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More on the WTC Disaster (Updated)

Of course this is not game related (we do not expect to be doing any further game coverage today), but with the legit news sites being almost impossible to access at times today, we've been getting loads of requests for more information about what's been going on. Here is the latest as of about 9:00 PM EDT:

  • President Bush addressed the nation 8:30 PM EDT. Here's a wire report: WASHINGTON (AP) - A grim-faced President Bush condemned ghastly attacks in Washington and New York on Tuesday and vowed to "find those responsible and bring them to justice." In the second Oval Office address of his presidency, Bush said the United States would retaliate against ``those behind these evil acts,'' and any country that harbors them.

To recap:

  • In two separate attacks, hijacked planes struck both main towers of the World Trade Center in Manhattan this morning, and both of the "twin towers" subsequently collapsed.
  • A hijacked plane struck the Pentagon in Washington, D.C. and part of it has collapsed as well.
  • A hijacked plane crashed in western Pennsylvania, near Pittsburgh. Reports indicate the hijackers planned to crash this plane into Camp David in Maryland.
  • 47 Story WTC building seven, one of the five (relatively) smaller buildings in the World Trade Center also later collapsed from ancillary damage.
  • The White House, the Pentagon, and the Capitol Building were all evacuated, all domestic flights in the US have been grounded through at least noon tomorrow.
  • Other closings include most federal offices, the stock markets, the Disney theme parks, and the cancellation of today's Major League Baseball schedule. The President's speech announced that all federal agencies will be open for business tomorrow.
  • Broadcasts out of Afghanistan showed evidence of missile attacks and antiaircraft fire, but what connection this has to today's apparent terrorist attacks in the US is not clear at this point. The US has denied involvement in these attacks.
  • In the first hints of any sort at the scope of casualties, the New York City Fire Department has estimated that as many as half of the 400 firefighters dispatched to the scene are missing. CNN has said that 78 Police officers are missing. Also, the death toll from those on the four hijacked planes has been placed at 266. The number of dead and injured at the Pentagon has been widely reported as about 100. No estimates of the number of victims from the World Trade Center have been made.
  • People throughout the United States have are being urged to donate blood to help offset significant shortages in New York and Washington. The American Red Cross in Greater New York or the American Red Cross are places to contact about donating blood or money, or both.
  • Some news sites seem to be back online. Here are some links that have been more reliable: CNN.com; CNET.com; Yahoo; The New York Times; washingtonpost.com; usnews.com; ABCNEWS.com; FOXNews.com; MSNBC; and BBC News Online.

All of our thoughts go out to the victims of these attacks and their families and friends in what must be an incredibly difficult time.

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654 Replies. 33 pages. Viewing page 10.
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474. Re: things Sep 13, 2001, 06:42 anon@216.101
 
Uhh.. Why? Ok, you've heard of the internet... Television etc right? If the guy really had a dick and a message, he'd broadcast it to the world in some way or another. HE reportedly DID warn of an attack about three weeks ago. HE also said that he agreed with the attack. HE obviously has money and resources to get this MESSAGE out FIRST before resorting to a battle. If these terrorists were really concerned about the US attacking their arab brothers (they don't appear to care) They wouldn't agree with the terrorist attack - because the US reaction will not be a pretty one. Stupid morons.

You're telling me that terrorists with these types of resources can't get their message out? If it's an act of desperation, why operate without a message?! The ONLY message that was presented on the 11th was one of HATE. Where the HELL do you come off saying that this is an act of desperation under these circumstances?

I'm out.


--- QUOTE BELOW ---
3) This is a faq about bin Laden: http://www.msnbc.com/news/627355.asp
Notice that it tells anything you might want to know about him...except WHY. Why do they hate the US and its western allies? Do YOU know? How much are the many CIA-assisted coups (influenced by commercial interests) in places like Chile, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Iran, etc. ever discussed? Or the use of these places as pawns in the game of "containing the communist menace"? It's easier just to dehumanize Arabs and say they're crazy.

Terrorism isn't madness, it's DESPERATION.

