27 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
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| 27. |
Re: To # 3 ATTN: Loonyboi |
Jun 28, 2001, 21:35 |
anon@158.252 |
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 >>Well, that's really a unique situation. The unedited version of The Stand is much, much, MUCH longer than the original (I have both) and is in every way a far better book.
Loonyboi, you have it so wrong. The newer book would have been better if, and only if, Stevie had NOT done the following:
1) Change all of the dates
2) Change small things about the characters (like Harold's milkyway candy bars)
3) Change all of the dates.
But, it was nice to read more about the Trashcan man.
-The Time Master |
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| 26. |
Re: Quaikatana? |
Jun 28, 2001, 15:36 |
shul |
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there is something in QuakeX that you cant exchange for any good-storyline
... and the people rests, your honor....
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| 25. |
Re: Quaikatana? |
Jun 28, 2001, 13:45 |
anon@212.158 |
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Hei, Shul, you better goin to the cinema watching blockbusters, that playing 3D gamez
>As someone wrote somewhere (sorry someone, I don't really
>remember who you are) - "could carmack take a minute and
>rent a 'story writer'"
>This is most certainly what valve did....
HL has this blockbuster feeling that you can watch in the cinema. It good, but there is something in QuakeX that you cant exchange for any good-storyline HL-type game |
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| 24. |
Re: THEY DID RELEASE ONE LIKE LAMEDUKE |
Jun 26, 2001, 04:44 |
shul |
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i got it off of NEWARE CLUB BBS
... This is probably the most sophisticated way of spamming a channel I've ever seen...
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| 23. |
Re: Quakatana |
Jun 25, 2001, 14:38 |
BeastOfBurden |
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I know, let's all bash id because they mainly focus on
tech instead of content.
Do you seriously expect a company with
limited resources (less than 20 employees) to
both set the graphical bar *AND* have the most
complete, immersive, addictive gaming experience
in every game they produce with millions of perfectly
refined gameplay options? id's focus will
always be the engines, as long as John Carmack
is lead programmer. What's wrong with that?
Every gaming company has to choose what aspect
of the game is most important to focus on,
because you can't do everything well and still
ship in this lifetime.
Look at the original Unreal. It had better graphics
than Quake2 by far, but the gameplay suffered. It
was basically a tech demo. It may not have been the
best gaming experience, but it pushed the bar on
graphics vs. Q2 and others.
By contrast, Half-life had a truly enveloping storyline, but
graphics were basically sub-par with respect to Unreal.
Was pushing the graphics envelope the focus of Half-life?
Of course not, but it did push the envelope of
single player gaming and the development of the mod
community. Ask anyone at Valve, and they would
say that pushing gameplay always rises above
graphics in importance in their *particular*
approach towards making games. TF2 is supposed to be a revolution in *gameplay*, not necessarily graphics,
which is why it's taking so long.
When Quake3 came out it kicked UT's butt as far as
graphics, but was inferior as far as the *breadth* of
available gameplay options out of the box. Q3
just had heavily refined deathmatch and CTF, while
UT offered DM, CTF, Domination, Assault, and Last
Man Standing. UT did have graphical improvements
over Unreal, but in comparing UT to Q3, you simply
have two games that were produce with different focus.
Q3 for graphics & refined gameplay, UT for pushing
new gameplay options.
Daikatana at least tried to be different by adding
sidekicks and a certain amount of RPG elements to the
gameplay, but in no way did the final product excel
or push the gaming envelope, and thus it was deservedly
maligned, because it had promised way more than it
delivered.
As long as a game pushes the envelope and therein
achieves excellence in at least one aspect of game
design (graphics, gameplay, depth, immersion, etc.)
thus setting a new standard for others to follow,
why can't we simply applaud their success more than
we rip them apart for where they may fall short?
How completely lame to lambast a company simply
over what is really just a value judgement (graphics
innovation & deathmatch refinement over depth of
storyline or a revolution in gameplay).
It's no wonder some people think id doesn't listen
to them whine & compain. I don't blame them.
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| 22. |
Re: Quaikatana? |
Jun 25, 2001, 03:30 |
shul |
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Rolphus: Oh dear. I am sorry if I am being too critical.
I didn't mean too.
I am, too, tried coding a bit for Q3A. Its fun. The technology is great.
I am, too, passed through all of the levels, just in the sake of nice gameplay and beautiful arenas.
I also tried to figure out where the hell is the game. there was no game. sorry. it's simple as that. *no* game.
