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Frontline Reports from the Invisible War

Following the release of the demo for Deus Ex: Invisible War (story), a Delay Deus Ex: Invisible War Petition is online (thanks Scott) hoping to forestall the shooter/RPG sequel's release until some issues are ironed out, an effort that is probably futile in light of the game's gold announcement (story). In response to the types of complaints found in the petition, a post to the ION Storm Forums by Chris Carollo addresses some of the points made by detractors, and offers an unofficial Dxinvisible War Demo FAQ explaining why things are handled as they are, and outlining a few settings that can be tweaked.

74 Replies. 4 pages. Viewing page 1.
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74. . Nov 27, 2003, 19:42 Bob
#$%$&*# MS. The thing that gets to me is, any normal business venture would have to be successful on it's own in order to continue. But with M$ propping up Xbox with their bottomless pit of capital, they can continue to gut PC game after PC game for decades regardless if they ever make money at it.

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73. No subject Nov 27, 2003, 18:08 Acleacius
Well its no wonder M(FucksShitUp)S has been throwing millions of dollors at the best PC Game Developers, for the last 3 years. Oh course this is a tried and tested method for buying off an industry or the White House.

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72. Re: No subject Nov 27, 2003, 12:36 XEON
I know its an Xbox trailer, its an Xbox game after all

The PC market isn't dead (yet) The PC gaming market is currently sitting at around 27% of all game sales with consoles talking up the lionshare of 65% (ish) and the other gaming platforms sitting at around 8%. The PC market is at a low ebb, the same way it always seems to go during the mid console cycle. At platform change the PC market actually increases to over 30%.

Source: ILS Report from the best place for real market data in the entertainment industry

"Leading the fight for original WASD†gaming"
B: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?

P: I think so, Brain, but where are we going to find a duck and a hose at this hour?
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71. No subject Nov 27, 2003, 11:44 Acleacius
Umm thats no PC game trailer, Sir, I knew him an you no PC game trailer. Thats a XBox advertisment all the, fantasicO reviews are XBox mags and sites. Oh no they would never compromise the PC version.
One of the more recent threads at IS, is about how the reason consoles are so popular is because the PC is dead, cause of PIRACY and that is why consoles are so popular, Rolflmaopmgo.

BTW Almost 4000 sig's in 5 to 6 days PLEASE sign it. Your voice does matter. This IS NOT the presidental election 2000, IT MATTERS.
This comment was edited on Nov 27, 11:47.
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70. No subject Nov 27, 2003, 11:11 XEON
I'm sure it'll appear on Blues on the update, but...

There's a gameplay/cgi movie of DX2 over on Shacknews

All the footage has come from the PC I mean Xbox version.

Certainly watching it shows more realistic damage ratios than the PC demo

"Leading the fight for original WASD†gaming"
B: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?

P: I think so, Brain, but where are we going to find a duck and a hose at this hour?
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69. Re: Pre-Order S.T.A.L.K.E.R Oblivion Lost Nov 27, 2003, 10:15 hurdy gurdy
S.T.A.L.K.E.R. - Oblivion Lost

That is the worst name for a game ever. *sigh* It should be boycotted on that principle alone. However, the game does look pretty cool... I'll give it that.

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68. Re: Pre-Order S.T.A.L.K.E.R Oblivion Lost Nov 27, 2003, 03:09 G_ManX
SSsshhhhh!!! Dont say S.T.A.L.K.E.R too loud..Bill'l hear you. And we don't want his claws in that one, eh?  
Old enough to know better, young enough not to care.
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67. Re: Pre-Order S.T.A.L.K.E.R Oblivion Lost Nov 27, 2003, 02:40 Bob
Hunterzyph, can you not see that you sound exactly like Dues Ex:IW fanboys before the demo came out?

I hope Stalker is good too but when do people ever learn?

