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Out of the Blue

I saw an interview segment with Jason Batemen on the news this morning, and he seems fairly confident Arrested Development, the quirky TV comedy, will return as a movie or some other project. Here is exactly what he had to say: "Well, I think one day we will probably do some sort of reunion, whether it'd maybe be a movie, or something for cable, I mean I doubt very much a series will ever come back, but it's something that we the cast are eager to do. The boss Mitch Hurwitz, I believe is eager to do it; he's got a master plan, he's probably got timing worked out. You know you don't want to do it right away, you've got to wait a little bit, so, we'll see."

Hopeful Links! Thanks Ant and Mike Martinez.
Stories: Russia sect holes up in cave to await end of world. Lenny Bruce is not afraid.
Cows flee after seeing McDonald's. Thanks Boing Boing.
Images: Absolute Worst Product Package...Ever. Thanks Digg.
Media: Yoshi versus a Segway -- Yoshi wins everytime. Thanks Doppler.
Heynabonics.

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61. evden eve nakliyat firmalar&#305; May 17, 2008, 15:37 kardelen133
 
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60. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 22:25 Krovven
 
Hmm must be some confusion or he was some kind of liaison officer. YVR is not located within the boundrys of Vancouver so VPD has never had jurisdiction there.

Yea, just checked with some family. He was there as part of a joint task force, sharing intelligence etc, etc.


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59. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 22:18 Enahs
 
f you had watched the video for yourself before stating any of your opinions there wouldn't be any misunderstanding on your part, now would there?

I have watched the video... I watched it after I said I had not watched it, but before I said my opinion based the information I had acquired.



Therefore, everything you stated about the event was without merit.
It was not without merit. It was wrong. There is a difference.

How do you know this without watching the video?
I have.

Again...how do you know when you haven't watched the video?
Again, I have.

Again...how do you know when you haven't watched the video?

Like I said, again, I have.

You already stated you don't know Canadian law or how the YVR security works...and you haven't watched the video.
Like I just said. I have watched the video. And like I said, I asked for clarification on who and what exactly was involved. The video just shows police and guys in yellow. It does not explain who they are....Why they are there.


No SHIT! That's what people are saying...but again you didn't watch the video to see that they did not do that!

Like I said, I have watched the video. Just because I said at one point did not mean I would never or was incapable of doing so...


Airport Security are not police. RCMP are not SWAT.

That was an analogy. And as I said I was under the impression that the RCMP were not part of the airport security force. Analogy. What is hard to understand that? Why are you keeping on arguing over things I said based off of wrong information, that I have admitted to it being wrong information? I clearly attempted to get the correct information.


You don't have any facts because you didn't watch the video.

No. I have watched the video.....
The video just shows people getting tazed by somebody, it does not explain who they are and why they are their.



You want to come off as an adult and being all serious and intelligent. But I asked for clarification on misinformation and based my opinion off of the information I got. Stop fucking arguing with me over my response based on a misunderstanding. I already admitted I misunderstood wrong and my opinion was not representative of the situation.



You keep annoying me even more. I already admitted I was fucking wrong and said I agreed with your view point. Stop beating the damn dead horse.



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58. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 22:15 Krovven
 
Now that I'm home and can listen find out the time stamp...for those that are interested.

http://www.cbc.ca/mrl3/8752/bc/ondemand/video/YVRTASERVIDEO.wmv

6:00 mark (on the above link) is where the "I'm/we going to taser him?", followed by "yep" is located.

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57. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 22:03 Yosemite Sam
 
PiTiFUL...do you know when they pulled VPD out of the YVR? Simple curiosity.

Hmm must be some confusion or he was some kind of liaison officer. YVR is not located within the boundrys of Vancouver so VPD has never had jurisdiction there.

Oh and airport security may not be what you all think it is. You could not even call them rent-a-cops, in Canada only police are allowed to carry weapons, even our border guards until very recently did not carry firearms. All those guys are for is going after punk kids and watching parking lots.



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56. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 21:53 Krovven
 
Oh no, you are annoyed with me...

...if you had watched the video for yourself before stating any of your opinions there wouldn't be any misunderstanding on your part, now would there? Meatforce's response was bang on, you misunderstood because you haven't watched the video, where two distinct uniforms are shown, and who was there first and what they did (or didn't do).

Therefore, everything you stated about the event was without merit.

