Send News. Want a reply? Read this. More in the FAQ.   News Forum - All Forums - Mobile - PDA - RSS Headlines  RSS Headlines   Twitter  Twitter
Customize
User Settings
Styles:
LAN Parties
Upcoming one-time events:

Regularly scheduled events

Hellgate EULA Follow-up

The Hellgate: London Website follows-up on our story about the Hellgate demo EULA (story) with an explanation of why it's worded the way it is. According to the post, the language that raised eyebrows is boilerplate stuff, and that reserving the right to inspect your system is to protect them against you being naughty, so you should trust them not to be naughty themselves, though they do admit that parts of the EULA are "somewhat broad in scope and potentially ambiguous in nature." Word is:

We want to make something very clear. We are in no way scanning your computers for your personal information or taking any personal information without your knowledge. The only time that Flagship or Ping0 would collect your personally identifiable information is when you actually decide to give it to us. Examples are when you create an account for Hellgate: London online or when you provide us your personal information when you enter a contest. The language in the portion of the EULA that has been cited is actually fairly standardized language that is used in the vast majority of EULAs for recent on-line software. It was unfortunately also somewhat broad in scope and potentially ambiguous in nature in an attempt to keep the legalese at a minimum.

This catch-all statement was included so that we have the ability to determine if someone is using hacks, unauthorized mods or other abusive applications while playing the game which spoils the gameplay for everyone else. We also use this catch-all to protect other parties offering technical support, such as our online provider, Ping0. This is a completely legitimate function and other leaders in the MMO space do it in an effort to stop hackers and provide better technical support. In order to stop hacks and cheats, as well as attempts at outright fraud, we may need the ability to scan our player’s computers for applications running at the same time as our game. This paragraph was designed to be able to allow for such functionality. It is also important to point out that EA does not determine what we do in regards to online and offline for our game security.

Also, this has nothing specifically to do with advertisements. EA has nothing do with Massive or potential ad-serving in Hellgate: London. First and foremost, any in-game advertising that would be in Hellgate: London is there to simulate how London looks in the real-world. Ads that represent this have been in the entirety of the beta, and in fact, have been shown in the game for well over a year. The fact is that we did not agree to potentially have ads in the game just to make more money. If we did not work with Massive, we would have to get individual approvals from every single company that we want to feature in the Underground stations. This is simply too time consuming and it’s much better to have the experts to do it, allowing us time to focus on making Hellgate: London better and better while getting a realistic portrayal of London in the process.

Should we elect to serve ads, they must be approved by us, Flagship Studios. We would demand that they be in-context with the game world - aged, weathered, only shown in appropriate areas, just as the static posters you see in the Stations are now. We have no interest in putting giant, bright-white billboard in the middle of your battles or having you wield swords of Brand X Cola.

Finally, Hellgate: London and all of the online play and components are controlled by Flagship Studios and Ping0. We’re all gamers here, and we’re as sensitive to protecting our personal information as you are. This is why we have spent the past six months becoming a member of the ESRB Privacy Online certification program. This means that we’re meeting the most rigorous standards in the industry for protecting your privacy and the information that you provide us.

View
58 Replies. 3 pages. Viewing page 1.
< Newer [ 1 2 3 ] Older >

58. Re: No subject Jun 14, 2008, 07:28 the
 
* REMOVED *
This comment was deleted on Mar 9, 2009, 09:02.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
57. No subject Oct 28, 2007, 20:20 Theo
 
i think some folks need to have a huge group unbunching of thier panties, personally. Whatever way you look at it, ten million games have wording pretty much down this line.

its already there on software you own, i promise.

whats blatantly happening here is the vulture brigade from blues (and you gotta love them) is watching a new devloper make PR screw up after PR screwup; and they are diving for the left over meat. I think realistically the game is fun but they [flagship] would be much better getting heads down and producing some content FAST, to show people the month fee option isnt a total cry for cash. like i said, the vultures smell roadkill...

keeping my fingers crossed personally, as i like the game and would like to see it do well. in fact, if after the first month of release they have some content and 80% of all the bugs fixed, i would most likely subscibe...

