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Op Ed

games.on.net - Supporting the PC: It’s okay to get upset about poor console ports, but do the right thing anyway.
This is why, if you support PC gaming, and especially if you’re one of the people who actually signed the petition, you should do the right thing and buy the game. If the game sells well, it’ll encourage other publishers to think about doing the same. It might convince more publishers to take their games to our favourite platform, and, hopefully, they’ll take the time to properly optimise them.

If it sells badly, it’s just yet another nail in the coffin of publisher confidence in the platform. And that’s the last thing we need.

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55. Re: Op Ed Aug 15, 2012, 19:34 jdreyer
 
Creston wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 15:59:
Veterator wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 00:16:
All for full price....because if you do, the guys who made it will do better next time...probably....maybe.


That's how GMC sold cars for close to thirty years...

Creston

Heh, yep. And it wasn't until people started to take their money elsewhere like Honda and Toyota that they improved.
 
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54. Re: Op Ed Aug 15, 2012, 15:59 Creston
 
Veterator wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 00:16:
All for full price....because if you do, the guys who made it will do better next time...probably....maybe.


That's how GMC sold cars for close to thirty years...

Creston
 
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53. Re: Op Ed Aug 15, 2012, 15:57 Creston
 
jdreyer wrote on Aug 14, 2012, 23:45:
Creston wrote on Aug 14, 2012, 14:02:
Being upfront about something doesn't excuse pisspoor quality. Never has, never will. You can try to be upfront with your boss about why you're not going to do any work this week, and at the end of the week, your ass will still be fired.

I fail to see why some dipshit developer feels that they should somehow be exempt from this rule. 720p is a fucking joke. the PC ran that resolution back in 19fucking96. Now we're supposed to be shouting for joy that 16 years later, we get a game that runs at 720p? Fuck. that.

Creston

Well, the positive thing about their transparency is that it allows we consumers to make an educated (non)purchase. I appreciate that at least, although I've never been interested in this game in the least.

As for the boss-worker analogy it's actually the opposite case where I work. We try to work around people's personal issues when they tell us as to not lose valuable employees. It's when they don't communicate that people get fired.

Voodoo I, released in 1996, was limited to 800x600 resolution and didn't even have SLI. 1024x768 resolution wasn't available until Voodoo 2 was released in 1998, but I get your point.

I guess it's cool that they say that the game is a pisspoor port, but it's not as if that information would have somehow been unobtainable otherwise. So them being honest about it doesn't really get them any extra kudos from me.

And sure, if you mention that your wife is dying, your boss is going to be lenient. If, on the flipside, you go to your boss and say "yeah, hey, I'm going to do shit-all worth of work next week. Why? No real reason." then see how that's going to work out.

I stand corrected on the date. I could have sworn it was 1996, but admittedly I did zero googling.

Creston
 
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52. Re: Op Ed Aug 15, 2012, 15:52 Creston
 
mag wrote on Aug 14, 2012, 17:00:
ItBurn wrote on Aug 14, 2012, 16:22:
mag wrote on Aug 14, 2012, 16:18:
Creston wrote on Aug 14, 2012, 14:02:
Being upfront about something doesn't excuse pisspoor quality. Never has, never will. You can try to be upfront with your boss about why you're not going to do any work this week, and at the end of the week, your ass will still be fired.
Creston

Uh. If you're up front with your boss and tell him mid-way through the week that you underestimated the time/money you needed to do everything you said you'd do by the end of the week, you should be fired?

God I hate it when people do that to me. That's not what he said. You understand what he meant, don't be an ass.

His analogy was bad and he should feel bad. Though I do understand that he meant, "This game does not sound like it will meet my expectations. I will refrain from purchasing it."

Riiiight. **I** am the one who should feel bad, because YOU apparently don't have a clue about the meaning of the word UPFRONT.

Okay.

Creston
 
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51. Re: Op Ed Aug 15, 2012, 15:13 Veterator
 
Mordecai Walfish wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 14:46:
Veterator wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 00:16:
So how many people would look at you like you're a lunatic when you tell them they should be buying watches that don't keep time, cars that have major mechanical issues not covered under warranty, a brand new house with a roof that leaks just a little bit, a toothbrush that doesn't clean your teeth and only has a few sharp edges, toothpaste that only makes you want vomit a little, and milk that smells like onions.

How does that even make sense?

Bad analogies galore.. The game should still be fully functional which negates all of these analogies. A watch that is difficult or unsightly to read? A car with a bad paint job, a house with shite wallpaper, a toothbrush with.. wait what?

lol

Should be fully functional, your definition of fully functional is?
Poor controls?
Poor performance on recommended or better specs?
Faulty DRM?
Unaddressed exploits in MP?
Crashing?
Game stopping bugs?
Save game bugs?


