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Out of the Blue

Well today is Election Day here in the U.S., our annual opportunity to practice democracy (insert joke here about continuing to practice until we get it right). Here's hoping all those who are registered get out and vote, and that the process proceeds smoothly.

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156. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:55 PHJF
 
There are already millions of disenfranchised Americans... they're called people with criminal convictions.

There definitely should be higher standards for voters. My grandmother, for instance, is racist. She wouldn't vote for Obama on the sole fact of his being black. She should absolutely, positively, NOT be allowed to vote. In this day and age every citizen pretty much has access to tools to educate themselves and stay modestly informed... but a startling amount choose not to. I don't want uninformed bigots to have any say in a national election.

And the electoral college was put into place because college voters literally had to represent their constituents. This was the days before so much as the electric telegraph, when news traveled only as fast as a horse and rider could carry it. The days when a stump speech was literally a man standing on a tree stump. The electoral college was counted on to relay accurately the opinions/votes of groups of citizens to the federal government, because there was no line of communication between the two.

This comment was edited on Nov 7, 2012, 12:04.
 
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155. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:53 RollinThundr
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 11:47:
RollinThundr wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 11:12:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:58:
Prez wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:54:
Creston wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:51:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 08:14:
Lastly, fuck the popular vote. This is WHY we have an electoral college. Old, rural white men turned out in droves for Mitt. Pretty much every other demographic went Obama. Why should we cater to old, rural white men? They're uneducated, they're bigoted, and this isn't their country anymore. It belongs to the educated, mixed masses in the cities.

Uh, hello. The old, bigoted rural white man has just as much of a right to vote on a president as you do. That's called democracy, remember? It's that thing that you're always bleating about, until it does something you don't like.

Creston

Jesus Christ - I wish the ignore function also blocked people quoting the ones being ignored. I feel dumber for just having read the idiotic statement you quoted. At least it serves to validate my choice to leave him on ignore when I read utter tripe like this.

I love that he doesn't actually address this. Look at the demographics: women voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Minorities voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Under 40 voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Cities voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Graduate degrees voted overwhelmingly for Obama.

Men, over 40, and rural voted overwhelmingly for Romney. THIS is the problem with the GOP - they have been courting the wrong people. The social issues are what won this election, and it was the democrats stances.


Someone please quote this. I would love to know what he took offense to.

And when we're a bankrupt 3rd world social utopia that you idiots want, those "social issues" won't mean shit. It's not that they've been courting the wrong people, it's that the liberal indoctrination that has gone on in public schools/colleges for the last 20-30 years have produced a bunch of entitled douchebags like yourself.

3rd world social utopia? Has that happened in the last 4 years?

More importantly, were we a 3rd world social utopia under Joe McCarthy? Its the tax policy he fought for that I want to go back to.
Amazing that people call Joe McCarthy a socialist these days.

And how am I entitled? I'm arguing to raise my taxes! The entire economy is hurting because too few people make too much money. I'm certainly not in the top 0.1%, which is the number I take most offense to, but if you adjust the 1960s tax brackets for inflation my taxes are still going way up as a single man making a very nice amount of cash.


The economy is hurting because we severly overspend along with taxes being at an all time low across the board. It's not just the 1%, I realize you've bought into the whole OWS 1% bullshit, but that simply isn't the root of all evil and the reason our economy sucks.

And you wonder why I say you buy into class warfare, you keep repeating it over and over. Rob Peter to pay Paul it'll solve all our problems while we continue to spend into oblivion.
 
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154. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:47 Beamer
 
RollinThundr wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 11:12:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:58:
Prez wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:54:
Creston wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:51:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 08:14:
Lastly, fuck the popular vote. This is WHY we have an electoral college. Old, rural white men turned out in droves for Mitt. Pretty much every other demographic went Obama. Why should we cater to old, rural white men? They're uneducated, they're bigoted, and this isn't their country anymore. It belongs to the educated, mixed masses in the cities.

Uh, hello. The old, bigoted rural white man has just as much of a right to vote on a president as you do. That's called democracy, remember? It's that thing that you're always bleating about, until it does something you don't like.