The problem i think for the ones amongst us who arnt caught up in the panty bunching; is that we know there's probably at least 2 months worth of bug fixing to do/ let alone content work.

Still, cant wait to play through the basic game with my house mate online, should be a entertaining evening with some beer and chips.

/Theo

This comment was edited on Oct 28, 20:24.
 
Avatar 23977
 
Everyone on Bluesnews is synical, get over it.
edit: i cant spell, this is my disclaimer.
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
56. Re: No subject Oct 25, 2007, 16:47 Max Schaefer
 
Yes, that point was wrong. We will not sell your personal information to advertisers, and have said that. I'm not sure how much more clear I can make it. The EULA does not authorize us to do so, but rather we reserve the right to collect the information "to facilitate the provision of software updates, dynamically served content, product support and other services to you, including online play." No personal information about you is ever shared with anyone, much less sold. Period.

Perhaps you're confused with the provision where we aggregate non-personal data of our overall userbase, things like how many customers use which video card, to better target our products. That is not personal data, just overall statistics. In contrast to your claim, Blizzard does this, too. From their Privacy Policy: "Blizzard may use this information to generate aggregate statistics about our user community and may provide such information to advertisers and/or our partners. In addition, Blizzard may use such information for security, system integrity (the prevention of hacking, cheats, etc.), or enforcement purposes."

I hope this clears up any confusion about that.


This comment was edited on Oct 25, 16:48.
 
Max Schaefer
C.O.O., Flagship Studios
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
55. Re: No subject Oct 25, 2007, 16:18 m00t
 
Er, I guess you failed to comprehend the rest of my post.
They only state a small number of things they could use them for and then go on to state they can do anything they want with it whatsoever. How did you miss that part?

Hellgate basically states they will sell it to any/all advertising partners. Valve's EULA would let them do this but doesn't spell out directly that they are.

See how that's Vague and Hellgate's is specific in this case?

Maybe you're confused because there are 2 things people are finding objectionable?
The scanning of people's computers for cheats (Valve and Blizzard do this *EXACT* thing),
and the sharing of information about them (Blizzard doesn't allow for this, Valve does but does not spell out that they would or wouldn't, and Hellgate allows and specifically states they will).

 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
54. Re: Getting nervous Max? Oct 25, 2007, 15:49 Undocumented Alien
 
For ongoing content, a publisher can either choose to do a monthly subscription, or make expansions.

Or, do what ArenaNet does with Guild Wars and provide ongoing content FOR FREE and also release expansions to generate revenue WITHOUT in-game ads.

 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
53. Re: Getting nervous Max? Oct 25, 2007, 14:10 Max Schaefer
 
Am I nervous? Of course. We're about to launch a huge online game in a few days, and if you're not nervous doing that, there's something wrong with you. But I'm confident in our game, our economic model, and the enormous effort we've put into making this game. We have a passionate and talented group of developers who've spent entirely too many nights here at the office because they believe in what we're doing.

When we made Diablo II back at Blizzard, our lingering regret was that we couldn't expand the world as much as we wanted. We made an expansion, but it was expensive to produce, and took a year. Our customers have told us that they want more frequent updates than that.

For ongoing content, a publisher can either choose to do a monthly subscription, or make expansions. The reason we chose to take the subscription route is the inherent efficiency in doing so. We can do more frequent updates, and don't have to produce and ship boxes all over the world. The test of this model is whether we provide good value for your subscription dollar. We have the team and plans set to do just that, and we fully understand that we will be judged based on what we deliver.

If you don't want to subscribe, unlike almost every other subscription game out there, we are also offering a huge free online component right out of the box. You can play forever and enjoy a metric ton of content without every paying a dime after you buy the game. We understand that not all players want to spend $10 a month, and respect that.

