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Out of the Blue

Hamm, overslept today in spite of falling off early last night. Not sure what's up with that, it's not like I feel sick or overtired or anything. Oh well, it could have been worse; I could have been awakened by the G-Man, but I wasn't. At least I don't think I was.

"Wake up and smell the.... ashes..."

R.I.P. Dimebag Darrell Abbott. Thanks ASLayerAODsk.

Links of the Day: Make your own Headcrab.
Stories of the Day: Babylon 5 Movie Starts Filming in April.
Police Dog Bites Nude Man in the Genitals. Thanks Bryan.
Jawa in Jersey.
Science!: Concussions Kept Tintin Forever Young - Study (registration required). Thanks Warren.
Getting Burned? Put on a Shirt.
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Follow-ups: Panel: Robot Won't Save Hubble.
Thanks Mike Martinez and Ant.

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110 Replies. 6 pages. Viewing page 3.
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70. Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait Dec 9, 2004, 18:22 Moog Operator
 
"Our leaders are leaders, not role models"
Whether you care to admit it or not, peopel base their actions and impressions of actions based on successful people in their society (the president just may be included in that group) and how the act. The president is a role model to millions of children in your country.

"the rest of the free world is safer with Saddam defeated and the Taliban captured or on the run"
No it isn't and any competent analyst - there are scores of them who agree - will say that the world is much more dangerous when, what, 2 billion muslims want every American dead? Not to mention the dangers of opium, heroin, the billions of dollars america alone spends on it going to gangsters etc. Calling the world "safer" because USA mass media proclaims it so is simply indicative of your having been totally bamboozled by American propaganda - which is the most effective, advanced system of propaganda ever instituted in the history of this planet.


"And your response to incidents like the repeated attacks to the WTC, international flight bombings"

My response is if the USA would alter it's foreign policy to reduce abuse of the countries, groups, religions, etc. which are marginalized and persecuted by current policy, these attacks would never have happened in the first place. Not living in the United States leaves one more answer on the tip of my tongue - Bring 'em on. Bring on about 6 million deaths strong of "'em" on, and then keep bringing them. If Americans such as yourself choose, and you do choose, to be completely ignorant of the ultimate causes of the death of Americans, Spaniards, Britons, and focus on narrow minded proximate causes which allow one to rationalize utter lunacy in worldwide affairs - you deserve the terror, you deserve the Iraqi insurgency, your children deserve the debt they are being fucked with, you deserve the IEDs, all of it. All of those things are caused by deeper reasons than some whipped up muslims "hating your freedom," and if as a mass of people Americans choose to ignore it, they deserve the deaths, debt, and hatred which is coming to them.

An effective and foolproof plan to curb worldwide fear and hatred of America and Americans is to quite simply stop terrorizing the entire planet with the multi-faceted state-terror the USA engages in, and has engaged in in the past. Say "We are very sorry for the holocaust we have committed directly, and by proxy in the last 60 years on the poor people of the Earth, and will immediately cease and decist holocautical activites, and begin taking atual steps to reduce terror - our own terror." Then watch the world react with ... peace. It's that easy.

BTW I own 4 guns, and have never had problems with shooting people, probably because my role models were not homicidal maniacs - ordering murder and war crimes is just as bad if not worse than commiting them.

STAY RIGHT WHERE YOU ARE, GET OUT OF THAT BED AND GET DOWN ON THE FLOOR, GET OUTSIDE RIGHT NOW, RIGHT HERE: GET DOWN ON THE CEMENT, I DONT CARE IF YOU'RE NUDE, GET DOWN ON THE CEMENT, I DON'T CARE IF ITS FREEZING! WHERES THE DRUGS, WE KNOW YOU GOT THE DRU
 
STAY RIGHT WHERE YOU ARE, GET OUT OF THAT BED AND GET DOWN ON THE FLOOR, GET OUTSIDE RIGHT NOW, RIGHT HERE: GET DOWN ON THE CEMENT, I DONT CARE IF YOU'RE NUDE, GET DOWN ON THE CEMENT, I DON'T CARE IF ITS FREEZING! WHERES THE DRUGS, WE KNOW YOU GOT THE DRU
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69. From my cold dead.. Dec 9, 2004, 18:22 Killer Kane
 
HANDS ! ..i was in the woods on Sun w/ a buddy and my son shooting targets & cans , having a blast ( amazing what a 30-0-6 w, an armor piercing bullet will do to a tallboy can !..) you think you are going to take that away from anyone ???! ( what a silly argument ! )guns are here to stay , and unfortunately that feedom comes with great risk. you have the freedom to starve to death , freeze to death and have your building knocked down by planes in this country as well....it all comes with the territory .....even if all guns were suddenly banned you could never stop some maniac from getting one and doing the un-thinkable.....thats just the way is

 
Avatar 14092
 
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68. Re: guns Dec 9, 2004, 18:20 Propagandhi
 
Summary of gun debate:

Troll->anecdotal evidence->made up statistic->personal attack->made up statistic->anecdotal evidence->made up statistic->repeat

The worst part is that neither side notices their hypocracy...
 