Unlike with physical goods you can buy, fixing the above items is usually out of the question without the developer/publisher doing it. Which is why I picked the analogies I did, you can't fix them easily or cheaply and they prevent you from tolerating/using what you purchased expecting a useable product. And most of them aren't things you'd notice or know when buying it. You'd know if the watch was hard to read, you'd know if the car had a shit paint job, you'd know if a house had wallpaper you didn't like....assuming you looked at them before buying. Games have some screenshots, a little video maybe, and some blurb of text and minimum specs. Beyond that third party reviews are all you have to go on...rarely is there a demo anymore.

And no reasonable person or retail shop would expect you to put up with that stuff on physical goods, nor would a court of law if it came to it unless it was disclosed up front. Game publishers/devs usually disclose very little and you have to be expected to rely on game reviews to try to find out these things if they don't write it off as "it'll probably be fixed" and never mention it.

 
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50. Re: Op Ed Aug 15, 2012, 14:46 Mordecai Walfish
 
Veterator wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 00:16:
So how many people would look at you like you're a lunatic when you tell them they should be buying watches that don't keep time, cars that have major mechanical issues not covered under warranty, a brand new house with a roof that leaks just a little bit, a toothbrush that doesn't clean your teeth and only has a few sharp edges, toothpaste that only makes you want vomit a little, and milk that smells like onions.

How does that even make sense?

Bad analogies galore.. The game should still be fully functional which negates all of these analogies. A watch that is difficult or unsightly to read? A car with a bad paint job, a house with shite wallpaper, a toothbrush with.. wait what?

lol
 
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49. Re: Op Ed Aug 15, 2012, 11:26 m0deth
 
Yet another young author that doesn't have a clue as to how capitalism really works. He just cites the same ole shit we were taught in school, and have yet to see operate as described in practice.

What he misses, and some of you picked up on...is that if you continue to pay for shit, that's all they will sling. Period.
 
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48. Re: Op Ed Aug 15, 2012, 09:40 Chromius
 

Let them go out of business and fade away and let another replace them.
 
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47. Re: Op Ed Aug 15, 2012, 07:42 Prez
 
It seems like the author didn't know which side of the debate to take, so he just decided to argue both. Considering that he told us more than once "that's how capitalism works" I find it odd that he doesn't seem to grasp that if PC gamers buy the crappy ports like he is suggesting then we will continue to see more and lazy console ports because we tell the publishers we're okay with it when we buy them. And THAT is how capitalism works.  
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“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.”
- Mahatma Gandhi
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46. Re: Op Ed Aug 15, 2012, 01:17 Wowbagger_TIP
 
Jerykk wrote on Aug 14, 2012, 23:38:
Sadly, it is often a lose-lose situation for PC gamers. If we buy the crappy ports, the publishers get the message that it's okay to make crappy ports. If we don't buy the crappy ports, the publishers get the message that there's no PC market for their games. Publishers with lots of experience on the platform are less likely to believe the latter, since they have examples of PC games that sold well. However, given Namco's inexperience with the platform, I wouldn't be surprised if they misconstrued Dark Soul's failure as a lack of interest from PC gamers rather than a lack of quality on Namco's behalf.

Seems bizarre that they are incapable of reading reviews and forums to see what people hate about their game. But then I've never worked for one of these publishers. They could be run by monkeys in suits for all I know.
 
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"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." -- Bertrand Russell (I think...)
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45. Re: Op Ed Aug 15, 2012, 00:16 Veterator
 
So how many people would look at you like you're a lunatic when you tell them they should be buying watches that don't keep time, cars that have major mechanical issues not covered under warranty, a brand new house with a roof that leaks just a little bit, a toothbrush that doesn't clean your teeth and only has a few sharp edges, toothpaste that only makes you want vomit a little, and milk that smells like onions.

All for full price....because if you do, the guys who made it will do better next time...probably....maybe. Or you know, sell you the same shit because you bought it the first time and it's cheaper to do it kinda right than completely right.

If you're not careful they might not sell you the product you don't want to use/play/drink/whatever anymore. Oh noees.

I wish I could put out something mediocre and try to guilt people into buying it at 50 bucks a pop, or I won't put further mediocre products. How does that even make sense?

 
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44. Re: Op Ed Aug 14, 2012, 23:45 jdreyer
 
Creston wrote on Aug 14, 2012, 14:02:
Being upfront about something doesn't excuse pisspoor quality. Never has, never will. You can try to be upfront with your boss about why you're not going to do any work this week, and at the end of the week, your ass will still be fired.

I fail to see why some dipshit developer feels that they should somehow be exempt from this rule. 720p is a fucking joke. the PC ran that resolution back in 19fucking96. Now we're supposed to be shouting for joy that 16 years later, we get a game that runs at 720p? Fuck. that.

Creston

Well, the positive thing about their transparency is that it allows we consumers to make an educated (non)purchase. I appreciate that at least, although I've never been interested in this game in the least.

As for the boss-worker analogy it's actually the opposite case where I work. We try to work around people's personal issues when they tell us as to not lose valuable employees. It's when they don't communicate that people get fired.

