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Evening Consolidation

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20. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 14:23 Dev
 
HorrorScope wrote on Jul 27, 2013, 11:46:
That said it is still a huge bump in ram for the consoles overall, it looks like just having 8 gigs on a pc will cover console port needs.
Actually sounds like 4gb would
 
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19. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 12:42 dj LiTh
 
I think something to consider is just how much experience microsoft has in making OS's and how much experience sony has, as its a pretty big disparity. That could be one reason for the bloated figures, perhaps in future updates it will be trimmed down some.  
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18. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 12:27 wtf_man
 
Windows 7 technically uses around 512MB. We're talking that the OS actually REALLY needs to REALLY run, here. It can run on a netbook with an atom processor and 1GB of ram quite nicely for simple things like web browsing, etc. (unlike Vista). Technically you can install Windows 7 on a machine That has only 512MB but it will be slow as snot since it will constantly swap to the hard drive's virtual memory.

What you are seeing in the task manager that shows OS utilizing more than 512MB is a ton of prefetch stuff, that can be taken back by Applications if they need it. The more memory you have, the more it will try to use for prefetch data to act "snappier".

If you turn off prefetch and superfetch... you will see those numbers go down dramatically. Of course there are other services that are running, that basically cache like prefetch, but I don't know them all.
 
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17. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 12:26 Creston
 
That's pretty hefty, Sony. What in God's name are you running on that box? Bloatware 5.0?

Creston
 
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16. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 11:46 HorrorScope
 
Dev wrote on Jul 27, 2013, 01:41:
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 23:06:
Really guys? 3.5GB, and here your modern PC OS takes under 1.7GB on average with a normal installation.
Since when? Try 10 times that for most modern windows installs.

Not HD install size, memory usage size, as you later said, it can even be quite a bit less than that in memory.

And the 12 gig or ram on the 180 is a rumor that it was something they are considering.

As to this news it is still disappointing how bloated these O/S's are an how much now runs in the background at all times. All those things console players way back when would try to leverage against the pc to prove it was better... All roads lead to PC assimilation, the pc proved to have everything right, since they are very similar now and the O/S on it is much more open than the consoles closed environment, yes even Win 8.

That said it is still a huge bump in ram for the consoles overall, it looks like just having 8 gigs on a pc will cover console port needs.
 
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15. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 11:42 Dev
 
Fibrocyte wrote on Jul 27, 2013, 11:23:
Dev wrote on Jul 27, 2013, 01:41:
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 23:06:
Really guys? 3.5GB, and here your modern PC OS takes under 1.7GB on average with a normal installation.
Since when? Try 10 times that for most modern windows installs.

Go home, Dev. You're drunk.

Seriously, though, I'm guessing you misread the comment that you responded to. My Win8 install is taking 1.8GB right now. If it required 17GB then my computer wouldn't even boot.
I was thinking hdd, not RAM. Even though the headline says RAM. Probably because 3.5gb sounds high for OS ram usage.
Although in my defense, the comment I quoted doesn't mention, and talks about "installation"
 
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14. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 11:23 Fibrocyte
 
Dev wrote on Jul 27, 2013, 01:41:
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 23:06:
Really guys? 3.5GB, and here your modern PC OS takes under 1.7GB on average with a normal installation.
Since when? Try 10 times that for most modern windows installs.

Go home, Dev. You're drunk.

Seriously, though, I'm guessing you misread the comment that you responded to. My Win8 install is taking 1.8GB right now. If it required 17GB then my computer wouldn't even boot.
 
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13. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 08:01 Burrito of Peace
 
Sho wrote on Jul 27, 2013, 02:04:
Articulate, intelligent explanation of why RAM usage is a good thing here.

At a more anecdotal level, I have 16GB of main system memory in my desktop PC. Right now, the system has reserved 6GB of that for itself. Applications that I bring up often load up in five seconds or less thanks to predictive caching (which is awesome for KSP and the hojillion mods I have installed, for example). Even so, I can't recall ever seeing a game slice off more than 4GB for its own usage. RAM is there to be used, not sit idle and suck down power. I don't see the fuss.
 
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12. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 03:51 jacobvandy
 
nin wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 23:10:
kunic wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 22:54:
nin wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 22:34:
Report: OS overhead takes up 3.5GB of PS4ís 8GB of RAM.
I'm guessing at least a chunk of that is the video recording for sharing, a feature I doubt I'll use much...

I think you'd be surprised. You never know when a really cool or funny moment will crop up that you'd be able to then capture and upload for everyone to see.


I think that would involve me actually being decent at said game, as opposed to (my normal play skill of) shooting all around the enemy before finally snagging an accidental nut shot...


