Send News. Want a reply? Read this. More in the FAQ.   News Forum - All Forums - Mobile - PDA - RSS Headlines  RSS Headlines   Twitter  Twitter
Customize
User Settings
Styles:
LAN Parties
Upcoming one-time events:
Greenbelt, MD 08/22

Regularly scheduled events

Op Ed

Ars Technica - Why on-disc downloadable content isnít the crime itís made out to be.
So let's all settle down. Just because a portion of a game disc is locked away as DLC doesn't mean you're getting ripped off. Both games and DLC are still value propositions that have to be judged on their own merits, regardless of whether they're available on disc from day one or not. You're not entitled to free content just because it's on the disc, or because it's taking away from what "should" have been in the core game. Don't like it? Don't buy it!

View
32 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
< Newer [ 1 2 ] Older >

32. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 20:08 The_Pink_Tiger
 
<pedant>
Actually, there were a number of shareware games that released on CD that let you play the shareware but to get the rest of the game - which was on the CD - you had to call up the company to get a serial number.

I remember iD did this with Quake. The CD was $5 and included the shareware version of Quake. It had all their shareware games - Wolf3D, Doom, Doom2 (demo), Heretic, Hexen - on that CD. You could play the shareware but you had to call 1-800-ID-Games to get an unlock key to unlock the full version of the game, which was already on the disc.

Needless to say, there were tools available on the net which would generate the serials for you without the hassle of the phone call. ;-)


 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
31. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 19:52 killer_roach
 
Prez wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 19:36:
Well it mattered enough for Dude to write an article about it, hence the discussion. Rarity doesn't generally preclude discussion of whether it's a sound practice or not.

To posit a counterfactual, it might be it merited an article not because it was happening frequently, but that people were incensed about it enough to make such an assessment worthwhile to publish (not to mention, in having a somewhat controversial opinion, it generates clicks).
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
30. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 19:36 Prez
 
NKD wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 16:59:
Does it really matter? On-disc DLC is incredibly rare.

Well it mattered enough for Dude to write an article about it, hence the discussion. Rarity doesn't generally preclude discussion of whether it's a sound practice or not.
 
Avatar 17185
 
ďThe greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.Ē
- Mahatma Gandhi
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
29. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 19:20 ventry
 
The worst part of this is that if you do vote with your wallet and not buy a game that has on-disc DLC do the developers look at the poor sales figures and say "Well on-disc DLC doesn't work"?
NO!!!
They start pissin' and moanin' and playing the "piracy" card.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
28. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 18:46 killer_roach
 
Mordecai Walfish wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 18:04:
I think we have the same opportunity with Disc-Locked DLC, and I as well will think twice before supporting any game that blatantly ships with completed content locked on the disc.

You assume the direction is toward more of it, rather than less, something that I might argue is erroneous.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
27. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 18:04 Mordecai Walfish
 
NKD wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 16:59:
Does it really matter? On-disc DLC is incredibly rare.

Persistent-Connection DRM used to be "incredibly rare" as well, but it took a beating by gamers in forums just like this and became a topic of mostly reviled hatred in the community thus limiting it's roll-out in many ways.

I think we have the same opportunity with Disc-Locked DLC, and I as well will think twice before supporting any game that blatantly ships with completed content locked on the disc.
 
Avatar 56178
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
26. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 17:58 Dev
 
Don't like it? Don't buy it!

Good point! I'll judge it on its merits and not buy it!

PHJF wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 17:49:
And here's another example of a DLC fuckup. I'm playing Borderlands 2. I didn't preorder, because I'm not a dolt. Therefore I don't have the mechromancer (nevermind the soldier, carbon copied from borderlands 1, should have been DLC, and the mechro in the game to begin with).

Suddenly I'm finding mechromancer items in my game. So now instead of a 25% chance to find a class artifact I can actually use, I now have a 20% chance and then a 20% extra chance to find an item completely fucking useless to me. Thanks a fucking lot, Gearbox.
Fortunately for you, they are now selling the mechromancer DLC separately which includes essentially ALL the preorder "exclusives" like that magic find rare relic, and the extra golden keys, etc. The only thing it doesn't include is some skins.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
25. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 17:49 PHJF
 
And here's another example of a DLC fuckup. I'm playing Borderlands 2. I didn't preorder, because I'm not a dolt. Therefore I don't have the mechromancer (nevermind the soldier, carbon copied from borderlands 1, should have been DLC, and the mechro in the game to begin with).

Suddenly I'm finding mechromancer items in my game. So now instead of a 25% chance to find a class artifact I can actually use, I now have a 20% chance and then a 20% extra chance to find an item completely fucking useless to me. Thanks a fucking lot, Gearbox.
 
Avatar 17251
 
Steam + PSN: PHJF
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
24. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 17:34 Fletch
 
ABVH wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 12:48:
According to some of you 'DLC Whiners' ;

[snipped idiotic blathering]

PLONK
 
Avatar 10520
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
23. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 17:01 killer_roach
 
For me, it's a bit of a mixed bag, and I admit I'm more on the side of the publishers than most here. I find it particularly scuzzy that developers hide what's more or less vital parts of the game behind a paywall, but other things (like cosmetic items) I'm not as concerned about.

What the major problem is is the fact that games, like most other forms of media, fairly closely follow the monopolistic competition model for pricing. If a game simply has more content, they can't get away with charging more than their competition - if you need a certain average sales price to break even or get a market rate of return that's higher than the going MSRP, you're going to have to go the DLC route.

