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Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans

The Legend of Grimrock Website has an update on what's up at Almost Human as the work on post-release support for their dungeon-crawler. They mention the developers' lives have been made easier by the acquisition of proper rigs, and talks of how pleasantly surprised they are at the game's success, which is allowing them the luxury of some time to sort out what their next project will be, a process that brought them back to where they started: "It took us some time to evaluate these but in the end we realized that building our own games is the reason why we are here and the success of Grimrock tells us that it is a good reason. So we’re committed to keep working on Grimrock and see where that road leads us. The exact form, whether it be an expansion, a full blown sequel or even something completely different, is still undecided. Frankly, we were a bit exhausted with the whole concept of grid-based games after working so intensely for a year but as some time has passed we now think that we have more to give to this genre." In the meantime they continue to work on the editor, and there's a progress report on that as well.

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21 Replies. 2 pages. Viewing page 1.
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21. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 21, 2012, 08:41 briktal
 
Beamer wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 15:05:
briktal wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 14:55:
Beamer wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 10:53:
Dades wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 10:44:
Never had a chance to play this, what was the general consensus around here?

General consensus around here is overwhelmingly positive. One of those rare games almost everyone here loves.

I did not love it. I found it an awful combination of FPS and old school dungeon crawler, like taking the worst parts of Zork, Nethack and Doom and throwing them into a pot. Every wall looks the same, you can only move in cardinal directions (it's tile based), combat is real time but turn based, and you find some things by mouse looking. I found combat annoying, I found the dungeons dull, and I really hated that I was in first person but had to move a tile at a time.

I'd prefer playing Zork, Nethack or Doom.

There is a set of "old school dungeon crawlers" more or less exactly like it already, so they didn't really create a genre by mashing up some old games. And I think that was one of the keys to the success/positive reaction to the game. It was a very simple, focused indie made modern version of an existing, well-defined genre. About as close as the "Game X with better graphics" many fans of classics wish for. A lot of people went into it knowing exactly what to expect, and it delivered that. Grimrock also avoided the biggest problem these kinds of genre remakes have because it is such a simple game. That prevents almost all of the "well it didn't have x..." or "back in the day y worked like this..." complaints as well. Picking a genre that has been dead for 20 years didn't hurt either.

Oh, I agree, though none of the dungeon crawlers I played were quite like this (it moved closer to FPS, while still limiting you.)

And I didn't like it. I'm all for reviving old genres, but dislike doing so without getting rid of the old warts. Sticking me on a tile, and keeping me with kind of turn based kind of real time combat just isn't fun to me. It was that way due to technical limitations back then. Now that we're no longer limited I'd prefer more freedom of movement and freedom of combat. It feels, to me, like remaking X-COM and still making you do base defenses where only 3 of your guys have clips because everyone else is holding an empty heavy plasma.

I'd say that for these games, going from tile movement to free movement would be more like remaking X-COM and instead of using TUs, using a move and shoot system.
 
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20. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 21:14 Bhruic
 
My big problem with the game was the forced-reload scenarios. The times where you'd be randomly teleported, or find the door behind you lock, or find a bunch of doors suddenly open, where you have no chance of surviving unless you know about it ahead of time. Once you are surrounded on multiple sides by enemies, you are pretty much dead. So you get forced to reload and deal with the situation now that you know it's about to occur. No real skill involved with stuff like that.

But otherwise, it was decent fun. I did end up having to look up one or two things online, just because it's no fun being stuck when you can only bang your head against the wall (somewhat literally in-game!). But most of them were challenging without being impossible to figure out.
 
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19. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 19:22 jacobvandy
 
Zadig wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 19:01:
enemies constantly respawn? I was hoping to see Grimrock during the summer Steam sale but that's something I usually can't tolerate.

Not everywhere; for most of the game it's just snails in certain areas so that you don't run out of food. But in the latter stages when all hell starts breaking loose, the pace of gameplay completely changes. No more clearing an area and spending a bunch of time exploring and finding secrets, you're basically shepherded to the end. I really would like to see a randomized replay mode that doesn't have the same scripted plot events that kind of spoil the experience.
 
