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859. Re: removed Nov 2, 2013, 13:14 Prez
 
D-Rock wrote on Nov 2, 2013, 13:04:
Good riddance.

Likewise.
 
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Goodbye my Monte boy. May you rest in the peace you never knew in life.
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858. Re: removed Nov 2, 2013, 13:04 D-Rock
 
Prez wrote on Nov 2, 2013, 12:09:
And if Blue has a bias, why has he left all of the rest of yours , RT' s , and Mad Max' s posts?

You're assuming I mean political bias. You're wrong.

It all comes down to deciding who you like and who you don't like. Blue's behavior makes it clear how he feels about me. He's a poor moderator, and that contradicts the respectable attitude that's normally portrayed in in 'Out of the Blue'.

Prez, you've officially made my asshole list.

Blue, please remove my account from this site. I've been reading here since 1996 and it's deteriorated into a bunch of BS. Good riddance.
 
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857. Re: removed Nov 2, 2013, 12:56 RollinThundr
 
Prez wrote on Nov 2, 2013, 12:22:
RollinThunder, I really have to disagree with you on the way the media reports about racial violence. The story of the Australian man shot by bored kids ( one of whom was white iirc) was covered by all of the mainstream networks. CNN had just as many stories covering it as Fox news did; surely you are not going to say they are biased against white people too? None of these stories are swept under the rug. Some of the stories (like the Trayvon Martin one) have way more facets to cover as well as a dynamic nature since there was the lack of an initial arrest and rallies for "justice". And of course the media is going to cover every single antagonistic thing angry protesters say and do since it gets people angry, getting the other side riled up escalating the war of words and giving them more juicy shit to cover. Had those bored black teens not been initially arrested the same thing would have played out with white protests and the like. And the media would have been more than happy to cover that too.

Fair enough Prez, however I hate it that stations like NBC will doctor 911 calls to slant a news story. That isn't journalistic integrity. That's pushing an agenda.

It's a culture issue, yet everyone is too afraid to say that because they don't want to be branded racist by the left.
 
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856. Re: removed Nov 2, 2013, 12:22 Prez
 
RollinThunder, I really have to disagree with you on the way the media reports about racial violence. The story of the Australian man shot by bored kids ( one of whom was white iirc) was covered by all of the mainstream networks. CNN had just as many stories covering it as Fox news did; surely you are not going to say they are biased against white people too? None of these stories are swept under the rug. Some of the stories (like the Trayvon Martin one) have way more facets to cover as well as a dynamic nature since there was the lack of an initial arrest and rallies for "justice". And of course the media is going to cover every single antagonistic thing angry protesters say and do since it gets people angry, getting the other side riled up escalating the war of words and giving them more juicy shit to cover. Had those bored black teens not been initially arrested the same thing would have played out with white protests and the like. And the media would have been more than happy to cover that too.  
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Goodbye my Monte boy. May you rest in the peace you never knew in life.
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855. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 2, 2013, 12:16 RollinThundr
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 19:52:
RollinThundr wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 18:02:
Liberal policies always shrink the middle class, read a history book instead of trying to redefine it like your ilk always does.

If you really wanted to strengthen the middle class you'd not be voting for democrats in the first place.

I get it, you want to pick and choose certain aspects of the economy to paint a pretty picture, reality doesn't work like that.

Again you know nothing about me, stop claiming you do mr I make so much money but give nothing back. Want to pay more taxes? Go head, I doubt the government would tell you no. There you go, there's your solution! All you liberals that claim all we need to do is tax more can just give up more. Win win!

Can you name a frickin' history book you want me to read?

You get nothing. If you really got something, you'd point to some empirical evidence. You'd mention a book.

You never, ever do. Ever. You just throw out your own conjecture. You never attempt to back it with research, whether yours (showing the figures your using), or someone reputable's (by linking to their book or study.)

Your whole "pay more taxes if you'd like" shows that you know nothing. Again, I have not once complained about the people in this thread, despite your insistence of the "evil CEOs" strawman. I've complained about the system/rules.


