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Gatherings & Competitions

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120. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 16, 2012, 16:17 D-Rock
 
netnerd85 wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 19:56:
What about Women's groups? It's suppose to be about celebrating differences.

'Women's groups' is pretty broad. I'm not sure why you even brought that up.

netnerd85 wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 19:56:
If those that are different felt invited, wanted and not abused in common groups then they wouldn't feel the need to have their own group.

There's nothing wrong with forming your own group. Everyone has felt uninvited, unwanted, and abused at some point in time in their life. So welcome to real life. I associate with the people I like and who respect me, and ignore the ones I don't like -- it's an important life skill.

netnerd85 wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 19:56:
You can create any group you want. You are free to do so. You would have some criticism as ALL groups do.

It's great to live in a country where you are free to organize. I agree that pretty much any common interest group will receive at least some criticizm (heck -- that's what I'm doing to GaymerCon).

What is their agenda anyway? Sure, have a convention with nothing but homosexual gamers so you can game safely, but at the end of the day you go home and the homophobic trash-talkers are still there. My opinion is that singling themselves out is a waste of time -- but to each his/her own.

netnerd85 wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 19:56:
So, let's all just give up?

Those are your words -- not mine. Don't imply that I meant that in any of my posts.

netnerd85 wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 19:56:
No, fuck that.

I'm glad to see you don't agree with that mentality either.


netnerd85 wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 19:56:
I'm going to strive for perfection until I find it. Tolerance, peace for all and yada yada yada. It's a dream to reach for, better than humanity tearing it's self apart, wouldn't you say?

You lost me at 'perfection'. Dreams are great but at some point you have to live in reality. It's how you handle reality that determines where you go in life.

netnerd85 wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 19:56:
Not sure what you are saying here? Sounds like "Get over it and move on". You have no understanding of the issue do you? - that issue being discrimination.

See my previous post so you can understand my experience with discrimination. I'm not sure if 'get over it and move on' is the best choice of words, but if you want to accomplish dreams and goals in life you pretty much have to do that when you encounter obstacles. If you decide to stop when you hit one of those obstacles and just sit around and complain that it's not fair, that's your choice.


netnerd85 wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 19:56:
What are you on about here? It sounds so far off topic.

I figured that the average Blue's News reader could relate to that. The point is that 'making' things fair is not always a good thing. There's a lot of time wasted on that in this Kindergarten country we live in.
 
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119. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 16, 2012, 15:35 Beamer
 
D-Rock wrote on Aug 16, 2012, 12:50:
Beamer wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 17:03:
You didn't whine about it because it didn't happen every waking moment of your life

Also, I don't really see any whining anywhere other than from, in your own terms, white middle class males who feel that everyone experiences life the same way they do...

You don't know enough about me to make either of those statements.

Don't assume I've never experienced what it's like to be a minority. I lived the first 16 years of my life in a neighborhood and school where I was the minority. I've been ridiculed, called names, bullied - I do know what it's like. Instead of whining about how hard it was and that I needed special treatment, I worked hard to better myself and my environment. It wasn't fair but I didn't let that stop me.

Please add something constructive to this thread -- something that's based on what you know, not what you assume about me.

Actually, I do know it didn't happen every waking moment of your life. No white male in America has experienced more than a few moments of what it's like to be a woman or a minority. It's entirely impossible.

Yes, you were ridiculed and called names for being a minority, but what happened if you walked into the nearby Walgreen's? What happened when you applied for a job? What were the expectations for your life? Who where your role models?

This is all the major things you're missing while focusing instead on the minor issues like "no one looked like me."
 
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118. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 16, 2012, 15:31 D-Rock
 
Bhruic wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 19:43:

Approved by who? AFAIK, there's no one that is required to "approve" a group of people having a meetup.

Apparently I don't understand the details of how Meetup actually works so thanks for correcting me as far as that goes. I'm going by information others have provided me in conversation and apparently I've got bad information. I was merely using Meetup as an example based on what's been shared with me about groups specific to race.