Our EULA, as has been explained, does limit the collection of information to our legitimate purposes, and to whom the information may be given. EA is the publisher, so it's their language, but it does specify that only EA (and it's affiliates), and "Related Parties" can do the security checks on your computer. In another section, The "Related Parties" are defined specifically as Flagship Studios, Ping0, Namco-Bandai, and Aria systems (they do the billing.) That's it. The people running the game can get the information necessary to responsibly run an online game. There is no conspiracy here, and really no alternative.

Max Schaefer
C.O.O. Flagship Studios
This comment was edited on Oct 25, 14:10.
 
Max Schaefer
C.O.O., Flagship Studios
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
52. No subject Oct 25, 2007, 09:59 KilrathiAce
 
damage been already done.

 
Avatar 7413
 
"On 2646.215 I myself attacked & destroyed TCS Tiger's Claw in my Jalthi heavy fighter"
Bakhtosh Redclaw Nar Kiranka
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
51. Re: Getting nervous Max? Oct 25, 2007, 07:39 Kevlar
 
And for a team with such a stout design pedigree from Blizzard, this obviously antagonistic relationship with the community through design, PR and pricing decisions (which didn't just pop up overnight with the EULA, by the way) is truly shameful.

Max, this isn't just the EULA - this is the final straw for a number of gamers who have observed a number of decisions made that are not made in their best interests or to make a better game, and a few (debatable) stalwarts like Valve and ArenaNet remind us it doesn't have to be this way. You went from being impervious to criticism as the makers of a new-Diablo-with-zombies to placing serious doubt in at least *my* purchase through the fact that there will be an inherently unfair playing field online, whether I subscribe or not (I won't on principle if I do make the purchase). I thought you guys would have already gotten the hint when all the comments started brewing around when the news hit, followed shortly by Penny Arcade lambasting your pricing scheme. Guess not.

By the way, if the sharing information clause in the EULA is intended strictly for sharing information, why wasn't that strictly defined, then? Oh, right - because your lawyers specifically made it vague in case you lie or change your mind later, and therefore it's legally better to remain vague. All these decisions smack of best practices driven by the legal department, the PR team, and the bottom line - wonder how the game's doing in all of that?

 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
50. Re: Getting nervous Max? Oct 24, 2007, 22:40 nin
 
PS : Your crazy ideas with regards to gimping your game, charging 10 bucks a month for stuff that should be just included in the box and for "extra content" which does not include any expansion packs and is not in any way guaranteed, then stating that if you ever stop paying that monthly fee at any one point you'll lose access to any and all "perks" that you gained from that fee, has caused you to lose at least MY sale for your game.

If you guys survive to make another game, you might want to think about that.


Preach on, Brother Creston!



------------------------------------------------
"I feel compelled to comment on Zephalfdkasj's completely irrelevant and lengthy tangent into concealed pistol carry...Rarely is extreme insecurity so painfully, transparently obvious."
 
http://store.nin.com/index.php?cPath=10
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
49. Getting nervous Max? Oct 24, 2007, 21:02 Creston
 
Your game is sure drawing a lot of negative attention, huh? As a start-up, it might have been wiser to skip all the bullshit until you actually got established in the market.

"We make no apologies about wanting to make money as this is a business"

Really? You make no apologies? That's funny. If I look at the little quote at the top of the news item, it says :
"The fact is that we did not agree to potentially have ads in the game just to make more money"

You guys are backpedalling so fast you can't even remember what you say from day to day anymore. It helps if you train your choir to all sing the same story, it might make you look a little more believable.

PS : Your crazy ideas with regards to gimping your game, charging 10 bucks a month for stuff that should be just included in the box and for "extra content" which does not include any expansion packs and is not in any way guaranteed, then stating that if you ever stop paying that monthly fee at any one point you'll lose access to any and all "perks" that you gained from that fee, has caused you to lose at least MY sale for your game.

If you guys survive to make another game, you might want to think about that.

Also, your monnicker of a "free game" is bullshit. The game costs 50 bucks. There's nothing fucking free about it.

Creston

 
Avatar 15604
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
48. Re: No subject Oct 24, 2007, 20:52 Creston
 
That being said... IT'S JUST A GAME PEOPLE. Getting this bent out of shape for a few gigs of code and artwork is pathetic

Do you really not understand that people are just making comments on a game? Do you really imagine that people are sitting at home with steam coming out of their ears and their blood pressure spiking at ~ 220/180?

