24 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
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| 24. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 9, 2012, 08:58 |
Verno |
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| Endless Space is pretty fun, I've found myself really enjoying the MP. People complain about the AI but it's nowhere near as bad as the brain dead Civ 5 stuff. |
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Playing: Path of Exile, Animal Crossing, Tales of Graces F
Watching: Survivorman, Justified, Silent Running |
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| 23. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 9, 2012, 05:21 |
RailWizard |
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Scottish Martial Arts wrote on Jul 9, 2012, 05:03:
It's a learning curve. A curve you will learn if you want to be good. Just like any other realistic simulator.
Except that, once mastered, Arma still feels clunky and inelegant, particularly the squad command interface. Since you want to compare it to simulators, compare Arma to DCS A-10C. The latter has a steep learning curve, but once the HOTAS commands are mastered, it's easy and intuitive to accomplish any task in the cockpit. Or look at the Unix command line interface: difficult to learn, extraordinarily easy to use. A learning curve reflects complexity, sure, but once that learning curve is climbed, if the interface still feels frustrating to use, then that reflects poor design. Arma and Operation Flashpoin, for all their strengths, have never been very well designed with regard to the interface.
The reality is that Arma is a niche product. Even among simulator junkies it has its detractors, since the game oscillates between realism (ballistics) and arcadiness (pretty much everything else). The success of DayZ, while a boon in sales for BIS, is only going to draw so many new fans to the series.
Well you got me there. I haven't done much with the vanilla game, so not sure what the squad ui is like.
I do tend to put up with quite a lot when it comes to bad UIs. It just doesn't bother me so much for some reason. Realizing this, I also think it gives me an edge over others who struggle with it. So to me, weakness becomes strength. Then again as I said above, I don't entirely know what I'm talking about. lol
I also don't mind if Dayz remains a niche game. Think I prefer it actually as the 'masses' today don't have much to offer. |
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| 22. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 9, 2012, 05:03 |
Scottish Martial Arts |
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It's a learning curve. A curve you will learn if you want to be good. Just like any other realistic simulator.
Except that, once mastered, Arma still feels clunky and inelegant, particularly the squad command interface. Since you want to compare it to simulators, compare Arma to DCS A-10C. The latter has a steep learning curve, but once the HOTAS commands are mastered, it's easy and intuitive to accomplish any task in the cockpit. Or look at the Unix command line interface: difficult to learn, extraordinarily easy to use. A learning curve reflects complexity, sure, but once that learning curve is climbed, if the interface still feels frustrating to use, then that reflects poor design. Arma and Operation Flashpoin, for all their strengths, have never been very well designed with regard to the interface.
The reality is that Arma is a niche product. Even among simulator junkies it has its detractors, since the game oscillates between realism (ballistics) and arcadiness (pretty much everything else). The success of DayZ, while a boon in sales for BIS, is only going to draw so many new fans to the series.
This comment was edited on Jul 9, 2012, 05:09. |
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| 21. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 9, 2012, 04:20 |
RailWizard |
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Krovven wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 21:02:
Jerykk wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 18:29:
Krovven wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:41:
psst, just because someone buys Arma II for DayZ doesn't mean they will keep playing it beyond the first 15-30min. Nor does it mean they will tolerate the controls or the gameplay in Arma.
Maybe. But if everyone hated the controls and gameplay, you'd think that negative word of mouth would have spread by now. Arma 2 has been on top of the Steam list for weeks.
People like the gameplay of DayZ, they put up with the controls. This has been repeated over and over by a lot of people.
Arma 2 has both shit gameplay and shit controls.
People buying Arma 2 aren't buying it for Arma.
As far as I'm concerned, best thing DayZ could do, is move to a better engine.
What do you mean by shit controls exactly? Are you left-handed like me? Cuz I need to rebind pretty much everything for every single game I play...
"Shit controls" AKA Overly complex controls are par for the course in tactical shooters. It adds encumbrance to slow you down so you don't run around like a moron in CoD or any other arcadey shooter. Also helps you hide and/or be stealthy when needed.
It's a learning curve. A curve you will learn if you want to be good. Just like any other realistic simulator. |
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| 20. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 21:47 |
Krovven |
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Dev wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 21:31:
I wasn't suggesting the people buying it are arma 2 fans who will buy arma 3.
And if you look at the first post, that's exactly what he was suggesting, and I was countering.
And your numbers, nor do mine, tell us anything about how many people buy it and stop playing after a very short period of time. Which was my point. I wouldn't be at all surprised if there are more sales than there are players. Which is actually a compliment towards the mod as I think they'd have far more players if they were not using the Arma 2 engine.
I missed the 22,000 and was looking at the '110,000 in 24 hrs'. That's decent numbers, but could also be cherry picked from a high peak after a sale. I thought the recent word was that the interest in DayZ had fallen off due to some changes to social impact gameplay?
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| 19. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 21:31 |
Dev |
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Krovven wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 20:56:
Dev wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:55:
Krovven wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:41:
psst, just because someone buys Arma II for DayZ doesn't mean they will keep playing it beyond the first 15-30min. Psst, if one RTFA on the day z news blue posted a little above they'd see this:
"Currently we're running 22,000 concurrent at full peak, and 10,000 off peak
[...]