Bhruic wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 19:43:
What you effectively seem to be arguing is that everyone that is "different" in some fashion should do their best to hide that fact and not call any attention to it. If they just pretend hard enough to be "normal", perhaps people will leave them alone and stop picking on them.

Apparently I'm not communicating effectively because that's not what I'm trying to say. Everyone is different. I'm not asking anyone to hide their differences and fit a specific profile. There is, however, nothing wrong with 'going with the flow' in society and being proud of who you are despite your differences. I see too many people rocking the boat for attention and not actually being productive with it.

Bhruic wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 19:43:
Why is it that as soon as someone wants to form a group for something with which people have issues, they are just grand-standing and calling attention to themselves?

I have nothing wrong with someone exercising their right to organize and their right to free speech -- I encourage it.

Organizing with a political or societal change agenda is grandstanding and calling attention. That's the point of it. My point is that it's a double edged sword. You'll get attention, but the minute you label yourself a minority or disadvantaged, you're reinforcing that wall that was put there in the first place. Do something more productive with your time...
 
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117. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 16, 2012, 12:50 D-Rock
 
Beamer wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 17:03:
You didn't whine about it because it didn't happen every waking moment of your life

Also, I don't really see any whining anywhere other than from, in your own terms, white middle class males who feel that everyone experiences life the same way they do...

You don't know enough about me to make either of those statements.

Don't assume I've never experienced what it's like to be a minority. I lived the first 16 years of my life in a neighborhood and school where I was the minority. I've been ridiculed, called names, bullied - I do know what it's like. Instead of whining about how hard it was and that I needed special treatment, I worked hard to better myself and my environment. It wasn't fair but I didn't let that stop me.

Please add something constructive to this thread -- something that's based on what you know, not what you assume about me.

This comment was edited on Aug 16, 2012, 13:31.
 
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116. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 15, 2012, 19:56 netnerd85
 
D-Rock wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 13:15:
While I understand that an event like this that has a political statement that's meant to create awareness, I think it hurts more than it helps. They are making a very clear statement that they are different from the majority and they want to be recognized and treated fairly, but by doing it they are also reiterating that they are different. It puts up an even bigger, thicker wall when they make the statement.
What about Women's groups? It's suppose to be about celebrating differences.

D-Rock wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 13:15:
It's ironic that I look on meetup and see plenty of African American groups with common interests -- it's like they're saying "hey, I'm a majority and I want to make everyone aware of it". Yeah, that's helpful -- remind everyone that you're a group that gets singled out by singling yourself out. It's behavior like this that makes the race card a deprecated and ineffective method of getting what you feel is fair. Most people don't take it seriously anymore.
If those that are different felt invited, wanted and not abused in common groups then they wouldn't feel the need to have their own group.

D-Rock wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 13:15:
Let's say I'm a white middle class male and I want to start my own meetup group. Let's call it "White Middle Class Male Gamers". How long do you think that group would stay in existence (or would it even be approved as a group in the first place?). Suddenly it's not fair to me -- because I'm a majority I can't exercise my right to free speech and tell everyone how proud I am to be the person I was born as. I seriously doubt I'd be able to (on an 'official' level)congregate with people in my specific demographic that have a common interest without being labeled a hate group. Think about it realistically -- does anyone think something like this would NOT cause enough controversy to be next to impossible to establish or maintain?
You can create any group you want. You are free to do so. You would have some criticism as ALL groups do.

D-Rock wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 13:15:
This all brings me to a simple point -- life isn't fair. No matter how hard you try to make it fair, that level of perfection will never be attainable. There are consequences for the choices you make in life, and there are even consequences to who you're born as.
So, let's all just give up? No, fuck that. I'm going to strive for perfection until I find it. Tolerance, peace for all and yada yada yada. It's a dream to reach for, better than humanity tearing it's self apart, wouldn't you say?

D-Rock wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 13:15:
While technically I'm not a minority, I've experienced what it's like to be one many times in my life and I know it's not fun. I didn't whine about it, got on with my life, and did the best I could with the resources I had. It's the way I continue to live today and others respect me as a result of it. I respect myself because of those decisions.
Not sure what you are saying here? Sounds like "Get over it and move on". You have no understanding of the issue do you? - that issue being discrimination.