If so, you need to get out more and observe more of the world. Get out of your parents' basement for a change.

Hellgate looks like a game I might enjoy. I refuse to buy it because of their retarded pricing scheme and partially because of their cunthole EULA. Many people here agree with me on that.

Since we hang out here for a certain amount of time, we'll comment to that effect on threads with regards to the game.

That's all. Really. I couldn't care less if Hellgate does well or not, although for the sake of PC Gaming, I hope it dies just as horrible a fucking death as episodic gaming did.

So, really, you can relax. Nobody is about to die over this. You might want to remember every now and then that this is a site with news about games, which allows for COMMENTS ON THOSE GAMES.

Nobody's picketing over this. Take a deep breath.

Creston


 
Avatar 15604
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
47. Re: No subject Oct 24, 2007, 19:49 Krovven
 
The only thing they *say* or *appear* to use them for.

Thanks for making my point. Valve SAYS what they are doing and what it's for.

The EA/Flagship EULA does not say what it's for and intentionally they left it very vague and wide open for interpretation. They admitted they left it vague for "legalese" reasons. So don't tell me or anyone else here that the EULA for Hellgate is specific and the Valve one is not.

If you need to send a COO from the company to message boards to admit the EULA is vague, explain why it is so, then also explain what they will be doing with that information, you're EULA is very poorly written and too vague.

----------------------------------------------------
Currently fragging in Team Fortress 2, Episode 2, Portal and CoH Opposing Fronts.

Join the "Blues News" Steam Community Group. http://steamcommunity.com/groups/bluesnews/
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
46. Re: No subject Oct 24, 2007, 18:53 m00t
 
The only thing they *say* or *appear* to use them for. It does not specifically say they cannot (or will not) use them for anything else. And they do scan your computer.

Steam and the Steam Software may include functionality designed to identify software or hardware processes or functionality that may give a player an unfair competitive advantage when playing multiplayer versions of any Steam Software, other Valve products, or modifications thereof ("Cheats"). You agree that you will not create or assist third parties in any way to create Cheats. You agree that you will not directly or indirectly disable, circumvent, or otherwise interfere with the operation of software designed to prevent or report the use of Cheats. You acknowledge and agree that either Valve or any online multiplayer host may refuse to allow you to participate in certain online multiplayer games if you use Cheats in connection with Steam or the Steam Software. Further, you acknowledge and agree that an online multiplayer host may report your use of Cheats to Valve, and Valve may communicate your history of use of Cheats to other online multiplayer hosts for Valve products. Valve may terminate your Account or a particular Subscription for any conduct or activity that Valve believes is illegal, constitutes a Cheat, or which otherwise negatively affects the enjoyment of Steam by other Subscribers. You acknowledge that Valve is not required to provide you notice before terminating your Subscriptions(s) and/or Account, but it may choose to do so.

How do you think they get access to their computer statistics? They do ask you right before they do it, but it's less spelled out in the EULA. Also, if you bought things over Steam, Valve has a lot of your personal information already. Likewise with Hellgate if you pay the sub in a manner other than gamecard.

Arguably, the Hellgate EULA just spells out in specific what they feel they have the right to do which would be more forthcoming. The Valve one is vague in what it will collect and extremely broad in what it can do with it (Anything), the Hellgate one is explicit, but has marketing ties.

Really, I don't see what the big deal is. A lot of companies have done this for a long time, why are people crying their eyes out over this one?

 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
45. Re: No subject Oct 24, 2007, 18:19 Krovven
 
User Generated Information may include, but is not limited to, chat, forum posts, screen names, game selections, player performances, usage data, suggestions about Valve products or services, and error notifications.

Moot, nowhere in there does it suggest that they may take your personal information or scan your computer to get access to that information. Everything they cover is game or website related...specific to their games. And the only thing they DO use this information for is the game stats, which ARE publicly displayed.