Creston

Jesus Christ - I wish the ignore function also blocked people quoting the ones being ignored. I feel dumber for just having read the idiotic statement you quoted. At least it serves to validate my choice to leave him on ignore when I read utter tripe like this.

I love that he doesn't actually address this. Look at the demographics: women voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Minorities voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Under 40 voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Cities voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Graduate degrees voted overwhelmingly for Obama.

Men, over 40, and rural voted overwhelmingly for Romney. THIS is the problem with the GOP - they have been courting the wrong people. The social issues are what won this election, and it was the democrats stances.


Someone please quote this. I would love to know what he took offense to.

And when we're a bankrupt 3rd world social utopia that you idiots want, those "social issues" won't mean shit. It's not that they've been courting the wrong people, it's that the liberal indoctrination that has gone on in public schools/colleges for the last 20-30 years have produced a bunch of entitled douchebags like yourself.

3rd world social utopia? Has that happened in the last 4 years?

More importantly, were we a 3rd world social utopia under Joe McCarthy? Its the tax policy he fought for that I want to go back to.
Amazing that people call Joe McCarthy a socialist these days.

And how am I entitled? I'm arguing to raise my taxes! The entire economy is hurting because too few people make too much money. I'm certainly not in the top 0.1%, which is the number I take most offense to, but if you adjust the 1960s tax brackets for inflation my taxes are still going way up as a single man making a very nice amount of cash.

 
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153. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:47 Prez
 
Beamer's utter idiocy aside, I have to say that I don't believe the electoral college is bullshit, Creston. Yeah, the way things work now basically Ohio and Florida decide every election, but that's more a factor of deep-seated demographic differences. Without it, votes of those in smaller states would count for even less than they do now. There are counties in California and Burroughs in New York that have populations that dwarf entire states. The popular vote of these counties alone could render entire states voiceless, and ultimately wholly unrepresented on the Federal level. The difference between California's 54 college votes and RI's 4 is tiny compared to the differences in the populations. It's all about trying to ensure each state has a voice in every election, and it has worked well for its existence.

As an aside, James Madison once wrote that an electoral college also is needed to limit the damage that widespread voter fraud in any area of the country could do in an election , though that was probably more a concern in the 18th century than the 21st.
 
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Goodbye my Monte boy. May you rest in the peace you never knew in life.
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152. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:45 Beamer
 
Prez wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 11:19:
Haha - Beamer asking to be quoted just so I see it? Priceless. . Truly a man desperate for attention.

Says the guy who, repeatedly, quotes things I say and says "thank god for ignore" without the ability to ever repute a discussion.

And he even mentioned me in his next post. Brilliant.
 
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151. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:44 Beamer
 
Creston wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 11:28:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:53:
Creston wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:51:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 08:14:
Lastly, fuck the popular vote. This is WHY we have an electoral college. Old, rural white men turned out in droves for Mitt. Pretty much every other demographic went Obama. Why should we cater to old, rural white men? They're uneducated, they're bigoted, and this isn't their country anymore. It belongs to the educated, mixed masses in the cities.

Uh, hello. The old, bigoted rural white man has just as much of a right to vote on a president as you do. That's called democracy, remember? It's that thing that you're always bleating about, until it does something you don't like.

Creston

When did I say they didn't have the right to vote?
I said that they aren't relevant, not that they should be forbidden to vote...

Don't play coy, Beamer, you know damn well what you meant. Like it or not, those rural people are part of the united states. In 2000 every single liberal cried for months when Gore won the popular vote and Bush won the electoral college. It needed to be abolished, and it was ridiculous yadda yadda yadda.

And now you're championing it like it's the greatest gift to democracy that has ever been invented, because "IT SHUTS UP THE DAMN OLD WHITE PEOPLE!" You know just as well as I that the electoral college is fucking bullshit.

It wouldn't have mattered in this election (fortunately, since the last thing I want to hear is three more months of people whining about it), but if 300 million people vote, the guy who should be president is the one who gets 150,000,001+ votes. Not the one who happens to get enough votes in "important" states and gets 270 votes from a bunch of cocksuckers who work one day every four years.

