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GUN Backfires

BOYCOTTGUN.COM (thanks GamerGod) is a website with a call to action from the Association For American Indian Development who are looking to inspire a boycott of Activision products over GUN, the recently released shooter set in the wild west. The goal is to inspire a recall for GUN or the release of an edited version that redresses problematic depictions of Native Americans and their treatment within the game. Here's a bit:

It has come to our attention that video game publisher, Activision, has released for Xbox 360, Xbox, Playstation , PS2 and PC, a new game set in the American West with some very disturbing racist and genocidal elements toward Native Americans. The game is called "Gun" and features a frontiersman hero named Colton White. One of his earliest tasks that the game player must complete before advancing to the next level is to slaughter, not once, but on an ongoing basis, Apache Indians. Not only slaughter (and this is the terminology used in the game) but to scalp (terminology also used in the game) them as well with a "scalping knife" that can be purchased as part of the many weapons offered to the hero of the game, Colton White.

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67. BS! Feb 3, 2006, 05:34 MakersMarksman
 
This is about PR, not legalities. Activision, just as Univeral or any other movie studio or publisher, enjoys First Amendment rights. This BS about the indians being offended is just a ploy to get attention by left wing radicals that (unfortunately) don't have enought real work to do. Hey, people dis on white guys every day, but we don't raise a stink; no, we just sit back and take it. That's because its politically correct to dis (despite the substantial political and technological advances for which white males are responsible, including, among other things, the U.S. Constitution, space travel, the light bulb, the atomic bomb, the cure for polio, air travel, computers, etc.-- the list goes on and on). What have the indians done? But, of course, we can't look at things from this perspective because it would be politically incorrect to do so. . . . .

 
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66. Re: I'm with the Indians Feb 2, 2006, 09:53 xXBatmanXx
 
Look, we whites came killed and took their land by force. I don't feel near as bad, if I feel bad at all about the blacks. What was done to the Indians is akin to genocide
and I will not play or support GUN


As opposed to any other movement of one group of people into another's area in history? Give me a break.

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65. Re: Meh Feb 2, 2006, 00:07 MindTrigger
 


2 words.

Revisionist History.

Maybe if we ignore what happened in the "old west" it will go away, right? Moronic.

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64. Re: Meh Feb 1, 2006, 23:07 Kxmode
 
kxmode, don't read into my post too much, bro. I mean, yes, you're pretty much correct in your essay about Nazis and their relations to the entire German population. But the post I italicised was something I thought humerous. You take the Nazi tag away from CoD2 and all you get are...hordes of white men trying to kill you. And it comes back around to one little fact, it's just a game.

Yeah I liked your comment! I just got into one of my "I hate cookie-cutter games, would like to see something different" rant. you know?

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63. Re: I'm with the Indians Feb 1, 2006, 22:57 Masa
 
perhaps the haitians set a proper trend with Vice City and now any relgious organisation/ race/ nation will sue for any representation in a game. though i wonder why the hare krishnas haven't sued rockstar over the first two gta's yet?


Or did you ever play Hitman 2? There was a cult (I think based in India) that was portrayed in the game in a bad light, whole lot a bad hoopla over it. Eidos ended up changing the name of the cult in further printings of the game.




Look, we whites came killed and took their land by force. I don't feel near as bad, if I feel bad at all about the blacks. What was done to the Indians is akin to genocide
and I will not play or support GUN



You know, the past is the past. History is history, and we are taught history in schools to learn from it, lest not to let it repeat. I feel bad for what happened back in those days, but myself being punished for something I had no control over, that's no better.

 
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62. I'm with the Indians Feb 1, 2006, 22:28 Ahumado
 
Look, we whites came killed and took their land by force. I don't feel near as bad, if I feel bad at all about the blacks. What was done to the Indians is akin to genocide
and I will not play or support GUN

 
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61. Re: Meh Feb 1, 2006, 22:14 thane_jaw
 
kxmode. I'm sorry but there's ample reason to suggest that even guards in concentration camps were not willing participants in the events. I'm not a holocaust denier, but there was a famous psychology experiment in the 60's. They got school teachers to administer "shocks" to a poor learner(actor) whenever they got a question wrong. even though they implored the actor to answer correctly they were always forced to increase the "shock" power. Even though they were fairly liberal people, none of them refused to comply.

