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Metro: Last Light HUD "Fix" Inbound

The Steam Forums have an update from Professor Pew, spokesperson for 4A Games, and esteemed doctor of pew-pew, who explains the situation regarding the locked field of view in Metro: Last Light, their new shooter sequel (thanks Strategy Informer). It turns out the problem is that allowing adjustable FOV would conflict with their 3D HUD (which arguably means the HUD should have been reworked, rather than FOV locked). They are contemplating their options for a long term fix, and in the meantime are planning a game update "in the next few days" to allow players to adjust the FOV by directly editing CFG files, though this will indeed mess with the HUD. Here's word:

We're aware the community have been asking for a 'Field of View' slider for Metro: Last Light. Unfortunately, this was not as simple a thing to implement as it might appear!

The main reason for maintaining a fixed FOV is because we have 3D elements like the watch and weapon ammo that need to remain visible.

In addition, all the game's first-person cut scenes and cinematics and each and every animation involving Artyom's hands - idle weapon animations, reloads, ladder climbing, melee attacks etc, - were created assuming the same, fixed field of view.

Changing the FOV would break all the cut-scenes and animations - you would be able to see inside Artyom's arms, or they would appear to float in the air in front of you. Or worse.

We had considered offering three FOV pre-sets, but this would still require significant work to re-do every animation, adjust the HUD and UI and other seemingly small but incredibly time consuming tasks.

Even with a wider but still fixed field of view, Artyom's hands would look too far away. We know - we tried.

Game performance is also tied to FOV - the amount of geometric detail we put in each scene has been partly determined by this set FOV, and setting a wider FOV would have a performance impact.

We understand this issue is important to many people, and we have been looking at possible solutions.

In the immediate term - the next title update, due in the next few days will allow you to directly change the FOV in the .cfg files.

This may well trigger a number of issues listed above - you have been warned!

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72 Replies. 4 pages. Viewing page 2.
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52. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 18:45 shihonage
 
Solution to all problems: design the game with fixed FOV of 90.

90 is the FOV that doesn't cause motion sickness.

This is not as good as having an FOV slider, but a fuckton better than a fixed low FOV.
 
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51. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 18:34 RollinThundr
 
nin wrote on May 15, 2013, 14:17:
Yakubs wrote on May 15, 2013, 14:14:
RollinThundr wrote on May 15, 2013, 13:55:
Techie714 wrote on May 15, 2013, 11:35:
You people bitch so much about trivial things...Wait this is Blues..Nevermind..lol

No that's pretty spot on. Whiniest group of gamers on the internet.

Yeah, let's use the comments section on this news post ABOUT THE FOV to talk about... uh... how super cool and fun the game is la di da la di da?


Let's be clear: no tears will be shed when rollin leaves...


lol aww did I hurt your wittle feelings nin? For someone so concerned with people trolling, you sure do your fair share. Just sayin.
 
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50. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 18:24 Rhialto
 
Darks wrote on May 15, 2013, 10:33:
I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm sick and tired of 3D as a whole.

I'm a huge fan of 3D, played Metro 2033 in 3D and enjoyed it. I play all my games in 3D. I'm mostly sick of people saying 3D is not welcome. Some don't like it, fine, some enjoy it.
 
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49. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 18:11 Overon
 
The statement made suggests bad design decisions. However this statement is stupid:
Game performance is also tied to FOV - the amount of geometric detail we put in each scene has been partly determined by this set FOV, and setting a wider FOV would have a performance impact.
A reason for no FOV is because can lower performance. I can make a similar statement by parallel reasoning: "We did not include AA because AA lowers performance."

Also I have seen people complain of shadows flickering when moving and "screen door" effect when shining the flash light at some surfaces. It's blatantly obvious how unpolished the game is.
http://kzn-clan.nl/imgup2/GF
http://i.imgur.com/QAW0Xe4.jpg

This comment was edited on May 15, 2013, 18:34.
 
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48. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 17:55 Asmo
 
MajorD wrote on May 15, 2013, 10:28:
Interesting, as it was never an issue with Metro 2033. Changing FOV from the 45 (default) to 60 (optimum - any higher looked ridiculous) in Metro 2033 did not cause any issues that I can recall.

Is it due to enhancements to the graphics engine, or the updated '3D' HUD, or both? Regardless, we can chock it up to poor design/forethought and consolitis.


