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Out of the Blue

We had a fine old time cooking out yesterday. I also got to use my little charcoal lighting device that gets the coals burning without lighter fluid. I also learned a lesson about its use, as I left the lid open on the side of the grill as I fired up the coals, and it turns out this thing generates so much heat it was able to roast the paint off the inside of the lid, even though this is designed to withstand being closed over the grill while cooking. BTW, the smell of flame-proof paint cooking is especially noxious.

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24. Re: No subject May 31, 2007, 04:16 Tango
 
It was on the grill in that stand-by up position... it didn't strike me that the proximity of the lid to the chimney was a problem
No... wow that's quite some heat being thrown off. What sort of charcoal was it - lumpwood? Nuclear fusion charcoal?!

 
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23. Re: No subject May 30, 2007, 11:48  Blue 
 
Why was the lid on? Or was it just nearby?

It was on the grill in that stand-by up position... it didn't strike me that the proximity of the lid to the chimney was a problem, at least until people started passing out from the poison gas burning the coating inside the lid produced.
 
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22. Re: No subject May 30, 2007, 11:40 Enahs
 
Nobody with such poor basic English could possibly be a threat

My engrish is grate, isntit?


You guys make fun of my quick fairly thoughtless typing, yet I have received tons (yes, I weighed them) of compliments on my writing for various things I actually took the time to work on.

I so hate you guys. I hope you have a grilling accident and can no longer grow hair on a certain part of your leg!


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This comment was edited on May 30, 11:41.
 
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21. Re: No subject May 30, 2007, 11:21 Tango
 
Don't suck up to him... he won't stop hating you.
Nobody with such poor basic English could possibly be a threat ;P:)

 
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20. Re: No subject May 30, 2007, 11:19 Tango
 
Yes I did... as I described, this super-heating of lump charcoal was how I seared the paint off the inside lid of my Weber.
Why was the lid on? Or was it just nearby? I usually light our chimney and just plonk it on the lower of the two grills (where the coals would sit) and leave the lid off (or tuck it into that thing at the side which holds the lid). Alternatively, putting it on a couple of bricks on the earth would do. Oh, and spray it with a hose when you're done. I have a patch on my leg where hair won't grow from accidentally brushing against it.

The Weber we have comes with that hinged grill, but it's not ideal. If you're having a big cook up, chances are you're using the space. If you're not, chances are you're using the coal baskets which are completely inaccessible from the side (if set up for direct heat). If you're not using the baskets at all (and I'm not sure why you wouldn't, burns for longer and hotter) then you wind up with a bunch of coal at the sides, not burning and a whole load of ash thrown up from disturbing the burning coals.

Nope, the only way to refill a Weber is to light another load of coals in the chimney, lift off the grate and pour it in. The added bonus of having sparks fly everywhere just makes it all the better.

 
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19. Re: No subject May 30, 2007, 10:35 Enahs
 
This defies every bit of experise I have read on the topic

Yes well, the problem with cooking is that everybody quotes every "myth" to come before them. Because, why argue with it as the food is damn tasty!

But I'm still not getting a gass grill.

Unwashed heathen!
No, as I said, the important thing is getting your food to taste good, however you do it. As long as you use some kind of grill I am cool, for those sicks disgusting people with no grill.....ugh...just....ugh!


Don't suck up to him... he won't stop hating you.
In fact, I hate him even more now! And you to!


Yes I did... as I described, this super-heating of lump charcoal was how I seared the paint off the inside lid of my Weber.
Wait, inside? Why in the hell would your grill have paint on the inside? That just seems silly to me. Are you sure it was paint you seared off?!



As for adding coals to the fire after it's going, you need to get the grate with the hinges on each side:

http://www.amazon.com/Weber-70915-Replacement-Hinged-Cooking/dp/B00004RAKX

Except, that grate sucks for cooking steaks!
You need a thicker denser grate, so it can hold more heat and transfer more to the meat quicker. Also, the Nickel is not the best at transferring heat, too!
My lovely and fairly cheap charcoal grill came with a door on the side to access the charcoal and add more, etc.



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18. Re: No subject May 30, 2007, 10:10  Blue 
 
Are you drunk Blue?!

Sure, it's after 9:00 am, isn't it?

Did you buy one of those chimneys? We got one for our Weber and it's excellent. http://www.weber.com/bbq/img/accessories/allfuel_05_large.jpg

Gets those coals hot in 20 minutes, though you have to be a little careful with lumpwood - it tends to burn so hot it burns itself up! I like to get a good lumpwood fire going then add some charcoal briquettes for a combination of super heat and long-lasting coals without faffing about adding coals (which is a bit of a nightmare with a Weber).

