Send News. Want a reply? Read this. More in the FAQ.   News Forum - All Forums - Mobile - PDA - RSS Headlines  RSS Headlines   Twitter  Twitter
Customize
User Settings
Styles:
LAN Parties
Upcoming one-time events:

Regularly scheduled events

More Games to Support AMD's Mantle

AMD writes of plans for more upcoming games that will support the advanced Mantle API support in the AMD Radeon R9 series of graphics cards (thanks HARDOCP). Most of the items are over a month old, but they have news from E3 of Mantle support plans for Battlefield Hardline, Dragon Age Inquisition, and Plants vs. Zombies Garden Warfare. Here's word:

  • On March 19 we announced a technology partnership that will add Mantle support to CRYENGINE® — the game engine behind blockbuster titles like Crysis and FarCry.
  • On March 20 Microsoft announced DirectX® 12, the next major evolution of its own game API. This is terrific news because it really draws attention to the value of low-level programming and Mantle’s leading contribution. With DirectX 12 games still over 18 months away and no alternatives in sight for Linux gamers, Mantle’s future looks bright.
  • On April 14 we announced that the upcoming release of Sid Meier’s Civilization®: Beyond Earth will support Mantle. In case you’re not familiar with the series, the current iteration is Civilization V, which, despite being nearly four years old, remains the sixth most played game according to Steam1. With Mantle in its arsenal, the next installment could be even bigger.
  • On April 16 we published a Mantle whitepaper, giving developers and enthusiast gamers a deep, technical insight into the technology. Have a look to find out how Mantle delivers such dramatic performance increases.
  • On May 1 we launched the Mantle SDK beta, which made Mantle available to a much greater number and variety of game developers. That should help accelerate the proliferation of Mantle-enabled game titles.
  • On June 9 EA announced that three of its upcoming games would support Mantle: Battlefield Hardline, Dragon Age Inquisition and Plants vs. Zombies Garden Warfare. Each of these brings new features, maps and gameplay to already-popular franchises. If the results we saw with Mantle in Battlefield 4 are anything to go by, these games should absolutely fly on AMD Radeon™ hardware.

View
31 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
< Newer [ 1 2 ] Older >

31. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 12, 2014, 17:47 TheEmissary
 
bhcompy wrote on Jun 12, 2014, 15:51:
UHD wrote on Jun 12, 2014, 11:06:
bhcompy wrote on Jun 12, 2014, 10:48:
TheEmissary wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 20:50:

Mantle is not supported on the consoles at all. The consoles have their own low level api that is proprietary to the console manufacturers.

Tom's Hardware article about Mantle

Did you read my linked article, which is newer, with quotes directly from AMD? AMD supports Mantle on console platforms.

It says they're ready to support Mantle on console platforms. Not the same thing.

It says "MS and Sony are welcome to utilize it whenever they want. We're standing by our phones." Which is to say AMD supports it.

AMD is of course going to claim to support it considering they designed and manufactured the hardware in these systems but it still wishful thinking. Microsoft and Sony have dismissed the idea of using Mantle on consoles and AMD themselves have admitted that Mantle is mostly for use on desktop PCs. So there is no point in expecting consoles to ever use it.

As far as ports go Xbox One ports are going to require much less work to get it working on PC considering they use a variant of DX11 and will have DX12 in a console update.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
30. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 12, 2014, 15:51 bhcompy
 
UHD wrote on Jun 12, 2014, 11:06:
bhcompy wrote on Jun 12, 2014, 10:48:
TheEmissary wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 20:50:

Mantle is not supported on the consoles at all. The consoles have their own low level api that is proprietary to the console manufacturers.

Tom's Hardware article about Mantle

Did you read my linked article, which is newer, with quotes directly from AMD? AMD supports Mantle on console platforms.

It says they're ready to support Mantle on console platforms. Not the same thing.

It says "MS and Sony are welcome to utilize it whenever they want. We're standing by our phones." Which is to say AMD supports it.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
29. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 12, 2014, 14:35 TheEmissary
 
Despoiler wrote on Jun 12, 2014, 12:17:
eRe4s3r wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 22:00:
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 18:29:
Trevellian wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 11:19:
Is this where Nvidia gets to cry foul about their competitor getting to have an edge in certain games now like AMD did?
They can try, the difference is the SDK is open to anyone who wants to implement it, that includes nvidia.

