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Guild Wars Patch, Bans

These Guild Wars Game Update Notes outline the new update to ArenaNet's MMORPG. The update implements several changes intended to remove the need for "farming" to progress in the game, while also making it easier to identify players using cheats, bots, and hacks. On a related note, they also announce the banning of over 100 user accounts for using bots to farm. The update outlines extensive balance changes and tweaks, and promises more to come:

We know that some players currently engage in repetitive farming activities for the primary purpose of unlocking skills and items for PvP. Rather than preserving the effectiveness of farming for this purpose, it is our intention to address the larger issue of the need for farming by assessing how players acquire and unlock items, runes, and skills, and then by taking steps to ensure that players can acquire and unlock these things through normal gameplay. We believe that the most effective way to play the game should also be the most fun way to play the game. You can expect to see the first meaningful changes towards this goal next week.

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93. Re: No subject Jun 11, 2005, 10:51 Creston
 
One thing that really annoys me when you get invited to a guild is that that fucking message pops up every single time you zone.

I got invited to a guild before Qix made the Blue Conclave, and I got so tired of seeing that message all the time. I had wanted to leave the invitation open (they're nice peeps in that guild) in case the blue's guild wasn't going anywhere, but you either accept or reject it, or just really get bored to tears by it. That could use a little work.

Creston


 
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92. No subject Jun 11, 2005, 01:30 Tr0n
 
There is no limit in switching guilds, just teritories (US, EU, Korea).

 
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91. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 20:09 Gandhi
 
You can always leave that guild. But I believe there is a limit to how many times you can switch guilds - so always think it over before you join. Of course if you are happy with the guild you joined, you can stay with them - there is nothing that stops you from partnersing with other guild members in PvE areas.

You cannot make anything fool-proof. The fools are too inventive
 
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You cannot make anything fool-proof. The fools are too inventive

GW: Tr Gandhi (Ra), Shiva Sung (Mo), Mangal Pandey (Ne), Rana Pratap Singh (Wa), Boddhi Satwa (Ri), Bhagat Singh (De), Bahadur Shastri (Pa)
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90. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 19:09 Prez
 
Lol! I got an invitation to join a guild! I accepted; of course I just started playing 2 days ago - so what the hell I am supposed to do now?

 
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“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.”
- Mahatma Gandhi
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89. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 16:09 MeatForce
 
Yes. Which is why I'm quite content to take a wait-and-see approach for the next couple of weeks. They've managed to impress and amaze me thus far, so who am I to assume they've suddenly gone completely berserk and are now doing their best to trash such an impressive achievement?

And along those lines, Gaile has also said:

Your faith is well placed and will be borne out by the future.

So yeah: I'll wait & we'll see.


PS - The BF2 Demo is ready to be downloaded now....

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I'm not even angry. I'm being so sincere right now, even though you broke my heart and killed me.
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88. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 16:03 Creston
 
In regards to Creston's views, I wonder, why is it that you do not play a game that fits the game type which you apparently seek? WoW and FF11, even Lineage 2, fits your need to farm.

If price is an issue, there are numerous free Korean MMOs available for download. However, I find it strange that you continue to play a game which you do not enjoy and although I respect your views, the demand for changes shows signs of being spoiled, perhaps you as well are asking for things on a silver platter just as how PvPers have been accused of such.


I have already explained this, but I guess I'll go over it again.

1) The game at launch time was perfect, for me. Since then it has been brutally nerfed, PvE wise, in favor of PvP.

2) I'm still playing it to finish the storyline, as again I have already said. I like the storyline, it's pretty decent, so I want to finish it. If, at the end of that, the game is still in this Fuck All You PvE Players mode, I will most definitely quit.

3) I've NEVER said that I want to farm, and I challenge you to quote me where I said that. Good luck.
I want to find stuff during the course of the game. Right now, I'm not finding fucking shit. And actually, since the beginning of the game, I haven't found shit, but I figured that once I got to the end parts, I'd finally start finding stuff.
I'm in the desert now, and my drops are worse than they were in fucking Ascalon. At least I'd find a blue there every now and then. And why is this? Because in response to farming, Arenanet has nerfed the drops.
Great going.

4) I won't pay monthly for a game, much less pay monthly for a game which then forces you to WAIT IN FUCKING LINE BEFORE YOU CAN PLAY. I wonder if that is even legal?

5) Korean MMORPGS? Yeah, why don't I play some chinese puzzle games while I'm at it? I SPEAKA DA ENGLISJ, NOTTA DA KOREAN.