If we got rid of the fucking electoral college, we could also get rid of the horseshit "LET'S SEE WHAT'S GOING ON IN OHIO!!!" news coverage. Does anyone give a shit about Ohio? (Or Florida, for that matter?) I don't think even people in Ohio give a shit about Ohio. Why are Florida and Ohio always the ones that elect the fucking president, for all intents and purposes?

So yes, the people you feel "don't matter" are part of the united states, and their vote DOES matter. And what they want to see happen in the country DOES matter. That's called Democracy.

Creston


I have no clue where you're getting this from. In this very thread I argue for 0% corporate taxes. I'm not exactly some bleeding heart liberal. I just think the Republican party likely got a big wakeup call that their social agenda is one that was pretty handedly beaten down yesterday and they can't keep appealing to the rural old men. Remember that quote, often taken out of context, that they're "running out of angry old white men?" It's true. Appealing to that demographic isn't going to win anything.

Never once did I try to say people shouldn't be allowed to vote.
Never once did I criticize the electoral college.
Never once did I think Al Gore would have made a good president.

I think the electoral college is great, because it balances things out.
I think that yes, those people are part of the United States, but what I said is they do not own the United States. For its entire history they were the defining demographic, and for a long time the only one that was even allowed to vote. That is not true. Appealing to the anti-abortion, anti-gay-marriage, pro-creationism crowd failed miserably yesterday.
 
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150. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:44 Wowbagger_TIP
 
Prez wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 09:21:
Yeah I agree with that. What bothered me most about his first term is what he *didn't* get passed - no federal budget in 4 years ( 2 of them while Democrats contolled the Congress and virtually any budget he wanted would have passed with ease)

Please please please stop repeating this nonsense about Democrats controlling Congress for 2 years. It didn't happen.

RollinThundr wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 08:13:
oh for fucks sakes. Obama didn't get anything done let's blame the GOP for blocking him! Or lets blame Bush! Or Reagan! So this is what conservatives have to look forward to for another 4 years? Blame everyone else but Obama for being a failure of a president? Yippy can't wait!

And the Republicans are right back at it again.
 
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"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." -- Bertrand Russell (I think...)
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149. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:31 RollinThundr
 
Creston wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 11:28:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:53:
Creston wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:51:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 08:14:
Lastly, fuck the popular vote. This is WHY we have an electoral college. Old, rural white men turned out in droves for Mitt. Pretty much every other demographic went Obama. Why should we cater to old, rural white men? They're uneducated, they're bigoted, and this isn't their country anymore. It belongs to the educated, mixed masses in the cities.

Uh, hello. The old, bigoted rural white man has just as much of a right to vote on a president as you do. That's called democracy, remember? It's that thing that you're always bleating about, until it does something you don't like.

Creston

When did I say they didn't have the right to vote?
I said that they aren't relevant, not that they should be forbidden to vote...

Don't play coy, Beamer, you know damn well what you meant. Like it or not, those rural people are part of the united states. In 2000 every single liberal cried for months when Gore won the popular vote and Bush won the electoral college. It needed to be abolished, and it was ridiculous yadda yadda yadda.

And now you're championing it like it's the greatest gift to democracy that has ever been invented, because "IT SHUTS UP THE DAMN OLD WHITE PEOPLE!" You know just as well as I that the electoral college is fucking bullshit.

It wouldn't have mattered in this election (fortunately, since the last thing I want to hear is three more months of people whining about it), but if 300 million people vote, the guy who should be president is the one who gets 150,000,001+ votes. Not the one who happens to get enough votes in "important" states and gets 270 votes from a bunch of cocksuckers who work one day every four years.

If we got rid of the fucking electoral college, we could also get rid of the horseshit "LET'S SEE WHAT'S GOING ON IN OHIO!!!" news coverage. Does anyone give a shit about Ohio? (Or Florida, for that matter?) I don't think even people in Ohio give a shit about Ohio. Why are Florida and Ohio always the ones that elect the fucking president, for all intents and purposes?