This is FUD in every way possible.... Seriously, where the hell do people get that this is an open API? When you can not download the SDK publicly and you can not read the API specs then it's not a open API.

AMD said they will make it open early 2014, but until now 12 June 2014, fuck all has happened. Access is stricly limited to AMD selected developers. The api itself is locked behind a NDA and is not part of any open standards body. (Like Khronos Group)

So no, nobody can support mantle except choice developers selected by AMD ONLY (Currently)

And dx12, which will do what Mantle does but platform agnostic, will come in late 2015...

I truly wish AMD would open the API and put it into OpenGL.. so it's not that I am hating on them here, I just think it should be clear that this isn't an open API.

OpenGL has the same core problem that DX currently has. That is the core was developed prior to multi-core CPUs and thus the scaling is terrible. You can't add more extensions to solve that problem. It needs to be rewritten from the ground up for modern computers like Mantle and DX12.

Actually, DX11 does support multithreaded rendering contexts the problem is that some GPU vendors like AMD and Intel don't support it in their drivers. For that reason you only see one or two games supporting that feature one of the major ones being Civilization V.

DirectX12 and new versions of OpenGL will be changing the core API beyond mere extensions. Google for "OpenGL approaching zero overhead" presentations on the subject.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
28. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 12, 2014, 12:17 Despoiler
 
eRe4s3r wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 22:00:
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 18:29:
Trevellian wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 11:19:
Is this where Nvidia gets to cry foul about their competitor getting to have an edge in certain games now like AMD did?
They can try, the difference is the SDK is open to anyone who wants to implement it, that includes nvidia.

This is FUD in every way possible.... Seriously, where the hell do people get that this is an open API? When you can not download the SDK publicly and you can not read the API specs then it's not a open API.

AMD said they will make it open early 2014, but until now 12 June 2014, fuck all has happened. Access is stricly limited to AMD selected developers. The api itself is locked behind a NDA and is not part of any open standards body. (Like Khronos Group)

So no, nobody can support mantle except choice developers selected by AMD ONLY (Currently)

And dx12, which will do what Mantle does but platform agnostic, will come in late 2015...

I truly wish AMD would open the API and put it into OpenGL.. so it's not that I am hating on them here, I just think it should be clear that this isn't an open API.

OpenGL has the same core problem that DX currently has. That is the core was developed prior to multi-core CPUs and thus the scaling is terrible. You can't add more extensions to solve that problem. It needs to be rewritten from the ground up for modern computers like Mantle and DX12.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
27. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 12, 2014, 12:13 Despoiler
 
NewMaxx wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 14:23:
jdreyer wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 12:44:
But didn't mantle become a bust? They were claiming improvements of 30%, but all I ever saw in real-world testing was 5-10%.

Mantle is probably worth if it you have a weaker system otherwise (CPU), especially with how far AMD CPUs are behind Intel's these days. Still, I think we'll see more universal results with DX12. I'm not bashing Mantle per se but...getting closer to the metal has been around since before Glide FX (a fact I've stated before in Mantle threads). I think a lot of people (and fanboys) over-hyped the concept since, as usual, they don't know what the hell they're talking about. I think it's a step in the right direction but it's evolutionary not revolutionary.

It benefits all systems, but different ways. If you have a CPU bottleneck because of weak CPU or you are running multiple GPUs it will greatly reduce the CPU bottleneck. If you have what I would call a balanced system that mostly is GPU bound then your frame times are roughly half of what DX11 delivers and you can see upto 100% higher minimum fps. This translates to a much much smoother gameplay experience. You do get slightly high max fps, but it's min fps that is the key benefit of Mantle.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
26. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 12, 2014, 11:06 UHD
 
bhcompy wrote on Jun 12, 2014, 10:48:
TheEmissary wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 20:50:

Mantle is not supported on the consoles at all. The consoles have their own low level api that is proprietary to the console manufacturers.

Tom's Hardware article about Mantle

Did you read my linked article, which is newer, with quotes directly from AMD? AMD supports Mantle on console platforms.

