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Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch

The Star Wars: The Old Republic website has word that a new version 2.3 game update is now available on the Play Test Server for the Star Wars MMORPG, though word is you will already need a high-level character copied over to participate: "Game Update 2.3 is now live on our Public Test Server! For those of you that already have high level, copied characters on our Public Test Server, we encourage you to explore the CZ-198 moon and two new Czerka Flashpoints. Get on, check everything out, and give us your feedback by posting on the Public Test Server forum. Unfortunately, we won’t be able to offer the ability to copy characters for this test nor will there be any rewards offered for testing. We apologize for any inconvenience that this may cause."

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22. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jul 1, 2013, 02:15 NKD
 
HorrorScope wrote on Jul 1, 2013, 00:28:
Big difference if the game is profitable to cover on-going costs monthyl vs covering costs already concurred years ago. I'm not so sure the game is overall profitable, just that today it brings in more monthly than they put into it monthly.

Yeah but simply being profitable on a month to month basis isn't enough to keep a project alive. It has to be more profitable than all the other things you could put those resources into.

EA isn't going to keep Bioware Austin running and developing the game if it is only making a middling profit. They will gut the studio and particularly outstanding employees will be offered jobs at another EA studio.
 
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21. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jul 1, 2013, 00:28 HorrorScope
 
Big difference if the game is profitable to cover on-going costs monthyl vs covering costs already concurred years ago. I'm not so sure the game is overall profitable, just that today it brings in more monthly than they put into it monthly.  
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20. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 30, 2013, 23:30 Asmo
 
F2P is a viable alternative to get people to try your product and tempt them to buy in to it.

Converting to F2P may indicate that subs are dropping (they certainly were in TOR), but it does not mean the game is or has been losing money.

Further, conversion to F2P is not free, it's another cost to be sunk in to the final "must make at least this much to cover costs" total. Going with the same method of taking disparate and anecdotal bits of evidence and knitting them together in to some form of narrative, the move to F2P was an effort to get a bigger consumer base because subs were waning and it was obviously worth more to keep the game running albeit on a more unpredictable income stream than it was to just shut it down.

If they were staring down a hundred + million in unrecoverable costs and the game was losing money, they'd shut it down. EA does not seem particularly caring of it's userbase or it's studios, I doubt they'd keep the game live for sentimental reasons...
 
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19. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 30, 2013, 20:26 NKD
 
Julio wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 17:20:
Rattlehead wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 15:34:
I like this game..how do you respond to that?
Good for you, just spend lots more cash because EA needs it.

NKD wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 13:40:
That would take ages to pay back, and that's not how EA does business.

EA has lost close to $800 million in the last four years, and they've won the worst company award back to back. That's how they do business.

http://www.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:EA&fstype=ii&ei=6Z_QUfjmJLK80AGaaA




Yep. They aren't in a position to be running an MMO that may never pay off/ If it wasn't already in the black or was going to be soon, they'd kill the project, shutter Bioware Austin, and reallocate the staff to a more profitable project.
 
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18. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 30, 2013, 19:44 DarkCntry
 
Julio wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 17:20:
EA has lost close to $800 million in the last four years, and they've won the worst company award back to back. That's how they do business.

$800m in operating costs is far different than $500m in a single project...

As for the 'worst company' award, it was an internet poll which already invalidates itself.
 
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17. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 30, 2013, 17:20 Julio
 
Rattlehead wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 15:34:
I like this game..how do you respond to that?
Good for you, just spend lots more cash because EA needs it.

NKD wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 13:40:
That would take ages to pay back, and that's not how EA does business.

EA has lost close to $800 million in the last four years, and they've won the worst company award back to back. That's how they do business.

http://www.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:EA&fstype=ii&ei=6Z_QUfjmJLK80AGaaA



 
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16. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 30, 2013, 15:34 Rattlehead
 
I like this game..how do you respond to that?  
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15. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 30, 2013, 13:40 NKD
 
HorrorScope wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 11:06:
NKD wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 06:32:
Julio wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 06:15:
You guys haven't included marketing costs for the game. And no ongoing costs for the first 11 months? Development costs are only part of the equation. Your link is for development costs only.

Here's a full all-in estimate...