D-Rock wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 13:15:
Imagine if every multiplayer game you played had a handicap that balanced things out for all players. How would you feel if you were highly skilled and never got the opportunity to realize the results of them? Would you truly be happy if all you had to do is blindly click to win a game and nevery really learn anything from it?
What are you on about here? It sounds so far off topic.
 
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115. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 15, 2012, 19:43 Bhruic
 
D-Rock wrote on Aug 15, 2012, 13:15:
Let's say I'm a white middle class male and I want to start my own meetup group. Let's call it "White Middle Class Male Gamers". How long do you think that group would stay in existence (or would it even be approved as a group in the first place?). Suddenly it's not fair to me -- because I'm a majority I can't exercise my right to free speech and tell everyone how proud I am to be the person I was born as. I seriously doubt I'd be able to (on an 'official' level)congregate with people in my specific demographic that have a common interest without being labeled a hate group. Think about it realistically -- does anyone think something like this would NOT cause enough controversy to be next to impossible to establish or maintain?

Approved by who? AFAIK, there's no one that is required to "approve" a group of people having a meetup. If you want to have your own group called that, go ahead. Might some people complain about it? Certainly. But other people complaining doesn't stop you from doing something.

What you effectively seem to be arguing is that everyone that is "different" in some fashion should do their best to hide that fact and not call any attention to it. If they just pretend hard enough to be "normal", perhaps people will leave them alone and stop picking on them. That's a really poor way to have to go through life. Not to mention an unrealistic one, when you consider how many groups already exist. Christians of all the various stripes have their meeting places. So do Muslims. So do Hindus. Etc. You have groups for model trains. Hell, you have groups for knitting. Why is it that as soon as someone wants to form a group for something with which people have issues, they are just grand-standing and calling attention to themselves? Shouldn't the same be true for all the rest? Should Christians stop having group meetings because they are calling attention to the fact they are different than non-Christians?

This comment was edited on Aug 15, 2012, 20:22.
 
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114. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 15, 2012, 17:03 Beamer
 
You didn't whine about it because it didn't happen every waking moment of your life.

Life isn't fair, you're right, but couldn't we take strides to make it more fair?


Also, I don't really see any whining anywhere other than from, in your own terms, white middle class males who feel that everyone experiences life the same way they do...
 
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http://www.hydrahead.com
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113. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 15, 2012, 13:15 D-Rock
 
I could care less about people's personal preferences or the way they were born, as long as it does not have a negative impact on me. The right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness is a very important concept that's one of the ideals that defines what this country is all about. This group of gamers has done nothing wrong and deserves to speak freely, congregate in a legal manner, etc.

While I understand that an event like this that has a political statement that's meant to create awareness, I think it hurts more than it helps. They are making a very clear statement that they are different from the majority and they want to be recognized and treated fairly, but by doing it they are also reiterating that they are different. It puts up an even bigger, thicker wall when they make the statement.

It's ironic that I look on meetup and see plenty of African American groups with common interests -- it's like they're saying "hey, I'm a minority and I want to make everyone aware of it". Yeah, that's helpful -- remind everyone that you're a group that gets singled out by singling yourself out. It's behavior like this that makes the race card a deprecated and ineffective method of getting what you feel is fair. Most people don't take it seriously anymore.

Let's say I'm a white middle class male and I want to start my own meetup group. Let's call it "White Middle Class Male Gamers". How long do you think that group would stay in existence (or would it even be approved as a group in the first place?). Suddenly it's not fair to me -- because I'm a majority I can't exercise my right to free speech and tell everyone how proud I am to be the person I was born as. I seriously doubt I'd be able to (on an 'official' level)congregate with people in my specific demographic that have a common interest without being labeled a hate group. Think about it realistically -- does anyone think something like this would NOT cause enough controversy to be next to impossible to establish or maintain?