Don't have to be good at a game to catch unique or interesting stuff. Weird bugs or behavior are way more compelling than just playing a game decently.
 
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11. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 02:04 Sho
 
This isn't about storage space -- it's about RAM usage. Now, unfortunately a lot of people misunderstand the whole deal about that. In terms of system architecture, the main reason you have RAM (as well as a whole hierarchy of caches in the CPU) is because long-term persistant storage is slow, so slow that the CPU would do nothing but wait much of the time if you were to operate directly from disk (meanwhile, those caches are there because relative to the CPU's needs, RAM is actually too slow as well). Consequently, in a very simplified manner, RAM is at its best when full: Modern operating systems will opportunistically prefetch and keep caches of data you MIGHT need from disk, so the CPU doesn't have to wait for it when you do need it. As long as those caches can be evicted efficiently when the working set of a program grows (i.e. something more important needs to use the RAM), that sort of RAM full-ness isn't an issue, but a good thing.

The bottom line is that laymen often misunderstand and inappropriately panic at seeing high RAM utilization levels, or high memory usage by an application - it doesn't actually have to mean that the system is overtaxed or the application is a monster, the real situation is more complex than that.

In this case though we're talking about the amount of RAM reserved for use by the operating system and its services. Given that the new console generation wants to do a lot of background activity (the social stuff, downloading in the background, ...) it's not surprising this is a fairly high number.
 
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10. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 01:59 ItBurn
 
Dev wrote on Jul 27, 2013, 01:41:
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 23:06:
Really guys? 3.5GB, and here your modern PC OS takes under 1.7GB on average with a normal installation.
Since when? Try 10 times that for most modern windows installs.

10 times more? You're mad. 1.7 sounds about right.
 
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9. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 01:41 Dev
 
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 23:06:
Really guys? 3.5GB, and here your modern PC OS takes under 1.7GB on average with a normal installation.
Since when? Try 10 times that for most modern windows installs.
 
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8. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 01:26 Agent.X7
 
It's pretty much an alarmist article designed to get page views. The OS on consoles isn't like Windows.  
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7. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 00:57 Xil
 
nin wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 22:34:
Report: OS overhead takes up 3.5GB of PS4ís 8GB of RAM.

Little disappointed to read this. Granted, the ps3 does all kinds of neat shit with 512 meg (total!), but still...

I'm guessing at least a chunk of that is the video recording for sharing, a feature I doubt I'll use much...

Oh well...

to be honest I find this a bit hard to believe, if ps3 takes 96mb.... I guess time will tell
 
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6. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 27, 2013, 00:45 Beamer
 
What, is it running Windows?  
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5. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 26, 2013, 23:10 nin
 
kunic wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 22:54:
nin wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 22:34:
Report: OS overhead takes up 3.5GB of PS4ís 8GB of RAM.
I'm guessing at least a chunk of that is the video recording for sharing, a feature I doubt I'll use much...

I think you'd be surprised. You never know when a really cool or funny moment will crop up that you'd be able to then capture and upload for everyone to see.


I think that would involve me actually being decent at said game, as opposed to (my normal play skill of) shooting all around the enemy before finally snagging an accidental nut shot...

 
http://www.nin.com/pub/tension/
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4. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 26, 2013, 23:06 Mashiki Amiketo
 
Really guys? 3.5GB, and here your modern PC OS takes under 1.7GB on average with a normal installation.  
--
"For every human problem,
there is a neat, simple solution;
and it is always wrong."
--H.L. Mencken
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3. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 26, 2013, 23:04 dj LiTh
 
Interesting, more then xbone is taking up (3gb) also didnt they just up it to 12gb for the xbone? I'll be interested to see some real world numbers instead of all the theorycraft going on.  
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2. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 26, 2013, 22:54 kunic
 
nin wrote on Jul 26, 2013, 22:34:
Report: OS overhead takes up 3.5GB of PS4ís 8GB of RAM.
I'm guessing at least a chunk of that is the video recording for sharing, a feature I doubt I'll use much...

I think you'd be surprised. You never know when a really cool or funny moment will crop up that you'd be able to then capture and upload for everyone to see.
 
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1. Re: Evening Consolidation Jul 26, 2013, 22:34 nin
 
Report: OS overhead takes up 3.5GB of PS4ís 8GB of RAM.

Little disappointed to read this. Granted, the ps3 does all kinds of neat shit with 512 meg (total!), but still...

I'm guessing at least a chunk of that is the video recording for sharing, a feature I doubt I'll use much...

Oh well...
 
http://www.nin.com/pub/tension/
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