Yes I did... as I described, this super-heating of lump charcoal was how I seared the paint off the inside lid of my Weber.

As for adding coals to the fire after it's going, you need to get the grate with the hinges on each side:

http://www.amazon.com/Weber-70915-Replacement-Hinged-Cooking/dp/B00004RAKX

I'm agreed with Enahs though, gas and charcoal are both good for different things. If I had to choose, I'd go for charcoal every time though.

Don't suck up to him... he won't stop hating you.


This comment was edited on May 30, 10:12.
 
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17. Re: No subject May 30, 2007, 09:34 Tango
 
This defies every bit of experise... ...I'm still not getting a gass grill
Are you drunk Blue?!

Did you buy one of those chimneys? We got one for our Weber and it's excellent. http://www.weber.com/bbq/img/accessories/allfuel_05_large.jpg

Gets those coals hot in 20 minutes, though you have to be a little careful with lumpwood - it tends to burn so hot it burns itself up! I like to get a good lumpwood fire going then add some charcoal briquettes for a combination of super heat and long-lasting coals without faffing about adding coals (which is a bit of a nightmare with a Weber).

I'm agreed with Enahs though, gas and charcoal are both good for different things. If I had to choose, I'd go for charcoal every time though.

 
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16. Re: No subject May 30, 2007, 08:00  Blue 
 
I am not sure what you mean by "burn carbon dioxide"

My brain said "monoxide," but my fingers typed "dioxide."

and I am not just making the temperature I achieve up with my gas grill out of my head. I have used, because I am a nerd, non-contact IR thermometers on it before, as well as used it to melt certain things in a pan at high temperature.

This defies every bit of experise I have read on the topic, but I guess I can't argue with what seem to be your own experiments.

But I'm still not getting a gass grill.
 
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15. Re: No subject May 29, 2007, 23:44 Enahs
 
Okay, the main site just went a bit wonky with respect to font colors.. anyone else see that?

No. Lay off the weed man!

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14. Re: No subject May 29, 2007, 23:42 Dan =0)
 
Okay, the main site just went a bit wonky with respect to font colors.. anyone else see that?

Dan =0)
 
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13. Re: No subject May 29, 2007, 23:21 Enahs
 
That's fine, but you have it absolutely backwards.

No. Well, it truly is dependent on the person and their skill level, desire, and equipment and knowledge.

The upside to gas is that you can control a low even heat, and simmer things without having to try and manage a weenie pile of coals, but they rarely get above 600F.

Yes, gas is easiest to do low slow cocking, but you can not do smoking with it (well you can, but it is pointless, as there is to much water vapor forced in the air which prevents the smoke from really "diggin' in" to the meat).

Charcoal is not hard to do low slow cooking, it is in fact fairly trivial once you get the embers to their mojo, which just takes practice and experience with your individual grill. But, yes it does take practice and you have to learn your grill, but once you do it is very easy and gives a better flavor for slow cooking with a little smoke for BAM!

The upside to gas is that you can control a low even heat, and simmer things without having to try and manage a weenie pile of coals, but they rarely get above 600F.

You say that it is hard to get gas over 600F, but you are simply wrong; or every gas grill you have used has had a cheaper burner that is undersized for the grill. I hate to keep using the word trivial, but it is quite trivial to get a gas grill well over 1500F. One of the keys is to have "fake charcoal" (basically they are ceramic charcoal shaped brikets that go right about the flame) , other wise the heat can escape very fast. Using the gas grill, with a proper sized burner, you can have it "rocket hot" in ~10 min, it takes so much longer with charcoal.

Propane, with typical air composition at sea level has a peak combustion temperature of ~3,600F. I do not know why you keep wanting to saying it can not get hot enough. If you have the air-to-propane mixture correct, and the appropriate setup for the grill you can get it, for cooking purpose, just as hot as a charcoal grill in 1/4th the time.

Really, both gas and charcoal grilling, the key is to get the grilling grate hot (for cooking things hot and fast like steaks), and also just important is the material of the grilling grate. If you do not have a good grilling grate, it will not transfer the heat fast enough, as air is a poor conductor of heat. With gas you can simply do this much faster when done right. It does not make it better, just different (which is why I own and use all options!). And point of fact, from my own experiences, I have never bought a gas grill that came with a good grate (but then again, I never bought one of those $800 grills either) and I had to buy my own. The charcoal grill I am currently using came with a superb grilling grate.

