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Out of the Blue

Sad about Hostess Brands closing, since it seems to be the result of an insoluble labor conflict, and while strikes often result in threats that they will result in the closure of a company, that rarely seems to actually happen as it has in this case. I find it interesting how many people are going all Tallahassee over the pending Twinkie shortage, however, as they are the poster child for crappy junk food, and I don't know anyone who has eaten one in recent memory, much less actually savors them (labor strife aside, I think if everyone saddened by this actually bought Twinkies, Hostess would be fine). In my opinion, Hostess only ever made one really good product, which was their fruit pies, which I have not seen in a store in over a decade if not longer. I assumed they stopped making them, but I see them on eBay at seemingly exorbitant prices, so I'm not sure if that's due to the Hostess closure, or perhaps they are working off old stock, since these babies are half preservatives anyway (I think it's the latter, as the labels all seem to feature Fruit Pie the Magician, and Wikipedia says he was removed from the packaging in 2006).

Fruity Links: Thanks Ant and Acleacius.
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38 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
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38. Re: More Big Picture Details Nov 18, 2012, 23:39 xXBatmanXx
 
nin wrote on Nov 18, 2012, 13:34:
TangledThorns wrote on Nov 18, 2012, 13:33:
After I read the news Friday morning I went to the supermarket during my lunch break and bought nine boxes of Twinkies, six original and three chocolate filled. I'm holding on to them till they are in demand by collectors many years from now.

I'm not sure where I saw it, but there was a picture of a guy that held onto a twinky for like 40 years. Even sealed in the package, it looked nasty.


Sell them ASAP. Announcement coming soon....
 
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37. Re: More Big Picture Details Nov 18, 2012, 18:31 HorrorScope
 
PHJF wrote on Nov 18, 2012, 12:23:
But face it they really make garbage anyway and buyers overall are much smarter today then yesteryear on what these high sugar-carb bombs do and it adds up

hahaha!

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/18/us-obesity-us-idUSBRE88H0RA20120918

Yeah and there are still millions eating better to. Some do listen. Before everyone ate sweets and smoked like no one's business.
 
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36. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 18, 2012, 16:31 Fantaz
 
Come to Canada for the Twinkies!  
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35. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 18, 2012, 13:40 1badmf
 
Prez wrote on Nov 18, 2012, 07:50:
The union could have worked for free, and I bet Hostess still would have gone bankrupt eventually.

By the same token, everyone in the boardroom could have taken a 99.9999% pay cut and it seems likely the company would still have gone bankrupt unless something was fundamentally and drastically changed. That doesn't make the cronyism and the obscene self-serving pay increases to the corporate fat cats any less despicable, or the situation of the screwed-yet-again little guy any less sad, but that's how it seems.
they did take such paycut - after the new CEO found out about the raises he slashed the salaries of the top 4 execs to $1 for the year. i think the causes of this bankruptcy are far more complex than anyone here realizes, but as a teamster myself, i have no sympathy for the leadership of that union that put their pride above the jobs of 18,000 workers.
 
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34. Re: More Big Picture Details Nov 18, 2012, 13:34 nin
 
TangledThorns wrote on Nov 18, 2012, 13:33:
After I read the news Friday morning I went to the supermarket during my lunch break and bought nine boxes of Twinkies, six original and three chocolate filled. I'm holding on to them till they are in demand by collectors many years from now.

I'm not sure where I saw it, but there was a picture of a guy that held onto a twinky for like 40 years. Even sealed in the package, it looked nasty.

 
http://store.nin.com/index.php?cPath=10
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33. Re: More Big Picture Details Nov 18, 2012, 13:33 TangledThorns
 
After I read the news Friday morning I went to the supermarket during my lunch break and bought nine boxes of Twinkies, six original and three chocolate filled. I'm holding on to them till they are in demand by collectors many years from now.  
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32. Re: More Big Picture Details Nov 18, 2012, 12:23 PHJF
 
But face it they really make garbage anyway and buyers overall are much smarter today then yesteryear on what these high sugar-carb bombs do and it adds up

hahaha!