I know plenty about you:
1) Not overly well educated. One degree, from a mid-tier school or below. UMass Boston perhaps
2) IQ likely around the 110 area, give or take 10%
3) Degree was a technical one. Some liberal arts classes may have been thrown in, but nothing above the 101 or 102 level
4) Likely from a lower-middle-class upbringing. Comfortable, but not incredible
5) Parents born with little to nothing
6) Watches a good amount of cable news
7) Watches a lot of YouTube videos of a political/conspiracy nature
8) Reads a lot of "fringe" news sites. By "fringe" I mean not mainstream, or close to it. This is where you feel the "real" stories are
9) Never reads sites that aren't preaching to your choir, so to speak
10) International travel has been limited mostly to tourist areas. You've probably been to Montreal and Cancun. Maybe a few bigger European cities

I love how you're trying to make a thread that has proven what a failure Obamacare has been about me somehow.

Not gonna bite beamer. Like I've said, you're one of those condescending pricks who thinks he knows everything about everything regardless of topic and you're not afraid to say so. People like you that are so full of themselves aren't worth the time to give them what they want.

I'm not the first person who's had it out with you, I won't be the last, maybe you should look at yourself before trying to dissect others.
 
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854. Re: removed Nov 2, 2013, 12:12 RollinThundr
 
D-Rock wrote on Nov 2, 2013, 11:08:
D-Rock wrote on Oct 31, 2013, 15:50:
* REMOVED *
This comment was deleted on Nov 1, 2013, 08:25.

Wow Blue -- you just lost a reader. A reader that doesn't use ad blockers. Did someone 'tell on' me or is it just your bias against me? While this comment might have warranted removal, the last one you removed did not (it was a link to an article!).

There are plenty of other people that post insults here and you have no problem leaving them unremoved.

And don't even try and justify it with language appropriateness based on age. Some of the ads you have on your site are offensive and very inappropriate (F2P MMORPG's with blatant sexual content anyone?).

Your actions prove that you are an asshole as well. You have yet to justify them.

I challenge you to leave this post intact -- I'm just calling a spade a spade, and I encourage you and others to justify your actions.

Nothing new, the usual suspects can insult you all day long because they're part of the BN clique. I've had threads deleted that were on topic, had zero personal insults towards anyone, but because they were anti democrat, poof, gone.

It's typical and it isn't the only site you'll see it on. Liberals love their echo chambers.
 
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853. Re: removed Nov 2, 2013, 12:09 Prez
 
D-Rock wrote on Nov 2, 2013, 11:08:
D-Rock wrote on Oct 31, 2013, 15:50:
* REMOVED *
This comment was deleted on Nov 1, 2013, 08:25.

Wow Blue -- you just lost a reader. A reader that doesn't use ad blockers. Did someone 'tell on' me or is it just your bias against me? While this comment might have warranted removal, the last one you removed did not (it was a link to an article!).

There are plenty of other people that post insults here and you have no problem leaving them unremoved.

And don't even try and justify it with language appropriateness based on age. Some of the ads you have on your site are offensive and very inappropriate (F2P MMORPG's with blatant sexual content anyone?).

Your actions prove that you are an asshole as well. You have yet to justify them.

I challenge you to leave this post intact -- I'm just calling a spade a spade, and I encourage you and others to justify your actions.

Not cool. At all. Yours was not the only post removed in this thread. And if Blue has a bias, why has he left all of the rest of yours , RT' s , and Mad Max' s posts? Looks to me you have a persecution complex.
 
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Goodbye my Monte boy. May you rest in the peace you never knew in life.
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852. Re: removed Nov 2, 2013, 11:08 D-Rock
 
D-Rock wrote on Oct 31, 2013, 15:50:
* REMOVED *
This comment was deleted on Nov 1, 2013, 08:25.

Wow Blue -- you just lost a reader. A reader that doesn't use ad blockers. Did someone 'tell on' me or is it just your bias against me? While this comment might have warranted removal, the last one you removed did not (it was a link to an article!).

There are plenty of other people that post insults here and you have no problem leaving them unremoved.

And don't even try and justify it with language appropriateness based on age. Some of the ads you have on your site are offensive and very inappropriate (F2P MMORPG's with blatant sexual content anyone?).

Your actions prove that you are an asshole as well. You have yet to justify them.