This comment was edited on Nov 27, 02:40.
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66. Pre-Order S.T.A.L.K.E.R Oblivion Lost Nov 27, 2003, 02:16 Hunterzyph
Want AI? Want dynamic gameplay? Want to achieve objectives in different ways? Want co-op gameplay? Step right up for Stalker: Oblivion Lost, due 1H 2004. Prepare to have a new notch carved in the Classic Game totem pole. (once you register you can see a whole boatload of screenshots) (official website) (developer's site, best forum)

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65. No subject Nov 27, 2003, 01:10 Brakton
I've at the demo since it has come out. I decided to give it another chance. Well, I've played the demo, played it some more, once again, and then again. I implemented the changes Warren Spector suggested to make the game better, which was a slight improvement (removing the bloom effect made the graphics sharper, and moving the HUD closer to the edges of the screen helped things). But I just can't get over the fact that all the weapons share the same ammunition. I mean, are we meant to believe that a pistol requires the same type of ammo as a flame thrower?!!?!?! So much for realism. Another minor detail I'd like to mention is the lack of bullet holes left on the wall. While this isn't a real big factor in game play, it just adds that finishing touch--more realism if you will. Lack of being able to reload my weapon is somewhat frustrating in a game of this type (UT2K3 etc., isn't a big deal, because those games are fast based, and completely action based). And what about all of those videos from the E3 conference seen on the web from around 2001/2002? Those videos show an excellent game in progress, with a great HUD....the demo we were given is not the same game. I miss the ability to type in a login and password at different terminals found throughout DX1. The new interface that allows you to hack is dumbed down and utterly stupid. The RPG part of this game has sunk to the bottom of the deep blue sea like a 300lb. boulder. I think DX2 needs to go back to the drawing board for us PC enthusiasts so it can become the game it should have become (ahhh....Half-Life 2 is right around the corner, and I can't wait--so save your money folks, and go buy a game worth your $49.99, or better yet, spend your money on DX1 at the bargain bin for $14.99). I know none of our comments will make any difference, and Warren Spector isn't going to change a thing, which is a major dissapointment. That being said, the game should stick to the platform it seems to have been intended for, the console (rest assured, I won't buy it for XBox either). Why oh why, Mr. Spector did you snub the PC gaming community? Why?!?! All of your faithful fans of the original just received a kick in the head. It's a sad sad day for the PC gamers in the world.

BTW: In case you haven't guessed, I have cancelled my pre-order, at which my pocket book thanked me.

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64. Re: Need a bigger shovel there, Warren? Nov 26, 2003, 22:36 Wowbagger_TIP
(In fact, we've been "dinged" by console gamers for making too-PC-centric a game as often as we've been dinged by PC gamers for making a game that's too consoley!)
Yeah, right.

Yeah, that's exactly what I thought. First of all, how many console gamers are following the game development. Second, has anyone seen anything about the game that seems PC-like to begin with? The whole damn thing looks like a console game, top to bottom. I'm surprised that the demo didn't ask me to hit the Start button or something.

"God isn't interested in technology. He cares nothing for the microchip or the silicon revolution. Look how he spends his time, forty-three species of parrots! Nipples for men!"
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"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." -- Bertrand Russell (I think...)
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63. Re: Need a bigger shovel there, Warren? Nov 26, 2003, 22:07 ReDeeMeR
Yep, notice how that tool posted: "We've recieved loads of positive feedback" but forgot to mention all the negative feedback also the reason behind his bullshit post.

Reading it, I thought he just said "It's the way we meant it to be, stfu" gently.

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62. Re: Need a bigger shovel there, Warren? Nov 26, 2003, 21:30 Mad Max RW
Game developers all speak the same bullshitter language. They closely resemble politicians.

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61. Need a bigger shovel there, Warren? Nov 26, 2003, 21:25 ]-UnderTOW-[
With all the horse shit Warren Spector's shovelling from that FAQ, he's going to need a much larger shovel.

(In fact, we've been "dinged" by console gamers for making too-PC-centric a game as often as we've been dinged by PC gamers for making a game that's too consoley!)

Yeah, right.

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60. Re: ... Nov 26, 2003, 21:08 Avatus
Uh, Deus Ex 1 had gameplay, immersion and features that made up for that, which DX 2 doesn't. And besides, Deus Ex ran fine on 3DFX cards, if it ran slow on non glide cards that's their fault for buying a game that was clearly and openly made primarily for voodoo cards. However, DX2 is touted as a D3D game, D3D is supported by pretty much every card there is.


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59. I voted Nov 26, 2003, 21:03 Gunz
I cancelled my pre-order and plan to rent the Xbox version when the Blockbuster down the street gets it. The demo convinced me I need some time with the 'real' code before I spend more than $7 on the game.