500 million

Not to mention the sub revenue estimates I gave you we're the most they could possibly have gotten.

None of us know for sure, but I'm sure if the game was profitable they would have not gone to F2P and stayed with their subscription model. Or got rid of most of the senior guys involved with this fiasco.

I've been through your link 2 or 3 times and I don't see any $500 million figure.

Not that I want a pony in this race, but here it was "“I think it’s safe to say that the total all-in investment in ‘Star Wars’ is probably approaching half a billion dollars,” Creutz says."

Ah. Yeah, smells like one of those Pachter-like wild guessers. If EA was saying the game would be acceptably profitable at 500k subs, then it didn't cost them half a bill. That would take ages to pay back, and that's not how EA does business.
 
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14. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 30, 2013, 11:06 HorrorScope
 
NKD wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 06:32:
Julio wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 06:15:
You guys haven't included marketing costs for the game. And no ongoing costs for the first 11 months? Development costs are only part of the equation. Your link is for development costs only.

Here's a full all-in estimate...

500 million

Not to mention the sub revenue estimates I gave you we're the most they could possibly have gotten.

None of us know for sure, but I'm sure if the game was profitable they would have not gone to F2P and stayed with their subscription model. Or got rid of most of the senior guys involved with this fiasco.

I've been through your link 2 or 3 times and I don't see any $500 million figure.

Not that I want a pony in this race, but here it was "“I think it’s safe to say that the total all-in investment in ‘Star Wars’ is probably approaching half a billion dollars,” Creutz says."
 
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13. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 30, 2013, 06:32 NKD
 
Julio wrote on Jun 30, 2013, 06:15:
You guys haven't included marketing costs for the game. And no ongoing costs for the first 11 months? Development costs are only part of the equation. Your link is for development costs only.

Here's a full all-in estimate...

500 million

Not to mention the sub revenue estimates I gave you we're the most they could possibly have gotten.

None of us know for sure, but I'm sure if the game was profitable they would have not gone to F2P and stayed with their subscription model. Or got rid of most of the senior guys involved with this fiasco.

I've been through your link 2 or 3 times and I don't see any $500 million figure.
 
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If you don't like where gaming is heading, stop giving your money to the people who are taking it in that direction.
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12. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 30, 2013, 06:15 Julio
 
You guys haven't included marketing costs for the game. And no ongoing costs for the first 11 months? Development costs are only part of the equation. Your link is for development costs only.

Here's a full all-in estimate...

500 million

Not to mention the sub revenue estimates I gave you we're the most they could possibly have gotten.

None of us know for sure, but I'm sure if the game was profitable they would have not gone to F2P and stayed with their subscription model. Or got rid of most of the senior guys involved with this fiasco.

This comment was edited on Jun 30, 2013, 06:29.
 
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11. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 29, 2013, 22:16 HeadWound
 
Julio wrote on Jun 29, 2013, 21:13:

Feel free to google the numbers, they're easy to find.

$500+ million invested in the game.
Peak subscriber base 1.7 million. So say $40/copy = $68 million revenue

Let's say they managed to get all those subscribers to pay every month for the 11 months it was a subscription model..another $281 million revenue (and realistically they probably got a fraction of that).

So...
-$500 million + $68 million +$281 million = -$151 million and it's probably worse than that. Add whatever they're making from F2P minus development costs to switch to F2P and costs since the changeover.

They've lost at least $100 million, probably more.

first google result I found

According to my math, the have made at least $200 million (I used your math and substituted the 200 in that article for your 500)
 
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10. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 29, 2013, 21:34 NKD
 
Julio wrote on Jun 29, 2013, 21:13:

Feel free to google the numbers, they're easy to find.

$500+ million invested in the game.

Something showing up on Google doesn't make it true. Telling us to Google for someones outsider guesses or some debunked low level employee's personal blog isn't helpful to the discussion.

If you think EA spent $500 million on TOR, you're bonkers. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and you don't have it. The only official word we have to go on is that they were aiming to make the game profitable at 500,000 subs. They had more than that for quite some time. And even in F2P, they still have around 500,000 subs, plus whatever F2P model makes them.
 