Now lets look at the Hellgate EULA:

You agree that EA, its affiliates, and each Related Party may collect, use, store and transmit technical and related information that identifies your computer, including without limitation your Internet Protocol address, operating system, application software and peripheral hardware...EA and/or the Related Parties may also use this information in the aggregate and, in a form which does not personally identify you, to improve our products and services and we may share that aggregate data with our third party service providers.

MAJOR difference between the two. If you can't already comprehend how different they are, then I can't explain it any other way.

----------------------------------------------------
Currently fragging in Team Fortress 2, Episode 2, Portal and CoH Opposing Fronts.

Join the "Blues News" Steam Community Group. http://steamcommunity.com/groups/bluesnews/
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
44. Re: No subject Oct 24, 2007, 17:27 Undocumented Alien
 
On the subject of the in-game advertising, poor Kaiser has been misinterpreted more often than I could identify. We chose to have Massive stream ads into our game for two main reasons: It lets us have realistic ads that we approve and which are context-appropriate without having to make up fictional companies or movies or whatever. This really does up the realism of the scene. And secondly, we will make some incremental revenue on it, but it really did start with wanting to have realistic ads in the subway tubes. We make no apologies about wanting to make money as this is a business (and a start-up at that,) but if we didn't think this added to the game, we wouldn't do it. Please ask someone who's in the beta or get some screen shots and see for yourself what the ads look like. It's got to be one of the most unobtrusive, context-appropriate use of ads that have ever appeared in a computer game.

Sorry, but being a start-up company doesn't justify charging PC Gamers a $10 monthly subscription fee on top of the $50 box value and then saying in-game ad placement is a necessity for monetary survival and realism. In-game ads for realism in a FICTIONAL game, it would seem to me that FICTIONAL ads would be MORE appropriate then REAL ads. I have no problem with FSS wanting to make some money, I agree it is a business, but I would think that IF your game is as good as you THINK it is, then you should get PLENTY of revenue from box sales and monthly subscriptions as well future expansion packs. Companies like ArenaNet offer the same game model WITHOUT a monthly subscription for certain 'perks' nor do they use ads and their game(s) (GuildWars and Expansions) are doing fine, they are still in business some how.

The placement of 3rd party ads is a kick in the groin to gamers and a sad path for the future of gaming, much like movie threaters, Sports (WAY to much advertising now, we get sponsor ads within the game now, not just commercials anymore, stat lines are now sponsored by blah blah blah), and I guess now gaming. Next we will see a dialog box pop up in a game that will say, "That head shot was brought to you by NVidia, the way it was meant to be played". Thanks for being one of the pioneers to bring this greedy model to our hobby, it will only get worse and worse. Thanks.

Games used to take us away from reality, let us enjoy ourselves for an hour or two, but thanks to people like yourself Mr. Schaefer corporate greed slowly seeps into hobby.



This comment was edited on Oct 24, 17:31.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
43. No subject Oct 24, 2007, 16:40 Max Schaefer
 
Hello, I just posted this in the other EULA thread:

"Greetings. My name is Max Schaefer, and I'm C.O.O. of Flagship Studios. Wow, this has spun way out of control! With any luck, I can hopefully clarify some things.

On the topic of the Consent to Use of Data, people are reading much more into this than there is. We gather data specifically to address technical support problems, to deliver patches, and to prevent cheating. This is something most every internet game does, and for good reason. We don't have nefarious goals with this, but need the ability to do these things to provide good customer support and create a secure playing environment that's as cheat-free as possible. Flagship Studios is a relatively small operation, and our focus is 100% on making Hellgate: London (and Mythos) as good as they can be. We're somewhat puzzled as to why our EULA, as opposed to all the others that have the same language, is singled out, and are distressed at the confusion it has caused. Maybe EA's legal wording isn't optimal (it's legalese, after all), but it's grounded in rational and necessary concepts that anyone running an online game needs to adhere to.