I challenge you to leave this post intact -- I'm just calling a spade a spade, and I encourage you and others to justify your actions.
 
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851. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 19:52 Beamer
 
RollinThundr wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 18:02:
Liberal policies always shrink the middle class, read a history book instead of trying to redefine it like your ilk always does.

If you really wanted to strengthen the middle class you'd not be voting for democrats in the first place.

I get it, you want to pick and choose certain aspects of the economy to paint a pretty picture, reality doesn't work like that.

Again you know nothing about me, stop claiming you do mr I make so much money but give nothing back. Want to pay more taxes? Go head, I doubt the government would tell you no. There you go, there's your solution! All you liberals that claim all we need to do is tax more can just give up more. Win win!

Can you name a frickin' history book you want me to read?

You get nothing. If you really got something, you'd point to some empirical evidence. You'd mention a book.

You never, ever do. Ever. You just throw out your own conjecture. You never attempt to back it with research, whether yours (showing the figures your using), or someone reputable's (by linking to their book or study.)

Your whole "pay more taxes if you'd like" shows that you know nothing. Again, I have not once complained about the people in this thread, despite your insistence of the "evil CEOs" strawman. I've complained about the system/rules.


I know plenty about you:
1) Not overly well educated. One degree, from a mid-tier school or below. UMass Boston perhaps
2) IQ likely around the 110 area, give or take 10%
3) Degree was a technical one. Some liberal arts classes may have been thrown in, but nothing above the 101 or 102 level
4) Likely from a lower-middle-class upbringing. Comfortable, but not incredible
5) Parents born with little to nothing
6) Watches a good amount of cable news
7) Watches a lot of YouTube videos of a political/conspiracy nature
8) Reads a lot of "fringe" news sites. By "fringe" I mean not mainstream, or close to it. This is where you feel the "real" stories are
9) Never reads sites that aren't preaching to your choir, so to speak
10) International travel has been limited mostly to tourist areas. You've probably been to Montreal and Cancun. Maybe a few bigger European cities
 
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http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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850. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 19:43 Wowbagger_TIP
 
RollinThundr wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 18:02:

Liberal policies always shrink the middle class, read a history book instead of trying to redefine it like your ilk always does.

If you really wanted to strengthen the middle class you'd not be voting for democrats in the first place.

I get it, you want to pick and choose certain aspects of the economy to paint a pretty picture, reality doesn't work like that.

Again you know nothing about me, stop claiming you do mr I make so much money but give nothing back. Want to pay more taxes? Go head, I doubt the government would tell you no. There you go, there's your solution! All you liberals that claim all we need to do is tax more can just give up more. Win win!

Ok, so what history book did you get this knowledge of the economy from?

I think we understand just fine that there are a lot of factors tied into the economy. That doesn't mean that you can't answer basic questions about parts of it. That you consider it all one nebulous entity where the only factors that matters are government spending and "printing money" shows exactly how little you actually understand about it.

 
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"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." -- Bertrand Russell (I think...)
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849. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 19:35 Wowbagger_TIP
 
RollinThundr wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 17:34:
It's also quite bullshit in regards to national media coverage, most of those crimes are swept under the rug, and you'd never hear Obama chime in on those cases, the fact that you can't even come to admit there's a general liberal bias in media to begin with speaks volumes, although with how much fail Obamacare has been so far even the left leaning stations can't spin that shit in a positive light at this point.

Swept under the rug how? They get news coverage, the perpetrators were arrested, charged and convicted. You're completely full of shit.
 
Avatar 9540
 
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." -- Bertrand Russell (I think...)
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848. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 18:02 RollinThundr
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 17:42:
RollinThundr wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 16:42:

This is why I keep telling you you're illogical when talking about the economy, you cannot just pick and choose what factors affect an economy to suit your bias, you either talk about EVERYTHING that encompasses an economy, or you shut the fuck up.

Who do you think buys the products or services that corporations make & provide that contribute to an economy? The poor? Only other 1%'ers? Just the middle class? No EVERYONE but especially the middle class.

How do you think government spending affects investments, that then affects job growth and growth in general? Oh whats that? Government spending doesn't matter? Just taxes matter?