So yes, the people you feel "don't matter" are part of the united states, and their vote DOES matter. And what they want to see happen in the country DOES matter. That's called Democracy.

Creston

QFT if nothing else the electoral college makes a mockery of the saying "your vote counts" regardless of who you're voting for.
 
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148. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:28 Creston
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:53:
Creston wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:51:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 08:14:
Lastly, fuck the popular vote. This is WHY we have an electoral college. Old, rural white men turned out in droves for Mitt. Pretty much every other demographic went Obama. Why should we cater to old, rural white men? They're uneducated, they're bigoted, and this isn't their country anymore. It belongs to the educated, mixed masses in the cities.

Uh, hello. The old, bigoted rural white man has just as much of a right to vote on a president as you do. That's called democracy, remember? It's that thing that you're always bleating about, until it does something you don't like.

Creston

When did I say they didn't have the right to vote?
I said that they aren't relevant, not that they should be forbidden to vote...

Don't play coy, Beamer, you know damn well what you meant. Like it or not, those rural people are part of the united states. In 2000 every single liberal cried for months when Gore won the popular vote and Bush won the electoral college. It needed to be abolished, and it was ridiculous yadda yadda yadda.

And now you're championing it like it's the greatest gift to democracy that has ever been invented, because "IT SHUTS UP THE DAMN OLD WHITE PEOPLE!" You know just as well as I that the electoral college is fucking bullshit.

It wouldn't have mattered in this election (fortunately, since the last thing I want to hear is three more months of people whining about it), but if 300 million people vote, the guy who should be president is the one who gets 150,000,001+ votes. Not the one who happens to get enough votes in "important" states and gets 270 votes from a bunch of cocksuckers who work one day every four years.

If we got rid of the fucking electoral college, we could also get rid of the horseshit "LET'S SEE WHAT'S GOING ON IN OHIO!!!" news coverage. Does anyone give a shit about Ohio? (Or Florida, for that matter?) I don't think even people in Ohio give a shit about Ohio. Why are Florida and Ohio always the ones that elect the fucking president, for all intents and purposes?

So yes, the people you feel "don't matter" are part of the united states, and their vote DOES matter. And what they want to see happen in the country DOES matter. That's called Democracy.

Creston

 
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147. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:21 nin
 

I like pie.


 
http://www.nin.com/pub/tension/
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146. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:19 Prez
 
Haha - Beamer asking to be quoted just so I see it? Priceless. . Truly a man desperate for attention.  
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Goodbye my Monte boy. May you rest in the peace you never knew in life.
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145. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 11:12 RollinThundr
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:58:
Prez wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:54:
Creston wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:51:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 08:14:
Lastly, fuck the popular vote. This is WHY we have an electoral college. Old, rural white men turned out in droves for Mitt. Pretty much every other demographic went Obama. Why should we cater to old, rural white men? They're uneducated, they're bigoted, and this isn't their country anymore. It belongs to the educated, mixed masses in the cities.

Uh, hello. The old, bigoted rural white man has just as much of a right to vote on a president as you do. That's called democracy, remember? It's that thing that you're always bleating about, until it does something you don't like.

Creston

Jesus Christ - I wish the ignore function also blocked people quoting the ones being ignored. I feel dumber for just having read the idiotic statement you quoted. At least it serves to validate my choice to leave him on ignore when I read utter tripe like this.

I love that he doesn't actually address this. Look at the demographics: women voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Minorities voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Under 40 voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Cities voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Graduate degrees voted overwhelmingly for Obama.

Men, over 40, and rural voted overwhelmingly for Romney. THIS is the problem with the GOP - they have been courting the wrong people. The social issues are what won this election, and it was the democrats stances.


Someone please quote this. I would love to know what he took offense to.

And when we're a bankrupt 3rd world social utopia that you idiots want, those "social issues" won't mean shit. It's not that they've been courting the wrong people, it's that the liberal indoctrination that has gone on in public schools/colleges for the last 20-30 years have produced a bunch of entitled douchebags like yourself.
 