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18. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 19:01 Zadig
 
enemies constantly respawn? I was hoping to see Grimrock during the summer Steam sale but that's something I usually can't tolerate.  
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17. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 15:25 jacobvandy
 
I did finish it... Overall was very cool, lots of puzzles and hidden areas/loot to find. However the combat was quite tedious, and in the latter sections of the game enemies constantly respawn and don't give you the freedom to just hang around and explore the nooks and crannies of exponentially more complex areas. Couldn't really find secrets at that point unless you stumbled upon them, so I knew I was missing things in practically being forced to move on, which really irked me.  
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16. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 15:23 Orogogus
 
I think there were basically a handful of games in this niche genre before Grimrock -- Dungeon Master, Eye of the Beholder 1-3, Dungeon Hack and Stonekeep. And I guess Might & Magic skirted pretty close around Isles of Terra and Xeen. I don't really know that I'd say they're that way because of technical limitations. By the time Stonekeep came out there was already Ultima Underworld I & II, SSI's Ravenloft and Menzoberranzan and a few others, all real-time gridless action RPGs. It places less emphasis on action skills than something like Deus Ex, but isn't as sterile as, say, Wizardry, Bard's Tale or the old Might & Magics  
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15. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 15:21 Beamer
 
jimnms wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 15:16:
Orogogus wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 12:48:
jimnms wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 12:44:
I liked it too, and I also need to finish it. I got stuck, took a break hoping I'd come back fresh and feel like an idiot when I find out what I missed.

I like that it's a modern version of games like Eye of the Beholder, etc., but I'd like to see a blend of LoG with roguelike elements, ie. random dungeons, permadeath (optional).

That was Dungeon Hack, made with the Eye of the Beholder II engine. Permadeath would feel kind of weird with a party-based game, though.

I think it could work. Like in Dungeons of Dredmor, have it an option and remove the ability to save/load with it on. If a party member dies, it's permanent. After all party members die, it's game over, save deleted.

While I get the hardcore mode, like Diablo, I still prefer it in a rogue-like game that is short and played in one session.

I used to keep a running list of ways I died in Nethack:
- wearing a blindfold to use my telepathy to hunt down a cockatrice and a kobold wizard, having my gauntlets exploded when the kobold read a scroll of destroy armor at me, killing them both, feeling around on the ground for the cockatrice's corpse so i could stone things with it and getting instantly petrified because i touched it when my gloves were off

- choking to death trying to eat The Largest Giant

- disintegrated by god for committing heresy

- casting genocide on my own race

- killed by my own ghost

- polymorph trap turned me into a water-breathing creature, nowhere near water



I need to start playing again!
 
-------------
Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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14. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 15:16 jimnms
 
Orogogus wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 12:48:
jimnms wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 12:44:
I liked it too, and I also need to finish it. I got stuck, took a break hoping I'd come back fresh and feel like an idiot when I find out what I missed.

I like that it's a modern version of games like Eye of the Beholder, etc., but I'd like to see a blend of LoG with roguelike elements, ie. random dungeons, permadeath (optional).

That was Dungeon Hack, made with the Eye of the Beholder II engine. Permadeath would feel kind of weird with a party-based game, though.

I think it could work. Like in Dungeons of Dredmor, have it an option and remove the ability to save/load with it on. If a party member dies, it's permanent. After all party members die, it's game over, save deleted.
 
Avatar 17277
 
MeanJim on Steam
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13. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 15:05 Beamer
 
briktal wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 14:55:
Beamer wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 10:53:
Dades wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 10:44:
Never had a chance to play this, what was the general consensus around here?

General consensus around here is overwhelmingly positive. One of those rare games almost everyone here loves.

I did not love it. I found it an awful combination of FPS and old school dungeon crawler, like taking the worst parts of Zork, Nethack and Doom and throwing them into a pot. Every wall looks the same, you can only move in cardinal directions (it's tile based), combat is real time but turn based, and you find some things by mouse looking. I found combat annoying, I found the dungeons dull, and I really hated that I was in first person but had to move a tile at a time.

I'd prefer playing Zork, Nethack or Doom.

There is a set of "old school dungeon crawlers" more or less exactly like it already, so they didn't really create a genre by mashing up some old games. And I think that was one of the keys to the success/positive reaction to the game. It was a very simple, focused indie made modern version of an existing, well-defined genre. About as close as the "Game X with better graphics" many fans of classics wish for. A lot of people went into it knowing exactly what to expect, and it delivered that. Grimrock also avoided the biggest problem these kinds of genre remakes have because it is such a simple game. That prevents almost all of the "well it didn't have x..." or "back in the day y worked like this..." complaints as well. Picking a genre that has been dead for 20 years didn't hurt either.