No, absolutely not the police are not at fault and should not be held responsible.

How do you know this without watching the video?

No. The RCMP is not at fault, at all. If they guy has not been talked to by the airport police, if they did not calmly and politely try and contain him and get lines of communication going.

Again...how do you know when you haven't watched the video?

Do NOT blame the RCMP or the tazers. They were called in to be physical, direct enforcers. Period.

Again...how do you know when you haven't watched the video?

Any kind of blame, if any, lies solely on the Airport and not the RCMP or tazers.

You already stated you don't know Canadian law or how the YVR security works...and you haven't watched the video.

If the guy was just confused and tired and emotional, the airport staff and airport polices/securities job and legal and moral obligation was to try and help him before calling the RCMP in to kick his ass because their was a physical threat.

No SHIT! That's what people are saying...but again you didn't watch the video to see that they did not do that!

But I see this situation as no different the if the LAPD could not handle a situation and calls in the SWAT team.

Airport Security are not police. RCMP are not SWAT.

From what I can tell, airport security are not even armed.

I absolutely refuse to put any blame (based on the facts I have) on the RCMP or tazers, none at all.

You don't have any facts because you didn't watch the video.

RCMP are not brought in as "enforcers". RCMP are there to help people. Want to read their Ethics and mission statement? Scroll down and click on the link I posted earlier going to the RCMP website. They did not try and peacefully sort out the situation, they went in with full intention of being aggressive.

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55. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 21:50 Warhawk
 
Airport Security arrived on the scene about 3 minutes or more before RCMP. Airport Security made no attempt to do anything other than talk on their radios.

RCMP (Federal Police stationed inside the airport) were called in and they are the ones that tased the man.

OK.....

So why are you getting on the RCMP about tasing him when they were called in by the AS? What did AS say to them about the situation? What were the instructions given to the RCMP/how was the situation described to them when they were called in? And why the hell didn't AS take care of it if he was so gentle, kind, and benign? Why couldn't AS gently lead him way for questioning if he wasn't being violent or disruptive?

Maybe the Canadian law enforcement needs to listen to Rodney King?


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And we’re out of beta, we’re releasing on time
So I’m GLaD I got burned, think of all the things we learned
For the people who are still alive
 

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54. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 21:33 Enahs
 
Huh? I was very clear.

No. As I said. My initial question was clarification on the situation as to the police forces involved. I never once claimed to know what was going on. I honestly said I was confused and asked for clarification. Meats replied, and I took from his answer that the people that tazed him was an outside police force (ala City/Provinence police being called in, implying the police force in the airport could not handle the situation, regardless if they tried or not); maybe that was a misunderstanding/communication between me and him.

I then based my comments and opinion after attempting to clarify up my questions.


I was open and honest and said I needed more information. I was clearly attempting to be fair and not let my personal beliefs and lack of information interfere.


I am really kind-a annoyed with you right now with your previous post to me (the one posted while I was responding to another post). Saying I made one assumption after another with each paragraph (not that I would even consider most of those complete paragraphs). There was no assumption at all. And the concept in each paragraph was the same, not one after another. Saying my opinions have no merit and basically saying I am spewing garbage is BS. Saying I have my facts wrong and I am misunderstanding the situation is fine. I was clearly trying to putout effort into trying to understand the situation and I see no reason to dismiss me like I was your nut-rag over what should be clear to you as a misunderstanding of the facts based on the numerous post about this topic and the fact that I started with trying to clarify something before making an opinion. My opinion is a perfectly valid one, for what I understood the situation to be. So I misunderstood the situation, big f'in deal. That is why we communicate with people and not just dismiss them!






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53. No subject Nov 15, 2007, 21:16 xXBatmanXx
 
oh noes!!!! Busted page.

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52. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 21:12 Krovven
 
PiTiFUL...do you know when they pulled VPD out of the YVR? Simple curiosity.

Sister in-laws Dad used to be stationed at the YVR and was with the VPD (talking 15 to 20 years ago). I'd ask him, but he has passed on.

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51. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 21:07 Yosemite Sam
 
They are Canada's federal police force, but actually (confusingly) are responsible for all kinds of policing in Canada. Different provinces and cities use them for different reasons, so I'm not totally sure why they responded here, but I'm assuming it's because they are responsible for domestic security and counter-terrorism.

