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Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt

A tweet by Minecraft creator Markus 'Notch' Persson relates an exchange with Microsoft about Windows 8 and the indie sandbox game: "Got an email from microsoft, wanting to help 'certify' minecraft for win 8. I told them to stop trying to ruin the pc as an open platform." He follows this expressing his distaste for the process and the new OS: "I'd rather have minecraft not run on win 8 at all than to play along. Maybe we can convince a few people not to switch to win 8 that way.." Thanks Computer and Video Games.

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99 Replies. 5 pages. Viewing page 3.
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59. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 15:38 sauron
 


Dear Holy Quote-Chained Walls of Text, Batman!

I thought I was reading a dissertation in here!
 
Avatar 8692
 
Kittens!
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58. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 15:31 Kastagir
 
An offer from Microsoft to "certify" a third-party application for Windows is simply an offer to test it to make sure it works. I'm not defending Microsoft or anything, since limited effort is extended to make things like games "certified," but this Notch guy seems like he goes out of his way to be difficult to deal with. Either that or this tweet could be translated as "Screw you, I hate Windows."

Personally, I'm going to skip Win8 like I skipped Vista. And I don't care about Minecraft.
 
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57. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 15:27 DangerDog
 
But it's okay to put minecraft on closed console platforms like xbox360?

I support his decision but I'm not going to pat him on the back just yet.
 
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56. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 15:26 Beamer
 
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 14:02:
Beamer wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:49:
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:32:
Beamer wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:18:
PHJF wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:14:
It's about the slippery slope MS now created with Win8, the potential of taking away control from the users.

Most users are not qualified to be IN control of anything other than MSPaint or Minesweeper. 99% of IT work is trying to prevent people doing things or undoing what they've done.

Most don't want to be in control, either. Hence the huge explosion of Apple and Google.
So Microsoft will very happily monetize losing control, because that's what the market demands. We all know what happens to companies that ignore what their consumers want when demand is this overwhelming.

But just because they create a nice little walled-in courtyard for people afraid of the outside world doesn't mean they'll prevent anyone else from venturing out there. As I keep mentioning, businesses could not survive like this. They still rely on legacy software, custom modifications to existing software, etc. Walling off like this would strangle enterprise, which is still the Microsoft bread-and-butter.

You are assuming MS is acting logically or has the interest of customers at heart. If the company's past history shows anything is that they are prone to make some major fuck-ups as well. They are clearly taking the Apple road here and it will get worse, not better, unless Win8 is a major financial failure.

You can only assume they act logically, and having the interest of the consumer and the interest of themselves at heart is the only way to survive.

What you repeatedly ignore is that [b]the bulk of Microsoft's business is enterprise[/b] and that [b]enterprise cannot exist in a walled-in ecosystem.[/b] So if you think Microsoft will cut off their strongest, most reliable, most profitable customers, I'd argue you're not the one being rational.

Now, we may end up with Windows 9 Consumer edition which is walled in and Windows 9 Enterprise which isn't, but is 3x the price, but Microsoft knows they cannot turn their back on enterprise and knows enterprise and walled-in cannot exist together.

Again, companies acting logically only happens in pure Economic Theory. The real world is far different though and companies often act in retarded and illogical way, often very anti-consumer. Publishers are the shining example of that. Also, MS has a lot of past fuck ups that were anything but logical though if you wish to ignore and whitewash them it's your choice.

Beamer wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:51:
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:40:
SpectralMeat wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:36:
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:32:
unless Win8 is a major financial failure.
That is what I am hoping for.

Early signs point to a failure. Time will tell if it is or not.

What "signs?"
Analysts are high. Early previews are high. Most articles written about it in the mainstream media are very pleased.

The hardcore nerds aren't pleased, but we're the minority. It's not being made specifically for us. We'll begrudgingly move on to whatever we need to, and we tend to be very slow adopters of major changes, anyway.

As for this, you answered this yourself.

"What you repeatedly ignore is that [b]the bulk of Microsoft's business is enterprise[/b] and that [b]enterprise cannot exist in a walled-in ecosystem.[/b]"

Corporations, the biggest Windows customer share, have absolutely NO reason to move to Win8. No reason whatsoever. Who cares if reviews and blind to reality analysts think? Sales are what matter. Hell, reviews for Vista were also high and analysts were also high, in more ways than one, and we all know Vista was a financial failure.

