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Out of the Blue

I had along-overdue visit with the eye doctor yesterday, though it turns out my glasses prescription hasn't changed (I'm nearsighted), so the delay was of no consequence. I forgot, however, to try to satisfy my curiosity when he asked me if I had any questions, because I wanted to ask him his thoughts on that LASER eye surgery (I'm guessing he gets that a lot). I will follow-up with him on this directly soon enough, but I decided to lay some groundwork on the web... searching for "LASER eye surgery problems" (naturally the aspect of this I am most curious about) turned up enough of an abundance of results to turn anyone off to the prospect. A more refined search for "Custom LASIK problems" was much less pessimistic, though, with the majority of hits from eye doctor sites discussing potential complications. Along the way I learned that the Custom LASIK is also capable of coping with astigmatisms too (though mine is considered quite mild to start with), so it's possible I'm a candidate for this. At this point I admit to still being a bit doubtful about all this... I'm not much of a gambler, and I'm reluctant to risk my vision in order to take the chance on improving it, but I am still tugged by curiosity, so if anyone has any links or information about the pros and cons of this procedure, I'd be very interested.

Links of the Day: An Analysis of Netflix's DVD Allocation System. Thanks Bronco.
By Popular Demand: Eyeball jewelry new fashion trend. Thanks all one million of you.
Stories of the Day: Actors Whip Easter Bunny at Church Show. Thanks Halsy.
Man to bet all on Vegas roulette spin.
The forgotten story behind IBM's 'first mainframe'.
Science!: Dangerous space rocks under watch.
Media of the Day: Spider-Man 2 Trailer. Thanks Ant.
Thanks Mike Martinez

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128. Re: No subject Apr 12, 2004, 20:48 JediLuke
 
Discrimination is just another word for choice. Someone else put it quite nicely:"When I order steak instead of hamburger, I'm discriminating."

Somehow I don't quite think it works the same way with steaks and hamburgers as people. A person is free to choose which food to eat, but the government is not free to choose which citizens to protect and provide with basic rights.

Who cares if homosexuality has biological origins or not?

Why do you always ask for clarification on the most obvious points? It's significant because were homosexuality chosen, we'd be talking about discriminating against a lifestyle choice, but instead we're talking about discriminating against people. They have no choice, this is who they are. If a gay man wants to get married, he cannot simply decide to become heterosexual and marry a woman. To suggest that a gay man should marry a woman if he wants to be married is to truly destroy the definition of marriage. Sex is a fundamental part of marriage. A gay man is not going to have sex with a woman any sooner than you're gonna beg a guy to fuck you in the ass. Two people that do not have sex don't have a very good chance for a successful marriage.

This is one reason why your "gays have the same rights" argument is idiotic.

Yes, they do. Repeating that lie will not make it true. The truth isn't invalidated by your refusal to accept it.

Good lord you're obtuse. Your claim is solely based on semantics. You say that homosexuals have the same right to marry a member of the opposite sex that anyone does. While this is true, it's obviously an attempt to be correct based on a technicality. A child could see the weakness of this argument. Can you dispute this statement?

"Homosexual couples are not provided the same right to officiate their relationship in marriage as straight couples are."

No, you cannot. Therefore, homosexual couples do not have the same rights as straight couples. QED.

Let me ask you, if *only* gay marriage were legal, would you feel you have the same rights as gays? You have just as much right to marry someone of the same sex as they do. This is every bit as stupid as your argument.

What about homosexuality requires that we destroy marriage to make homosexuals happy?

What about letting gays marry destroys marriage?

Why don't they come up with their own damn institution - Garriage, maybe?

Why would you throw something that stupid in there? What are you trying to say? Their own damn institution? First of all, you don't "own" marriage. Secondly, in what capacity would this institution serve? How would it differ from marriage? I suspect you were joking, but that's just a dumb thing to say.

now you're advocating redefining marriage (and destroying it in the process) as defending the sanctity of marriage?

The great thing about you is that you continue to rely on arguments that have already been disproven. We're glad you make yourself laugh, but you've yet to show that allowing gays to marry represents either the redefinition or destruction of marriage.

Face it, the only arguments you guys can come up with (after paring away all the obfuscation, ad hominem attack, and strawman argument), is "come on, be nice, why are you being so mean?"

No, not really. Several people have tried, with varying degrees of patience and tact, to show you the many fundamental flaws in your reasoning. You continue to hold the same false premises as truisms, however. You don't have a single rational support for your position. For fuck's sake, you've already given yourself away! Just drop the act already. You don't approve of gay behavior and you want to stick it to the liberals. I'm starting to suspect more and more that not only are you a bigot, but you've got a few marbles rolling around upstairs.

By writing the laws to exclude a natural state of being (homosexual)

That never happened, so the arguments based upon it are invalid.

How can you call them invalid when you've admitted that you'd support a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage? That would be a law excluding a natural state of being. Pull your head out of your ass.

The marriage laws don't care what religious means (ceremony) are used to achieve the end (marriage - woman and man).

Again you're supplying your own self-serving definition of marriage without citing anything but precedent as support. Face it, you're begging the question.