All airports in Canada fall under RCMP jurisdiction, also in this case YVR is located in Richmond which also is under RCMP jurisdiction. Basically in Canada the federal goverment either supplys police(RCMP) or gives money to provinces\citys that opt to have their own police force.

On another more joyful subject, got Super Mario Galaxy yesterday, super sweet game, best Mario game yet.


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50. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 21:05 Krovven
 
You are now saying that the "police" are actually the "police" officers on the security force. I.E., not an outside police force. I am getting conflicting things here.

Huh? I was very clear.

Airport Security arrived on the scene about 3 minutes or more before RCMP. Airport Security made no attempt to do anything other than talk on their radios.

RCMP (Federal Police stationed inside the airport) were called in and they are the ones that tased the man.

Watch the video...pretty self explanatory.


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49. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 21:04 Enahs
 
and you do not know how the RCMP or the airport security works.

No kidding. That is why the first thing I said was asking for clarification on the situation....


You've made one assumption after another with each paragraph you've written and none of it is based on fact.

No. I made a statement based off the answers I got to my question...




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48. No subject Nov 15, 2007, 21:04 zincthallinide
 
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47. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 21:02 Enahs
 
I'd watch the video first before making opinions Enahs.

As I said. I am not sure as to the situation. You are now saying that the "police" are actually the "police" officers on the security force. I.E., not an outside police force. I am getting conflicting things here.

My previous post only had to do if, as I I understood it based off of Meat's posts, that outside an outside police force was called in.

It has nothing to do with if the guy deserved to be treated better, or was calm. My previous post was only saying that if you call an outside police force in to kick ass, then they are going to kick ass. Do not blame them for doing so.

As I said in my previous post, it is the airport and airport securities fault. The police on the security team at the airport are not an outside force, and so yes, they can be held responsible.


and used as the primary action instead of taking a less violent course of action, which really could and should have been done here.

And what I was trying to say, is if you call in an outside force to kick ass, that outside force should ONLY be called in when all other possibilities have been tried.


But now you are saying this was not an outside force, and so I agree with you (as I implied in the previous post).

The first thing I said was I was unsure of the situation.



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46. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 20:58 Krovven
 
Sorry Enahs but after reading your last post, your opinions have no merit at all. You haven't watched the video, and you do not know how the RCMP or the airport security works.

You've made one assumption after another with each paragraph you've written and none of it is based on fact.

Maybe the legal system is different in Canada.

Well DUH! Tasers aren't even sold to the public without a special permit.


http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/tasers/

This is just one excerpt from the above link.

What are the drawbacks?

The company says there are none. Critics argue that there hasn't been enough research into the safety of stun guns. They point to the deaths since 2001 of more than 50 people in North America after Taser shocks.

...

While there have been several accounts of deaths involving Tasers, the exact cause of death is often contentious

...

re: Robert Dziekanski

The Mounties speculated that he died from a rare condition called excited delirium, though the coroner's office has not concluded the cause of death.

No chance this was exasperated by being tased twice back to back?
_______________________________

I hadn't even heard about this one...less than a week from the YVR man. Very few details on this one, but sounds like it may have been needed, since he was already in custody and at the police station when he became agitated.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/montreal/story/2007/10/19/taser-ban.html

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45. No subject Nov 15, 2007, 20:55 xXBatmanXx
 
Well, enough of THAT dead horse.

Topic for tomorrow - has been a topic in the past, please hold out until tomorrow, but I know Blue may even chime in on this one:

The perfect cup of coffee.....do your research, and come back with some good shit. I am in need of a new coffee maker, and great coffee.

Please wait until tomorrow, so I have something to do tomorrow. ehehehehhe

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44. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 20:51 Krovven
 
I am confused when you guys are saying police.

Are the "police" that tazered him the Airport security?

Did the airport security call the Police in?

If you watch the video you can see Airport Security (yellow jackets) were there for several minutes, just standing there waiting, doing nothing. They most likely called in the RCMP as they were yapping on their radios off and on.

RCMP are stationed in and have their own detachment in the YVR airport, nobody was called in from outside. Vancouver City also has their own police force that is not part of the RCMP. City police used to be stationed at YVR, but I don't think they are anymore as it's technically not in Vancouver (could very well be wrong on this).

I'd watch the video first before making opinions Enahs. As Ive already stated many times, I don't have a problem with the use of a Taser...but this was way wrong from beginning to end. My problem with the use of Tasers is when it's being abused, and used as the primary action instead of taking a less violent course of action, which really could and should have been done here.