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9. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 29, 2013, 21:13 Julio
 
CJ_Parker wrote on Jun 29, 2013, 19:31:
Julio wrote on Jun 29, 2013, 19:22:
I'm sure it's making more money than it costs to run the servers, but it's probably still close to 100 million down the drain. I'm sure they didn't recoup development and marketing costs.

OK then let's hear your detailed analysis on how this game ended up 100M in the hole. Since you're so sure about it it should be easy enough so go right ahead...

Feel free to google the numbers, they're easy to find.

$500+ million invested in the game.
Peak subscriber base 1.7 million. So say $40/copy = $68 million revenue

Let's say they managed to get all those subscribers to pay every month for the 11 months it was a subscription model..another $281 million revenue (and realistically they probably got a fraction of that).

So...
-$500 million + $68 million +$281 million = -$151 million and it's probably worse than that. Add whatever they're making from F2P minus development costs to switch to F2P and costs since the changeover.

They've lost at least $100 million, probably more.
 
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8. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 29, 2013, 21:12 Wash Washburne
 
This report is little bit outdated, but I can only assume that the numbers of players didn't really go up that much since the report was published:

Thx to eurogamer.net

By Fred Dutton Published Monday, 7 May 2012


Star Wars: The Old Republic currently has 1.3 million active subscribers, publisher EA has announced.

That's a sizable drop on the 1.7 million reported in February.

The figure comes out of its annual financial report, released earlier today, which saw the publisher boast net annual income of $76 million, compared to a loss of $276 million this time last year.

Total revenue for the fiscal year came in at $4.14 billion, up from $3.59 billion 12 months ago.

EA noted "strong results" for traditional boxed products such as Mass Effect 3, SSX and Kingdoms of Amalur, but put the focus squarely on digital.

FIFA 12 had its best year ever, raking in $108 million in downloads and microtransactions, while full game downloads were up 76 per cent year-on-year, contributing $60 million to its coffers over the last three months. Meanwhile, EA's Play4Free brand is currently bringing in $2 million a month.

Total digital revenue for the year was $1.2 billion, up 42 per cent.

Battlefield 3 is still going great guns too - 6.3 million gamers logged in during March alone.

"We are proud to report a strong quarter and a fiscal year highlighted with $1.2 billion of digital revenue," commented CEO John Riccitiello.

"In the coming year, we break away from the pack, with a very different profile than the traditional game companies and capabilities that none of our new digital competitors can match."

Elsewhere in its report, EA revealed plans to invest $80 million over the next year "in development of games for Gen4 console systems."



 
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7. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 29, 2013, 19:31 CJ_Parker
 
Julio wrote on Jun 29, 2013, 19:22:
I'm sure it's making more money than it costs to run the servers, but it's probably still close to 100 million down the drain. I'm sure they didn't recoup development and marketing costs.

OK then let's hear your detailed analysis on how this game ended up 100M in the hole. Since you're so sure about it it should be easy enough so go right ahead...
 
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6. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 29, 2013, 19:22 Julio
 
NKD wrote on Jun 29, 2013, 19:04:
Techie714 © wrote on Jun 29, 2013, 17:01:
100+ Million down the drain....

Not saying it's a good game, but it's making money or it wouldn't be running. EA isn't exactly known for it's grand charity work in keeping unprofitable games running.

I'm sure it's making more money than it costs to run the servers, but it's probably still close to 100 million down the drain. I'm sure they didn't recoup development and marketing costs.
 
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5. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 29, 2013, 19:04 NKD
 
Techie714 © wrote on Jun 29, 2013, 17:01:
100+ Million down the drain....

Your comment seems to imply that the game has been cancelled. Given that the game is profitable and releasing new content, I'm not sure what you're getting at. Not saying it's a good game, but it's making money or it wouldn't be running. EA isn't exactly known for it's grand charity work in keeping unprofitable games running.
 
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4. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 29, 2013, 18:05 Wash Washburne
 
The best part of almost any recent SW games are the CGI movies, anything else pass that is just waste of time. Gimme SW CGI series and I'll be a happy camper, but wait now the Disney owns the rights, we might actually see something done there and SW:Rebels is already in works.  
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3. Re: Star Wars: The Old Republic PTR Patch Jun 29, 2013, 17:01 Techie714 ©
 
100+ Million down the drain....  
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