This is why I hate even bringing up economy with you, because you clearly have no fucking idea how the economy actually works, or just how many factors tie into it. You just repeat over and over the same flawed liberal class warfare bullshit talking points that no matter how many times you say it, it won't ever be reality.


This isn't what we're talking about. It's like having a discussion on how the water is a factor in why pizza outside the NYC area are terrible and how that can be fixed, and you keep jumping in and going "why aren't we talking about the toppings!"

I'm trying to discuss a very specific issue with the economy. You keep trying to bring it around to an entirely unrelated issue with the economy. Yes, it's all issues, but you can't keep steering the conversation back to where you're comfortable. The government is spending too much. Not a single person here is denying that.

Sorry, you're just wrong in saying you should discuss "EVERYTHING." That's just not a possibility. If you discuss "EVERYTHING," you get into depth on "NOTHING." In reality, there are hundreds of factors that impact the economy. I'm not interested in discussing all of them right now, I'm interested in discussing one of the most basic root causes that we disagree on.

I don't really know what your second sentence has to do with anything. My arguments have all been about strengthening the middle class, so you acting as if I'm discounting them is strange. Also, no, the top 1%s spending isn't significant in the economy. Why not? Because they're only 1%. There's only so much spending they can do.

Also, go get a goddamn degree in anything fucking business related, take a class, read a book and mention which goddamn book, cite a fucking study or set of numbers and post the link to it, and then tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. I've done all of that in this thread.

Liberal policies always shrink the middle class, read a history book instead of trying to redefine it like your ilk always does.

If you really wanted to strengthen the middle class you'd not be voting for democrats in the first place.

I get it, you want to pick and choose certain aspects of the economy to paint a pretty picture, reality doesn't work like that.

Again you know nothing about me, stop claiming you do mr I make so much money but give nothing back. Want to pay more taxes? Go head, I doubt the government would tell you no. There you go, there's your solution! All you liberals that claim all we need to do is tax more can just give up more. Win win!
 
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847. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 17:42 Beamer
 
RollinThundr wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 16:42:

This is why I keep telling you you're illogical when talking about the economy, you cannot just pick and choose what factors affect an economy to suit your bias, you either talk about EVERYTHING that encompasses an economy, or you shut the fuck up.

Who do you think buys the products or services that corporations make & provide that contribute to an economy? The poor? Only other 1%'ers? Just the middle class? No EVERYONE but especially the middle class.

How do you think government spending affects investments, that then affects job growth and growth in general? Oh whats that? Government spending doesn't matter? Just taxes matter?

This is why I hate even bringing up economy with you, because you clearly have no fucking idea how the economy actually works, or just how many factors tie into it. You just repeat over and over the same flawed liberal class warfare bullshit talking points that no matter how many times you say it, it won't ever be reality.


This isn't what we're talking about. It's like having a discussion on how the water is a factor in why pizza outside the NYC area are terrible and how that can be fixed, and you keep jumping in and going "why aren't we talking about the toppings!"

I'm trying to discuss a very specific issue with the economy. You keep trying to bring it around to an entirely unrelated issue with the economy. Yes, it's all issues, but you can't keep steering the conversation back to where you're comfortable. The government is spending too much. Not a single person here is denying that.

Sorry, you're just wrong in saying you should discuss "EVERYTHING." That's just not a possibility. If you discuss "EVERYTHING," you get into depth on "NOTHING." In reality, there are hundreds of factors that impact the economy. I'm not interested in discussing all of them right now, I'm interested in discussing one of the most basic root causes that we disagree on.

I don't really know what your second sentence has to do with anything. My arguments have all been about strengthening the middle class, so you acting as if I'm discounting them is strange. Also, no, the top 1%s spending isn't significant in the economy. Why not? Because they're only 1%. There's only so much spending they can do.

Also, go get a goddamn degree in anything fucking business related, take a class, read a book and mention which goddamn book, cite a fucking study or set of numbers and post the link to it, and then tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. I've done all of that in this thread.
 