This sort of presupposes that the only reason marriage was gender-specific in the first place was to exclude homosexuals, which I find ridiculous.

Where are you getting this stuff? Talk about straw men. His point was clearly that when marriage was first made a legal process it was not known that homosexuality was as natural a state of being as heterosexuality. Now that this is known, it becomes clear that not allowing gays to marry is unfairly discriminating against them, and denying rights to gays because of their sexuality is just as bad as denying rights to blacks because of their race.

Morlock, in every single post you're making invalid assumptions which lead directly to your invalid conclusions. You have no argument. You're the worst straw man offender here. You pick apart replies and disagree with non-central points as though that destroys the refutation of your basic premise. Your position as you've presented it is utterly flawed. If you're not representing it properly, maybe you should do so rather than having a nice chucklefest with yourself over how smart you obviously believe yourself to be. You're currently saying nothing.

~Steve

This comment was edited on Apr 12, 20:59.
 
http://stevegoldbergmusic.com
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  56. Apr 10, 11:30  Re: Some different feedback Patrick
  63. Apr 10, 15:32   Re: Some different feedback Dr.Del
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  39. Apr 9, 21:24 My real issue... Ray Marden
  42. Apr 9, 22:01 Laser Eye Surgery BigSugar
  43. Apr 9, 22:09 Bunny Whuppins BigSugar
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  57. Apr 10, 14:01 ... Bunko
  58. Apr 10, 14:17  Re: ... JediLuke
  59. Apr 10, 14:21  Re: ... Morlock
  60. Apr 10, 14:34   Re: ... Bunko
  62. Apr 10, 15:00    Re: ... Enahs
  64. Apr 10, 15:48   Re: ... Halsy
  66. Apr 10, 16:41    Re: ... Morlock
  67. Apr 10, 16:57     Re: ... Morlock
  70. Apr 10, 18:11     Re: ... Bunko
  72. Apr 10, 18:59      Re: ... Morlock
  73. Apr 10, 19:07       Re: ... Dantastic
  74. Apr 10, 19:28        Re: ... Morlock
  75. Apr 10, 19:36         Re: ... Dantastic
  77. Apr 10, 19:41          Re: ... Morlock
  78. Apr 10, 20:24           Re: ... Dantastic
  79. Apr 10, 21:13           Re: ... JoeCool
  76. Apr 10, 19:40       Re: ... Morlock
  80. Apr 10, 21:14       Re: ... JediLuke
  81. Apr 10, 23:25        Re: ... Morlock
  82. Apr 10, 23:46         Re: ... JediLuke
  83. Apr 11, 00:16          Re: ... Morlock
  84. Apr 11, 00:27           Re: ... JediLuke
  85. Apr 11, 00:42            Re: ... Morlock
  86. Apr 11, 00:48             Re: ... JediLuke
  87. Apr 11, 00:58              Re: ... Morlock
  88. Apr 11, 01:07               Re: ... JediLuke
  90. Apr 11, 01:26                Re: ... Morlock
  92. Apr 11, 01:32                 Re: ... JediLuke
  97. Apr 11, 02:00                  Re: ... Morlock
  98. Apr 11, 02:11                   Re: ... JediLuke
  101. Apr 11, 02:21                   Re: ... Ray Marden
  103. Apr 11, 02:23                    Re: ... JediLuke
  89. Apr 11, 01:21               Re: ... complicity
  91. Apr 11, 01:31                Re: ... Morlock
  93. Apr 11, 01:42                 Re: ... complicity
  95. Apr 11, 01:44                  Re: ... JediLuke
  96. Apr 11, 01:56                   Re: ... complicity
  99. Apr 11, 02:13                  Re: ... Morlock
  100. Apr 11, 02:19                   Re: ... JediLuke
  104. Apr 11, 02:36                   Re: ... complicity
  112. Apr 11, 15:31                    Re: ... Morlock
  113. Apr 11, 16:13                     Re: ... JediLuke
  114. Apr 11, 22:41                      Re: ... JoeCool
  116. Apr 12, 01:03                       Re: ... Morlock
  117. Apr 12, 01:08                        Re: ... JediLuke
  119. Apr 12, 14:54                        Holy Crap Moog Operator
  120. Apr 12, 15:24                         Re: Holy Crap JediLuke
  121. Apr 12, 15:37                          Re: Holy Crap Moog Operator
  122. Apr 12, 15:52                           Re: Holy Crap JediLuke
  123. Apr 12, 15:59                          Re: Holy Crap JoeCool
  124. Apr 12, 16:03                           Re: Holy Crap Moog Operator
  125. Apr 12, 16:16                           Re: Holy Crap JediLuke