So again, the signs are here. Corporations, big and small, have no reason whatsoever to move. Win8 offers nothing new, it takes away more features than it gives in fact. Adoption rate will be lower than Vista more than likely.

But hey, keep on living in fairy land where publishers are doing well and MS always acts logically.

Actually, tablets are the reason that corporations have to move to Windows 8. By this point most executives are carrying around tablets, but they can't do most of what they need to on them.

Behold: Surface Pro.


 
-------------
Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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55. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 15:08 Cutter
 
Good on him. Maybe it's time for the devs to start making a push to make Linux the dominant gaming platform. That'd hurt MS huge.
 
Avatar 25394
 

"Nobody wants to be nobody in America. Ed is the apotheosis of a prevailing American syndrome. It used to be that someone became famous because they were special. Now people are considered special just for being famous. Fame, itself, is its own virtue.
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54. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 14:14 Matshock
 
Graham wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 13:51:
InBlack wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 11:02:
yuastnav wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 10:38:
"Certify minecraft for win8"?

What does this even mean?

It means that they want to turn Windows PC's into a closed system ala Apple's Macintosh computers.

All software has to be 'certified' by Microsoft before the OS will let it run. Microsoft will probably take this a step further as they will only allow digital copies of the software to be purchaed through their built-in app buying software. (again ala Apple's Itunes)

Sorry, we need to correct some ignorance here.

OS X is not a closed system. It has a gatekeeper that can be completely turned off. Software can be downloaded from the Internet, installed from third party apps stores, or even compiled yourself with free tools that are both included in the OS and available freely online.

The conduit for buying software as a digital download from Apple is the "App Store". iTunes is used for movies, TV shows, music, and iOS apps.

I expect better from a site frequented by people this close to technology. If you're going to talk shit about something, understand it first.

--Written from my Ubuntu installation on a self-built rig.

Then I *could* end up with OS XI instead of Windows in a few years.

I think the comparison is coming from iOS which is the bulk of Apple's sales and thus what people think about Apple.

Good correction though. Hopefully Apple sticks with that formula instead of closing up more just because MS does.

Or better yet everyone just migrates to Linux and comes up with a unified standard. Get the big hardware folks and game devs behind that and it could happen.

Or better yet MS gets off it and diversifies into modernizing the power grid or something useful.

 
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53. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 14:11 Mr. Tact
 
This reminds me, it must be getting close to time for me to buy a couple of OEM Win 7 CDs....  
Truth is brutal. Prepare for pain.
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52. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 14:02 NKD
 
Matshock wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 13:15:
NKD wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 13:08:
Minecraft works fine on Windows 8. Beyond that no one should give two fucks.

For now- they may implement licensing restrictions in the future so one day Mojang either does MS's certification process and passes the cost on to you or tells MS to piss off and all future releases of Minecraft won't work on Windows 8.

Patches slow down because they all wait on MS approval, indie titles get shut out, etc. etc..

And Windows XP was going to delete all my MP3s and only WMAs were going to be allowed. Still waiting on that one.
 
Avatar 43041
 
If you don't like where gaming is heading, stop giving your money to the people who are taking it in that direction.
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51. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 14:02 ASeven
 
Beamer wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:49:
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:32:
Beamer wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:18:
PHJF wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:14:
It's about the slippery slope MS now created with Win8, the potential of taking away control from the users.

Most users are not qualified to be IN control of anything other than MSPaint or Minesweeper. 99% of IT work is trying to prevent people doing things or undoing what they've done.

Most don't want to be in control, either. Hence the huge explosion of Apple and Google.
So Microsoft will very happily monetize losing control, because that's what the market demands. We all know what happens to companies that ignore what their consumers want when demand is this overwhelming.

But just because they create a nice little walled-in courtyard for people afraid of the outside world doesn't mean they'll prevent anyone else from venturing out there. As I keep mentioning, businesses could not survive like this. They still rely on legacy software, custom modifications to existing software, etc. Walling off like this would strangle enterprise, which is still the Microsoft bread-and-butter.

You are assuming MS is acting logically or has the interest of customers at heart. If the company's past history shows anything is that they are prone to make some major fuck-ups as well. They are clearly taking the Apple road here and it will get worse, not better, unless Win8 is a major financial failure.

You can only assume they act logically, and having the interest of the consumer and the interest of themselves at heart is the only way to survive.