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43. Re: No subject Nov 15, 2007, 20:40 Krovven
 
Batman, that is US law, not Canadian law. It also does

I'm not disputing the fact that Tasers are useful in the right instance...this was not one of those instances.

Within the circumstances of this Fourth Amendment case, Wylie having twice broken from the officer's grasp and continuing his attempt to escape, a reasonable officer could well have chosen to use escalated, non-lethal force.

The case you have refer to was violent. The officers FIRST tried to subdue him physically. Did that happen here with the YVR case? No.

"The court finds that under the circumstances in this case, a decision to use the Taser device did not cross the 'hazy border between excessive and acceptable force'."

Note... "hazy border between excessive and acceptable force". Even the ruling stated that there is a hazy area between excessive and acceptable force. Again...the officers tried to subdue that person physically before using the Taser...my guess is they tried to talk to him before even using physical force.

http://www.safety-council.org/news/sc/2005/news.html

Says much the same thing...except they put a nice cap on the end.

"CSC’s president participated on the steering committee that provided advice and guidance to the Canadian Police Research Centre (CPRC) Board and Executive Director in the conduct of a taser safety study. A Review of Conducted Energy Devices was released in August 2005. The study supports the use of tasers/stun guns (conducted energy devices) and concludes their advantages far outweigh their dangers. It says the risks are low but manageable, but police and the public need to be more aware of these dangers.

The Canada Safety Council is now asking the CPRC to develop minimum national standards for their efficacy and safety. Relying completely on manufacturer’s specs, as is currently the case, is unaccepable."

There were 4 cops standing 1 foot away from the guy and he posed no threat whatsoever.

My point here is that the person wasn't violent at that time, nor was he ever violent towards a person, he was ready to communicate, the cops didn't try.

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42. Re: Vancouver YVR Taser video Nov 15, 2007, 20:12 Enahs
 
No. The police that were called in were the RCMP (Royal Canadian Mounted Police, AKA "The Mounties").

Ok. So this means that somebody from outside the airport was called in. Airports have their own security, and usually some key members of that security are real city or state (Provinces) police officials too.

Why would the airport call in for extra help if they had not tried to detain him?

More importantly, why would the police not come in with force in a situation like this? They are being called in to supersede the authority of another police force that should be reasonably well trained. Why would they not expect that others have tried to reason with him, and that he was a serious threat?

I mean seriously. Unless the Canadian law system is so f'ed up as to there is no security in the airport; why would the RCMP be called in unless the person was a serious threat and required immediate and swift subduing? Why would the RCMP think otherwise?


No, absolutely not the police are not at fault and should not be held responsible. They were called in as basically physical enforcers in this situation like this. They are trained, and legally obligated to go into a situation like this as the suspect is a unstable highly dangerous person who has likely caused damage to somebody else and needs immediate subduing with decisive force.


No. The RCMP is not at fault, at all. If they guy has not been talked to by the airport police, if they did not calmly and politely try and contain him and get lines of communication going. It is 100% there fault. The RCMP can only expect, in a situation like this, to be called in to handle a dangerous suspect the Airport police could not physically handle.

Do NOT blame the RCMP or the tazers. They were called in to be physical, direct enforcers. Period.

Any kind of blame, if any, lies solely on the Airport and not the RCMP or tazers.

If the guy was just confused and tired and emotional, the airport staff and airport polices/securities job and legal and moral obligation was to try and help him before calling the RCMP in to kick his ass because their was a physical threat.


Maybe the legal system is different in Canada. But I see this situation as no different the if the LAPD could not handle a situation and calls in the SWAT team. The LAPD would be fucking assholes for calling in SWAT because they did not want to do their jobs and give some guy a ticket. It is SWATS job to kick ass. The RCMP's job was to kick ass in this situation. There is no reason they should have expected that the well trained airport security and police did not even try and talk to the guy.

No sorry. I absolutely refuse to put any blame (based on the facts I have) on the RCMP or tazers, none at all. They did exactly what they were legally and morally obligated to do. They should NOT have been called in unless the guy was a serious physical threat and had been tried to be detained by the airport police and got violent. Period.

You can not call in a Police force to supersede the power of another police force, and not expect there to be a serious threat in that situation that needs immediate and swift dealing with. Period.








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