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| 76. |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Dec 9, 2004, 19:05 |
Tango |
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and I still haven't seen anything concrete to dispute that idea Well no, of course you haven't - there isn't a concrete piece of evidence other than pre-Madrid the war didn't enjoy popular support in Spain. The election was thus essentially a referendum on continuing involvement, and the people spoke. It's just simple democracy. However, this isn't why your original statement - that Spain wimped out to the terrorists - is wrong.
The point is that it is nothing to do with bowing to terrorism. They pulled out of the war in Iraq, not the War on Terror. These are two very very different wars. Spain is a big player in the War on Terror and have a lot to offer - they have been fighting Eta and other Basque terrorist groups for years, like the UK and Northern Ireland, or Indonesia and Islamic fundamentalists there. As with any nation in the democratic West, there's no escaping the War on Terror.
However, anyone that claims the war in Iraq is part of the War on Terror is not correct. Bush and Blair don't even say it is - or at least they didn't at the time. Iraq was about WMD according to them. Others (like Halsy and JoeBlow et al :)) suggest Iraq is about oil, and US interests in the middle east, so on. Still others believe it was a neo-conservative plan from the beginning, Resolution 1441 providing the necessary legal justification and 9/11 providing the political and popular springboard, despite a complete (and highly obvious) lack of connection.
It was only after the WMD thing was shown to be nonsense that Bush and Blair have started reminding us how great the world is without Saddam. Which nobody disagrees with - the notion that anyone that doesn't like the war in Iraq automatically is saying Iraq was better off before is so wrong as to be laughable. What is almost undeniable though, even by war supporters is that the war was a war of choice, not necessity (as opposed to Afghanistan). The Spanish government chose to join up, although the majority of citizens didn't want to. There was a terrorist bomb (which was terrorism, not Iraqis) which slaughtered a lot of people. The citizens, who already believed the choice the government made to sign up was the wrong one, had the chance to boot them out, and did so. All this meant was that Spain's official position came into line with their popular position.
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We don't go to Ravenholm. |
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Date |
Subject |
Author |
| |
1. |
Dec 9, 10:26 |
No subject |
nin |
| |
13. |
Dec 9, 11:27 |
This just kills me ... |
BFSoLo. |
| |
16. |
Dec 9, 11:45 |
Re: This just kills me ... |
xXBatmanXx |
| |
2. |
Dec 9, 10:40 |
No subject |
sauron |
| |
3. |
Dec 9, 10:44 |
Dimebag will be missed |
McNublet |
| |
4. |
Dec 9, 10:45 |
Not a good day... |
Zathrus |
| |
5. |
Dec 9, 10:51 |
Pantera... |
Hanover |
| |
8. |
Dec 9, 11:12 |
Re: Pantera... |
AJ |
| |
6. |
Dec 9, 10:53 |
Quicksand |
Zorlack |
| |
12. |
Dec 9, 11:25 |
Re: Quicksand |
xXBatmanXx |
| |
14. |
Dec 9, 11:31 |
Re: Quicksand |
Beamer |
| |
36. |
Dec 9, 14:29 |
Re: Quicksand |
Mr. Tact |
| |
37. |
Dec 9, 14:43 |
Re: Quicksand |
xXBatmanXx |
| |
38. |
Dec 9, 15:02 |
Re: Quicksand |
MrGrosser |
| |
7. |
Dec 9, 11:01 |
Another (groin-related) story of the day |
Jim |
| |
9. |
Dec 9, 11:12 |
Re: Another (groin-related) story of the |
Zathrus |
| |
10. |
Dec 9, 11:14 |
Image of the Day |
Gandhi |
| |
17. |
Dec 9, 12:04 |
Re: Another (groin-related) story of the |
Tango |
| |
18. |
Dec 9, 12:11 |
Re: Another (groin-related) story of the |
Warhawk |
| |
20. |
Dec 9, 12:31 |
Re: Another (groin-related) story of the |
xXBatmanXx |
| |
21. |
Dec 9, 12:42 |
Re: Another (groin-related) story of the |
Warhawk |
| |
22. |
Dec 9, 12:49 |
Re: Another (groin-related) story of the |
xXBatmanXx |
| |
11. |
Dec 9, 11:21 |
Dimebag R.I.P |
Protoz |
| |
15. |
Dec 9, 11:43 |
ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
FourPak |
| |
19. |
Dec 9, 12:29 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Jim |
| |
24. |
Dec 9, 12:58 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
nin |
| |
26. |
Dec 9, 13:12 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
xXBatmanXx |
| |
27. |
Dec 9, 13:30 |
Flash problems in Firefox.. |
BicycleRepairMan |
| |
30. |
Dec 9, 13:39 |
Pantera |
BicycleRepairMan |
| |
28. |
Dec 9, 13:34 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Zathrus |
| |
29. |
Dec 9, 13:38 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Jereco |
| |
39. |
Dec 9, 15:06 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Yosemite Sam |
| |
41. |
Dec 9, 15:23 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
nin |
| |
46. |