"We now have 1000 servers. We're getting 110,000 players in a 24 hour period at the moment."
Thats not the player numbers for people buying and stopping playing after a few mins. Thats twice as good as the player numbers steam has for things like L4D2, and almost half as good as the numbers for CS. You can hardly compare Steam numbers for L4D2 to a static 24 hr period that they are referring to in the article. L4D2 peak today (so far) was 11,365....that's PEAK unique users at a single specific point of day, that's not unique users for the whole day. Arma 2 (on Steam) is sitting at 4,723 peak.
How does this automatically translate to new fans for Arma 3 as the OP was suggesting? It doesn't, at all. People are buying the game for DayZ, not Arma. I can actually compare them. In the article he mentions two sets of numbers, one for a peak and one for unique. The peak he mentions is 22k, the unique is 110k. I can compare the current peak of 22k to l4d2's current peak of 11k. 11 is about half of 22. And 22 is about half of the 40ish of CS.
The arma 2 numbers on steam do NOT comprise the entire game's players since its NOT steamworks. Lots of people bought on amazon recently when they were running the sale. Hence, one cannot directly compare numbers listed in steam for non steamworks games on steam vs steamwork only games on steam (such as l4d2). However, one CAN compare official peak numbers from the mod author vs official steamwork only game peak numbers. Its certainly not a perfect comparison, but its doable.
I wasn't suggesting the people buying it are arma 2 fans who will buy arma 3. The point I was debating was the one I quoted, about people not playing it past 15 minutes.
I think its HIGHLY unlikely that a game would stay that high in steam top ten if the majority of people thought it (and/or its mods) sucked so bad it wasn't worth playing after 15 mins, especially given that this game's sales are basically going on word of mouth about a mod. If I bought it and a friend asked what I thought and I thought it sucked, I'd tell them so.
Also, I think its HIGHLY unlikely that a game has that many players (daily peak, daily unique, or total) if a majority of them are stopping after 15 minutes because of an immense suckage factor. I chose the peak number to look at because its more easily comparable to other games current peak numbers such as on steam stats. To me, that gives it a more tangible feel for where its current MP popularity is compared to some other games current MP popularity.
This comment was edited on Jul 8, 2012, 21:43. |
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| 18. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 21:02 |
Krovven |
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Jerykk wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 18:29:
Krovven wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:41:
psst, just because someone buys Arma II for DayZ doesn't mean they will keep playing it beyond the first 15-30min. Nor does it mean they will tolerate the controls or the gameplay in Arma.
Maybe. But if everyone hated the controls and gameplay, you'd think that negative word of mouth would have spread by now. Arma 2 has been on top of the Steam list for weeks.
People like the gameplay of DayZ, they put up with the controls. This has been repeated over and over by a lot of people.
Arma 2 has both shit gameplay and shit controls.
People buying Arma 2 aren't buying it for Arma.
As far as I'm concerned, best thing DayZ could do, is move to a better engine.
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| 17. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 20:56 |
Krovven |
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Dev wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:55:
Krovven wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:41:
psst, just because someone buys Arma II for DayZ doesn't mean they will keep playing it beyond the first 15-30min. Psst, if one RTFA on the day z news blue posted a little above they'd see this:
"Currently we're running 22,000 concurrent at full peak, and 10,000 off peak
[...]
"We now have 1000 servers. We're getting 110,000 players in a 24 hour period at the moment."
Thats not the player numbers for people buying and stopping playing after a few mins. Thats twice as good as the player numbers steam has for things like L4D2, and almost half as good as the numbers for CS.
And that has what to do with the ratio of purchases to those still playing? And how does that correlate to those that stopped playing due to controls? Nothing. Feel free to continue debating what is only a theory based on the shit controls and gameplay of the Arma series. Just like Techie's theory that people buying Arma 2 for DayZ automatically turn into people buying vanilla Arma 3.
You can hardly compare Steam numbers for L4D2 to a static 24 hr period that they are referring to in the article. L4D2 peak today (so far) was 11,365....that's PEAK unique users at a single specific point of day, that's not unique users for the whole day. Arma 2 (on Steam) is sitting at 4,723 peak.
How does this automatically translate to new fans for Arma 3 as the OP was suggesting? It doesn't, at all. People are buying the game for DayZ, not Arma.
This comment was edited on Jul 8, 2012, 21:08. |
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| 16. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 20:15 |
wtf_man |
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Jerykk wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 19:40:
It will probably shoot up even higher when the DLC is available for the PC.
From what I've read, the Dawnguard DLC is pretty underwhelming so I don't expect it to really help Skyrim's PC sales, especially when the mod community has already released superior DLC for free.
Yeah... I am on the fence to get it as well... While the Vampire Story in Morthal was interesting... I'm not sure they should have gone with that faction for the DLC.