6) the demand for changes shows signs of being spoiled, perhaps you as well are asking for things on a silver platter just as how PvPers have been accused of such

I'm not demanding changes, in fact, I was one of the apparently very few people that was ABSOLUTELY FINE with the way the game was RIGHT OUT OF THE BOX.
ergo, you're accusing me of something that's plain simply wrong.
I'd have been perfectly happy had the game stayed the same, with the extremely tough boss monsters, the elite skills scattered around the game, the earlier drop rates, etc.
I guess the rune seller is an improvement that I can grow to like, although I still think that finding a rune is 100 times cooler than just going there with 5 plat and going "okay, let's see. Minor vigor. minor absorption. minor healing. minor divine favor..hmmm... ah, what the hell, let's throw a minor smiting in there too. There. "
It's like going to Walmart for fuck's sake

is to try a different class build than what you are accustomed to.

I already have four characters. *shrug*
Well, three actually, and the fourth is built, just haven't played it yet.

hey, for you finding items isn't all that great, for me it's one of the coolest parts of an RPG.

Creston

 
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87. No subject Jun 10, 2005, 15:54 Tr0n
 
I think Gaile Gray in the latest Fansite Friday interview said it best.

"This isn't to say that every single update is going to delight each and every player. With any given update there is going to be a certain percentage of players who are not happy with the changes. For instance, some players were really into the whole process of farming for loot, and today they're concerned about the recent changes that made farming less profitable. But the game is undergoing an evolutionary process, and some of the concerns being expressed in the short-term will be addressed with planned alterations in the longer term. It may not be apparent where things are moving, but positive and satisfactory changes are in the works and will be incorporated into the game with the same care that we have shown with all the other updates. On the other hand, players who had expressed concerns about having difficulties in capturing skills are delighted with the new Signet of Capture system, and there seems to be universal approval for that change."

http://www.pixelrage.com/mesmerize/fansitefriday/46/

In ArenaNet we trust!

This comment was edited on Jun 10, 15:54.
 
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86. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 15:49 Creston
 
The game has to appeal to both player groups and at the same time shouldn't favor one group of players to the other.

Well, not to be rude, but the way these patches are going, by the end of it, the favor is going to be :

PvP 100% - PvE 0%

And by the way, what you said that my system leaves casual players out of the loop, no it doesn't. First of all, if they are casual players, they'd be casual in PvE too, and so they still wouldn't have anything (especially now with the drop rate halved).

But coupled with a rewards thing for PvP matches won (or fame, or rank), would have to come a matchmaking service that pits opponents of the same fame / rank against one another.
No n0 fighting against Three Old N00bs.
If you make that matchmaking service that matches up fame ranks against each other, someone is ALWAYS going to get more stuff unlocked. Win / Win for everyone.

I thought about this system for quite awhile yesterday at work before posting it, and there is nothing wrong with it that I can discover. If someone can think of something that's wrong with it, let me know, but to me it seems like it would be perfect.

Creston


 
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85. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 14:07 itzaaron
 
Sure, but in those games you don't have to spend dozens or hundreds of hours to get the weapon you want. Sure I like to say that I have fame, and that I won at the HoH on my second try, but that doesn't actually reward you with stuff even though there's lots of stuff available.

I like PvP for its intensity and the fact that you can say, "for 30 minutes, I was on the best team in the world," but you really can't be a mainly-PvP player without missing out on a lot that a mostly-PvE player would find and experience. I'm not going to quit the game over it, I'm just saying it would be nice to be able to win stuff in PvP, in addition to a better spot on the ladder.

 
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84. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 14:02 dipsetwhat
 
well said

 
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83. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 13:37 Tr0n
 
Isn't competition and being the best in the world the best reward you can get?

What do you get when you beat another clan in HL2/Q3/D3/...? Fame, victory, respect, a better spot in the ladder etc...

 
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82. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 13:18 itzaaron
 
I will say that I agree with the idea that players should somehow be able to get items in PvP as well as in PvE. All the weapons and runes I use, save one Superior Earth, I have found myself in PvE, but I actually want to play PvE so I really don't care if my sword only gives +11% damage while enchanted. Additionally, one of the bigger reasons why I don't do much PvP is that there's no real reward for it. Unless you actually hold the Hall of Heroes and get one of the three sigils, you don't gain anything tangible by playing PvP.

 
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81. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 12:59 Tr0n
 
"And if they are so absolutely determined to make runes and upgrades rewards for playing the game, then as Creston has already said, they should be giving PvPers their item rewards in PvP, for crying out loud!"