I think the only path out of this situation is open dialogue of ALL OF THE ISSUES. The United States and Britain need to acknowledge their middle east role over the past decades and address the griefs of these people. Not spout empty, predictable platitudes about "terror will not stand." Terror will stand as long as people are oppressed.
 
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473. A Thought Sep 13, 2001, 06:36 anon@24.177
 
I usually don't appriciate people posting ideas to be spread "to everybody" usually because the idea is insincere or coercive, or some damn form of advertizing.. But somehow I feel like spreading this one around. At least I'm sincere about it..


I was watching a news report that covered the expected economic impact of this terrible event. One thing they mentioned was that the impact of just one day of people not shopping, going to restaraunts, stores, etc., would be on the order of $15 billion.

I realized that part of the reason of striking at the WTC, besides the great number of people there, is that it's a blow to the financial and business heart of America and the West. They struck to injure not only so very many people, but the economics of our society.

I suddenly thought, "If everybody goes out and buys the groceries, toys, tools, sees a movie, goes out to eat, etc., that they would have not done in the days of mourning after this terrible tragedy, it would more than make up for the loss THAT THEY WANTED!

And it goes right along with denying them the rest of the victory they want -- all of us staying at home, shocked and afraid.

Well, we're not going to do that.

Don't allow yourself to feel powerless. Don't allow them to panic us into recession. Go out with some friends. Buy someone a gift. Take some friends out to dinner. Donate blood. Give some money to a charity. Get some extra stuff at the store to make a special dinner. Buy your kids those toys they've been wanting. Do something for somebody else.

Let's show the world that America, despite adversity and serious tests, goes on and lives life!

I'd like to see everyone spread this message and take it to heart. They're not going to get satisfaction from us.
 
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472. Re: Ireland Sep 13, 2001, 06:19 anon@194.128
 
This has probably been said here already but one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter... it's human nature.

I'm sure who did this will be made to pay, but then won't they just retaliate further, then won't we strike back, then won't they retaliate further.. see a pattern... whilst we shouldn't just sit by and let these killing scum get away with this massive slaughter how can we possibly expect to hit back and not expect a war ?
 
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471. Re: Ireland Sep 13, 2001, 05:44 anon@213.66
 
"That is true in theory, but we bombed Iraq because Bush 1 wouldn't stand for tyranny, yet we ignored South Africa for years as they lived under tyrannical rule."

Don't forget the primary reason for invading Iraq: Oil.
 
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470. Re: I've written many posts today, but... Sep 13, 2001, 05:27 anon@194.128
 
Whilst I totally agree that the Arab backlash is uncalled for and downright sick, what about the Arab's dancing in the streets laughing at our dead ?

We are no better than them. Fucking sad.
 
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469. A rational call for carpet bombing. Sep 13, 2001, 05:07 anon@209.245
 
War is an ugly thing. People die in war, and they aren't always soldiers. Osama bin-Laden declared a holy war on the United States of America. We all know what President Bush said regarding the "No distinction between terrorists and those who harbor them". Stop and think about that. If my brother kills a man, and I KNOW it, before it happened or not, and I don't "turn him in" for lack of a better phrase, then I am just as guilty as he. Because I have condoned his actions by my inaction.

***IF*** Osama bin-Laden is responsible for this atrocity, it is just his first step in bringing his holy war to America. It has been said here and there that this attack was not "terrorism" but retaliation to acts America has commited in the Middle-East. So be it. I am no expert on foreign affairs, and I honestly don't know what grievances some Middle-East countries may have against us. That is my fault, for not paying closer attention to what my country does. But, I DO know that if the foreign response (by a country or an individual) is the act of war that we saw two days ago, then war it shall be.

War has been declared on our country by the actions we've seen over the course of the past several years. Our next step is to identify precisely who our enemies are, find them, and kill them. I don't say that lightly. War means death. It has become blatantly obvious to even the most obtuse Americans that our faceless enemies are willing to die for their cause. So are we. They are willing to kill for their cause. So are we. Which cause is right? I can't rightly say. We are all "the bad guys" to somebody else. But I can't put enough emphasis on this: Wars are won by killing the enemy. Killing them until they are all dead, or killing them until those that are left surrender unequivocally and unconditionally. Killing them until they can't kill us. Call it heartless or call it cold-blooded, but don't you dare call it blood-thirsty or reactionary.