It says they're ready to support Mantle on console platforms. Not the same thing.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
25. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 12, 2014, 10:48 bhcompy
 
TheEmissary wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 20:50:

Mantle is not supported on the consoles at all. The consoles have their own low level api that is proprietary to the console manufacturers.

Tom's Hardware article about Mantle

Did you read my linked article, which is newer, with quotes directly from AMD? AMD supports Mantle on console platforms.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
24. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 22:00 eRe4s3r
 
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 18:29:
Trevellian wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 11:19:
Is this where Nvidia gets to cry foul about their competitor getting to have an edge in certain games now like AMD did?
They can try, the difference is the SDK is open to anyone who wants to implement it, that includes nvidia.

This is FUD in every way possible.... Seriously, where the hell do people get that this is an open API? When you can not download the SDK publicly and you can not read the API specs then it's not a open API.

AMD said they will make it open early 2014, but until now 12 June 2014, fuck all has happened. Access is stricly limited to AMD selected developers. The api itself is locked behind a NDA and is not part of any open standards body. (Like Khronos Group)

So no, nobody can support mantle except choice developers selected by AMD ONLY (Currently)

And dx12, which will do what Mantle does but platform agnostic, will come in late 2015...

I truly wish AMD would open the API and put it into OpenGL.. so it's not that I am hating on them here, I just think it should be clear that this isn't an open API.

This comment was edited on Jun 11, 2014, 22:06.
 
Avatar 54727
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
23. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 20:50 TheEmissary
 
bhcompy wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 19:58:
Quboid wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 17:18:
Tipsy McStagger wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 14:57:
So for someone who doesn't usually follow AMD stuff ever and without googling, what the hell is this mantle anyways? Someone give me a quick breakdown.

There's hopefully more qualified people than me to say (hat's off to jdreyer, BTW) but basically it's an alternative to Direct 3D which improves performance. Specifically, it reduces the amount of CPU power that's needed by the graphics card, so developers can dedicate more to AI/physics/even more complex graphics/whatever. The next version of Direct 3D, in DirectX 12, will apparently have similar performance boosts, supposedly of up to about 30% (but as with drivers, real world improvements are somewhat less).

Again, I'm no expert but AFAIK, Mantle isn't tied to AMD hardware in the same way as PhysX or TXAA are to Nvidia gear. If Nvidia wanted to, they could add support to Geforce cards but unless the market forces their hand, I expect they'd be loath to embrace an AMD technology - unless they fancy pulling a Microsoft by embracing, extending and exterminating it.

It's worth noting that AMD provides the video hardware for both Xbox and Playstation, now, and that Mantle is supported across all 3 hardware platforms. This is the real benefit, as it allows for easier cross-platform support. It may not do much for AMD in the PC space as far as competing with nVidia, but it does make it easier for developers to work on all three major platforms, which is beneficial for everyone(particularly us PC gamers that get stuck with awful ports, or no ports).

Mantle is not supported on the consoles at all. The consoles have their own low level api that is proprietary to the console manufacturers.

Tom's Hardware article about Mantle
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
22. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 19:58 bhcompy
 
Quboid wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 17:18:
Tipsy McStagger wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 14:57:
So for someone who doesn't usually follow AMD stuff ever and without googling, what the hell is this mantle anyways? Someone give me a quick breakdown.

There's hopefully more qualified people than me to say (hat's off to jdreyer, BTW) but basically it's an alternative to Direct 3D which improves performance. Specifically, it reduces the amount of CPU power that's needed by the graphics card, so developers can dedicate more to AI/physics/even more complex graphics/whatever. The next version of Direct 3D, in DirectX 12, will apparently have similar performance boosts, supposedly of up to about 30% (but as with drivers, real world improvements are somewhat less).

Again, I'm no expert but AFAIK, Mantle isn't tied to AMD hardware in the same way as PhysX or TXAA are to Nvidia gear. If Nvidia wanted to, they could add support to Geforce cards but unless the market forces their hand, I expect they'd be loath to embrace an AMD technology - unless they fancy pulling a Microsoft by embracing, extending and exterminating it.