  126. Apr 12, 16:21                            Re: Holy Crap JoeCool
  127. Apr 12, 19:50                             No subject Morlock
>> 128. Apr 12, 20:48                              Re: No subject JediLuke
  129. Apr 12, 23:12                               Re: No subject JediLuke
  131. Apr 13, 10:11                                Re: No subject Moog Operator
  115. Apr 11, 22:42                     Re: ... JoeCool
  110. Apr 11, 02:59                 Re: ... Zathrus
  65. Apr 10, 16:16  Re: ... HIGH_PING
  68. Apr 10, 17:18   Re: ... nin
  69. Apr 10, 17:37    Re: ... Morlock
  94. Apr 11, 01:44  Re: ... Ray Marden
  102. Apr 11, 02:23   Re: ... Morlock
  105. Apr 11, 02:38    Re: ... Morlock
  106. Apr 11, 02:43     Re: ... JediLuke
  107. Apr 11, 02:52      Re: ... Morlock
  111. Apr 11, 02:59       Re: ... complicity
  108. Apr 11, 02:53     Re: ... complicity
  109. Apr 11, 02:57      Re: ... JediLuke
  118. Apr 12, 12:36     I love trolls, especially bigots Moog Operator
  71. Apr 10, 18:52 The status of this thread... Dantastic
  130. Apr 13, 09:33 $0.02 Tango
  132. Apr 13, 10:44  Re: $0.02 bangersnmash
  133. Apr 13, 11:13   Re: $0.02 JediLuke
  137. Apr 13, 12:20    Re: $0.02 bangersnmash
  138. Apr 13, 12:48     Re: $0.02 Tango
  139. Apr 13, 12:57     Re: $0.02 JediLuke
  140. Apr 13, 13:35     Re: $0.02 Moog Operator
  141. Apr 13, 15:06      Re: $0.02 JediLuke
  164. Apr 14, 16:59      Re: $0.02 bangersnmash
  166. Apr 14, 17:26       Re: $0.02 Tango
  167. Apr 14, 17:33       Re: $0.02 Moog Operator
  168. Apr 14, 18:36        Re: $0.02 Morlock
  169. Apr 15, 07:47         Re: $0.02 Tango
  173. Apr 15, 13:41          Re: $0.02 Morlock
  174. Apr 15, 13:54           Re: $0.02 nin
  175. Apr 15, 14:05            Re: $0.02 Morlock
  176. Apr 15, 14:57             Re: $0.02 Tango
  170. Apr 15, 12:26        Re: $0.02 bangersnmash
  171. Apr 15, 13:03         Re: $0.02 Tango
  172. Apr 15, 13:05         Re: $0.02 JediLuke
  177. Apr 15, 15:32         Re: $0.02 Moog Operator
  178. Apr 15, 18:20          Re: $0.02 Morlock
  179. Apr 15, 20:10           Re: $0.02 Tango
  180. Apr 15, 20:46            Re: $0.02 Morlock
  181. Apr 15, 22:35             Re: $0.02 JediLuke
  183. Apr 16, 08:29              Re: $0.02 bangersnmash
  185. Apr 16, 13:32               Re: $0.02 JediLuke
  188. Apr 17, 12:30                Re: $0.02 bangersnmash
  189. Apr 17, 14:19                 Re: $0.02 Morlock
  190. Apr 17, 14:33                  Re: $0.02 Morlock
  191. Apr 17, 20:49                 Re: $0.02 Tango
  182. Apr 16, 07:16             Re: $0.02 Tango
  186. Apr 16, 15:50              Re: $0.02 Morlock
  187. Apr 16, 20:02               Re: $0.02 JediLuke
  184. Apr 16, 10:51           Re: $0.02 Moog Operator
  134. Apr 13, 11:20   Re: $0.02 Moog Operator
  135. Apr 13, 11:26    Re: $0.02 nin
  136. Apr 13, 11:29     Re: $0.02 JediLuke
  142. Apr 13, 15:17      Re: $0.02 Bronco
  143. Apr 13, 16:21       No subject Morlock
  144. Apr 13, 16:38        Re: No subject JediLuke
  145. Apr 13, 17:06        Re: No subject Tango
  146. Apr 13, 17:39        Re: No subject Moog Operator
  147. Apr 13, 19:33 Re: redefining marriage AirWreck
  148. Apr 13, 19:38  Re: redefining marriage JediLuke
  149. Apr 13, 23:05  Re: redefining marriage Morlock
  150. Apr 13, 23:38   Re: redefining marriage JediLuke
  151. Apr 14, 08:01   Re: redefining marriage Tango
  152. Apr 14, 10:51    Re: redefining marriage Moog Operator
  153. Apr 14, 10:56     Re: redefining marriage Moog Operator
  154. Apr 14, 14:10    Re: redefining marriage Morlock
  155. Apr 14, 14:46     Re: redefining marriage JediLuke
  156. Apr 14, 15:01     Re: redefining marriage Moog Operator
  157. Apr 14, 15:15      Re: redefining marriage JediLuke
  158. Apr 14, 15:28      Re: redefining marriage Morlock
  159. Apr 14, 15:41       Re: redefining marriage Moog Operator
  160. Apr 14, 15:42       Re: redefining marriage Tango
  161. Apr 14, 16:19        Re: redefining marriage Morlock
  162. Apr 14, 16:35         Re: redefining marriage JediLuke
  163. Apr 14, 16:45         Re: redefining marriage Tango
  165. Apr 14, 17:19         Re: redefining marriage Moog Operator


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