Ok, I thought. They are going for a tech demo. Cool. I spent 50$ for a tech demo. Then they got team arena out (huh?).
The worrying thing is that companies such as turbine are going in the same path. so instead of ACII we will get "Hey , look what a great engine we built.. ehhmm... we laid off the content guys few weeks ago... arrr"
See where this is going?
Btw, I do understand why any company would go in this direction, engines are more profitable than content.
Just PLEASE don't create so much hype around your tech demos!!!
... ooops, I guess I got off too critical again 
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| 21. |
Re: Quaikatana? |
Jun 24, 2001, 19:28 |
Rolphus |
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Shul: I had to think long at hard before making this post. My initial thought was that you were just being negative. Then I found myself agreeing with a lot of what you said. Now, I'm not sure what to think. I agree totally on the Half-Life thing. At the stage when id made Quake, they could have made a Half-Life like game, perhaps not as good as Half-Life, but something significantly more single-player driven.
However, in their current state, with a film-qualified animator, a guy solely dedicated to handling decent sound, tools for mappers to work better (although that's definetely good for licensees), and stuff like that, which id have never really done before, I believe (well, hope) that they're heading for something truly great in gaming. You may be right however, perhaps they're just aiming for a more complete licensing package.
As for the 5:1 compression - if you put my spin on it, they did it to improve the game for modem players, allow more players per session, and stuff like that. Perhaps it was the result of some netcode they were testing for Doom... who knows. With your version of the news, the code was written for the licensees. I'm not saying which is better, true, or anything... just two different ways of looking at it.
I hope I'm right, but the more I think about it, the more I suspect you may be.
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| 20. |
Re: Quaikatana? |
Jun 24, 2001, 10:48 |
shul |
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Well, I hope you will read this, Rolphus…
I think id ppl r not so interested in the gamer’s community but the gaming industry... take the quake engine for example (in which I see the turn for the worst) - Half life used it and it and half life is a great game. Why couldn't ID do it?
The answer is, unfortunately, it didn't interest them.
Adding x5 compression to the net code a year after the game release??? What the hell?
As someone wrote somewhere (sorry someone, I don't really remember who you are) - "could carmack take a minute and rent a 'story writer'"
This is most certainly what valve did....
Oh well, Id guys probably are not interested in my opinion... (On the other hand if levelord or someone will say something this might have an impact :-) )
Answer to rant over
shul the magnificent.
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| 18. |
Re: THEY DID RELEASE ONE LIKE LAMEDUKE |
Jun 23, 2001, 23:41 |
anon@12.73 |
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OH yeah..I got it off of something called a BBS...this was before we had internet connection in our house and it was like early 90s I think...but yeah...i got it off of NEWARE CLUB BBS...i doubt if they still have those things anymore..but its worth a try!
-courtney |
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| 17. |
THEY DID RELEASE ONE LIKE LAMEDUKE |
Jun 23, 2001, 20:01 |
anon@12.73 |
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| Hi Everybody! Quake sucked bad before it was like true 3d. I had an early version of it and ill have to check my old computer to see if I still have it...but the graphics were kinda similar to doom..and the music sounded like fantasy type stuff..and the water was very very deep and it was just crazy cause quake was like that and it sucked! |
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| 16. |
Re: To # 3 |
Jun 23, 2001, 04:09 |
Heatwave |
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heh...You know...when I wrote that, somehow I knew you were going to respond... and specifically to that point no less.
But I suppose I should have clarified I knew that it had outsold the original. As you said it's a completely safe assumption. I was simply referring to a fair comparison of time as well. I kindof rushed htat post out at the time and I didn't feel like fleshing everyhting out. Even now I'm not all together as it's 4AM and I'm still a little...umm...tipsy...in fact I'm only writing this to try to wait a few minutes to untipsy myself that much more before I sleep. And as I said my point's still made.
-Heatwave
(and oddly enough that was me that made the very unfunny (I'm still sorry) comment about the Dark Tower series way back around christmas or something that we went back and forth with for a bit.)
...what the...what the hell...It's a pop-up ad about tombraider the movie...the first game was awesome...the new ones all suck...oh screw it i cant handle this right now...night... or morning... whichever you prefer...
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-Heatwave
(Apologies for wasting anyones space or time with this message.) |
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| 15. |
Re: You know... |
Jun 22, 2001, 22:58 |
Kazmont|OSLT |
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I know what you mean. it really only seems like yesterday we were having lan parties in my apartment playing DM4 like no ones business. All weekend, every weekend. Those were the days. 