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Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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846. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 17:34 RollinThundr
 
Wowbagger_TIP wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 17:27:
RollinThundr wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 16:42:
Explain to me then why we don't get mass media attention when 5 black teens kill a WW2 vet in his 80's for a whopping 20 bucks? Explain to me why we don't get mass media coverage when 4 blacks torture, rape, mutilate and kill a white couple in Tennessee? Or when they kill a white baseball player because "they were bored?" where's the mass outrage? If you for one minute tell me there's not a bias to not report massive crimes like that based on skin color, while proclaiming African Americans only as victims, like the Jessie Jacksons, and Al Sharptons of the world do on a daily basis, then you're either 1, an out right liar, or 2. You feel so guilty because slavery happened then I don't know what to tell you.

But saying all that makes me a racist obviously, because I don't think ANYONE should get special treatment based on color, and I'm a racist because I think you should be capable of being a productive member of society regardless of color. That's what racism is in America these days. It's sickening much like political correctness is sickening.

You asked this same question earlier and I gave you the answer, and you had no response to it.† Youíve apparently already purged the answer from your mind because it doesnít fit in with all the idiocy stored in there.†
The reason it doesnít make a big news splash (although it certainly did make the news, as I found out about two of those events because they were front page news on MSN.com)† is because the perpetrators were immediately arrested and charged with the crimes, as they should be.† So what exactly is your issue?

RollinThundr wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 16:42:
This is why I keep telling you you're illogical when talking about the economy, you cannot just pick and choose what factors affect an economy to suit your bias, you either talk about EVERYTHING that encompasses an economy, or you shut the fuck up.

Who do you think buys the products or services that corporations make & provide that contribute to an economy? The poor? Only other 1%'ers? Just the middle class? No EVERYONE but especially the middle class.

How do you think government spending affects investments, that then affects job growth and growth in general? Oh whats that? Government spending doesn't matter? Just taxes matter?

This is why I hate even bringing up economy with you, because you clearly have no fucking idea how the economy actually works, or just how many factors tie into it. You just repeat over and over the same flawed liberal class warfare bullshit talking points that no matter how many times you say it, it won't ever be reality.


Youíve conclusively proven here that you know nothing about economics, and specifically you have no answer to the question that Beamer asked.† Itís not magic.† The money exists and went somewhere.† Your sputtering and blathering on about stuff you donít understand isnít answering anything.

1%er's, Politician pet projects? Various other government spending? All of the above? Neither do you, neither does beamer.

Although making the statement and sticking with it that government spending does fuck all to effect the economy is flat out wrong, and anyone who believes that to be true, obviously doesn't have much a clue much like you're claiming I don't.

It's also quite bullshit in regards to national media coverage, most of those crimes are swept under the rug, and you'd never hear Obama chime in on those cases, the fact that you can't even come to admit there's a general liberal bias in media to begin with speaks volumes, although with how much fail Obamacare has been so far even the left leaning stations can't spin that shit in a positive light at this point.
 
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845. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 17:27 Wowbagger_TIP
 
RollinThundr wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 16:42:
Explain to me then why we don't get mass media attention when 5 black teens kill a WW2 vet in his 80's for a whopping 20 bucks? Explain to me why we don't get mass media coverage when 4 blacks torture, rape, mutilate and kill a white couple in Tennessee? Or when they kill a white baseball player because "they were bored?" where's the mass outrage? If you for one minute tell me there's not a bias to not report massive crimes like that based on skin color, while proclaiming African Americans only as victims, like the Jessie Jacksons, and Al Sharptons of the world do on a daily basis, then you're either 1, an out right liar, or 2. You feel so guilty because slavery happened then I don't know what to tell you.

But saying all that makes me a racist obviously, because I don't think ANYONE should get special treatment based on color, and I'm a racist because I think you should be capable of being a productive member of society regardless of color. That's what racism is in America these days. It's sickening much like political correctness is sickening.

You asked this same question earlier and I gave you the answer, and you had no response to it.† Youíve apparently already purged the answer from your mind because it doesnít fit in with all the idiocy stored in there.†
The reason it doesnít make a big news splash (although it certainly did make the news, as I found out about two of those events because they were front page news on MSN.com)† is because the perpetrators were immediately arrested and charged with the crimes, as they should be.† So what exactly is your issue?

RollinThundr wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 16:42:
This is why I keep telling you you're illogical when talking about the economy, you cannot just pick and choose what factors affect an economy to suit your bias, you either talk about EVERYTHING that encompasses an economy, or you shut the fuck up.