That would only favor the hardcore PvP crowd, which would leave the casual PvPers out of the loop.

You see, things like these were (and still are) discussed on the alpha testing forums for years. All of the suggestions you guys mentioned and tons others have been evaluated and even tested internally with temporary test builds.

Before ArenaNet makes any big changes, they have to carefully consider how are these changes going to affect the gaming world at large and in the long run. It's not just as simple as adding the option to unlock all skills and be done with it. The game has to appeal to both player groups and at the same time shouldn't favor one group of players to the other.

In my 2 years of alpha testing I've seen what these guys are capable of and I'm 100% confident they will keep fixing and improving the game until the players and the developers are happy with it. But it’s not a simple process. You learn these things when you’re in constant contact with them and where you can see first hand how these decisions are made and executed.

This comment was edited on Jun 10, 13:03.
 
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80. No subject Jun 10, 2005, 12:45 dipsetwhat
 
I equate it to you playing Half Life 2 Deathmatch, but you can't use the gravity gun, because you haven't gotten there in single player yet.

Your point here is somewhat flawed, seeing as how runes are merely bonuses. They do not guarantee wins. You can win HoH with a team full of PVP chracters as long as the strategy is strong and everyone communicates well.

In the case of HL2 DM, which I haven't played, I'd assume the gravity gun is somewhat useful in DM, not to mention fun. However, unlocked Runes for PVP players doesn't exactly add to the fun, it's just added numbers.

It's like last year's edition of the Detroit Pistons beating the Hall Of Famer-stacked LA Lakers; you don't need the names or the season stats, just a real team.


Where we share common ground is that I too believe PVP players should earn certain runes, but not in PvE; I believe after every 10 or 20 points in Fame that you achieve, you should have a selection of Minor Runes to choose from. This would encourage players to put more emphasis on their matches, it gives a 'reward' of sorts for winning early round battles and it keeps PvPers from having to do what they do not necessarily want to, and that's to fight through areas repeatedly to gain certain items.

In regards to Creston's views, I wonder, why is it that you do not play a game that fits the game type which you apparently seek? WoW and FF11, even Lineage 2, fits your need to farm.

If price is an issue, there are numerous free Korean MMOs available for download. However, I find it strange that you continue to play a game which you do not enjoy and although I respect your views, the demand for changes shows signs of being spoiled, perhaps you as well are asking for things on a silver platter just as how PvPers have been accused of such.

IMO, i see GW's PvE content as a regular single-player Action RPG. You don't need to get all the items. Just beat the game, and that's that. What certain players attempt to do with the game as of now is to somehow prolong a game that isn't meant to be prolonged.

Think of it as Quake 2; you play through single-player, then you go into Multiplayer Deathmatch and when you're bored, you stop. If MP isn't interesting, you don't just keep playing single-player with the hopes of grabbing every little item and killing every monsters. What you DO do is change the difficulty.

What i suggest, rather than continuing to beef up your characters, is to try a different class build than what you are accustomed to.

 
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79. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 12:20 MeatForce
 
The "unlock all" was only a weekend feature, which was said many times. ArenaNet always planned that players, be it PvE or PvP, will have to earn skills and not just get them from scratch.

This was their design concept from day 1.


Yeah, I know, but they're idiots for thinking that was going to work out. They should have paid more attention to how happy UAS made everyone.

I think it was pretty clear from day one post-launch that their decision to lock PvPers into PvE was a recipe for some serious whining (at the very least) and an excellent excuse for good ol' botting (at the very worst).

And if they are so absolutely determined to make runes and upgrades rewards for playing the game, then as Creston has already said, they should be giving PvPers their item rewards in PvP, for crying out loud!

It could be accomplished as easily as making fallen opponents drop items just like the PvE mobs do. The more opponents you kill, the better your chance at the pH4t leW7z

I don't know why this is so hard for them to grasp, really..

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I actually get paid for this..
 
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I'm not even angry. I'm being so sincere right now, even though you broke my heart and killed me.
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78. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 11:53 Creston
 
Runes and +15% while health > 50% weapons help sure, but a good team without them will destroy a mediocre team with them any day.

Absolutely, however, this guy was from a VERY good Guild, because I'm pretty certain he is from the Valandor. But in any case, if he's not from that one, then from one of the other elite guilds. You don't think that perhaps there's a correlation between those top guilds and the fact that they have all the items?