This all brings me to a simple point -- life isn't fair. No matter how hard you try to make it fair, that level of perfection will never be attainable. There are consequences for the choices you make in life, and there are even consequences to who you're born as. While technically I'm not a minority, I've experienced what it's like to be one many times in my life and I know it's not fun. I didn't whine about it, got on with my life, and did the best I could with the resources I had. It's the way I continue to live today and others respect me as a result of it. I respect myself because of those decisions.

Imagine if every multiplayer game you played had a handicap that balanced things out for all players. How would you feel if you were highly skilled and never got the opportunity to realize the results of them? Would you truly be happy if all you had to do is blindly click to win a game and nevery really learn anything from it?

This comment was edited on Aug 17, 2012, 09:36.
 
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112. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 14, 2012, 08:44 Verno
 
RailWizard wrote on Aug 13, 2012, 21:08:
It's attention whoring for a cause I don't agree with.

So you have a similar problem with churches, gun clubs and other social or ethnic groups? How about charities? As long as you agree with it, the cause deserves attention but if you don't then they have no right to free speech or deserve access to the same public spaces?

Nothing will change that or my attitude about it, just like nothing will change yours.

Speak for yourself. I've got an open mind and have no problem changing it when I've been convinced of something through logic and reason. I don't see why you would want to advertise being close minded and willfully stubborn as if it was a virtue.
 
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111. removed Aug 14, 2012, 03:53 RailWizard
 
* REMOVED *
This comment was deleted on Aug 14, 2012, 09:19.
 
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110. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 14, 2012, 03:04 Bhruic
 
RailWizard wrote on Aug 13, 2012, 21:08:
Nothing will change that or my attitude about it, just like nothing will change yours.

I'm sure you won't change your attitude. The same way that people who thought blacks were an inferior race and people who thought that women were an inferior gender didn't change their attitudes. Luckily society moved on, and people with such antiquated attitudes are now both a minority, and looked on with scorn.

As people with your attitude will be.
 
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109. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 14, 2012, 01:52 netnerd85
 
RailWizard wrote on Aug 13, 2012, 21:08:
It's attention whoring for a cause I don't agree with.

Nothing will change that or my attitude about it, just like nothing will change yours.

So here we are in this impossible scenario. In the old days the next step would be obvious, now I'm not so sure, but I know there will be a breaking point event at some point if this continues to be pushed. Natural selection will decide ultimately.

Derpa derr... like you said, histories greatest Generals.

Histories greatest musicians, artists, writers, actors... OH do I go on? you breed us so we can better the human race. It's a balance.

Hope this upsets you as you lay awake in bed at night, watching the doors, watching the windows for the HOMOSEXUAL! sleep tight little white heterosexual man, we are coming.

Please, there is surely a public library near you? learn something.
 
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108. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 13, 2012, 21:08 RailWizard
 
It's attention whoring for a cause I don't agree with.

Nothing will change that or my attitude about it, just like nothing will change yours.

So here we are in this impossible scenario. In the old days the next step would be obvious, now I'm not so sure, but I know there will be a breaking point event at some point if this continues to be pushed. Natural selection will decide ultimately.

 
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107. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 13, 2012, 09:34 Verno
 
RailWizard wrote on Aug 13, 2012, 07:02:
You all, perhaps due the severity of your buthurtedness, are missing the point entirely here.

I don't really give a shit about gays, or what they do. Only when I see stuff like this does it become a problem because I don't think they deserve any special attention or privilege.

Minorities need special dispensation and protection because of their inherent social status but let's put governmental issues aside. If a gay community wants to have a parade here, they need a parade permit. They pay for the right to it like any other social or ethnic group. The article talks about hosting their own convention, I don't see the problem with that, they will be paying for the space after all. Why does a Christian group or a gun club get to host rallies but not gay people? You could still attend if you want to, the majority of minority hosted events are all about acceptance and rarely close their doors to the public.

There is no need or reason to feel threatened by minority groups. They are people the same as you. They celebrate their status largely because of it being repressed for so long. As these things become more accepted and engrained into society they will become less and less newsworthy.
 
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106. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 13, 2012, 08:32 Beamer
 
RailWizard wrote on Aug 13, 2012, 07:02:
You all, perhaps due the severity of your buthurtedness, are missing the point entirely here.

