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Follow-up - Half-Life 2: Episode One

Some feedback on the story last night about Half-Life 2: Episode One suggests it was a misinterpretation of the story. In contrast with the assessment that Half-Life 2: Aftermath was being broken into episodes, there is a general feeling that this is really just a names change from Aftermath to Episode One.

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34. Re: RE: xXBatmanXx Feb 13, 2006, 04:19 Optimaximal
 
I dont understand why people bitch about Valve.
Because it's cool!

 
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33. Re: RE: xXBatmanXx Feb 12, 2006, 21:12 Yosemite Sam
 
Free content? Er? You're not talking about the HDR demo, are you?

That counts as free content, but no I was thinking of all the maps for CS and Deathmatch they have added.

Valve isn't as bad as EA or Atari, but they're hardly this benevolent entity who would glady bleed for the gaming community.

I dont expect anyone to bleed for the community, but I do expect a quality, tested product with support, and Valve delivers. In an era of PC gaming where the only concern is to the bottom dollar at any price, releasing games that are unfinished untested and as short as they think they can get away with and with as little support as possible, I dont understand why people bitch about Valve.


 
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32. Re: RE: xXBatmanXx Feb 12, 2006, 20:12 Masa
 

No, the game was delayed because Valve is absolutely INCAPABLE of doing any form of scheduling / planning.



What are you talking about? You don't produce a game like HL2 without anything but heavily planning. Like anything, it can all turn to shit, but you make adjustments accordingly.

I think of an company you can that about is 3d Realms and to some extent, id Software.


Are you interested in some beachfront property?

Don't kid yourself. Valve isn't as bad as EA or Atari, but they're hardly this benevolent entity who would glady bleed for the gaming community.



Man, you know, I could really call you out on some things. PC gaming isn't the best shape as a whole. It's not dead, and I don't think it'll die anytime soon, but it's not exactly hemmoraging great games these days. Frankly, I think the comparison between Valve and EA/Atari is rather blindsided, if not for the fact you at least know what the hell you're buying with a Valve product. With EA alone, you essentially buy the same thing with a different year attached, year after year, and the gameplay differentiates accordingly.



If Valve makes us pay $150 for the equivalent of one game yes, it's awful, and consumers won't stand for it.



Really. Yet you'll dump $10 a month into WoW?

 
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31. Re: RE: xXBatmanXx Feb 12, 2006, 18:15 Creston
 
Valve has continually added free content to the game

Free content? Er? You're not talking about the HDR demo, are you?

Totally off the radar dood, HL2 was delayed years, at Valves expence, so we could have the best game possible

No, the game was delayed because Valve is absolutely INCAPABLE of doing any form of scheduling / planning. And if you consider that Valve had originally said that the game was going to be 16 chapters, each "at least two hours long", and the final end result was a game that took you 12-15 hours to complete, I think it's safe to say that we didn't wind up getting the best possible game, and in fact Valve cut quite some content out.

Personally I think Valve is part of a dying breed of gamers making games for gamers

Are you interested in some beachfront property?

Don't kid yourself. Valve isn't as bad as EA or Atari, but they're hardly this benevolent entity who would glady bleed for the gaming community.

Creston


 
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30. Re: RE: xXBatmanXx Feb 12, 2006, 16:55 Yosemite Sam
 
And I spoke about Valve is not the community's friend but rather just a part of greedy corporate America.

Totally off the radar dood, HL2 was delayed years, at Valves expence, so we could have the best game possible. Greedy corperate america pushes unpolished, untested crap out the door on time to make their money (EA). Valve has continually added free content to the game, greedy corperate america slaps a few extra maps on a disk and charges you for it. Personally I think Valve is part of a dying breed of gamers making games for gamers, there are a few others but most of the companys are now corperations making games for money.