Is American foreign policy to blame for this? It may very well be. I don't know, and I don't care. I said I don't know which cause is "right", but I know that MY country has been attacked time and time again. We are in a war whether we like it or not, declared not by us, but by our enemies. Whoever they are and when we find them, let's take the war to THEM. Reap the whirlwind.
 
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468. Manhatten / NYC Schools. Sep 13, 2001, 04:12 anon@195.44
 
As part of the national mourning day, tomorrow (Friday 14 Sept.) my school, based in York, England are organising a book of goodwill / condolences, which we would like to send to a manhatten school, at the same time we are taking donations which should hopefully cover postage, and presumably, and of the left over cash will be donated to a suitable charity.

The problem I have come across is locating schools in Manhatten / NYC... I was wondering if any local readers could supply me with an email address or contact number for a school.

I would really appreciate any response.

-Tom Longfield
tomsimonlongfield@yahoo.com
 
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467. Re: Mr. Moore Sep 13, 2001, 04:10 anon@203.79
 
Mr. Jojo, you were doing brilliantly until that last paragraph  
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466. Mr. Moore Sep 13, 2001, 02:59 anon@216.175
 
Michael Moore must take delight in pointing out every bad thing this country has ever done, actual or imagined, and yet at the same time failing to mention anything good we've ever done. I simly can't believe this guy is naive enough to place the blame squarely on President Bush when the guy hasn't even been in office for a full year. President Bush is about as responsible for this as Clinton was responsible for the ecconomy. It just happened under their respective terms. Do I like Bush? No. But I liked Gore even less, and I can only imagine that Mr. Moore would be praising Gore for his handling of this situation if he was the one in office regardless of if he actually doing a better job or not.

I usually tend to ignore people like him, but when he makes unintelligible comments such as that it only makes my blood boil. People like him only find fault with our country, yet won't leave. Why? Because, regardless of what you hear from nutjob, half-assed, liberal, declasse-intellectuals, it's still the best damn country on this earth.

Although I gather that Mr. Moore is well meaning in his statements and beliefs, in the light of current events people like him really need to shut up and let those who actually run this country and know a great deal more about this situation get done what needs to be done. If that means killing a bunch of poor nike-less terrorists who are so poor they have to sleep in tents.. out in the desert (awww, pitty them), then so be it.

Mr. Jojo
 
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465. No subject Sep 13, 2001, 02:04 teh mane man
 
Mankind was born of unknown cause. Their presence is well known by all who is hunted.

Humanity will grow when it stops crying God, and to end exaggeration.

The war was fierce. It harbored hatred and unnoticed skill. No one paid attention to oneself.

The bloodshed is over.

The rolling hills are no longer green, the fields of flowers are no longer strife with life, and the sky is no longer graceful.

Life is no longer a solace for the soul.

The day the earth ceased to exist is the day peace became synonymous with existence.


 
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464. Re: I've written many posts today, but... Sep 13, 2001, 01:59 anon@162.33
 
I heard no reports of looting, but if it is true then it is sad indeed. Additionally, none of us should be directing their anger towards any one individual in the street, they are not the ones who are responsible, and we shouldn't lower ourselves to the level of the terrorists themselves.

However, I feel these incidents are overshadowed by the outpouring of compassion and empathy, the lines of people donating blood, helping others, and those few misguided souls who use these circumstances to their own ends are but small ripples in an ocean of humanity. I am not now, nor will I ever be, ashamed to say I am an American. I as proud to be one today as I have ever been.

About the many who are lost every day (#463, I believe), I DO think about them. Every day I appreciate greatly my ability to experience a new day, and EVERY DAY I think about all who have lost someone and are alone, those who did not get to experience another day, those whose time draws near. Not a day goes by that I don't revel in the blue sky and the green grass and wish everyone could experience it as I do. I support who need support as best I can, as well as those who provide that support, and I resent your apparent assumption that I, or anyone else, don't think about these people, don't feel for them, and don't pay them attention. You are no better than the rest of us, no holier or more sympathetic than the rest of us as you seem to imply (if I'm wrong, then I apologize to all). We are all human beings - none better than the other.
 