On the subject of the in-game advertising, poor Kaiser has been misinterpreted more often than I could identify. We chose to have Massive stream ads into our game for two main reasons: It lets us have realistic ads that we approve and which are context-appropriate without having to make up fictional companies or movies or whatever. This really does up the realism of the scene. And secondly, we will make some incremental revenue on it, but it really did start with wanting to have realistic ads in the subway tubes. We make no apologies about wanting to make money as this is a business (and a start-up at that,) but if we didn't think this added to the game, we wouldn't do it. Please ask someone who's in the beta or get some screen shots and see for yourself what the ads look like. It's got to be one of the most unobtrusive, context-appropriate use of ads that have ever appeared in a computer game.

Again, we're distressed by this controversy, and would like to get the clarifications out there as best we can, and we will try to be as responsive as is possible given we're extremely swamped trying to get ready for our big US release on October 31."

I'd also like to respond to the previous poster. EA reserves the right to share the data with "Related Parties", not just anyone. And "Related Parties" is defined elsewhere as: "Flagship Studios, Inc. PING0, LLC, Aria Systems LLC and Namco Bandai Games America Inc." All of those are directly working on the game, and have legitimate need for the information in order to provide service. No personalized information goes anywhere else, and our "third party service providers" are partners like Paypal, and they only get aggregated, non-personalized information as needed. All of this is industry standard, and shouldn't be causing the firestorm that it seems to be!

We have entered an era where people are actually starting to look at EULAs and other agreements that we seen to have to agree to with increasing frequency. At Flagship Studios, we are gamers and software users and share your concerns as individuals as well as as a company. We encourage you to read these agreements, and to challenge them. This is your right and responsibility, and it will lead to better policies and agreements. I think our agreement is fair, however, and a careful reading shows that it isn't overreaching, nefarious, or onerous, but ensures that we can do our jobs to provide technical support, to update the game, and to help stop cheating and hacks.
 
Max Schaefer
C.O.O., Flagship Studios
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
42. Re: No subject Oct 24, 2007, 14:27 m00t
 
As for the 'spyware', honestly it sounds just like Warden that WoW uses, or Half life 2's VAC.

Difference here is that those 2 companies are not 'reserving the right to share with their partners, without limitations'.


Valve:
"7. USER GENERATED INFORMATION

"User Generated Information" means any information made available to other users through your use of multi-user features of Steam or to Valve through your use of the Steam Software. User Generated Information may include, but is not limited to, chat, forum posts, screen names, game selections, player performances, usage data, suggestions about Valve products or services, and error notifications. Subject to the Valve privacy policy referenced in Section 1 above, as applicable, you expressly grant Valve the complete and irrevocable right to use, reproduce, modify, create derivative works from, distribute, transmit, broadcast, and otherwise communicate, and publicly display and perform the User Generated Information and derivative works thereof in any form, anywhere, with or without attribution to you, and without any notice or compensation to you of any kind.
"


That's pretty broad and explicitely states they reserve the right to distribute information gathered from various usage of their service.
"any information made available to other users through your use of multi-user features of Steam or to Valve through your use of the Steam Software. "
Which sounds like it would cover any sort of system information you send them (granted, they do ask...)