What you repeatedly ignore is that [b]the bulk of Microsoft's business is enterprise[/b] and that [b]enterprise cannot exist in a walled-in ecosystem.[/b] So if you think Microsoft will cut off their strongest, most reliable, most profitable customers, I'd argue you're not the one being rational.

Now, we may end up with Windows 9 Consumer edition which is walled in and Windows 9 Enterprise which isn't, but is 3x the price, but Microsoft knows they cannot turn their back on enterprise and knows enterprise and walled-in cannot exist together.

Again, companies acting logically only happens in pure Economic Theory. The real world is far different though and companies often act in retarded and illogical way, often very anti-consumer. Publishers are the shining example of that. Also, MS has a lot of past fuck ups that were anything but logical though if you wish to ignore and whitewash them it's your choice.

Beamer wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:51:
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:40:
SpectralMeat wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:36:
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:32:
unless Win8 is a major financial failure.
That is what I am hoping for.

Early signs point to a failure. Time will tell if it is or not.

What "signs?"
Analysts are high. Early previews are high. Most articles written about it in the mainstream media are very pleased.

The hardcore nerds aren't pleased, but we're the minority. It's not being made specifically for us. We'll begrudgingly move on to whatever we need to, and we tend to be very slow adopters of major changes, anyway.

As for this, you answered this yourself.

"What you repeatedly ignore is that [b]the bulk of Microsoft's business is enterprise[/b] and that [b]enterprise cannot exist in a walled-in ecosystem.[/b]"

Corporations, the biggest Windows customer share, have absolutely NO reason to move to Win8. No reason whatsoever. Who cares if reviews and blind to reality analysts think? Sales are what matter. Hell, reviews for Vista were also high and analysts were also high, in more ways than one, and we all know Vista was a financial failure.

So again, the signs are here. Corporations, big and small, have no reason whatsoever to move. Win8 offers nothing new, it takes away more features than it gives in fact. Adoption rate will be lower than Vista more than likely.

But hey, keep on living in fairy land where publishers are doing well and MS always acts logically.
 
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50. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 13:55 Draugr
 
Jivaro wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 11:38:
You are giving Microsoft entirely too much credit.

Oh come one now, we'd be stupid to think that now that MS came up with a way to deliver software to people that they can make money off of they would abandon the other routes. For example, with the Xbox it's not like they abandoned PC gaming! Oh wait, that's exactly what happened.

It won't happen at first, but you never throw the frog into the Boiling pot of water, you put the frog in luke warm water and bring it to a boil, lest they make a mess.

MS does have a lot tied up in enterprise, but that won't stop them from squeezing out the part of the market they don't like to try and get them in line with the way they want things to be done.

We all know what happens to companies that ignore what their consumers want when demand is this overwhelming.

Agreed, but I don't know of anyone with a desktop OS who is asking for this, which is exactly the problem with Windows 8 (as a dektop OS.)

As people are also keen to point out, enterprise is good business for them, and windows 8 wasn't really built to cater to them at all, and while it may offer some things that might help in that environment, it also invites a host of other issues. I don't know of any IT professionals who are looking forward to 8.
 
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49. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 13:51 Graham
 
InBlack wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 11:02:
yuastnav wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 10:38:
"Certify minecraft for win8"?

What does this even mean?

It means that they want to turn Windows PC's into a closed system ala Apple's Macintosh computers.

All software has to be 'certified' by Microsoft before the OS will let it run. Microsoft will probably take this a step further as they will only allow digital copies of the software to be purchaed through their built-in app buying software. (again ala Apple's Itunes)

Sorry, we need to correct some ignorance here.

OS X is not a closed system. It has a gatekeeper that can be completely turned off. Software can be downloaded from the Internet, installed from third party apps stores, or even compiled yourself with free tools that are both included in the OS and available freely online.

The conduit for buying software as a digital download from Apple is the "App Store". iTunes is used for movies, TV shows, music, and iOS apps.

I expect better from a site frequented by people this close to technology. If you're going to talk shit about something, understand it first.

--Written from my Ubuntu installation on a self-built rig.
 
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48. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 13:50 jacobvandy
 
I thought the tweet was an obnoxious inline ad, at first glance...

Anyway, people calling 'hypocrite!' are dumb, applause for Notch taking this stance, yadda yadda yadda.
 