the brainwashing via removing men from their families/ previous friends is a common tactic amongst terrorists. most notably the recent london bombings. where a wife of one of the terrorists reported her suicide bombing husband as always hanging around with guys she didn't know at the mosque (women and men are generally seperated within the mosque) and not having a real conversation with him for months. nothing is as black and white as you portray it. i doubt many of them believed what they did was evil until aft er the event. human mentaility is that of the herd, sad but ultimately true. the real danger is in not recognising when these tactics/ policies are being used and not being able to defend against them.

sorry i realise the above is poorly written, i'm simply trying to make the point that there is an element of gray in everything. labelling people evil oft hand is a poor choice, holds us as back as a unifed nation of earth and ultimately judgemental.

anyway back to gun, okayish game - real rental though. this appears to be a real ho-hah over nothing. perhaps the haitians set a proper trend with Vice City and now any relgious organisation/ race/ nation will sue for any representation in a game. though i wonder why the hare krishnas haven't sued rockstar over the first two gta's yet?

 
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60. Re: Meh Feb 1, 2006, 21:51 Masa
 
kxmode, don't read into my post too much, bro. I mean, yes, you're pretty much correct in your essay about Nazis and their relations to the entire German population. But the post I italicised was something I thought humerous. You take the Nazi tag away from CoD2 and all you get are...hordes of white men trying to kill you. And it comes back around to one little fact, it's just a game.

This comment was edited on Feb 1, 21:59.
 
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59. The REAL reason for this news Feb 1, 2006, 21:14 nightfend
 
Let's see...Activision has a game that is selling poorly on the Xbox 360. Knowing controversy sells copies of games, they create this fake "Indian" organization and go about comdemning their own game. Just watch, the sells of Gun are going to increase in direct proportion to the amount of media attention this gets.

 
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58. Damn history! Feb 1, 2006, 20:48 theAntiELVIS
 
All those things actually happened in the 18th and 19th centuries. Also the Native Americans actually slaughtered each other, indulged themselves in torture and the burning of captives as a form of entertainment, and used the tactic of slaughtering their enemy's children to deny them a new generation of warriors.

What the whites did to the natives was deplorable. What the natives did to each other and to the whites was deplorable, too.

Attempting to gain equality and justice in contemporary society is an honorable and laudable goal. Attempting to revise history to suit your agenda is not.

Now, the only real question is: do we want our entertainment to use these historical barbarities as fodder for a plot line? My feeling is that is a personal choice. Using censorship to enforce a personal choice or a political agenda, however, is outright social EVIL.

Decry games like GUN all you want - but organize a boycott? First of all, you will fail because the majority of people won't take part. Second you are attempting to engage in social/political censorship. This is all fine in the case of, say, boycotting the importation of goods from a nation with whom we are at war, or of a corporation or industry that is doing actual physical harm to people.

But this is a fantasy representation of an historical period. NO ONE IS ACTUALLY BEING KILLED! Get some perspective. It's no different than the whole Dan Quale/Murphy Brown fiasco.

-tAE-


 
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57. Re: No subject Feb 1, 2006, 19:47 xXBatmanXx
 
I hate this "that's a common misconception" bullshit that's actually a common misconception in and of itself - started by who the hell knows who.

Clone, BUT WIKI IS OWNED AND EDITED BY THE WHITE MAN!

hehehe sorry, couldn't control myself.

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56. typical Feb 1, 2006, 19:31 Bone43
 
kind of like a history lesson aint it,
I mean if the shit really happened what’s the big deal? guess we better pull all those old western movies off the self to there was plenty of scalping going on in those!


Its just a game get over it! that just doesn’t seem to make much difference with these bleeding heart libs!


 
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55. Re: Meh Feb 1, 2006, 19:22 Kxmode
 
It never ceases to amaze me how many assume all Germans from WW2 are evil. The truth is most of them were just conscripts of Hitler's army. They were drafted into Hitler's army defending Germany as patriots. This isn't a new concept; it has happened since the beginning of time. There were even German like Oscar Schindler who did not believe in Hitler and his regime. There was Thomas Kretchmann from "The Pianist" who wrote, "I just cannot understand how we have been able to commit such crimes against defenseless civilians, against the Jews. I ask myself again and again, how is it possible?" And of course there were native Germans like Jehovah's Witness that stayed totally neutral of Hitler's ideology and his war and paid the ultimate price for it. The true evils of WW2 were the Nazis. The Nazis consisted of Hitler, his advisers, his SS, and the men that ran the concentration camps (whatever rank they held). The ordinary German soldier never really assumed the role of Nazi... they just fought for their country and in the end lost. And to be honest they showed more bravery than today's terrorist. At least they wore freaking uniforms.