2033 had one hell of a bug for surround/eyefin users. Blow out to 3 screens and your horizontal mouse sensitivity was 3x more than the vertical (both in menu and in game) making it completely unplayable.

There is still some of this in Last Light (despite a "Way it's meant to be played" development and nVidia claiming it's fully compatible with surround/3d surround) which is why I've shelved it for now.

I don't have anyone to blame but myself for my lack of impulse control, but I'm sick and tired of donating money (albeit at GMG's very nice price) to companies for stuff that should work properly but doesn't...
 
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47. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 17:25 Acleacius
 
Ray Ban wrote on May 15, 2013, 16:16:
Jason Rubin on 4A Games


I think they deserve a break ...
Wow, that's shocking and really wish they would have been honest about it. It's not like we lack empathy, we are reacting to the information in the story, the information THEY gave us. There's nothing wrong with honesty, all 4A had to do was be honest about it.

"We lost heating in our small office and only have cushionless steel chairs. Also one of our guys lost his apartment to a mafia type who drove up with 3 armored vehicles and gave him an ultimatum to get out in 24 hours. We need another week or two to get PC FOV correct."

See ^^^^^^^...people would have probably started sending them money.


@HoSpanky
You can say "they should just make it right", but if they have to actually rework animations for every possible FOV setting....that's unrealistic.
That's overly broad and incorrect, each animation for every possible FOV is not how it's done.
 
The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders.That is easy.All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger.It works the same way in any country.
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46. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 17:21 MajorD
 
.

This comment was edited on May 15, 2013, 17:27.
 
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45. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 17:12 DangerDog
 
Ray Ban wrote on May 15, 2013, 16:16:
Jason Rubin on 4A Games


I think they deserve a break ...

Nope, again this didn't fly at them out of left field. All these smart, hard working guys couldn't even reflect on the fact that the previous game had FOV issues on the PC?

If you care about the art of making games then you have to care about more than the final product.

not so much on the PC apparently.
 
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44. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 17:10 MajorD
 
SpectralMeat wrote on May 15, 2013, 14:22:
nin wrote on May 15, 2013, 14:17:
Yakubs wrote on May 15, 2013, 14:14:
RollinThundr wrote on May 15, 2013, 13:55:
Techie714 wrote on May 15, 2013, 11:35:
You people bitch so much about trivial things...Wait this is Blues..Nevermind..lol

No that's pretty spot on. Whiniest group of gamers on the internet.

Yeah, let's use the comments section on this news post ABOUT THE FOV to talk about... uh... how super cool and fun the game is la di da la di da?


Let's be clear: no tears will be shed when rollin leaves...

At least he doesn't contribute to the whining, oh wait

NICE! LOL! Best post yet.
 
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43. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 17:02 TheEmissary
 
Parias wrote on May 15, 2013, 16:59:
TheEmissary wrote on May 15, 2013, 16:56:
The response to the FOV question by the dev is a cop-out because all they would had to do was put a disclaimer in the ini file or in the menu saying it could affect the performance. Let people tailor the performance for their own systems.

Well, there's the bit about how changing the FOV will break a lot of the first person animation sequences in the game too (i.e. seeing through your own arms, etc), but I agree - this should have been included with the release with a disclaimer.

At least they recognize the issue and are working to add the functionality now though.

It seems questionable that they can't find a way to decouple the animations from the FOV. Plenty of PC games are able to have adjustable FOV without breaking the game. Some games have different FOV for different things like a World Fov and a view model FOV and ones for the cinematics. So it also doesn't have to be an all or nothing change.

Usually when they say things like this it generally means they gave no thought at all to it early in development.
 
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42. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 16:59 Parias
 
TheEmissary wrote on May 15, 2013, 16:56:
The response to the FOV question by the dev is a cop-out because all they would had to do was put a disclaimer in the ini file or in the menu saying it could affect the performance. Let people tailor the performance for their own systems.

Well, there's the bit about how changing the FOV will break a lot of the first person animation sequences in the game too (i.e. seeing through your own arms, etc), but I agree - this should have been included with the release with a disclaimer.

At least they recognize the issue and are working to add the functionality now though.
 