I don't really give a shit about gays, or what they do. Only when I see stuff like this does it become a problem because I don't think they deserve any special attention or privilege.

The only ones I don't have a problem with when they do this is based on race. The reason for that should be obvious. However here in North America, there are only 2 races where this is acceptable. Blacks and Natives.

The only reason this shit blows up like this is because you fascist pricks think you own everyone.

So you can all put down the eye spreaders + drops and turn off the Ludwig Van.

I'm done here. (i think...)

I'm not sure how your refusal to let GaymerCon provide a "safe place" means we think we own everyone. Seems... reverse, no?

And if you think gay people don't deserve anything special then you agree they shouldn't be singled out as unable to get married, right? Because not letting them marry is some kind of "special" status.

And do you really have 15+ posts in this thread simply because you don't think they should have anything special (as if they really have anything special right now...)
 
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105. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 13, 2012, 07:47 nin
 
yuastnav wrote on Aug 13, 2012, 07:42:
RailWizard wrote on Aug 13, 2012, 07:02:
You all, perhaps due the severity of your buthurtedness, are missing the point entirely here.

I don't really give a shit about gays, or what they do. Only when I see stuff like this does it become a problem because I don't think they deserve any special attention or privilege.

The only ones I don't have a problem with when they do this is based on race. The reason for that should be obvious. However here in North America, there are only 2 races where this is acceptable. Blacks and Natives.

The only reason this shit blows up like this is because you fascist pricks think you own everyone.

So you can all put down the eye spreaders + drops and turn off the Ludwig Van.

I'm done here. (i think...)

Us fascists? You are the one who is talking about races!
There is only one human race on this planet that is still alive and this is the homo sapiens. You are still stuck in the 20th century with your outdated ideas and ideals and since you are mad that the world has left you behind a long time ago you start making up bs and calling everyone else a hypocrite.
The only thing that has come out of you are insults because you fail entirely to make a coherent argument.
Stop being so fething delusional.


Says everyone else is butthurt, then calls everyone fascist pricks...I'm laughing my ass off!

 
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104. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 13, 2012, 07:42 yuastnav
 
RailWizard wrote on Aug 13, 2012, 07:02:
You all, perhaps due the severity of your buthurtedness, are missing the point entirely here.

I don't really give a shit about gays, or what they do. Only when I see stuff like this does it become a problem because I don't think they deserve any special attention or privilege.

The only ones I don't have a problem with when they do this is based on race. The reason for that should be obvious. However here in North America, there are only 2 races where this is acceptable. Blacks and Natives.

The only reason this shit blows up like this is because you fascist pricks think you own everyone.

So you can all put down the eye spreaders + drops and turn off the Ludwig Van.

I'm done here. (i think...)

Us fascists? You are the one who is talking about races!
There is only one human race on this planet that is still alive and this is the homo sapiens. You are still stuck in the 20th century with your outdated ideas and ideals and since you are mad that the world has left you behind a long time ago you start making up bs and calling everyone else a hypocrite.
The only thing that has come out of you are insults because you fail entirely to make a coherent argument.
Stop being so fething delusional.
 
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103. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 13, 2012, 07:13 reisub
 
Why is paying money to hire out a convention centre a privilege?  
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102. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 13, 2012, 07:02 RailWizard
 
You all, perhaps due the severity of your buthurtedness, are missing the point entirely here.

I don't really give a shit about gays, or what they do. Only when I see stuff like this does it become a problem because I don't think they deserve any special attention or privilege.

The only ones I don't have a problem with when they do this is based on race. The reason for that should be obvious. However here in North America, there are only 2 races where this is acceptable. Blacks and Natives.

The only reason this shit blows up like this is because you fascist pricks think you own everyone.

So you can all put down the eye spreaders + drops and turn off the Ludwig Van.

I'm done here. (i think...)
 
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101. Re: Gatherings & Competitions Aug 13, 2012, 06:50 reisub
 
It seems to boil down to homosexuals are homosexual because they're crazy, the evidence for which being their homosexuality. Is that right?  
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