Ultimately, you'd think the publishers would figure out a cleaner way of making the break so as not to offend the consumer, but a disorganized rush to complete the game might result in such a mistake as Capcom has now done on multiple occasions. (I know they blame Microsoft's DLC rules on the 360 for why they do it, but they could always tell MS to go pound sand and whine for them to break their own rules - wouldn't be the first time a major publisher has gotten Microsoft to change policies as they go.)
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
22. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 16:59 NKD
 
Does it really matter? On-disc DLC is incredibly rare.  
Avatar 43041
 
If you don't like where gaming is heading, stop giving your money to the people who are taking it in that direction.
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
21. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 16:54 Beamer
 
ViRGE wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 16:51:
Beamer wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 16:02:
Ozmodan wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 16:00:
If they put it on the disk, it is yours. I have NEVER paid for any DLC, there are always easy ways to unlock it. Find it hard to believe anyone can construe that is in any way criminal. They sold me the disk it is on. It is mine.

Did you do this with shareware discs in the 90s?
Did you do this with Quake, which was distributed on a CD for ~$3 as a shareware version with the full version on the disc, able to be unlocked for $40 if you called a phone number?

"I paid for the disc, it's mine!"
That's a terrible comparison. Shareware was free to download/share, and when it was put on a disc the price being charged was putting it on a disc. You weren't actually paying for any content.

What he said was "If they put it on the disk, it is yours."
But fine, what about what companies like Adobe did in the 90s? Often a company sold a software suite that was very complimentary, such as PhotoShop and After Effects or whathaveyou. They'd just put it all on to one CD. You paid for what you used. Bought one program? Great, here's a CD. It has all of them, because it's easier for us to distribute that way. You get the serial for one. Want another? Just buy the serial, you already have the software!
 
-------------
Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
20. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 16:51 ViRGE
 
Beamer wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 16:02:
Ozmodan wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 16:00:
If they put it on the disk, it is yours. I have NEVER paid for any DLC, there are always easy ways to unlock it. Find it hard to believe anyone can construe that is in any way criminal. They sold me the disk it is on. It is mine.

Did you do this with shareware discs in the 90s?
Did you do this with Quake, which was distributed on a CD for ~$3 as a shareware version with the full version on the disc, able to be unlocked for $40 if you called a phone number?

"I paid for the disc, it's mine!"
That's a terrible comparison. Shareware was free to download/share, and when it was put on a disc the price being charged was putting it on a disc. You weren't actually paying for any content.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
19. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 16:31 Beamer
 
PHJF wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 16:28:
Did you do this with shareware discs in the 90s?
Did you do this with Quake, which was distributed on a CD for ~$3 as a shareware version with the full version on the disc, able to be unlocked for $40 if you called a phone number?

We weren't paying $60 for shareware discs. With the general lack of content current games are shipping with (for whatever reason), I consistently feel like I'm being asked to pay more for less. DLC of any kind is usually no more than salt in my wounds.

That wasn't his argument.

But yeah, you are being asked to pay more for less. Game devs are being asked to spend more for the same amount. There's an inevitable break there somewhere.

If you don't think a game is worthwhile due to the DLC - don't buy it. Simple. I'll continue ignoring almost all DLC and still enjoying my games. I'll continue not buying the DLC that I think is worthless, which is almost all of it. But, Fallout 3 arguments aside, I've never felt like what I was given with my purchase was incomplete.
 
-------------
Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
18. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 16:28 PHJF
 
Did you do this with shareware discs in the 90s?
Did you do this with Quake, which was distributed on a CD for ~$3 as a shareware version with the full version on the disc, able to be unlocked for $40 if you called a phone number?

We weren't paying $60 for shareware discs. With the general lack of content current games are shipping with (for whatever reason), I consistently feel like I'm being asked to pay more for less. DLC of any kind is usually no more than salt in my wounds.
 
Avatar 17251
 
Steam + PSN: PHJF
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
17. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 16:02 Beamer
 
Ozmodan wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 16:00:
If they put it on the disk, it is yours. I have NEVER paid for any DLC, there are always easy ways to unlock it. Find it hard to believe anyone can construe that is in any way criminal. They sold me the disk it is on. It is mine.

Did you do this with shareware discs in the 90s?
Did you do this with Quake, which was distributed on a CD for ~$3 as a shareware version with the full version on the disc, able to be unlocked for $40 if you called a phone number?

"I paid for the disc, it's mine!"
 
-------------
Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
16. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 16:00 Ozmodan
 
If they put it on the disk, it is yours, you paid for it. I have NEVER paid for any DLC, there are always easy ways to unlock it. Find it hard to believe anyone can construe that is in any way criminal. They sold me the disk it is on. It is mine.  
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
15. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 14:51 avianflu
 
+1 for Negadeath.


 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
14. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 14:34 nin
 
ASeven wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 14:30:
ABVH wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 12:48:
...

So you made a new account here just to show everyone that you're an idiot? Congratulations, mission accomplished.


Wow, what a quality poster...and his first comment was removed, too.

 
http://www.nin.com/pub/tension/
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
13. Re: Op Ed Oct 12, 2012, 14:30 ASeven
 
ABVH wrote on Oct 12, 2012, 12:48:
...

So you made a new account here just to show everyone that you're an idiot? Congratulations, mission accomplished.
 
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
32 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
< Newer [ 1 2 ] Older >


footer

Blue's News logo