I eat pasta!
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67. Re: Riddick Dec 9, 2004, 18:19 Hump
 
Riddick is an amazing game.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Sometimes I dream about....cheese. Here, have a medkit"
- Half Life 2 NPC
 
Avatar 10137
 
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Both the “left” and the “right” pretend they have the answer, but they are mere flippers on the same thalidomide baby, and the truth is that neither side has a clue."

- Jim Goad
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66. Riddick Dec 9, 2004, 18:11 Killer Kane
 
got Riddick today and played about 15 mins so far and iam pretty impressed . great cut scene with a "Whompa/Yeti in the begining , graphics on par with Doom 3 ( tho H2's facial animations have ruined all other games for me now in the face dept.....)great use of your own shadow , great hand animations ( best hand to hand combat in a game thus far ) AND you can see your LEGS when you look down !

 
Avatar 14092
 
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65. Re: guns Dec 9, 2004, 18:07 Enahs
 
http://www.guncite.com/cnngunde.html
Read it yourself, I did say in the civilized world.
If you want to compare the US to Somalia or some other really fucked up country to support your idea then ok, but I think the US should be above these other backward places.

LOL!
From your OWN site of reference:
http://guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvintl.html
Note, it is also the link at the VERY top of that page you linked to.

In fact, the link you posted is one of the examples that site has to show how misleading the media is in US gun death rates, and they go on to debunk that type of crap on the link I gave and the subsequent links on that page (which again, was at the very top and center of your link!)...

LOL good work man! Thanks for proving my point.


_____
Enahs
That’s a deep kiss too, like the Europeans. You know the French they have to unhinge their jaw to show love.
This comment was edited on Dec 9, 18:14.
 
Avatar 15513
 
I am free of all prejudice. I hate everyone equally.
- W. C. Fields
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64. Re: guns Dec 9, 2004, 18:00 Yosemite Sam
 
http://www.guncite.com/cnngunde.html
Read it yourself, I did say in the civilized world.
If you want to compare the US to Somalia or some other really fucked up country to support your idea then ok, but I think the US should be above these other backward places.


 
Avatar 21539
 
PSN id PR345, PST - D3, GTA5, Borderlands 2, Grid 2, GTA4, BoS, RDR, GT5, COD WaW, KZ2, RAGE, Dirt2, MC LA, Skate2, LBP, Dead Nation - Wanna jam? Hit me up on PSN, Mention Blues News.

CIV4 MOD http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=326525
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63. Re: guns Dec 9, 2004, 17:49 Enahs
 
Well someone with a gun is not going to play by your rules and come into your 8ft zone, there going to pop you at range. At least with a knife there going to have to approach you and you at least have a chance.

99% of all killings with guns are at close range. This is not a made up statistic either, look it up.

The point of my post was not to get into a debate or reasons for/against guns. Just pointing out some flaws in your logic. The fact is, how 99% of killings with guns are accomplished, a knife is just as if not more dangerous (and through my personal experience, I believe it is more dangerous).

If somebody is intent on killing anyone, having or not having access to a gun is not going to have any relevance.

Ohh, and FYI to a response to a comment you made earlier.
The United States of America is not even in the top ten percent of people killed with guns relative to the population.

You can hate guns all you want, fine and dandy with me! But if you are going to try and progress your agenda against them, at least use real facts and stop coming up with down right stupid fake numbers to support your side.

*edit*

FYI. I do not own a gun, nor plan on ever owning one. Though I have shot many different types and been trained to handle them. So do not even bother trying to insult me by calling me a “gun loving closed minded NRA fool”.

Just because I do not like/want something does not mean I have to lie and make up BS about it.


_____
Enahs
That’s a deep kiss too, like the Europeans. You know the French they have to unhinge their jaw to show love.
This comment was edited on Dec 9, 17:56.
 
Avatar 15513
 
I am free of all prejudice. I hate everyone equally.
- W. C. Fields
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62. Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait Dec 9, 2004, 17:46 Quaternion
 
Should we ban cars, too?

[opening can of worms]

At least cars have a use other than killing. A gun's purpose, on the other hand, is to kill. And that's something that never made it on my daily task list so I don't see the point of carrying one around.

Guns are only useful to hunters, cops and the military. I'm a programmer so a gun isn't of much use to me other than to shoot the monitor when I get pissed at the computer. If a civilian had shot last night's shooter instead of a cop, he'd be in court for quite a while with a vigilante justice case against him. Leave it to the boys in blue instead.