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/18/us-obesity-us-idUSBRE88H0RA20120918
 
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Steam + PSN: PHJF
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31. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 18, 2012, 12:15 xXBatmanXx
 
Picks:

BUF (WIN), GB, ATL, TB, DAL, PHI, JETS, STRIPED PUSSY, HOU, NE, NO, SD, BAL, SF
 
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30. Re: More Big Picture Details Nov 18, 2012, 11:30 HorrorScope
 
Dades wrote on Nov 17, 2012, 15:01:
MajorD wrote on Nov 17, 2012, 14:32:
This is a real shame.

I have heard & read more stories of business having to shutdown due to union strikes. So, in the middle of a recession, with unemployment at an all time high, they'll go on strike for more money and better benefits, which the companies simply can not afford as it is, because they are barely sustaining in the current state of the economy, and will eventually lead to the companies having to shutdown their operations. So what have they gained? //Shakes head….

Unions 'might' still have their place in various sectors, but definitely not all anymore. In this day and age they aren't as isolated as they once were, and have definitely become more volatile.

That's what happens with some unions but many corporations know that public apathy towards unions is at an all time high and use that to their advantage. That's not what happened to Hostess anyway, they asked the unions to take a third major concession in 5 years and many of the workers voted against it because they could not afford to take another pay cut. These guys were not auto workers without a high school education making 80k, demanding raises.

There are a lot of markets that have working conditions that practically require unions to avoid corporate abuse but thanks to global trade many companies know they can get chinese workers to do it without that concern.

- DADES - This is a signature of my name, enjoy!

Yeah Hostess filed for bankruptcy protection twice int the last decade, this was coming. But face it they really make garbage anyway and buyers overall are much smarter today then yesteryear on what these high sugar-carb bombs do and it adds up. Sure it was tasty garbage, but being in the doughnut business is not a great thing to be in right now.

But more on point, it is very very hard to take pay cuts, it has a terrible ripple affect. You budget just like companies and when you are making less and then asked again to make even less yet. Things start breaking and what do you do? Go into a bunker mode, spending less, which is the spiral, Hostess and everyone else sells less and less. Continue to cut the middle class consumer and will buy less.

Sometimes to me to fix things, you just need to circulate a bit more money, consumers will spend and that is what makes it all work. Not tighten up, loosen up.
 
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29. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 18, 2012, 07:50 Prez
 
The union could have worked for free, and I bet Hostess still would have gone bankrupt eventually.

By the same token, everyone in the boardroom could have taken a 99.9999% pay cut and it seems likely the company would still have gone bankrupt unless something was fundamentally and drastically changed. That doesn't make the cronyism and the obscene self-serving pay increases to the corporate fat cats any less despicable, or the situation of the screwed-yet-again little guy any less sad, but that's how it seems.
 
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“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.”
- Mahatma Gandhi
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28. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 18, 2012, 07:30 Julio
 
Bhruic wrote on Nov 18, 2012, 06:03:
Read this for details of the management salary increases.

That's exactly the way it works in these situations. The guys at the top level of the company raise their salaries to crazy levels, and put everyone they know on the payroll.

Then cut salaries/benefits/pensions for everyone below that top tier. Eventually driving the business into the ground.

The union could have worked for free, and I bet Hostess still would have gone bankrupt eventually.
 
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27. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 18, 2012, 06:03 Bhruic
 
PropheT wrote on Nov 17, 2012, 20:43:
They did, but the reality is that they held out for a bigger payday for the workers on a company that was going under because of labor costs. The union chose no jobs at all over the deal that was being offered them, so the idea that the union was protecting those people's jobs is kind of out the window. They were in a position to negotiate raises or concessions by the company to give back to the workers in the event of a return to profitability, but instead this is what happened.

The idea that management was negotiating in good faith is laughable. Hostess got bought by a hedgefund (well, two actually), loaded up the company with debt, paid out massive increases in salary to management while cutting salaries for the workers, and then declared bankruptcy when the workers wouldn't agree to even more cuts.