It's worth noting that AMD provides the video hardware for both Xbox and Playstation, now, and that Mantle is supported across all 3 hardware platforms. This is the real benefit, as it allows for easier cross-platform support. It may not do much for AMD in the PC space as far as competing with nVidia, but it does make it easier for developers to work on all three major platforms, which is beneficial for everyone(particularly us PC gamers that get stuck with awful ports, or no ports).
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
21. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 19:46 Creston
 
jdreyer wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 15:28:
Tipsy McStagger wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 14:57:
So for someone who doesn't usually follow AMD stuff ever and without googling, what the hell is this mantle anyways? Someone give me a quick breakdown.

It's AMD's new proprietary graphics acceleration technology. In key locations around the globe, they're able to pump liquid nitrogen past the earth's crust deep into the mantle where they harvest neutrinos given off by the massive temperature differential. They then use these neutrinos to power vast racks of servers in the cloud that AMD procs tap into to accelerate games and other graphics. Although they were claiming increases of 30-40% (which happened in special cases), in most cases improvement was only around 10%, so like NewMaxx said, more evolutionary than revolutionary.

CLOUD MAJICS!!! WAS IT INVENTED BY TEH MICROSOFT??!
 
Avatar 15604
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
20. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 19:39 TheEmissary
 
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 18:29:
Trevellian wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 11:19:
Is this where Nvidia gets to cry foul about their competitor getting to have an edge in certain games now like AMD did?
They can try, the difference is the SDK is open to anyone who wants to implement it, that includes nvidia. So if nvidia doesn't want to include the optimizations, then it's no ones fault other than theirs. Unlike physx which is closed source, and will fully fuck-on anyone who dares use a nvidia and ati card at once, including reversing gravity, and slowing the machine down to a crawl. Want a good example of it? Try the metro games.

Mantle is highly optimized for a specific architecture there is no denying that. If it was just a software optimization alone they would have backported it to some of their earlier graphics cards but they haven't. This should speak volumes.

Nvidia and other gpu vendors aren't going want to constantly playing catch up to standard that AMD can change at a whim. So regardless of a SDK being available or not its going to be defacto closed standard. Manufacturers will likely still have to reach a patent or licensing agreement to even use it as well. New versions of OpenGL, DirectX, or some future standard run in a vendor neutral way is how a similar api will reach mass implementation.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
19. No subject Jun 11, 2014, 18:29 Mashiki Amiketo
 
Trevellian wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 11:19:
Is this where Nvidia gets to cry foul about their competitor getting to have an edge in certain games now like AMD did?
They can try, the difference is the SDK is open to anyone who wants to implement it, that includes nvidia. So if nvidia doesn't want to include the optimizations, then it's no ones fault other than theirs. Unlike physx which is closed source, and will fully fuck-on anyone who dares use a nvidia and ati card at once, including reversing gravity, and slowing the machine down to a crawl. Want a good example of it? Try the metro games.
 
--
"For every human problem,
there is a neat, simple solution;
and it is always wrong."
--H.L. Mencken
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
18. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 17:18 Quboid
 
Tipsy McStagger wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 14:57:
So for someone who doesn't usually follow AMD stuff ever and without googling, what the hell is this mantle anyways? Someone give me a quick breakdown.

There's hopefully more qualified people than me to say (hat's off to jdreyer, BTW) but basically it's an alternative to Direct 3D which improves performance. Specifically, it reduces the amount of CPU power that's needed by the graphics card, so developers can dedicate more to AI/physics/even more complex graphics/whatever. The next version of Direct 3D, in DirectX 12, will apparently have similar performance boosts, supposedly of up to about 30% (but as with drivers, real world improvements are somewhat less).

Again, I'm no expert but AFAIK, Mantle isn't tied to AMD hardware in the same way as PhysX or TXAA are to Nvidia gear. If Nvidia wanted to, they could add support to Geforce cards but unless the market forces their hand, I expect they'd be loath to embrace an AMD technology - unless they fancy pulling a Microsoft by embracing, extending and exterminating it.

This comment was edited on Jun 11, 2014, 17:27.
 