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144. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 10:58 Beamer
 
Prez wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:54:
Creston wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:51:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 08:14:
Lastly, fuck the popular vote. This is WHY we have an electoral college. Old, rural white men turned out in droves for Mitt. Pretty much every other demographic went Obama. Why should we cater to old, rural white men? They're uneducated, they're bigoted, and this isn't their country anymore. It belongs to the educated, mixed masses in the cities.

Uh, hello. The old, bigoted rural white man has just as much of a right to vote on a president as you do. That's called democracy, remember? It's that thing that you're always bleating about, until it does something you don't like.

Creston

Jesus Christ - I wish the ignore function also blocked people quoting the ones being ignored. I feel dumber for just having read the idiotic statement you quoted. At least it serves to validate my choice to leave him on ignore when I read utter tripe like this.

I love that he doesn't actually address this. Look at the demographics: women voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Minorities voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Under 40 voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Cities voted overwhelmingly for Obama. Graduate degrees voted overwhelmingly for Obama.

Men, over 40, and rural voted overwhelmingly for Romney. THIS is the problem with the GOP - they have been courting the wrong people. The social issues are what won this election, and it was the democrats stances.


Someone please quote this. I would love to know what he took offense to.
 
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143. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 10:55 Beamer
 
Anyway, to those of you that think conservatives are more fiscally responsible, I show you these two maps:
Which states are in deficits
How counties voted

I see correlations there.

I also see correlations in this:
Balance of wealth in the united states] and this: [url=http://www.ntu.org/tax-basics/history-of-federal-individual-1.html]Top tax brackets by year.
 
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142. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 10:54 Prez
 
Creston wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:51:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 08:14:
Lastly, fuck the popular vote. This is WHY we have an electoral college. Old, rural white men turned out in droves for Mitt. Pretty much every other demographic went Obama. Why should we cater to old, rural white men? They're uneducated, they're bigoted, and this isn't their country anymore. It belongs to the educated, mixed masses in the cities.

Uh, hello. The old, bigoted rural white man has just as much of a right to vote on a president as you do. That's called democracy, remember? It's that thing that you're always bleating about, until it does something you don't like.

Creston

Jesus Christ - I wish the ignore function also blocked people quoting the ones being ignored. I feel dumber for just having read the idiotic statement you quoted before I realized who it was. At least it serves to validate my choice to leave him on ignore when I read utter tripe like this.
 
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Goodbye my Monte boy. May you rest in the peace you never knew in life.
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141. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 10:53 Beamer
 
Creston wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:51:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 08:14:
Lastly, fuck the popular vote. This is WHY we have an electoral college. Old, rural white men turned out in droves for Mitt. Pretty much every other demographic went Obama. Why should we cater to old, rural white men? They're uneducated, they're bigoted, and this isn't their country anymore. It belongs to the educated, mixed masses in the cities.

Uh, hello. The old, bigoted rural white man has just as much of a right to vote on a president as you do. That's called democracy, remember? It's that thing that you're always bleating about, until it does something you don't like.

Creston

When did I say they didn't have the right to vote?
I said that they aren't relevant, not that they should be forbidden to vote...
 
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http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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140. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 10:51 Creston
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 08:14:
Lastly, fuck the popular vote. This is WHY we have an electoral college. Old, rural white men turned out in droves for Mitt. Pretty much every other demographic went Obama. Why should we cater to old, rural white men? They're uneducated, they're bigoted, and this isn't their country anymore. It belongs to the educated, mixed masses in the cities.

Uh, hello. The old, bigoted rural white man has just as much of a right to vote on a president as you do. That's called democracy, remember? It's that thing that you're always bleating about, until it does something you don't like.

Creston
 
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139. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 10:47 Creston
 
jdreyer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 04:53:
sauron wrote on Nov 6, 2012, 10:20:
nin wrote on Nov 6, 2012, 09:59:
Voted Friday. Now I get to sit back and watch the fireworks. And being a glutton for punishment, I'm sure I'll be following it all night.