 
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29. Re: No subject Feb 12, 2006, 13:59 hiya
 
lol syl, that was good

 
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28. Re: No subject Feb 12, 2006, 10:36 Animals for Crackers
 
Or the TWELVE or so expansion packs for Everquest 1 which offer more generic, slapped on content with half-assed lore and such to satisfy the die-hards...why not cut to the chase, take a dump in a box, and call it EQ: The Swamps of Excrement and be done with it. Aww...mine's petrified.

Knowing Valve I just hope to god they make the effort to make each episode as varied and unique as possible (while still maintaining a coherent flow storywise) from one ep to the next...

This comment was edited on Feb 12, 10:52.
 
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27. Re: human Feb 12, 2006, 10:31 human
 
You say, "Who imagines anyone will pay $150". I didn't say it would be less. But it will still be a ripoff. But it doesn't matter because your argument is completely flawed. Look at those who pay for MMORPGs like WOW & EQ & UO & AC. It costs some people hundreds of dollars, and some even paid thousands of dollars. For a single game experience.

That's your argument? You think HL2 episodic expansions will be a MMORPG and thereby rip off poor gamers like you?

Stupid and disingenuous argument, and you know it. Calling it 'a single game experience' doesn't actually make HL2 expansions all of a sudden occupy the same market niche as a MMORPG, because it's not, and won't be. MMORPGS offer much more than a single player FPS like HL2 does, and gamers are smart enough to know it.

Secondly, even if Valve sold the equivalent of a game for $150, which, let us remind everyone, was your claim, does this mean that Valve and Stephen King are the spawn of Satan? One could in fact argue that episodic games offer people the option to try a small part of the game before buying it. Nothing wrong with that. Even if your idiot prophecy came to pass, it'd be a free market transaction with NO obligation on the part of the consumer to take part.

So, in the end, you're just another alarmist hand-wringing retard like Creston, bemoaning the fall of the games industry all because Valve decided to distribute their games themselves. Oh, woe is you! And yes, what DO you know, Zeph? Not much, from where I'm standing.

This comment was edited on Feb 12, 10:32.
 
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26. No subject Feb 12, 2006, 10:06 aldo_14
 
Lord of the Rings cost moviegoers $30 instead of $10. Did they complain that it was one movie's worth of entertainment but they had to pay thrice? No.

I think it's important to note that the 3 movies corresponded to 3 books. It's be more accurate to have (IMO), for example, Return of the King split into two 1 1/5 hour movies with tickets charged at £3.50 each, vs the actual 3 hour movie at £5. That would demonstrate the commercial reasons for episodic releases as well as the main concerns for fans. Another side thing is that episodic does tend to imply a reduced amount of content and advancement (i.e. of the game engine); if you're looking at episodes which appear (as Aftermath/Ep 1 does from the screens so far) to contain very little actual new art, the value does seem a bit questionable. It's kind of similar, to me, as to the tonnes of expansion packs released for the Sims and planned for BF2.


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This comment was edited on Feb 12, 10:09.
 
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25. Re: RE: xXBatmanXx Feb 12, 2006, 09:20 vacs
 
Lord of the Rings cost moviegoers $30 instead of $10. Did they complain that it was one movie's worth of entertainment but they had to pay thrice? No.

yeah, but the Lord Of the Rings trilogy is a undebatable masterpiece and HL2 is a standard, linear FPS so your argument doesn't hold any water.

 
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24. Re: human Feb 12, 2006, 08:10 Zephalephelah
 
Who imagines anyone will pay $150 for what we pay $50 for now? Only retards. QED

Point in fact: Stephen King's Green Mile = $1.99 per issue. 6 issues. $11.94. Paperback. Other paperbacks sold for $4.99. He did more than double. It pissed people off but it worked well enough to have a good movie made out of it.

In the early 1990's, some games were selling for $100. I think one even sold, quite well actually, at $120. It was back in the Myst days when people seemed to buy anything remotely cool, at any price, because show off value was big right then. Nerds were cool. It took a little knowledge just to get these things to work properly. 3DX was king. But yeah, a few games sold for more than $100.

