston
 
I could go on and on on how much better they are online than a traditional RTS, but I love the fact there's population caps and the main focus is on actual battles and tactics, not turtling and building up a huge army

Yeah that is obviously to each their own, I personally prefer the Supreme Commander style of RTS, because that's about strategy. This game is not about strategy, it's about tactics. Which is something completely different.

This shouldn't even be called an RTS. The idea that they are "saving" the RTS genre is bullshit. Supcom and its expansion sold plenty, as did the latest C&C games. (and yes, I'm not a great fan of those either, although the campaigns are fun.)

Shit, Relic themselves sold millions and millions of copies of DoW and its expansion packs. It's a bit crazy for him to be crying about the death of the genre.

Starcraft 2 is going to sell 10 million copies.

Edit : no, it's very rare that non Valve games get a preload.

Yeah I was worried about that. Thanks Caveman.

Creston

This comment was edited on Feb 17, 2009, 22:10.
 
Avatar 15604
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
7. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 22:08 Caveman
 
No, it's very rare that non Valve games get a preload.

Caveman.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
6. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 22:06 Creston
 
Does anyone who has it pre-ordered on Steam know if they are allowing preloads?

If I can't preload it there's no point in me getting it off Steam, since it'll take my connection like 5 days to download it. So if they won't do that, I'll just get it through Gogamer.

Steam doesn't really indicate one way or the other if they are...

Creston
 
Avatar 15604
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
5. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 21:54 Marvin T. Martian
 
So tired of RTS---time for a good TBS (Turn based strategy) game to come out, where planning and strategy actually come into play rather than who can click the fastest and mine resources the fastest, over and over and over again and can do it in their sleep to exploit the game and win.

This comment was edited on Feb 17, 2009, 21:55.
 
Avatar 1746
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
4. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 21:14 eRe4s3r
 
The question is, do you consider Total war games Strategy games as well? ^^ Because if yes they easily outclass CoH, WiC and DoW in both strategy and tactics.

I personally loved WiC and thought that advanced strategy games quite a bit, because it had a superb narrative. The only rts game ever played that send shivers down my spine in several occasions. I don't see how Dawn of War could do that with its over-the-top source material. But then again, i will remain optimistic about SP ...

And aside that, in 14 days Empires: Total war is out, and who cares about SP in DoW 2 then? ;p
 
Avatar 54727
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
3. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 21:06 Caveman
 
I couldn't help mention the Command and Conquer franchise, and see how dated and stale it's formula is. I tried playing it online a few times and it's just absolutely abysmal...no strategy or tactics involved at all. I can see why that game is so hated, it's only saving grace I think are the fun campaign modes.  
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
2. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 21:01 Caveman
 
Sometimes simple things are better, take a look at how successful Valve games are based off this concept.

I personally love Dawn of War II, almost as much as World in Conflict, I could go on and on on how much better they are online than a traditional RTS, but I love the fact there's population caps and the main focus is on actual battles and tactics, not turtling and building up a huge army. It's also nice not have to manage my resources, that's why I never got into Starcraft.

Some people like the traditional RTS style, some people like the new types such as CoH, WiC, DoWII. There's plenty of room in this market for both.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
1. Re: Dawn of War II Q&A Feb 17, 2009, 20:56 Overon
 
I think it's going a bit too far saying that dow 2 is an attempt to save rts. Dow2 is simplified rts and it is more approachable for newbies let's not get ahead of ourselves here relic.  
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
17 Replies. 1 pages. Viewing page 1.
< Newer [ 1 ] Older >


footer

.. .. ..

Blue's News logo