I'm unable to vote (foreign passport - Mordor; also, the Lidless Eye has no hands). However, Ive been absolutely glued to the Five Thirty-Eight page for weeks:

http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/

Unbiased political statistics analysis done with hard math - very interesting. Honestly, it really is!

So far, Nate Silver is 49 out of 50 state-wise, and FL may still swing his way (they're still counting). The man is so good at what he does.

Funny enough, he's been doing this stuff in baseball for a lot longer than he's been doing it in politics, and in baseball you wouldn't believe the resistance he (and fellow sabermetrics) have been facing.

538 actually really helped his credibility in the centuries-old baseball writer world too, since they finally had to admit that, huh, maybe there IS something to be gleaned from a hundred fucking years worth of data anyway.

But yeah, he is EXTREMELY good at using data to predict what's going to happen. Shit, in 2016 we don't even need to vote anymore. Just ask Nate Silver who the president will be, and take it as gospel. It'll at least save Bats 3 hours of standing in line in his funky-ass town

Creston
 
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138. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 10:41 Creston
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 00:29:
No, I'm saying that tax rates for the top earners, we're talking like top 0.1%, need to go up drastically. It isn't about how much someone earns, it's about how much they earn proportionately. Cutting taxes on the middle class won't do much if they're still only seeing a small chunk of the overall income in America. Too much of that income is going to too few people, because those few people make decisions that reward their income, not middle class income. Eliminate 1000 jobs, get a million dollar bonus. That's how we've incentivized "job creators." By allowing unlimited earning we've told them to find ways to earn unlimited income, and the only way to do that is to increase their share more. That money has to come from somewhere, so it comes from the middle class.

I disagree with you about corporate taxes. Corporations can, and will, send jobs overseas to avoid tax rates. So why should we tax them? We have two areas to tax: corporate and personal. When we tax corporate we give incentive to move operations out. If we tax personal, we're no longer doing that. No executive will say "man, taxes are too high here, I'm moving my family to Thailand," but they do say "man, corporate taxes are too high here, I'm moving your job to Thailand."

Think about the motives behind these moves, and how taxes influence it. Low personal taxes and high corporate taxes encourage business going overseas. High personal taxes and low corporate taxes encourage business staying here.

Okay, I have no problem with taxing the rich more, but sadly they can afford to lobby washington a whole lot more than I can...

As for your corporate vision, I disagree. If you have high personal taxes and low corporate taxes, the employee demands a higher salary in order to be able to keep his/her standard of living the same. The corporation sees the higher salary demand, and outsources that job to timbuktu.

Corporations are going to fuck their employees over no matter what, so you might as well tax the fuckers if they do so. And then give tax breaks if they invest in jobs here. Right now the majority of the tax breaks are going to corporations which do nothing but sheds jobs in favor of cheap foreign labor.

Creston
 
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137. Re: Out of the Blue Nov 7, 2012, 10:34 RollinThundr
 
Prez wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:30:
PHJF wrote on Nov 7, 2012, 10:13:
US Federal Spending 2010

"around 70%"??? And note this does NOT include funding for stuff like Homeland Security or the VA.

Medicare and SS serve a practical purpose, for all their flaws. I'm at far greater risk of dying of cancer than of a bullet from a Chinaman (as are you).

I agree that the defense budget would be less painful to cut - the point I was inelegantly trying to make is that the defense budget isn't the key to fixing America's financial woes. We probably don't need to be spending near as much as we are in defense, true, but what worries me is how far people seem willing to slash it without considering the potential risks involved.

Social Security is a huge drain on our budget that at least bears looking at. There are options that can be explored that could save a whole lot of money while still allowing us to keep our promises to our 'seasoned citizens' that were made long ago. But touching Social Security in DC is tantamount to political suicide - it is practically sacrosanct so no one is even willing to approach the subject because it would be career death. The main point is that with the country's finances in such a state of disarray I believe EVERYTHING needs to be on the table (including higher taxes) - With the understanding that we aren't just going to turn our backs on our elderly and sick, of course. But let's look where we can save some or make sure what we spend is spent more efficiently everywhere.

Common sense ftw.
 
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