Now let's go ahead and fast forward to today. You say, "Who imagines anyone will pay $150". I didn't say it would be less. But it will still be a ripoff. But it doesn't matter because your argument is completely flawed. Look at those who pay for MMORPGs like WOW & EQ & UO & AC. It costs some people hundreds of dollars, and some even paid thousands of dollars. For a single game experience.

But hey, I'm retarded. So what do I know, right kid?

 
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23. Re: RE: xXBatmanXx Feb 12, 2006, 06:56 human
 
Zeph is retarded, of course. Who imagines anyone will pay $150 for what we pay $50 for now? Only retards. QED.

 
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22. Re: RE: xXBatmanXx Feb 12, 2006, 04:30 Beamer
 
You're right. I called this a long, long time ago, saying how HL3 will cost us a full $150 if we purchased all the episodes and other bullshit they'll sell. And I spoke about Valve is not the community's friend but rather just a part of greedy corporate America.

You still miss so much that it's not funny.

If Valve makes us pay $150 for the equivalent of one game yes, it's awful, and consumers won't stand for it.

But there's a more likely chance we'll pay $150 for HL3 and get a ton. Lord of the Rings cost moviegoers $30 instead of $10. Did they complain that it was one movie's worth of entertainment but they had to pay thrice? No. They got their money's worth each time, even if it took $30 for a completion of the plot.

I suspect it will be the same for Valve. Maybe we'll pay much, much more for the completion of the plot, but games are not centered around the plot, they're centered around gameplay. If we get $150 worth of gameplay for $150 anyone complaining is probably going to be out of line, so long as there's enough plot to warrant it.

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21. Re: I stole this subject, too. Feb 12, 2006, 04:23 Shadowcat
 
Well, then maybe Valve could be a bit more forthcoming with their own information. If they don't, we are forced to draw our own conclusions based on available information.
Well no, we're not actually forced to do anything of the kind.

That said, a name change from "Aftermath" (suggesting something that follows on from HL2) to "Episode One" (suggesting something that precedes HL2) is nothing if not confusing.

 
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20. Re: No subject Feb 12, 2006, 04:22 Hunterzyph
 
Of course you are. Because Sin is something relatively new, and Half Life 2 is relatively 'done'.

 
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19. No subject Feb 12, 2006, 04:02 Hump
 
for some reason I'm actually looking foward more to the Sin Episodes than this.

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18. Re: Alright Feb 12, 2006, 01:58 Scottish Martial Arts
 
Btw, is there actually a release date for this thing? It's been in development for fucking yonks now.

April 24, they announced that a month ago or so I think.

 
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17. Re: I stole this subject, too. Feb 12, 2006, 01:16 Camaro76
 
Way to channel Fark, Camaro.

Yeah, looks like some people around here don't read Fark, do they? Whoops.

I should have saved that for April 1st though. Dammit!

edit: I guess the moral of the story is don't believe everything you read on the internet. Oh, that and Steam sucks. I love Valve threads...
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16. Re: I stole this subject, too. Feb 12, 2006, 00:11 Bunko
 
I work for Valve.
You work for Valve?

And what is good, Phaedrus, and what is not good -
Need we ask anyone to tell us these things?

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15. Re: I stole this subject, too. Feb 12, 2006, 00:05 Parallax Abstraction
 
I think you just want to make yourself sound smart, when in reality you dont know what you are talking about.

This is how bad info gets passed around.

Well, then maybe Valve could be a bit more forthcoming with their own information. If they don't, we are forced to draw our own conclusions based on available information. If Valve were ever to prove me wrong, that's cool. But they haven't and so far, they have done a number of things in line with the theory that's commonly referred to as "professional Valve bashing" around here. If you say we don't know what we're talking about, then please correct us if you are permitted to. Episodic can be good or bad for gamers and Valve isn't saying which way they'll go with it. If I had any idea either way, I wouldn't have to speculate.

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