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463. My personal opinion Sep 13, 2001, 01:17 anon@24.114
 
I am not writing this post to anger anyone or to start a flame war, but I am simply stating my opinion. It is very tragic that all those people died, but thousands of people die everyday from many things including terrorism and nobody gives a shit!! Now that this kind of terrorism has struck in our own backyard people are scared that "OUR" way of life is in danger. To me things like thousands of babies starving everyday because they have no food, when we as Americans as consumers waste tons of food everyday is shocking. I am also surprised that other people are shocked that something like this happened. I knew that something like this would happen soon because of the US meddling in foreign affairs and creating many enemies all over the world. We have been threatened with these kind of acts for years now, and I guess that people just never thought it would happen, or they were just in denial. I also don't think that the government will do much about this matter. Bush stated that he would basically declare war on the terrorists and any country that is harbouring them. How would the US look like when they show thousands of innocent Arabs lying in the streets dead, so that the US could kill a group of terrorists. Mothers holding there dead babies, and other horrid images flashing accross the TVs of the world would make the US look just as bad as the terrorists. Terrorist groups are very mobile and can relocate in days, if not hours. I think it would be VERY hard for the US to locate and kill just the terrorists who are responsible. Of course I agree that the terrorists should all be eliminated, but the US has to make sure that no innocent people die, which I think would be virtually impossible. I also think that the US will be as vulnurable as ever to terrorist attacks. Hijacking a jumbo jet might be a little harder than before, but overall terrorism will continue. The US is the worlds largest "melting pot" for many races and religions. There are probobly alot more of Bin Ladens group currently living in the US at this time, and they are most likey ready to strike again. There are many more cells that are operating at this exact time and can strike right now if they were so inclined. An attack on Bin Laden would probobly just make Sept 11 look like a small prelude of whats to come. Terrorism is impossible to stop especially if people are willing to give there lives because they think they are helping a worthy cause. I myself am an unselfish person and I think of people who suffer all over the world everyday, not just when something happens in my backyard. I don't mean to sound rude or unconsiderate but I think that if people cared more about other suffering people all over the world as much as they do about themselves or even their country, then our world would be a much better place for everyone, including us. As a final note my thoughs are with the people who have been affected by this act, and also all the suffering people of the world.

These are just my opinions
Thank you
 
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462. Re: I've written many posts today, but... Sep 13, 2001, 01:07 indiv
 
For the first time ever, I saw no racism, no crime, no looting, no self-serving agendas. Instead I saw compassion, empathy, support, incredible humanity where the very loss of humanity caused such terrible destruction, "ordinary" people braving such adverse conditions to help others, but more than anything I have seen unparalelled solidarity.

You may not have seen it, but it's there. There were reports of looting in New York yesterday, away from the disaster area. That's very sick in itself, but further, I'm watching a report on ABC right now about a backlash against Arabs in our country. People have apparently been calling Arab businesses, shooting Mosques, and doing all sorts of really stupid things.

We don't know who is responsible yet, but ABC news played recordings of people saying stuff like, "Get out of our country" and "All you Arabs should die" indiscriminately. It's fucking sad and it makes me ashamed to be American when just yesterday I was as proud as I have ever been to say that I am an American.

This is so sad... I really wonder sometimes if humanity is ever going to grow beyond this.

 
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461. Re: I've written many posts today, but... Sep 13, 2001, 00:28 anon@162.33
 
I believe that this attack, while horrendous and unconscionable and burned into the collective memory of this country and the world, has also shown something quite remarkable...

For the first time ever, I saw no racism, no crime, no looting, no self-serving agendas. Instead I saw compassion, empathy, support, incredible humanity where the very loss of humanity caused such terrible destruction, "ordinary" people braving such adverse conditions to help others, but more than anything I have seen unparalelled solidarity.

I saw no Democrats, I saw no Republicans, no Blacks, no Whites, no men, no women, no Christians or Jews or Muslims or Hindus, I just saw Americans. It is unfortunate that such a horrendous act brings us together so strongly, but perhaps this event will unite us even more strongly, unite us in a way that will illustrate to whoever perpetrated this attack that even with means such as this, you simply cannot break our spirit - that in fact this type of event binds us even closer together.