Voodoo I, released in 1996, was limited to 800x600 resolution and didn't even have SLI. 1024x768 resolution wasn't available until Voodoo 2 was released in 1998, but I get your point.
 
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43. Re: Op Ed Aug 14, 2012, 23:38 Jerykk
 
Icewind wrote on Aug 14, 2012, 19:07:
God, when are people going to get it into their thick skull that buying something you know isn't helping the hobby actually makes things worse since the publisher figures they can get away with it.

If you let them believe we're ok with this, they will continue pushing out shoddy ports. It's like an abused wife that doesn't call the cops on her husband. If you don't put your foot down you'll never see a positive result. The culprit will continue using you because they know you'll allow them to get away with it.

Sadly, it is often a lose-lose situation for PC gamers. If we buy the crappy ports, the publishers get the message that it's okay to make crappy ports. If we don't buy the crappy ports, the publishers get the message that there's no PC market for their games. Publishers with lots of experience on the platform are less likely to believe the latter, since they have examples of PC games that sold well. However, given Namco's inexperience with the platform, I wouldn't be surprised if they misconstrued Dark Soul's failure as a lack of interest from PC gamers rather than a lack of quality on Namco's behalf.
 
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42. Re: Op Ed Aug 14, 2012, 21:45 ASeven
 
A shame really, I would have loved for a decent PC port of Dark Souls. As it is though no sale for me. The quality of the port seems to be appalling so no sale for me.  
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41. Re: Op Ed Aug 14, 2012, 20:28 NegaDeath
 
It feels weird that I'm even using this sentence, but the stuff that Square Enix is publishing on PC is getting lot's of proper PC customization. Deus Ex HR, Hitman Absolution, and todays release of Sleeping Dogs for example. DX11, higher res textures, proper keyboard mapping, and even Steamworks support. And I will (and have) gladly support that effort with my cash. Little excuse for other devs to fall so short.

This comment was edited on Aug 14, 2012, 20:49.
 
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40. Re: Op Ed Aug 14, 2012, 19:07 Icewind
 
God, when are people going to get it into their thick skull that buying something you know isn't helping the hobby actually makes things worse since the publisher figures they can get away with it.

If you let them believe we're ok with this, they will continue pushing out shoddy ports. It's like an abused wife that doesn't call the cops on her husband. If you don't put your foot down you'll never see a positive result. The culprit will continue using you because they know you'll allow them to get away with it.

 
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39. Re: Op Ed Aug 14, 2012, 18:34 SimplyMonk
 
Bhruic wrote on Aug 14, 2012, 18:27:
I don't understand this mentality.

The guy is a shill or has an amazingly bad understanding of how publishers work internally.
 
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38. Re: Op Ed Aug 14, 2012, 18:34 Closed Betas
 
Bhruic wrote on Aug 14, 2012, 18:27:
Don’t think that publishers will see poor sales figures and think “Well, that’s what happens when we don’t optimise our games for PC! Maybe we’ll optimise next time.” You’re kidding yourself. Poor sales figures on PC are poor sales figures on PC, end of story.

I don't understand this mentality. Basically he's saying that companies are unable to figure out the reason for a game having poor sales. This doesn't make sense, as this particular company followed the internet enough to recognize the demand was there in the first place. So this idea they have a blindfold on when it comes to the internet seems excessively silly.

Well, you don't understand the companies.. they are NOT gamers, they are not PC enthusiasts, they are SUITS who have dollars that buy shit presented to them... They make deals then these devs go to work and get beat the shit out of on time restrictions, (and lately have no skills, like devs had in the past, They think coming in 9 to 5 with a 2 hour lunch and snack breaks, and gym time, and donut bar.. Is hard work..) Then its release time, funding is cut.. bye bye.. ship it.. us suits will fool the market, we spent 3 whole days out of this fiscal year how to lie to kids... End of story.

 
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37. Re: Op Ed Aug 14, 2012, 18:30 Closed Betas
 
Lol,

"Hi, we have shit developers and can only work on a static hardware platform and can't even do that well, but please buy our crap port on the PC, because if we see it sells, we'll do better next time.."

"After all we can probably do a bit more than mod a few menu's, setup a few .ini's configuation tweaks and hit a button (output to PC) and scam a few bucks off the suckers out there.. Thanks!!"

Yeah sure, we'll get right in line to purchase some for ya..
 
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36. Re: Op Ed Aug 14, 2012, 18:27 Bhruic
 
Don’t think that publishers will see poor sales figures and think “Well, that’s what happens when we don’t optimise our games for PC! Maybe we’ll optimise next time.” You’re kidding yourself. Poor sales figures on PC are poor sales figures on PC, end of story.

I don't understand this mentality. Basically he's saying that companies are unable to figure out the reason for a game having poor sales. This doesn't make sense, as this particular company followed the internet enough to recognize the demand was there in the first place. So this idea they have a blindfold on when it comes to the internet seems excessively silly.
 
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55 Replies. 3 pages. Viewing page 1.
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