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41. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 16:56 TheEmissary
 
Techie714 wrote on May 15, 2013, 11:35:
You people bitch so much about trivial things...Wait this is Blues..Nevermind..lol

Just like the person mentioned that 3D movies can make people physically ill the same can be said about FOV. Not everyone has the same setups or playing the games at the same distances and for that reason is why we need options. There are plenty of in-depth explanations about how FOV affects people. This is really no different than color blind people asking for a mode for them.

The response to the FOV question by the dev is a cop-out because all they would had to do was put a disclaimer in the ini file or in the menu saying it could affect the performance. Let people tailor the performance for their own systems.
 
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40. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 16:24 NKD
 
Ray Ban wrote on May 15, 2013, 16:16:
Jason Rubin on 4A Games


I think they deserve a break ...

Jesus christ, they literally had to smuggle in hardware to develop on?
 
Avatar 43041
 
If you don't like where gaming is heading, stop giving your money to the people who are taking it in that direction.
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39. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 16:16 Ray Ban
 
Jason Rubin on 4A Games


I think they deserve a break ...
 
"The future's so bright I gotta wear shades!"
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38. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 15:52 necrosis
 
HoSpanky wrote on May 15, 2013, 15:10:
Honestly, I'm all for configurable settings, but in a game where they built the character model/animations around a specific FOV...I can understand why they can't easily offer a slider.

You can say "they should just make it right", but if they have to actually rework animations for every possible FOV setting....that's unrealistic. They made the decision to go with in-world objects as your HUD, not magic floating indicator bars. That in itself is an impressive amount of effort, as you can SEE the bullets left in your clip. Most games would go for the easy option of an opaque clip and a little counter in the corner, and no one would cry about it. Altering EVERY ANIMATION your character or supporting ones can make simply to allow some players to widen the view is truly absurd. I don't hear people complaining that their real-world car of choice doesn't get wider just because they're fatter. I do think they should offer a demo so people can see what they'd be getting into prior to dropping fifty bucks or so on it.

They're trying something different. I applaud them for it, even if it makes a percentage of their customers ill from it (thank god, I don't have that issue). They're going to offer an option to alter the FOV, but it may not look right. That's fair, and Saluk made a good point that cutscenes should stick to the original FOV. If those cutscenes are in-game and don't pull you out of your location, however, it will also look odd and jarring at the beginning/end of said scenes.

While I prefer my games on PC, I do manage to have realistic expectations from games. I expect them to work, be fairly crash-free, and have proper controls. Expecting titanic changes from the versions aimed at a FAR less finicky crowd is again, absurd.

No one on here likes Justin Bieber, right? He's not going to change. There are millions of people willing to give him money to be what he is, why should he waste ANY part of his time worrying about those who complain about him? He should't. Developers who pay ANY attention to the PC crowd shouldn't be screamed at. Unless, of course, your ACTUAL GOAL is to have no games to play. If everything I presented to someone was scoffed at for something they didn't like, I'd STOP GIVING THEM ANYTHING.

If developers paid any attention to the forums on this site, they'd give up entirely on the platform. I GUARANTEE there isn't ONE SINGLE GODDAMN GAME that's been posted about on here that you guys didn't bitch and moan about over this perceived missing feature or that design decision. PLEASE, post YOUR games you have made, and see how this community treats you. They will shit all over ANYTHING you have made. Even if playing your game CURED CANCER, they'll complain that it didn't have high-res enough textures.
They made a decision to to bow to consoles then expect PC users to 'just deal with it' yet still shell out the same money when they are getting less service. How can you agree with that?

If it is hard to change the FOV because of models then they should not have used those models in the first place! They screwed up. I don't care how hard it is to fix. They dug their own hole and need to make things right.

And you think just because 'Developers who pay ANY attention to the PC crowd' get off scott free? They should not be screamed at? We should be ecstatic like little Timmy because he got something to eat? Gloriously grateful that we even get games? What stupid shit is this? I am to be happy I got something to eat even if its burnt to a crisp toast. SHUT UP AND EAT IT! YOU GOT SOMETHING DIDN'T YOU!

People are bitching because we were not treated like shit before. Now we are for no damned reason. Features that NEED to be part of PC games are being dropped left and right. If we do not voice these issues things will just continue to get worse and worse. You think PC gamers shit on everything? Guess what? We don't. We shit on games when the developers shit on us.
 
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37. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 15:39 DangerDog
 
HoSpanky, how long have you worked for 4A Games and why did you fuck this up when making the game?