Who do you think buys the products or services that corporations make & provide that contribute to an economy? The poor? Only other 1%'ers? Just the middle class? No EVERYONE but especially the middle class.

How do you think government spending affects investments, that then affects job growth and growth in general? Oh whats that? Government spending doesn't matter? Just taxes matter?

This is why I hate even bringing up economy with you, because you clearly have no fucking idea how the economy actually works, or just how many factors tie into it. You just repeat over and over the same flawed liberal class warfare bullshit talking points that no matter how many times you say it, it won't ever be reality.


Youíve conclusively proven here that you know nothing about economics, and specifically you have no answer to the question that Beamer asked.† Itís not magic.† The money exists and went somewhere.† Your sputtering and blathering on about stuff you donít understand isnít answering anything.
 
Avatar 9540
 
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." -- Bertrand Russell (I think...)
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844. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 16:42 RollinThundr
 
Prez wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 15:52:
Thought I had included your previous post before hitting send, it still stands though, I hate the double standard that it's ok and even excused to be an unproductive member of society just because, COLOR!

No one is "excusing" anyone for being unproductive. But many people who are unproductive need a little help to become productive - it seems to me that it would be more helpful enacting programs to do just that rather than getting mad at them (or one particular group of them as you seem to be), browbeating them, abandoning them, or disregarding them. And again, poverty isn't a 'color' issue. If race seems to be at the forefront of things like violence and poverty I say you can thank the media. If it riles everyone up about race it gets more people watching their news - it's good business to have separate groups at odds. It gets people emotional and escaltes the "war" that they are all to ready to report on, and the process continues.

Explain to me then why we don't get mass media attention when 5 black teens kill a WW2 vet in his 80's for a whopping 20 bucks? Explain to me why we don't get mass media coverage when 4 blacks torture, rape, mutilate and kill a white couple in Tennessee? Or when they kill a white baseball player because "they were bored?" where's the mass outrage? If you for one minute tell me there's not a bias to not report massive crimes like that based on skin color, while proclaiming African Americans only as victims, like the Jessie Jacksons, and Al Sharptons of the world do on a daily basis, then you're either 1, an out right liar, or 2. You feel so guilty because slavery happened then I don't know what to tell you.

But saying all that makes me a racist obviously, because I don't think ANYONE should get special treatment based on color, and I'm a racist because I think you should be capable of being a productive member of society regardless of color. That's what racism is in America these days. It's sickening much like political correctness is sickening.

Beamer wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 15:42:
RollinThundr wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 13:54:

As to where it's going? Out in the street more than likely, we certainly haven't cut any sort of serious spending at any level of government now have we? But no, I'm sure you'll come back and explain to us all that it's the CEO's, and big evil business.

It in the street?
Ok, so you don't know what total personal income is. That's fine, though I wish you'd Google it before you'd respond. I'll do it for you. Per the United States' Bureau of Economic Analysis, total personal income is is the sum of compensation of employees (received), supplements to wages and salaries, proprietors' income with inventory valuation adjustment (IVA) and capital consumption adjustment (CCAdj), rental income of persons with CCAdj, personal income receipts on assets, and personal current transfer receipts, less contributions for government social insurance.
In other words, total personal income is the total amount of money that US citizens earn in some capacity. I'd prefer the total private income, as it strips out all that government stuff, but I can't find that anywhere.


So, to recap:
- the amount of money US citizens earn, as a whole, has risen drastically. It's gone up 57% since 2000, which I think we'd all agree far outstrips inflation
- the taxation level has actually decreased, from about 21% to 20%
- the US labor force has fallen percentagewise from ~66% to 63%, but since the country is larger it's actually gone up about 10 million people
- by your own admission, wages have not increased


Given all this, your answer to where that massive jump in personal income went is... to the street? That doesn't make any money. Significantly more US money has been earned, taxation has decreased marginally, and the amount of people working has increased marginally.
So if that money isn't going to the middle class wages, and isn't going to the poor wages, where is it going?

"The street" is as logical an answer to that question as "blue."
Also, SHUT UP about government spending when asked about this. We're talking solely money citizens earn. Government spending is not part of this conversation. You keep trying to bring it back there because you do not understand what we are talking about.