I don't mind if people own guns to protect their homes, but I don't think any civilian should ever be walking around the city with a weapon. They may only be protecting themselves, but I don't know them so I just don't trust them to use it responsibly. To me, they're strangers bearing arms in a supposedly civilized setting.

The whole thing is based on the idea that we're in a dangerous chaotic society (every man for himself) and therefore need to defend ourselves because the law won't do it. It's a self fullfilling prophecy. If enough people distrust the law and prescribe to that mindset, we're back to the wild west with gun totting cowboys, vigilantes and all the trimmings.

If, on the other hand, people assume that it's relatively safe out there and don't bear arms, then it IS safer because there aren't a bunch of gun totting cowboys out there that can kill you at the pull of a trigger because they had a gun handy when you cut them off in traffic. They'll just flip you the finger and yell obscenities instead.

That's my view on it anyway.

 
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61. Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait Dec 9, 2004, 17:43 Yosemite Sam
 
NP nin I wasnt serious, glad to see someone on the board doesnt feel the need for a gun. Guess society has a long way to go before we can be truly called civilized.
PS I do realize that less then 50% of americans are so bent on the right to bear arms, its just the massive NRA lobbying that keeps the US in the stone age.

 
Avatar 21539
 
PSN id PR345, PST - D3, GTA5, Borderlands 2, Grid 2, GTA4, BoS, RDR, GT5, COD WaW, KZ2, RAGE, Dirt2, MC LA, Skate2, LBP, Dead Nation - Wanna jam? Hit me up on PSN, Mention Blues News.

CIV4 MOD http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=326525
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60. Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait Dec 9, 2004, 17:25 nin
 
Ouch, didnt think I was trolling.


My comment wasn't meant as a personal slam against you (and if you took it that way, I'm sorry).

I play a ton of FPS, but I'm very "anti gun". (Oddly enough, my father is very pro-gun, yet I can't get him into playing FPS games. ) But that's my personal choice, and I respect others rights to have them if they so desire.

Anyway...there's no real easy solution to the issue. And there's always going to be some nut that gets a gun and makes others look bad because of it.

My gripe with the current case is, now that the guy is dead, we have no idea WHY he did it. Don't get me wrong, I applaud whoever stopped him (I believe it was a cop, and I believe he was shot), but I wish we knew WHY this happened...



http://tds.nin.com/
 
http://www.nin.com/pub/tension/
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59. Re: guns Dec 9, 2004, 17:14 Zorlack
 
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/tables/weaponstab.htm

here are some stats..

 
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58. Re: guns Dec 9, 2004, 17:14 Yosemite Sam
 
Well someone with a gun is not going to play by your rules and come into your 8ft zone, there going to pop you at range. At least with a knife there going to have to approach you and you at least have a chance.
No it will not magically get better, the proliferation of guns would take years to clean up, but if magically every gun was gone then yes it would.
Ya my 1000 to 1 ratio is out of thin air and would not include police, just your average citizen, which is the folks I think sould not be able to bear arms, mmmmkay.

This comment was edited on Dec 9, 17:48.
 
Avatar 21539
 
PSN id PR345, PST - D3, GTA5, Borderlands 2, Grid 2, GTA4, BoS, RDR, GT5, COD WaW, KZ2, RAGE, Dirt2, MC LA, Skate2, LBP, Dead Nation - Wanna jam? Hit me up on PSN, Mention Blues News.

CIV4 MOD http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=326525
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57. Re: guns Dec 9, 2004, 17:14 Zathrus
 
At least I have a chance against a knife.

And I have a chance against a gun too. It's called running the fuck away. Most people are lousy shots, particularly when under pressure. And if you're in a domestic situation then merely putting a wall or door between yourself and the gun will give you as much protection as a bullet proof vest -- most handguns have no penetrating power, contrary to what's shown in movies.

People saved by guns compared to people killed by guns lol thats a what, 1000 to 1 ratio at best

Love the random number you pulled out of nothingness there. I'd say it's considerably lower than that. Certainly not in favor of guns, but nowhere as absurd as you claim.

because you are using something for reasons it was not designed for

Really? It takes much planning or effort to kill with a knife? Or a baseball bat? Or a car?

it takes no effort, no thought

Ever fired a gun? Even something like a paintball marker? Hitting things isn't as easy as it is in Quake. (For the record - I've never fired any gun more powerful than a BB rifle or a paintball marker; I'm a lousy shot with both)

Does it not sink in as to why the states has the highest murder rate in the civilized world, guns guns guns.

Yeah, and I'm sure if you outlaw them it'll just magically disappear, right? Uh huh. Get real. The issue is not as inanely simplistic as you seem to think.

 
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56. Re: guns Dec 9, 2004, 16:50 Enahs
 
Well I would personally prefer to face a madman with a knife then one with a gun anyday. At least I have a chance against a knife. Questionable?