I seem to recall this came up when someone said it was better to cook steaks at home than to order them in a restaurant, was that you also?
Yes, I said that. But if you can not cook a good steak, then it is obviously better to eat out! It is not hard at all, once you learn how to and properly maintain your grill (of any kind) to cook the best steak at home. You need, of course an excellent source of meat that is comparable to the well aged beef you find at a good steak house.

A grill can get hot enough to burn carbon dioxide, which is something like 900F.


I am not sure what you mean by "burn carbon dioxide" as no such thing happens. You can cause carbon dioxide to react with other carbon dioxide molecules to form various superoxides of carbon, but that requires not only high temperature but high pressure as well.

Are you sure you are not thinking of incomplete combustion and producing carbon monoxide? Which fyi, can easily happen if your gas grill sucks and is not "configured" for lack of a better word, properly. Which would leed to lower temperatures.


*edit*
And note, "slow cooking" over a charcoal grill while also smoking the food is NOT the same as "smoking" the food.

*edit 2* and I am not just making the temperature I achieve up with my gas grill out of my head. I have used, because I am a nerd, non-contact IR thermometers on it before, as well as used it to melt certain things in a pan at high temperature.

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This comment was edited on May 29, 23:43.
 
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12. Re: No subject May 29, 2007, 21:51  Blue 
 
Gas for cooking things like steak, hot and fast.

Charcoal for low slow cooking, certain kinds of roast and fish

That's fine, but you have it absolutely backwards.

The upside to gas is that you can control a low even heat, and simmer things without having to try and manage a weenie pile of coals, but they rarely get above 600F.

The upside to charcoal and wood is the ability to go way beyond that, and into the high temperatures required to properly cook a steak. I seem to recall this came up when someone said it was better to cook steaks at home than to order them in a restaurant, was that you also? A grill can get hot enough to burn carbon dioxide, which is something like 900F.


This comment was edited on May 29, 21:53.
 
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11. Re: No subject May 29, 2007, 21:19 banddirector
 

My guess is that without the cover a black BBQ easily reaches temps exceeding 120F (if it's sitting in direct sunlight) which is probably way too warm for most wasps.

That was probably it. The gas grill sat out on the deck, under direct sunlight most of the time. Sucker probably got so hot I didn't even need to fire it up to use it ...


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10. Re: No subject May 29, 2007, 20:54 Enahs
 
My guess is that without the cover a black BBQ easily reaches temps exceeding 120F (if it's sitting in direct sunlight) which is probably way too warm for most wasps.

Where is Cynips when ya need him. He has a Ph.D. in like bugs or insects or whatever....and I even thought he was doing some research on some type of a wasp!


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9. Re: No subject May 29, 2007, 20:41 WarPig
 
But by leaving the cover off, the bugs didn't use it.

My guess is that without the cover a black BBQ easily reaches temps exceeding 120F (if it's sitting in direct sunlight) which is probably way too warm for most wasps.


 
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8. Re: No subject May 29, 2007, 20:12 Enahs
 
When we covered it, we found the yellowjackets LOVED the grease left behind and turned it into a big yellowjacket hotel. We even tried burning off all the grease, and the bugs still returned. But by leaving the cover off, the bugs didn't use it.

Crazy.

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7. Re: No subject May 29, 2007, 19:17 banddirector
 

When we covered it, we found the yellowjackets LOVED the grease left behind and turned it into a big yellowjacket hotel. We even tried burning off all the grease, and the bugs still returned. But by leaving the cover off, the bugs didn't use it.

Go figure ....


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6. Re: No subject May 29, 2007, 14:08 Enahs
 
Bah, wussies.

I have a gas, charcoal and a smoker. Real mean BBQ.
Smoker for smoking...duh.
Gas for cooking things like steak, hot and fast.
Charcoal for low slow cooking, certain kinds of roast and fish . Some fish you do want to cook fast, though. With the charcoal you can also do slow cooking and mild smoking at the same time, which is great for chicken and fish.

And rusting, ya tards. Clean it and cover it up and it will not rust to any real extent.


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5. Re: No subject May 29, 2007, 13:53 banddirector
 

we just upgraded from a charcoal to a gas this year

That's the opposite of us - - we used to have a gas grill, but we didn't use it but once or twice a season, and it was rusting away out there, so we chucked it and bought a classic Weber round grill.

Sure, we have to wait the 20 minutes, but since we don't grill that often, it's worth it ....


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