Dec 9, 16:08 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Yosemite Sam |
| |
47. |
Dec 9, 16:20 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Zathrus |
| |
51. |
Dec 9, 16:26 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Warhawk |
| |
54. |
Dec 9, 16:36 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Warhawk |
| |
62. |
Dec 9, 17:46 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Quaternion |
| |
55. |
Dec 9, 16:38 |
Re: guns |
Yosemite Sam |
| |
56. |
Dec 9, 16:50 |
Re: guns |
Enahs |
| |
58. |
Dec 9, 17:14 |
Re: guns |
Yosemite Sam |
| |
63. |
Dec 9, 17:49 |
Re: guns |
Enahs |
| |
64. |
Dec 9, 18:00 |
Re: guns |
Yosemite Sam |
| |
65. |
Dec 9, 18:07 |
Re: guns |
Enahs |
| |
68. |
Dec 9, 18:20 |
Re: guns |
Propagandhi |
| |
73. |
Dec 9, 18:29 |
Re: guns |
Enahs |
| |
74. |
Dec 9, 18:51 |
Re: guns |
AirWreck |
| |
75. |
Dec 9, 18:54 |
Re: guns |
Yosemite Sam |
| |
71. |
Dec 9, 18:23 |
Re: guns |
Warhawk |
| |
80. |
Dec 9, 23:53 |
Re: guns |
MeatForce |
| |
81. |
Dec 10, 00:35 |
Re: guns |
Warhawk |
| |
83. |
Dec 10, 01:19 |
Re: guns |
JediLuke |
| |
88. |
Dec 10, 07:58 |
Re: guns |
Tango |
| |
84. |
Dec 10, 03:50 |
Re: guns |
Propagandhi |
| |
89. |
Dec 10, 09:12 |
Re: guns |
WarPig |
| |
92. |
Dec 10, 10:44 |
Re: guns |
Warhawk |
| |
93. |
Dec 10, 10:59 |
Re: guns |
nin |
| |
97. |
Dec 10, 14:50 |
Re: guns |
Quaternion |
| |
99. |
Dec 10, 15:15 |
Re: guns |
Warhawk |
| |
100. |
Dec 10, 15:29 |
Re: guns |
Quaternion |
| |
101. |
Dec 10, 17:06 |
Re: guns |
Nemesis |
| |
102. |
Dec 10, 17:36 |
Re: guns |
xXBatmanXx |
| |
103. |
Dec 10, 17:46 |
Re: guns |
Nemesis |
| |
104. |
Dec 10, 21:18 |
Re: guns |
WarPig |
| |
105. |
Dec 11, 11:31 |
Re: guns |
Armengar |
| |
106. |
Dec 11, 17:01 |
Re: guns |
nin |
| |
87. |
Dec 10, 07:44 |
Re: guns |
MeatForce |
| |
59. |
Dec 9, 17:14 |
Re: guns |
Zorlack |
| |
57. |
Dec 9, 17:14 |
Re: guns |
Zathrus |
| |
49. |
Dec 9, 16:25 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Warhawk |
| |
60. |
Dec 9, 17:25 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
nin |
| |
61. |
Dec 9, 17:43 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Yosemite Sam |
| |
91. |
Dec 10, 09:39 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
xXBatmanXx |
| |
94. |
Dec 10, 11:06 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Moonbender |
| |
95. |
Dec 10, 11:16 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Warhawk |
| |
96. |
Dec 10, 14:08 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
xXBatmanXx |
| |
98. |
Dec 10, 15:00 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Quaternion |
| |
77. |
Dec 9, 19:08 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Zathrus |
| |
90. |
Dec 10, 09:36 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
xXBatmanXx |
| |
42. |
Dec 9, 15:29 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Moog Operator |
| |
44. |
Dec 9, 15:51 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Warhawk |
| |
45. |
Dec 9, 16:07 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
BicycleRepairMan |
| |
52. |
Dec 9, 16:28 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Warhawk |
| |
48. |
Dec 9, 16:24 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Tango |
| |
53. |
Dec 9, 16:31 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Warhawk |
| >> |
76. |
Dec 9, 19:05 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Tango |
| |
86. |
Dec 10, 06:44 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Moonbender |
| |
50. |
Dec 9, 16:26 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Zathrus |
| |
70. |
Dec 9, 18:22 |
Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait |
Moog Operator |
| |
23. |
Dec 9, 12:57 |
R.I.P. Dimebag "Diamond" Darrel |
Toxic_Metal |
| |
25. |
Dec 9, 13:08 |
R.I.P. Dimebag Darrel |
Nameless Again |
| |
31. |
Dec 9, 13:44 |
Robot Won't Save Hubble. |
Quaternion |
| |
33. |
Dec 9, 14:00 |
Re: Robot Won't Save Hubble. |
Zathrus |
| |
34. |
Dec 9, 14:13 |
Re: Robot Won't Save Hubble. |
Quaternion |
| |
35. |
Dec 9, 14:18 |
Re: Robot Won't Save Hubble. |
xXBatmanXx |
| |
40. |
Dec 9, 15:10 |
Re: Robot Won't Save Hubble. |
Zathrus |
| |
43. |
Dec 9, 15:50 |
Re: Robot Won't Save Hubble. |
Jim |
| |
32. |
Dec 9, 13:57 |
Zathrus |
Bronco |
| |
66. |
Dec 9, 18:11 |
Riddick |
Killer Kane |
| |
67. |
Dec 9, 18:19 |
Re: Riddick |
Hump |
| |
72. |
Dec 9, 18:24 |
Re: Riddick |
Ihya |
| |
78. |
Dec 9, 19:40 |
Re: Riddick |
Propagandhi |
| |
69. |
Dec 9, 18:22 |
From my cold dead.. |
Killer Kane |
| |
79. |
Dec 9, 22:39 |
Mrow |
Creston |
| |
82. |
Dec 10, 01:09 |
You KNOW I had to say it... |
Camaro76 |
| |
85. |
Dec 10, 04:33 |
Rumsfeld Bullshit |
Hump |
| |
107. |
Dec 11, 18:04 |
No subject |
Malakai |
| |
108. |
Dec 15, 15:29 |
Re: No subject |
Gandhi |
| |
109. |
Dec 15, 16:38 |
Re: No subject |
Malakai |
| |
110. |
Dec 15, 17:01 |
Re: No subject |
Gandhi |
|
|
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