Avatar 10439
 
- Quboid
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
17. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 16:28 The Half Elf
 
jdreyer wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 15:28:
Tipsy McStagger wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 14:57:
So for someone who doesn't usually follow AMD stuff ever and without googling, what the hell is this mantle anyways? Someone give me a quick breakdown.

It's AMD's new proprietary graphics acceleration technology. In key locations around the globe, they're able to pump liquid nitrogen past the earth's crust deep into the mantle where they harvest neutrinos given off by the massive temperature differential. They then use these neutrinos to power vast racks of servers in the cloud that AMD procs tap into to accelerate games and other graphics. Although they were claiming increases of 30-40% (which happened in special cases), in most cases improvement was only around 10%, so like NewMaxx said, more evolutionary than revolutionary.

Amazed

 
Avatar 12670
 
"I've never seen a feature like this before. It warms your ass. It's wonderful" -Walter Bishop
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
16. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 16:24 harlock
 
eRe4s3r wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 15:53:
I would consider a new OS if DX12 could give my aging system another few years of staying power....

yeh that wont be the case, but it should make for more amazing things with the new gen cards tho

for example we might be saying goodbye to cards needing additional 12v power altogether except for megabeasts like titan, etc
 
Avatar 57944
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
15. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 15:59 dj LiTh
 
jdreyer wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 15:28:
Tipsy McStagger wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 14:57:
So for someone who doesn't usually follow AMD stuff ever and without googling, what the hell is this mantle anyways? Someone give me a quick breakdown.

It's AMD's new proprietary graphics acceleration technology. In key locations around the globe, they're able to pump liquid nitrogen past the earth's crust deep into the mantle where they harvest neutrinos given off by the massive temperature differential. They then use these neutrinos to power vast racks of servers in the cloud that AMD procs tap into to accelerate games and other graphics. Although they were claiming increases of 30-40% (which happened in special cases), in most cases improvement was only around 10%, so like NewMaxx said, more evolutionary than revolutionary.

Hahaha, thx for the laugh
 
Avatar 46370
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
14. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 15:53 eRe4s3r
 
KilrathiAce wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 14:52:
NewMaxx wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 14:23:
jdreyer wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 12:44:
But didn't mantle become a bust? They were claiming improvements of 30%, but all I ever saw in real-world testing was 5-10%.

Mantle is probably worth if it you have a weaker system otherwise (CPU), especially with how far AMD CPUs are behind Intel's these days. Still, I think we'll see more universal results with DX12. I'm not bashing Mantle per se but...getting closer to the metal has been around since before Glide FX (a fact I've stated before in Mantle threads). I think a lot of people (and fanboys) over-hyped the concept since, as usual, they don't know what the hell they're talking about. I think it's a step in the right direction but it's evolutionary not revolutionary.

Unless there is another OS thats popular for PC gaming of course dx12 is gonna win....

I would say that DX12 will be what MS uses to push it's next OS to the core and gamer audience.... since 8 was such a huge failure in that area. I would consider a new OS if DX12 could give my aging system another few years of staying power....
 
Avatar 54727
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
13. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 15:28 jdreyer
 
Tipsy McStagger wrote on Jun 11, 2014, 14:57:
So for someone who doesn't usually follow AMD stuff ever and without googling, what the hell is this mantle anyways? Someone give me a quick breakdown.

It's AMD's new proprietary graphics acceleration technology. In key locations around the globe, they're able to pump liquid nitrogen past the earth's crust deep into the mantle where they harvest neutrinos given off by the massive temperature differential. They then use these neutrinos to power vast racks of servers in the cloud that AMD procs tap into to accelerate games and other graphics. Although they were claiming increases of 30-40% (which happened in special cases), in most cases improvement was only around 10%, so like NewMaxx said, more evolutionary than revolutionary.
 
Avatar 22024
 
"It's just a bunch of mystic bovine scatology to me." - 1badmf
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
12. Re: More Games to Support AMD's Mantle Jun 11, 2014, 14:57 Tipsy McStagger
 
So for someone who doesn't usually follow AMD stuff ever and without googling, what the hell is this mantle anyways? Someone give me a quick breakdown.  
Avatar 57660
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
31 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
< Newer [ 1 2 ] Older >


footer

.. .. ..

Blue's News logo