Your classroom is a perfect example of this - everyone who can appreciate what happened, everyone who does not possess what, in my opinion, is the character flaw that allows them to be unmoved by the images of September 11th (a day after my birthday, by the way), realizes what terror this was, the suffering of the countless thousands directly involved and the millions in the United States and around the world who mourn with us, appreciate what this country represents and realize that something needs to be done to bring this kind of thing to an end.

I don't condone violence, but the epic scope of this attack demands, in my opinion, a response of the strongest caliber. It is not unlike a bully in a schoolyard - every day this bully pounds you, and you try to be as diplomatic as possible in response, not wanting to provoke the person. Yet one day you get fed up and pound him back (anyone see "A Christmas Story?). Suddenly, the bully realizes you mean business and thinks twice about doing it again - talks tough, of course, but never actually does anything because they realize you have been pushed one bit too far and they'll get it worse next time. Again, I don't condone violence, especially against innocents, yet I believe this requires a definite, and significant, response.
 
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460. Re: Ireland Sep 12, 2001, 23:30 Death-Dude
 
That is true in theory, but we bombed Iraq because Bush 1 wouldn't stand for tyranny, yet we ignored South Africa for years as they lived under tyrannical rule.

 
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459. Re: Ireland Sep 12, 2001, 22:40 DigitalSin
 
The IRA has observed a ceasefire since 1997. The Red Hand Defenders - a loyalist "paramilitary" (in this case, read terrorist) organization - claims to be observing a ceasefire, but anyone who has followed the Holy Cross School news before this tragedy in the US knows they are not.

In any case, neither of these organizations offer any threat to the US.

This comment was edited on Sep 12, 22:41.
 
====================
You wouldn't care what people thought of you if you realized how seldom they do
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458. ... Sep 12, 2001, 22:27 teh mane man
 
"I just noticed that Blue did indeed take "All the carnage that's fit to post!" off of the main page. Thank you once again, Blue."

Thanks to Blue, this is no longer a hardcore gaming news site, as it once was in the day...

 
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457. I've written many posts today, but... Sep 12, 2001, 22:11 anon@24.4
 
I would like to say a few more things. I wrote earlier, in post #281, that I was disgusted by the apathy in my school. I am still disgusted by the fact that so many were apathetic, but more and more I realize that there are almost more that do care than those that don't.

This was most evident during the beginning of classes. Every day, at the beginning of the day we "say" the pledge. I normally do not partake in doing this, simply because I disagree with "under god". Many others normally do not say the pledge daily, whether it is out of laziness or because we are talking about other things at the time. Today, however, everyone in the class said the pledge loudly and clearly, without hesitation. When it came on there was no pause, the teacher did not tell us to stand, we simply said the pledge. We showed that we were behind our country, and that we were loyal to it. We showed that we had realized we had been hit, but that we knew we would prevail and overcome what had happened. We were unified.

I don't know if similar situations happened in other classrooms of the school, I can only speak for mine. But in that classroom, and that time we were united as one in support of our country.

--ewigekraft23
 
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456. Re: Microsoft Flight Simulator 2000 Sep 12, 2001, 22:07 anon@24.163
 
Okay, I certainly hope you're kidding about that. This reminds me of the witch hunt after columbine at all the FPS and games in general.  
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455. Re: Microsoft Flight Simulator 2000 Sep 12, 2001, 22:03 Tony Z
 
#454

I understand that your post is a just (at least, I hope it is). In defence of flight sims though, the news coming in seems to state that these men were actually trained and perhaps even liscenced (sp?) pilots. No objects or games or anything other than these people are responsible for what happened yesterday, and lets not forget that please.

Blaming a flight sim for what happened yesterday (even as a joke) is no better than blaming quake for teaching children how to shoot guns.


--------------
Tony Zahn
Sofware Engineer, Achievement Technologies Inc.
Go Blue!
This comment was edited on Sep 12, 22:04.
 
--------------
Go Blue!
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