This is why I keep telling you you're illogical when talking about the economy, you cannot just pick and choose what factors affect an economy to suit your bias, you either talk about EVERYTHING that encompasses an economy, or you shut the fuck up.

Who do you think buys the products or services that corporations make & provide that contribute to an economy? The poor? Only other 1%'ers? Just the middle class? No EVERYONE but especially the middle class.

How do you think government spending affects investments, that then affects job growth and growth in general? Oh whats that? Government spending doesn't matter? Just taxes matter?

This is why I hate even bringing up economy with you, because you clearly have no fucking idea how the economy actually works, or just how many factors tie into it. You just repeat over and over the same flawed liberal class warfare bullshit talking points that no matter how many times you say it, it won't ever be reality.

 
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843. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 16:11 Beamer
 
Prez wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 15:59:
Would you mind reading my "where is the money going" post and telling me if you understand what I'm saying?

Is it me, or is it RollinThundr? Because "if US citizens, as a whole, are earning more money, but middle class income isn't seeing their wages grow proportionately, then where is the money going?" seems simple enough to me...

I haven't vetted the numbers myself but assuming they are correct it would have to mean the money is going to the wealthy. Which is certainly what I am seeing at my company.

Only place it can be going, right?
The people as a whole are making more, and we've ruled out it going to the government, so either we'd all be making more money, or a certain segment of us is making more money.
Numbers by year, back to the 90s, are here

I also very much like this chart:
Which shows how taxation has impacted our income equality.
Want to guess what a chart of the rise and decline of the middle class would look like?
 
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842. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 15:59 Prez
 
Would you mind reading my "where is the money going" post and telling me if you understand what I'm saying?

Is it me, or is it RollinThundr? Because "if US citizens, as a whole, are earning more money, but middle class income isn't seeing their wages grow proportionately, then where is the money going?" seems simple enough to me...

I haven't vetted the numbers myself but assuming they are correct it would have to mean the money is going to the wealthy. Which is certainly what I am seeing at my company.
 
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Goodbye my Monte boy. May you rest in the peace you never knew in life.
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841. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 15:57 Beamer
 
Prez wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 15:52:
Thought I had included your previous post before hitting send, it still stands though, I hate the double standard that it's ok and even excused to be an unproductive member of society just because, COLOR!

No one is "excusing" anyone for being unproductive. But many people who are unproductive need a little help to become productive - it seems to me that it would be more helpful enacting programs to do just that rather than getting mad at them (or one particular group of them as you seem to be), browbeating them, abandoning them, or disregarding them. And again, poverty isn't a 'color' issue.
Would you mind reading my "where is the money going" post and telling me if you understand what I'm saying?

Is it me, or is it RollinThundr? Because "if US citizens, as a whole, are earning more money, but middle class income isn't seeing their wages grow proportionately, then where is the money going?" seems simple enough to me...
 
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http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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840. Re: Morning Metaverse Nov 1, 2013, 15:55 Beamer
 
Mad Max RW wrote on Nov 1, 2013, 15:47:
Nobody in the world buys more crap than America's middle class. Corporations and businesses generate the crap we buy. It's in their own best interest to not shrink the middle class. It's flawed logic to claim corporations are the reason they're shrinking in the first place. Now, maybe in 20 or 30 years it will be a different story with China and India overtaking us. And that's only if their own massive bubbles don't burst.

Meanwhile, Obamacare continues to unravel...

Obama donorís firm hired to fix Web mess it created


KGW-OR: As Many As 150,000 Oregonians Will Lose Health Plan Because Of ObamaCare


My point is that no one is evil, sitting in a room going "shrink the middle class!" Executives negotiate their pay. They don't think about how it will damage the economy, they think about how it will help their retirement, or how it will help them pay for their kids' college, or how it will help them go on a better vacation then the husband of the women your wife is in a book club with, or whatever, basically the same thing anyone else things about.

Like I said anecdotally about the project I led to move US jobs overseas - no one was thinking about how it impacts the US economy. Moving those 100 jobs wouldn't make a dent. But when everyone is doing it...
 
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http://www.deathwishinc.com
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http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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