Actually, if you are within 8 feet of someone, a knife is more dangerous than a gun.

I would prefer to face someone with a gun than a knife. But that is just me, someone who has trained for many years in hand to hand combat via martial arts, and more importantly with Navy Seals and Special Op's guys and local police officers (as well as my knee is doing, I will probably start back next summer!) with guns that fired those little yellow BB's, more carnage happened to the defender with a knife than a gun…WAY more (in 8 foot range). However, with gun's innocent people get hurt in the "battle".

But ya know, if two people are standing around fighting over who gets shots, and you are not doing anything to help and are not getting away, you deserve to be shot….

Honestly…I think a lot more people deserve to be shot than are.



_____
Enahs
That’s a deep kiss too, like the Europeans. You know the French they have to unhinge their jaw to show love.
This comment was edited on Dec 9, 16:58.
 
Avatar 15513
 
I am free of all prejudice. I hate everyone equally.
- W. C. Fields
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55. Re: guns Dec 9, 2004, 16:38 Yosemite Sam
 
Well I would personally prefer to face a madman with a knife then one with a gun anyday. At least I have a chance against a knife. Questionable? Grabbed something else capable? common, you work for the NRA? There is nothing capable as a gun, except another gun. People saved by guns compared to people killed by guns lol thats a what, 1000 to 1 ratio at best. Gun talk will always get me boiling.
Sure you can kill with almost anything, but that takes planning or effort because you are using something for reasons it was not designed for. A gun is made to kill, it takes no effort, no thought, it is the perfect instrument of death. But you will all defend it to the last and then cry a river when people die. Does it not sink in as to why the states has the highest murder rate in the civilized world, guns guns guns.

This comment was edited on Dec 9, 17:00.
 
Avatar 21539
 
PSN id PR345, PST - D3, GTA5, Borderlands 2, Grid 2, GTA4, BoS, RDR, GT5, COD WaW, KZ2, RAGE, Dirt2, MC LA, Skate2, LBP, Dead Nation - Wanna jam? Hit me up on PSN, Mention Blues News.

CIV4 MOD http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=326525
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54. Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait Dec 9, 2004, 16:36 Warhawk
 

http://www.cnn.com/2004/LAW/12/07/boys.hit.ap/

Should we ban cars, too? Good thing she didn't have a gun, 'cause he would have made it, right?




*************
* Warhawk *
*************

You know what I'm going to get you next Christmas, Mom? A big wooden cross, so that every time you feel unappreciated for your sacrifices, you can climb on up and nail yourself to it.


This comment was edited on Dec 9, 17:03.
 

Have I lied to you? I mean, in this room? Trust me, leave that thing alone. - GLaDOS

Did IQs just drop sharply while I was away? - Ripley
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53. Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait Dec 9, 2004, 16:31 Warhawk
 
The decision was far more complex than bowing to terrorist pressure. It came down to weighing up principles vs lives, and they chose differently, perhaps, to how you personally (or America at large, or France, UK etc) would choose. It was nothing to do with wimping.

Possibly. Looked like caving to a terrorist threat to an awful lot of folks, though, and I still haven't seen anything concrete to dispute that idea (and you think it would have been brought up by now).


*************
* Warhawk *
*************

You know what I'm going to get you next Christmas, Mom? A big wooden cross, so that every time you feel unappreciated for your sacrifices, you can climb on up and nail yourself to it.
 

Have I lied to you? I mean, in this room? Trust me, leave that thing alone. - GLaDOS

Did IQs just drop sharply while I was away? - Ripley
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52. Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait Dec 9, 2004, 16:28 Warhawk
 
Maybe it would be to go after THE PEOPLE WHO DID IT, like Osama bin Laden

I agree wholeheartedly, we should have pursued that avenue first. Moog said that even that was wrong. I disagree.


*************
* Warhawk *
*************

You know what I'm going to get you next Christmas, Mom? A big wooden cross, so that every time you feel unappreciated for your sacrifices, you can climb on up and nail yourself to it.
 

Have I lied to you? I mean, in this room? Trust me, leave that thing alone. - GLaDOS

Did IQs just drop sharply while I was away? - Ripley
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51. Re: ot:Rumsfeld in Kuwait Dec 9, 2004, 16:26 Warhawk
 
And don't forget to add in the number of people who were saved because someone shot and killed (or merely wounded) some deranged asshole who was going to kill someone else.

As in the cop who took out the nut at the concert for starters.


*************
* Warhawk *
*************

You know what I'm going to get you next Christmas, Mom? A big wooden cross, so that every time you feel unappreciated for your sacrifices, you can climb on up and nail yourself to it.
 

Have I lied to you? I mean, in this room? Trust me, leave that thing alone. - GLaDOS

Did IQs just drop sharply while I was away? - Ripley
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