Every time this issue comes up the devs want to pretend like they've been blindsided by something that nobody in the history of making games has ever thought of.

If you're going to be mutiplatform then you need to deal with these issues early on, stop pumping out lazy console ports and then think you can PR your way out of it.
 
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36. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 15:38 Mad Max RW
 
It wouldn't be Blue's News without a handful of ignorant white knighting apologists.  
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35. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 15:10 HoSpanky
 
Honestly, I'm all for configurable settings, but in a game where they built the character model/animations around a specific FOV...I can understand why they can't easily offer a slider.

You can say "they should just make it right", but if they have to actually rework animations for every possible FOV setting....that's unrealistic. They made the decision to go with in-world objects as your HUD, not magic floating indicator bars. That in itself is an impressive amount of effort, as you can SEE the bullets left in your clip. Most games would go for the easy option of an opaque clip and a little counter in the corner, and no one would cry about it. Altering EVERY ANIMATION your character or supporting ones can make simply to allow some players to widen the view is truly absurd. I don't hear people complaining that their real-world car of choice doesn't get wider just because they're fatter. I do think they should offer a demo so people can see what they'd be getting into prior to dropping fifty bucks or so on it.

They're trying something different. I applaud them for it, even if it makes a percentage of their customers ill from it (thank god, I don't have that issue). They're going to offer an option to alter the FOV, but it may not look right. That's fair, and Saluk made a good point that cutscenes should stick to the original FOV. If those cutscenes are in-game and don't pull you out of your location, however, it will also look odd and jarring at the beginning/end of said scenes.

While I prefer my games on PC, I do manage to have realistic expectations from games. I expect them to work, be fairly crash-free, and have proper controls. Expecting titanic changes from the versions aimed at a FAR less finicky crowd is again, absurd.

No one on here likes Justin Bieber, right? He's not going to change. There are millions of people willing to give him money to be what he is, why should he waste ANY part of his time worrying about those who complain about him? He should't. Developers who pay ANY attention to the PC crowd shouldn't be screamed at. Unless, of course, your ACTUAL GOAL is to have no games to play. If everything I presented to someone was scoffed at for something they didn't like, I'd STOP GIVING THEM ANYTHING.

If developers paid any attention to the forums on this site, they'd give up entirely on the platform. I GUARANTEE there isn't ONE SINGLE GODDAMN GAME that's been posted about on here that you guys didn't bitch and moan about over this perceived missing feature or that design decision. PLEASE, post YOUR games you have made, and see how this community treats you. They will shit all over ANYTHING you have made. Even if playing your game CURED CANCER, they'll complain that it didn't have high-res enough textures.
 
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34. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 14:32 saluk
 
#1 - keep cutscenes in the old fixed FOV
#2 - increasing the FOV might make hud elements smaller/harder to read, but not disappear
#3 - render scene in user FOV, render hud second in fixed FOV
#4 - we know when we increase FOV it makes game perform worse. But we are on PCS. You let us toggle AA on (which hurts performance much worse than FOV) but wont let us increase the horizontal view range because???

When you make a ps3 version, I'm sure you adjust the textures and hard drive streaming to better support that platform. For the xbox version you integrate the xbox live and achievements in a slightly different way than ps3. And for each, you make sure that the control scheme works according to what the audience of that platform expects. You dont just shove some code on the box, release it, and hope it works.

When you release your game on the pc, TARGET THE F-ING PLATFORM. It's not that hard. PC users need a higher fov, because their face is closer to the screen. PC users need more configuration ability, because you do not know what setup the players will have. This isn't something that's nice to have. It's an important feature of the platform. Do your job.
 
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33. Re: Metro: Last Light HUD May 15, 2013, 14:22 SpectralMeat
 
nin wrote on May 15, 2013, 14:17:
Yakubs wrote on May 15, 2013, 14:14:
RollinThundr wrote on May 15, 2013, 13:55:
Techie714 wrote on May 15, 2013, 11:35:
You people bitch so much about trivial things...Wait this is Blues..Nevermind..lol

No that's pretty spot on. Whiniest group of gamers on the internet.

Yeah, let's use the comments section on this news post ABOUT THE FOV to talk about... uh... how super cool and fun the game is la di da la di da?


Let's be clear: no tears will be shed when rollin leaves...

At least he doesn't contribute to the whining, oh wait
 
Avatar 14225
 
Steam: SpectralMeat
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