What I would like to see is a shooter told from the Axis perspective. I don't want to see the evils! And I sure as hell do not want to partake in them. I want to play a Call of Duty styled game concentrating on three lives from each of the major Axis worlds. Of course being historically accurate means you might win battles but your side would eventually loose the entire campaign. This could be an interesting game...

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54. Re: Meh Feb 1, 2006, 18:50 Masa
 
If this was just a game about killing endless hordes of white men, nobody'd have taken offense.

It's call Call of Duty 2



Heh, indeed it is; and indeed, nobody does.

 
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53. Re: No subject Feb 1, 2006, 18:26 Clone
 
I hate this "that's a common misconception" bullshit that's actually a common misconception in and of itself - started by who the hell knows who.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scalping
"According to historian James Axtell, there is no evidence that the early European explorers and settlers in the Americas were familiar with this practice of the Scythians, or that they ever taught scalping to Native Americans. There is clear evidence, says Axtell, that the practice of scalping existed long before Europeans arrived, primarily in North America. The theory that Native Americans learned the practice of scalping from Europeans first appeared in the 1960s and is still professed by some writers and activists, but this belief is not supported by most academic scholars."


http://www.encyclopedia.com/html/s1/scalping.asp
"Most anthropologists believe that scalping was a native practice that aboriginal North Americans did not borrow from Europeans. To some, the scalp was not merely a trophy; it bestowed the possessor with the powers of the scalped enemy."
This comment was edited on Feb 1, 18:29.
 
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52. Re: No subject Feb 1, 2006, 18:12 Stanly Manly
 
"Am I the only person who thinks it's good to have a game where the white people scalp the Native Americans instead of the other way around? American folklore seems to constantly attribute that deplorable activity primarily to the Native Americans, when in truth it WAS the whites who started it, in order to have proof and get paid for every Native they killed. The Native Americans just followed suit. So I think it's good, educationally, to have a game that shows some of the atrocities that the colonists committed, and the fact that it was them who came up with those horrible tactics, not the Natives."

IIRC, the actual native american practice was called "Counting Coup", and involved merely touching an enemy in a way as to say "I could have just killed you, but chose not to". Or something to that effect.

 
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51. Re: No subject Feb 1, 2006, 18:00 xXBatmanXx
 
Could you get away with allowing people to save their own skin by performing a terrible act when trapped by circumstance, and yet still work for the good of others without "losing" the game?

Could you handle that situation acceptably by removing the control from the player in a cut scene once there was no way out?

I doubt you'd ever get funding for something like that, but with mature game design you could really pose a very interesting moral question to the player.


Sure, just jump characters once you make that choice.
Lots of games you don't play the same character all the waythrough the game.

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Avatar 10714
 
In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem. / Few men have virtue enough to withstand the highest bidder.
Playing: New dad
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50. No subject Feb 1, 2006, 17:54 Nexus
 
This is just a personal opinion, but I think a game that put you in the shoes of a German who wanted find a way to save Jews (like schindler), but maintain this as a secret, would be quite groundbreaking. The larger question would be if people would accept a game where the situation could force you to make a moral descision between the wellbeing of yourself and another.

Could you get away with allowing people to save their own skin by performing a terrible act when trapped by circumstance, and yet still work for the good of others without "losing" the game?

Could you handle that situation acceptably by removing the control from the player in a cut scene once there was no way out?

I doubt you'd ever get funding for something like that, but with mature game design you could really pose a very interesting moral question to the player.

 
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49. Look at "Who's Who"... Feb 1, 2006, 17:41 Killer Kane
 
Man I hate to say this...but thems some Ugly Indian chicks at that concert...(so "color me shallow"...I dont care...)


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"I started out with nothing...and I still have most of it left".

 
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48. Native Feb 1, 2006, 17:30 Producer
 
I am a Native American. I am not offended by the game. I am offended to see the link to the petition.

 
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