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| 14. |
Big Sword |
Jun 22, 2001, 19:00 |
Number{9} |
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It's amazing how much the original design of Quake is like Daikatana. Heck, replace the hammer with a sword and it would be Daikatana.
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-------------------
Ignore me!!! |
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| 13. |
Q3 |
Jun 22, 2001, 17:02 |
anon@208.9 |
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| In my opinion, Q3 achieved what it set out to. People are always saying it's more tech than game and I disagree. I like it better than any other FPS in terms of DM. Most people are just tired of dm in general, and are looking for something a little deeper in gameplay. The advertising of Q3 clearly stated it would be the best DM ever. It didnt boast revolutionary new gameplay. Q3 delivered, but the public was already looking for a little more. |
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| 12. |
You know... |
Jun 22, 2001, 16:36 |
EvilJohn |
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... it doesn't seem like it's been 5 years. When I think about video games Quake seems like a relatively new one to me.
Still, no game has had the effect of Quake. It did change things, for everyone. Quake is the reason we're sitting here now, and while I'll be sitting with 1300 of my closet friends in Mesquite in August.
I'll always be Grateful of what these guys did, and continue to do.
John "EvilJohn" Carney
Executive Director - QuakeCon 2001
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| 11. |
Re: Tech for the sake of tech |
Jun 22, 2001, 15:58 |
anon@24.114 |
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I think id software is following the same path as Lucasfilm/ILM (Industrial Light & Magic). When they first hit the market, their technical prowess and abilities far surpassed what was currently out there, and their directly controlled consumer offerings (the Star Wars films for example) were acclaimed and everyone wanted more, so they began licensing their tech and making their abilities available to third parties (ILM now offers stand-alone services to other studios), who specialized in the consumer offering but didn't have the technical abilities.
They (ILM and id) were eventually surpassed in terms of the quality of the content by the people who were using their tech (in id's case, Half Life or any of the Raven games for example)
This naturally leads to a symbiotic relationship where the tech is produced, a "demo reel" product is created (The Mummy and sequel for example, or Quake3) to entice and show off the tech for potential licensees (and also for consumers to get their hands on, after all, that's money too), and the real quality content products come later once a 3rd party that focuses strictly on content gets their product out.
Monolith did this with No One Lives Forever and before that with Shogo to a lesser extent.
It's also obviously a way to ensure that the tech you build stands up to a real game.
Either way I'm not knocking anyone here, but I think we're already seeing this approach more and more as the computer industry modularizes and specializes. |
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| 10. |
Re: To # 3 |
Jun 22, 2001, 13:38 |
loonyboi |
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The man whos released an unedited version of The Stand and actually outsold the origional?(at least im assuming by now...so feel free to correct, my pts stil made)
Well, that's really a unique situation. The unedited version of The Stand is much, much, MUCH longer than the original (I have both) and is in every way a far better book.
And since that's the only one that's been in print for the last 10+ years, it's a safe assumption that it's long outsold the original.
-jason |
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| 9. |
Re: To # 3 |
Jun 22, 2001, 12:46 |
Heatwave |
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<<Besides that, would you expect an author, say like Stephen King, to release every draft copy of every book he ever wrote ? >>
Are we both thinking about the same Stephen King?
The man whos released an unedited version of The Stand and actually outsold the origional?(at least im assuming by now...so feel free to correct, my pts stil made)
Who is actually known to write up most of a manuscript and only pick it up again 2-10 years later?
Look up the fantasy compilation Legends on Amazon.com and count how many reviews seem primarily concerned with the short story from The Dark Tower. (at least they were last year...)
yeah im pretty much just bitching bout nothin... but u need a better example...;)
and the new boards r sweet  but what are the little red dots next to some of the counters on headlines?
-Heatwave
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-Heatwave
(Apologies for wasting anyones space or time with this message.) |
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| 8. |
Tech for the sake of tech |
Jun 22, 2001, 12:39 |
ZigZang |
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I don't know. Q3A was an ok game, but a much better technology. How much money does id get by providing tech to other game companies? My guess is that in terms of profits it is much more profitable to provide the tech than to eeke it out with publishers, retailers etc. by providing "content" in the form of a game.
I would think that id would retain nearly all of the money from selling the tech whereas they would share the game profits with all those involved. So I suppose its a matter of perspective on what makes/will make Q3 and NewDoom a success. Perhaps NewDoom will be another tech demo like Q3A before it. To the critical eye of the gamer it looks as if id "has lost the touch" (or whatever), but to the business side of things, perhaps id just doesn't care. |
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27 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
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