I still think it will shoot Skyrim up to the top 3 of Steam for a week or two, at least. |
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| 15. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 19:40 |
Jerykk |
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It will probably shoot up even higher when the DLC is available for the PC.
From what I've read, the Dawnguard DLC is pretty underwhelming so I don't expect it to really help Skyrim's PC sales, especially when the mod community has already released superior DLC for free. |
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| 14. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 19:33 |
nin |
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wtf_man wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 19:25:
Kitkoan wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:59:
So does anyone know how Skyrim is still in the top ten physically? There is a limit where everyone who will buy it has bought it...
Well... in the past we used to see The Sims in the top 10... like for years in a row... so I would have to guess that there are still plenty of people available to buy Skyrim. I'm guessing some that are holding out for a sale, and can no longer hold out... others that are hearing how good it is from friends, and just buying it.
It will probably shoot up even higher when the DLC is available for the PC.
There's been a few weekends where other sites outside of steam sell it for $40. I'm not sure they're looking at purchases exclusively through steam, or if it counts if someone registers a serial.
Either way, a purchase for the pc version is always a good thing, and I'm glad it's done well.
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RollinThundr Apr 17, 2013, 12:25: Eh really tossing stuff like that in there only to get your panties all bunched up. If you really want to call that trolling sure.
Mr. Tact Apr 17, 2013, 12:33: Pretty sure that's the definition of trolling... |
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| 13. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 19:25 |
wtf_man |
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Kitkoan wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:59:
So does anyone know how Skyrim is still in the top ten physically? There is a limit where everyone who will buy it has bought it...
Well... in the past we used to see The Sims in the top 10... like for years in a row... so I would have to guess that there are still plenty of people available to buy Skyrim. I'm guessing some that are holding out for a sale, and can no longer hold out... others that are hearing how good it is from friends, and just buying it.
It will probably shoot up even higher when the DLC is available for the PC. |
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| 12. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 18:29 |
Jerykk |
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Krovven wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:41:
psst, just because someone buys Arma II for DayZ doesn't mean they will keep playing it beyond the first 15-30min. Nor does it mean they will tolerate the controls or the gameplay in Arma.
Maybe. But if everyone hated the controls and gameplay, you'd think that negative word of mouth would have spread by now. Arma 2 has been on top of the Steam list for weeks. |
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| 11. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 17:36 |
RailWizard |
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Krovven wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:41:
psst, just because someone buys Arma II for DayZ doesn't mean they will keep playing it beyond the first 15-30min. Nor does it mean they will tolerate the controls or the gameplay in Arma.
They won't because they will. They will because they won't.
It's like speaking without words.... |
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| 10. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 17:35 |
Wallshadows |
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| The control scheme for DayZ ranges from great to batshit wonky and it's hard to get it exact on various actions which range from climbing ladders to refilling your jerry can. It becomes even more stressful when you're being chased around and there is simply no time either find the right position to perform an action or wait for the animation to complete so you can haul ass. |
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| 9. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 16:43 |
nin |
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ASeven wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 16:20:
Did someone say... Skyrim?
I'm so, so sorry...
I still prefer Skyrm:Bear |
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RollinThundr Apr 17, 2013, 12:25: Eh really tossing stuff like that in there only to get your panties all bunched up. If you really want to call that trolling sure.
Mr. Tact Apr 17, 2013, 12:33: Pretty sure that's the definition of trolling... |
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| 8. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 16:22 |
ASeven |
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Dev wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:55:
Krovven wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:41:
psst, just because someone buys Arma II for DayZ doesn't mean they will keep playing it beyond the first 15-30min. Psst, if one RTFA on the day z news blue posted a little above they'd see this:
"Currently we're running 22,000 concurrent at full peak, and 10,000 off peak
[...]
"We now have 1000 servers. We're getting 110,000 players in a 24 hour period at the moment."
Thats not the player numbers for people buying and stopping playing after a few mins. Thats twice as good as the player numbers steam has for things like L4D2, and almost half as good as the numbers for CS.
It's krovven, what do you expect, logic and facts? Hell, next he'll be saying mods don't sell games. |
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| 7. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 16:20 |
ASeven |
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Did someone say... Skyrim?
I'm so, so sorry... |
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| 6. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 15:59 |
Kitkoan |
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| So does anyone know how Skyrim is still in the top ten physically? There is a limit where everyone who will buy it has bought it... |
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| *automatically refuses to place horse heads in anyone's bed* |
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| 5. |
Re: Steam Top 10 |
Jul 8, 2012, 15:55 |
Dev |
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Krovven wrote on Jul 8, 2012, 15:41:
psst, just because someone buys Arma II for DayZ doesn't mean they will keep playing it beyond the first 15-30min. Psst, if one RTFA on the day z news blue posted a little above they'd see this:
"Currently we're running 22,000 concurrent at full peak, and 10,000 off peak
[...]
"We now have 1000 servers. We're getting 110,000 players in a 24 hour period at the moment."
Thats not the player numbers for people buying and stopping playing after a few mins. Thats twice as good as the player numbers steam has for things like L4D2, and almost half as good as the numbers for CS. |
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24 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
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