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Morning Mobilization

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9. Re: Morning Mobilization Aug 27, 2013, 23:15 Tom
 
Yeah, I was counting on the additional registers as being the main reason for additional performance when going 64-bit, and 31% still seems like a stretch if x86->x64 is any indication. Maybe things are different on ARM? I mean, you can always come up with some tasks where the additional registers and instructions will make a huge difference. But are they the common things that people are waiting around on the CPU for? I doubt it. "animations, transparencies, and other iOS 7 graphical effects" - those things should be GPU bound anyway, right? Seems to me what matters here is stuff like app startup, compression, crypto, browser page processing/rendering/JS execution, etc.  
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8. Re: Morning Mobilization Aug 27, 2013, 20:34 NewMaxx
 
Tom wrote on Aug 27, 2013, 18:43:
64-bit may offer some small gains in performance (31% sounds like a stretch), but the primary reason to go 64-bit - on phones and on desktops - is to be free of address space restrictions.

31% is more than a stretch if you're just saying address space and memory management...you may even see a decrease in performance at the edge. Yes, the additional address space and the ability to manage more memory is nice, but we're talking about situations that were fulfilled by microcontrollers rather than microprocessors in the past. This means RISC (reduced instruction sets) where adding 64-bit instructions and registers can bring a large performance increase, again specifically in media tasks.
 
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7. Re: Morning Mobilization Aug 27, 2013, 20:29 NewMaxx
 
Fibrocyte wrote on Aug 27, 2013, 12:44:
Panickd wrote on Aug 27, 2013, 11:57:
And we need 64-bit cpus in phones... why?

Because 64-bit generally performs better?

Specifically in media operations, which is a very real focus these days, mainly because of the addition of the 64-bit registers.
 
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6. Re: Morning Mobilization Aug 27, 2013, 18:43 Tom
 
64-bit may offer some small gains in performance (31% sounds like a stretch), but the primary reason to go 64-bit - on phones and on desktops - is to be free of address space restrictions. Some phones already have 2GB of RAM today. If they want to go much higher than that, it's going to be a lot easier if the CPU and OS are 64-bit. Might as well start the transition sooner rather than later so that things are in place and ready.

Yeah, the OS and apps are going to be bigger too, but that's never stopped Apple before. (Universal binaries, high resolution support...)

Plus it's a spec they can sell people on who don't know any better. "64 must be twice as good as 32!"

Some code actually runs slower when compiled as 64-bit since the 2x size of an address (pointer) can cause more data to need to be transferred around, things to not fit in CPU caches as nicely, and other fun stuff.
 
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5. Re: Morning Mobilization Aug 27, 2013, 14:02 jdreyer
 
Panickd wrote on Aug 27, 2013, 11:57:
And we need 64-bit cpus in phones... why?

Bill Gates: "640K [of memory] ought to be enough for anyone."
 
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4. Re: Morning Mobilization Aug 27, 2013, 12:44 Fibrocyte
 
Panickd wrote on Aug 27, 2013, 11:57:
And we need 64-bit cpus in phones... why?

Because 64-bit generally performs better?
 
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3. Re: Morning Mobilization Aug 27, 2013, 11:57 Panickd
 
And we need 64-bit cpus in phones... why?  
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2. Re: Morning Mobilization Aug 27, 2013, 11:48 NeOCidE
 
Red wrote on Aug 27, 2013, 11:41:
Considering this is an iPhone "S" iteration, meaning it's a speed bump from the last model with minimal design or feature improvement, shouldn't the actual performance increase be more than 31%? That just seems incredibly lackluster.

I'm no spec-touting douche and firmly believe the full experience is more significant than numbers, but this round's rumored hardware is offering nothing of interest to the full experience. And then it doesn't even offer meaningful new numbers as a fallback. I don't deny being an Apple fan, but that just makes me all the more disappointed that they seem to be digging a nice deep grave to lay themselves into.

I suspect you're right about this. I imagine Apple' competitors are seriously upping the specs for next gen mobile devices. I really don't see what Apple are doing here to claw back the advantage they once had in their mobile division. They are producing the same lacklustre iPhones/iPads. I for one would like to see a full OS on the iPad.
 
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1. Re: Morning Mobilization Aug 27, 2013, 11:41 Red
 
Considering this is an iPhone "S" iteration, meaning it's a speed bump from the last model with minimal design or feature improvement, shouldn't the actual performance increase be more than 31%? That just seems incredibly lackluster.

I'm no spec-touting douche and firmly believe the full experience is more significant than numbers, but this round's rumored hardware is offering nothing of interest to the full experience. And then it doesn't even offer meaningful new numbers as a fallback. I don't deny being an Apple fan, but that just makes me all the more disappointed that they seem to be digging a nice deep grave to lay themselves into.
 
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