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47. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 13:46 avianflu
 
Ah, the disaster that is windows 8. A bad joke for folks like me who actually like windows o/s  
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46. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 13:15 Matshock
 
NKD wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 13:08:
Minecraft works fine on Windows 8. Beyond that no one should give two fucks.

For now- they may implement licensing restrictions in the future so one day Mojang either does MS's certification process and passes the cost on to you or tells MS to piss off and all future releases of Minecraft won't work on Windows 8.

Patches slow down because they all wait on MS approval, indie titles get shut out, etc. etc..
 
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45. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 13:08 NKD
 
Minecraft works fine on Windows 8. Beyond that no one should give two fucks.  
Avatar 43041
 
If you don't like where gaming is heading, stop giving your money to the people who are taking it in that direction.
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44. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 12:51 Beamer
 
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:40:
SpectralMeat wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:36:
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:32:
unless Win8 is a major financial failure.
That is what I am hoping for.

Early signs point to a failure. Time will tell if it is or not.

What "signs?"
Analysts are high. Early previews are high. Most articles written about it in the mainstream media are very pleased.

The hardcore nerds aren't pleased, but we're the minority. It's not being made specifically for us. We'll begrudgingly move on to whatever we need to, and we tend to be very slow adopters of major changes, anyway.
 
-------------
Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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43. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 12:49 Beamer
 
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:32:
Beamer wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:18:
PHJF wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:14:
It's about the slippery slope MS now created with Win8, the potential of taking away control from the users.

Most users are not qualified to be IN control of anything other than MSPaint or Minesweeper. 99% of IT work is trying to prevent people doing things or undoing what they've done.

Most don't want to be in control, either. Hence the huge explosion of Apple and Google.
So Microsoft will very happily monetize losing control, because that's what the market demands. We all know what happens to companies that ignore what their consumers want when demand is this overwhelming.

But just because they create a nice little walled-in courtyard for people afraid of the outside world doesn't mean they'll prevent anyone else from venturing out there. As I keep mentioning, businesses could not survive like this. They still rely on legacy software, custom modifications to existing software, etc. Walling off like this would strangle enterprise, which is still the Microsoft bread-and-butter.

You are assuming MS is acting logically or has the interest of customers at heart. If the company's past history shows anything is that they are prone to make some major fuck-ups as well. They are clearly taking the Apple road here and it will get worse, not better, unless Win8 is a major financial failure.

You can only assume they act logically, and having the interest of the consumer and the interest of themselves at heart is the only way to survive.

What you repeatedly ignore is that [b]the bulk of Microsoft's business is enterprise[/b] and that [b]enterprise cannot exist in a walled-in ecosystem.[/b] So if you think Microsoft will cut off their strongest, most reliable, most profitable customers, I'd argue you're not the one being rational.

Now, we may end up with Windows 9 Consumer edition which is walled in and Windows 9 Enterprise which isn't, but is 3x the price, but Microsoft knows they cannot turn their back on enterprise and knows enterprise and walled-in cannot exist together.
 
-------------
Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
42. Re: More Big Picture Details Sep 27, 2012, 12:48 Jivaro
 
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:38:
HorrorScope wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:32:
PHJF wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:14:
It's about the slippery slope MS now created with Win8, the potential of taking away control from the users.

Most users are not qualified to be IN control of anything other than MSPaint or Minesweeper. 99% of IT work is trying to prevent people doing things or undoing what they've done.

At home they are qualified to do whatever the hell they want, imo.

This. At home I do whatever I want, whether others think otherwise or not.

but but but...UR DOIN' IT WRONG!
http://www.halolz.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/wrong.jpg
 
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41. Re: Notch Knocks Win8: Minecraft Certification in Doubt Sep 27, 2012, 12:40 ASeven
 
SpectralMeat wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:36:
ASeven wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:32:
unless Win8 is a major financial failure.
That is what I am hoping for.

Early signs point to a failure. Time will tell if it is or not.
 
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40. Re: More Big Picture Details Sep 27, 2012, 12:38 ASeven
 
HorrorScope wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:32:
PHJF wrote on Sep 27, 2012, 12:14:
It's about the slippery slope MS now created with Win8, the potential of taking away control from the users.

Most users are not qualified to be IN control of anything other than MSPaint or Minesweeper. 99% of IT work is trying to prevent people doing things or undoing what they've done.

At home they are qualified to do whatever the hell they want, imo.

This. At home I do whatever I want, whether others think otherwise or not.
 
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