I'm not saying : all items = top guild, but if a top guild HAS all the items, and an up and coming one does not, what chance does the up and coming one ever have of defeating them?

Also, I think that your feelings about the specialness of finding runes might change a little now that you're ascended

If my drops keep going as they have been, I think I'll never find another rune again.
I have three characters. All three of them use a weapon and an item / shield that I have BOUGHT. None of them use anything that I have FOUND. where is the fun in this?


The "unlock all" was only a weekend feature, which was said many times. ArenaNet always planned that players, be it PvE or PvP, will have to earn skills and not just get them from scratch.

This was their design concept from day 1.


True, but their design concept is flawed in that PvP victories mean nothing, but hours spent grinding monsters gives you better odds in PvP. This doesn't strike you as odd?
I equate it to you playing Half Life 2 Deathmatch, but you can't use the gravity gun, because you haven't gotten there in single player yet.
It's a STUPID design decision, imo.

Creston

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77. No subject Jun 10, 2005, 11:44 Tr0n
 
The "unlock all" was only a weekend feature, which was said many times. ArenaNet always planned that players, be it PvE or PvP, will have to earn skills and not just get them from scratch.

This was their design concept from day 1.

 
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76. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 11:07 MeatForce
 
I think Creston is pretty much right on the money with his concerns, although I've decided to give ANet the benefit of a week or two before I fully snap (as they've said they're still in the process of sorting all of this out).

The thing about it that strikes me as odd is that during the beta weekends, you could roll a PvP character with all the skills and items unlocked, and everyone seemed to be happy.

Come launch-time, the unlock all skills button is gone from the PvP creation screen.. the result is that PvPers HAVE to play through countless hours of the game they're not interested in before they can use all of that stuff. I'd sure as hell be pissed off about that too. Why on Earth did they do it that way?

They should just put back the freakin' UAS button. It's so goddamn simple. The PvPers want it, the PvEers don't give a rat's ass, and it would put an end to the enormous divide between this game's two player-bases which are currently battling eachother in the fora over whose vision of the game is the right one. I just can't see why this can't be the game both groups want it to be, EXCEPT that some demented moron at ANet has decided that PvPers should be forced to 'experience' the rich RPG goodness that lurks inside GW.

Fuck that. If they want to experience it, they will. Forcing them to, however, will just get people into whine-mode, and ANet's solution to that problem so far appears to be to oil the squeaky wheels... But they don't even go and get some proper oil. They just kind of fumble around under their desks until one of them says, "well here's a bit off slimy ooze, Jim! Let's smear some of this around on things and see if it does any good!"

The thing I REALLY don't get about ANet's response to all of this is that by nerfing the drop rates of rares and uniques, they're drastically INCREASING the need for new PvPers to grind in PvE in order to unlock all the tweaks they're after. It just doesn't compute with me.

OTOH, I LIKE that they're not afraid to make some pretty sweeping changes to the game if they perceive there to be a need. Which is why I'm just going to see where all of this ends up in a couple of weeks. They could pull something clever out of their asses -- who knows?

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I actually get paid for this..
 
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I'm not even angry. I'm being so sincere right now, even though you broke my heart and killed me.
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75. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 10:58 itzaaron
 
I do agree that moving all the elite skills to post-ascention, and mostly to the last three missions and one quest, was a move I disagree with. Still, it's unlikely most people will stop playing a character as soon as they beat the game. Also, consensus is the Hundred Blades skill sucks for an elite. The problem is that if it weren't elite, people would be using it with Illusionary Weaponry to do absolutely broken damage in one hit.

Also, I think that your feelings about the specialness of finding runes might change a little now that you're ascended. I actually began to find so many that I was forced to sit around in town trying to sell runes just to free up space in my inventory. Maybe they could change it so there are only rune traders in Droknar's Forge or something, so that level 3's who have just finished pre-searing can't come in and (with money borrowed from their guild or from their other character) outfit themselves with superior runes.

Just a side-note, I'm not a PVPer, but I played at the Tomb of the Primeval Kings twice. The second time, my team held the Hall of Heroes. Several of the preliminary matches we didn't lose a single life on our team, even when we had to defeat four other teams ourselves. At that point I had only two minor runes, earth and energy, and was using armor from outside Sanctum Cay. Runes and +15% while health > 50% weapons help sure, but a good team without them will destroy a mediocre team with them any day.
This comment was edited on Jun 10, 10:59.
 
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74. Re: No subject Jun 10, 2005, 10:42 Creston
 
The devs blacklisted your account, in game.

Stalinism at its finest!

Creston

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