Read this for details of the management salary increases.

There are numerous examples of unions being the "bad guys", and in general I find they do as much harm as good, but this is definitely not one of those times.
 
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26. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 18, 2012, 05:49 Prez
 
However most haven't been a mouthpiece for the worker in some time and is no better, hell often worse, than the businesses they try to vilify.

Totally agree. To reiterate, when I say "the union is not the issue in this case", I was talking the majority of its 18000 some-odd members. The "bad guys" are a select few: the corporate fat cats who put their own personal gain above the good of the employee and company (not everyone in management or even the boardroom), and the reprehensible union bosses, who, as you say, act like they speak in solidarity for the employees at large when they do nothing of the sort and mostly act in their own interests.
 
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“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.”
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25. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 18, 2012, 03:13 Dades
 
ChandlerL wrote on Nov 18, 2012, 02:20:
The baker's union just made the decision for 18,000 people-- most of whom were not part of that union.

Unions began life as a beacon of hope for an industrializing young nation. However most haven't been a mouthpiece for the worker in some time and is no better, hell often worse, than the businesses they try to vilify.

The union is the one being vilified here and they did the only possible thing they could. The severity of the latest concession that Hostess asked for would have put many of the bakers near the poverty line. The union doesn't collect any dues from members of a defunct company, if there was another option they would have taken it but Hostess didn't give any ground. The workers had already given major concessions while the executives actually gave themselves huge salary bumps and bonuses while the company struggled. But please don't let facts get in the way of a union rant probably brought on by misconceptions in the media who are owned by corporations who hate unions.
 
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24. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 18, 2012, 02:20 ChandlerL
 
Prez wrote on Nov 17, 2012, 15:10:
I am vehemently anti-union because of some really ugly personal history with them, but Cutter is right that the union is not the issue in this case. These people have been asked to take cut after cut - how they continue to eek out a living is beyond me.

So folks may continue feeling "right" while 18,000 people get to try and eek out that living on their unemployment checks.

The baker's union just made the decision for 18,000 people-- most of whom were not part of that union.

Unions began life as a beacon of hope for an industrializing young nation. However most haven't been a mouthpiece for the worker in some time and is no better, hell often worse, than the businesses they try to vilify.

This comment was edited on Nov 18, 2012, 02:27.
 
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23. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 18, 2012, 00:00 BobBob
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twinkie_defense  
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22. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 17, 2012, 20:43 PropheT
 
xXBatmanXx wrote on Nov 17, 2012, 20:05:
I feel bad for those in the Union. They have made MAJOR concessions in the prior years, and the media isn't picking up on that. They are very anti-union. Sad. Very sad.

They did, but the reality is that they held out for a bigger payday for the workers on a company that was going under because of labor costs. The union chose no jobs at all over the deal that was being offered them, so the idea that the union was protecting those people's jobs is kind of out the window. They were in a position to negotiate raises or concessions by the company to give back to the workers in the event of a return to profitability, but instead this is what happened.

On a side note,fruit pies are all over here, I still eat them every now and then. I didn't even think of them until seeing the mention here, I'm going to miss those more than Twinkies or the cupcakes

 
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21. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 17, 2012, 20:17 xXBatmanXx
 
nin wrote on Nov 17, 2012, 20:14:
They will be back soon.

I hope you're right. Although I'm not sure which I fear more: them not returning, or someone else buying them and tweaking the recipe enough that they're not as good as they used to be.


True, but lets be honest, Twinkies don't taste the same.
 
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20. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 17, 2012, 20:17 xXBatmanXx
 
If anyone is looking to upgrade:

MicroCenter: Intel Core i5 2500K 3.3GHz LGA 1155 Boxed Processor $100

Can overclock the hell outta that thing. I am running 4.5 right now with no heat.
 
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19. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 17, 2012, 20:14 nin
 
They will be back soon.

I hope you're right. Although I'm not sure which I fear more: them not returning, or someone else buying them and tweaking the recipe enough that they're not as good as they used to be.

 
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