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58. Re: No subject Nov 26, 2003, 20:54 Vermilion
"Please Sign the Petition, the real intent isnt to stop it, it is to show unity to the shallow changes made to the game. The reason WS even responed is because the petition is getting over 500 post a day, well above 3000 now. So if your a fan of Deus Ex, Thief or anything WS please take the time to let WS know you care about the High quality Intellegent games he is associated with, that you expect and plan to hold him to his standard of execellence. If not expect to see Thief and the other games to effected as well, if you dont respond. "

Ion Storm will understand how I feel when I spend $50 next week on KotOR instead of DXIW. If you want to get fans together to make a statement, get them to agree NOT to buy the game until I.S. makes the changes you feel are necessary. They're going to listen a lot closer to bad sales reports than they are to complaining on the internet. If people refuse to buy the game, I.S. has no choice but to listen.

Unfortunately, gamers will still buy the game even after playing the demo, still bitch about the flaws after they've purchased it and still not understand why I.S. isn't immediately responding to their complaints. I've come to believe that people are largely incapable of voting with their wallets, the loudest voice they have. Remember that, Acleacius - if you buy DXIW before they've fixed it, you're a part of the problem rather than the solution.

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57. Re: gfx Nov 26, 2003, 20:49 Gunz
I would have posted this on the actual Ion Storm Deus Ex: Invisible War FAQ thread but all I get is errors. So here goes nothin'...

1. Game settings issues:

My user settings are reset to the defaults after I move between maps.

*** This doesn't work for me and many others. And yes, I've tried *both* (that I know of) user.ini files.

My forward movement and mouse rotation is causing the game to seem laggy.

*** I didn't have that problem.

The HUD seems to be taking up too much of my screen, itís too close to the center.

*** The HUD seems OK to me (though the icons seem kinda crappy).

The game seems to lack visual sharpness.

*** If I lose the "Bloom", my FPS takes a nose dive. And, um, I like the fuzzy effect.

I have generally poor performance. The game runs too slowly.

*** I'm choppy at 800X600: P4 2.4, 512, GeForceTi4400, Audigy Gamer. All latest drivers.

2. Design issues:

With the new unified ammo type, does that mean my pistol uses the same amount of ammo as my rocket launcher?

*** No. But it does mean that the flamethrower and the pistol use the same ammo. Huh? Nano-tech at work, maybe? Oh, and the SMG can produce flash/bangs from the ammo source. I'm cool with this if I can manufacture keys and grenades with some "Magic box" found in later levels.

The riot prod seems to use too much ammo for the effect it has and takes a long time to knock someone out.

*** In the demo, the gate guard doesn't even blink when I show him the prod and it takes in the area of 10 hits in the back for me to drop him. What's up with that?

Why donít headshots with a pistol take out enemies in one shot? That isnít very realistic.

"The problem we were trying to avoid was the case where the player could simply run directly towards an enemy at top speed and shoot them once in the head with a pistol, thus conserving other types of ammo."

That's why other games reduce your accuracy when you "... simply run directly towards an enemy at top speed" and other games might trigger a "fight or flight" reaction in the AI in such a situation - i.e the AI either runs away from the wildly shooting crazy person or stands its ground and puts a well aimed shot into the charging nut-ball's head.

That last answer seems like sooo much BS to me.... but it's quite revealing of a very troubling mindset: if they can't make rules that make sense (in the game), they'll try to make sense of the rules they made : )

It takes 5 headshots to stop players from cheating the ammo system?? If that's not a cheap patch, I don't know what is. Boy. *Bad* answer.

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56. Re: two replies Nov 26, 2003, 20:47 Ray Marden
Although I think the game runs quite poorly overall, you really should not knock over AA. AA and pixel shaders eat up bandwidth like you would not believe.

Absolutely not going to be playing Half-Life 2 or Doom 3 with AA enabled,

I really, truly hate my computer!
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55. gfx Nov 26, 2003, 20:21 Steele Johnson
the intent was to create a good game for the casual console gamer. Who cares about the graphics if the majority of gamers will be viewing it on a standard tv? Mwahahhaha!

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74 Replies. 4 pages. Viewing page 1.
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