Blizzard:
# WHEN RUNNING, THE PROGRAM MAY MONITOR YOUR COMPUTER'S RANDOM ACCESS MEMORY (RAM) AND/OR CPU PROCESSES FOR UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAMS RUNNING CONCURRENTLY WITH WORLD OF WARCRAFT. AN "UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAM" AS USED HEREIN SHALL BE DEFINED AS ANY THIRD PARTY SOFTWARE, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION ANY "ADDON" OR "MOD," THAT IN BLIZZARD'S SOLE DETERMINATION: (i) ENABLES OR FACILITATES CHEATING OF ANY TYPE; (ii) ALLOWS USERS TO MODIFY OR HACK THE WORLD OF WARCRAFT INTERFACE, ENVIRONMENT, AND/OR EXPERIENCE IN ANY WAY NOT EXPRESSLY AUTHORIZED BY BLIZZARD; OR (iii) INTERCEPTS, "MINES," OR OTHERWISE COLLECTS INFORMATION FROM OR THROUGH THE PROGRAM. IN THE EVENT THAT THE PROGRAM DETECTS AN UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAM, BLIZZARD MAY (a) COMMUNICATE INFORMATION BACK TO BLIZZARD, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION YOUR ACCOUNT NAME, DETAILS ABOUT THE UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAM DETECTED, AND THE TIME AND DATE THE UNAUTHORIZED THIRD PARTY PROGRAM WAS DETECTED; AND/OR (b) EXERCISE ANY OR ALL OF ITS RIGHTS UNDER SECTION 6 OF THIS AGREEMENT, WITH OR WITHOUT PRIOR NOTICE TO THE USER.
# WHEN THE PROGRAM IS RUNNING, BLIZZARD MAY OBTAIN CERTAIN IDENTIFICATION INFORMATION ABOUT YOUR COMPUTER AND ITS OPERATING SYSTEM, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION YOUR HARD DRIVES, CENTRAL PROCESSING UNIT, IP ADDRESS(ES) AND OPERATING SYSTEM(S), FOR PURPOSES OF IMPROVING THE PROGRAM AND/OR THE SERVICE, AND TO POLICE AND ENFORCE THE PROVISIONS OF THIS AGREEMENT AND THE EULA.
# Blizzard may, with or without notice to you, disclose your Internet Protocol (IP) address(es), personal information, and information about you and your activities in response to a written request by law enforcement, a court order or other legal process. Blizzard may use or disclose your personal information if Blizzard believes that doing so may protect your safety or the safety of others.
# BLIZZARD MAY RECORD YOUR CHAT SESSIONS AND OTHER ELECTRONIC COMMUNICATION TRANSMITTED OR RECEIVED THROUGH THE GAME AND YOU CONSENT TO SUCH MONITORING OR LOGGING.


Which does not appear to contain language indicating their right to distribute the data for purposes other than ToS enforcement and police investigation. So yeah, they are subtley different, but Steam (Valve) and Blizzard are both much larger entities than FSS so I'm not surprised they don't feel the need to whore out their customers to other people when they can do it entirely on an internal basis and keep any gains for themselves.

 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
41. Re: No subject Oct 24, 2007, 14:25 Flatline
 
At least its not about loans and mortgages.

Actually, that would be more realistic, at least in California.

What would be kind of cool would be if the ads matched all the ads that were shown at any given day with what's actually in London's underground.

I think it's funny everyone is going ballistic over this. Nobody complains when you see sponsors or billboards in racing games, because let's face it, corporate feces is a way of life in those games.

I'm passing on this game for now, but not because of all the crap and panty-wadding going on in this thread. I have too many other games I need to finish, to much real life going on, to play yet another open-ended game.

That being said... IT'S JUST A GAME PEOPLE. Getting this bent out of shape for a few gigs of code and artwork is pathetic. Especially when everything that's been going on with HGL has already gone on with other online games. I hate to break it to all of you chest-pounders, but the time to draw the line in the sand happened a long, long time ago, but you were to busy cracking out on World of Warcraft to want to do anything about it. Besides, it was your beloved Blizzard, who *never* does anything wrong. So you let them and other companies set the standard, and now others are making use of that standard and you're saying "what the hell? It's not Blizzard or Valve? Okay now I'm going to draw the line!"

There's a lot of windmills out there to tilt at, this one is no different than the others.

 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
40. No subject Oct 24, 2007, 14:04 PropheT
 

You had be agreeing with you until the final sentence, when I just wrote you off as a corporate shill.


It may seem weird to you, but there's still a lot of people out there who like to play games more than bitching about them.

 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
39. Re: No subject Oct 24, 2007, 14:01 Hornet303
 
Frijoles,

Right about the nVidia poster. The alienware poster is new to me too. In a magazine, of course, but the general public has no idea what alienware is.

At least its not about loans and mortgages.

 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
58 Replies. 3 pages. Viewing page 1.
< Newer [ 1 2 3 ] Older >


footer

Blue's News logo