Oh, I agree, though none of the dungeon crawlers I played were quite like this (it moved closer to FPS, while still limiting you.)

And I didn't like it. I'm all for reviving old genres, but dislike doing so without getting rid of the old warts. Sticking me on a tile, and keeping me with kind of turn based kind of real time combat just isn't fun to me. It was that way due to technical limitations back then. Now that we're no longer limited I'd prefer more freedom of movement and freedom of combat. It feels, to me, like remaking X-COM and still making you do base defenses where only 3 of your guys have clips because everyone else is holding an empty heavy plasma.
 
-------------
Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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12. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 14:59 Dades
 
I picked it up thanks to the recommendations here, any tips for a newbie who never played these kinds of games back in the day?  
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11. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 14:55 briktal
 
Beamer wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 10:53:
Dades wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 10:44:
Never had a chance to play this, what was the general consensus around here?

General consensus around here is overwhelmingly positive. One of those rare games almost everyone here loves.

I did not love it. I found it an awful combination of FPS and old school dungeon crawler, like taking the worst parts of Zork, Nethack and Doom and throwing them into a pot. Every wall looks the same, you can only move in cardinal directions (it's tile based), combat is real time but turn based, and you find some things by mouse looking. I found combat annoying, I found the dungeons dull, and I really hated that I was in first person but had to move a tile at a time.

I'd prefer playing Zork, Nethack or Doom.

There is a set of "old school dungeon crawlers" more or less exactly like it already, so they didn't really create a genre by mashing up some old games. And I think that was one of the keys to the success/positive reaction to the game. It was a very simple, focused indie made modern version of an existing, well-defined genre. About as close as the "Game X with better graphics" many fans of classics wish for. A lot of people went into it knowing exactly what to expect, and it delivered that. Grimrock also avoided the biggest problem these kinds of genre remakes have because it is such a simple game. That prevents almost all of the "well it didn't have x..." or "back in the day y worked like this..." complaints as well. Picking a genre that has been dead for 20 years didn't hurt either.
 
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10. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 13:34 avianflu
 
enjoyed it but would have liked a bit more variety in the levels. well executed in any case.  
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9. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 12:48 Orogogus
 
jimnms wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 12:44:
I liked it too, and I also need to finish it. I got stuck, took a break hoping I'd come back fresh and feel like an idiot when I find out what I missed.

I like that it's a modern version of games like Eye of the Beholder, etc., but I'd like to see a blend of LoG with roguelike elements, ie. random dungeons, permadeath (optional).

That was Dungeon Hack, made with the Eye of the Beholder II engine. Permadeath would feel kind of weird with a party-based game, though.
 
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8. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 12:44 jimnms
 
I liked it too, and I also need to finish it. I got stuck, took a break hoping I'd come back fresh and feel like an idiot when I find out what I missed.

I like that it's a modern version of games like Eye of the Beholder, etc., but I'd like to see a blend of LoG with roguelike elements, ie. random dungeons, permadeath (optional).
 
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MeanJim on Steam
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7. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 11:35 Silicon Avatar
 
Every time I see this I do a double-take and think that Cleve finally released Grimoire.

 
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6. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 11:16 Frijoles
 
I really enjoyed it, and actually finished it. Could have used some more variety. The editor comes a bit late, IMO. It was fun, but I've moved on to other games.  
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5. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 11:14 Verno
 
Loved Grimrock although I wish I had spent more time with it. It came out at the same time as a bunch of other stuff and I never did finish it. I think most people here really enjoyed it, even Krovven and I agreed on it which is pretty rare.  
Avatar 51617
 
Playing: Gauntlet, Dark Souls 2, Wasteland 2
Watching: Intruders, 24 Live Another Day, The Signal
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4. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 10:55 MajorD
 

Dades wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 10:44:
Never had a chance to play this, what was the general consensus around here?

I recall it being very favorable. This typically is not my type of game, but I ended up really liking it. Actually, I need to finish it, as I was ~75% through it.

IMHO I think this type of game - Grid based dungeon crawler with a modern polish - was released at a very favorable time, but I just don't know if an XP or sequel would be as favorable due to that novelty fading away. I could be wrong, but I just think the timing was right with LoG......


 
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3. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 10:53 ASeven
 
Dades wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 10:44:
Never had a chance to play this, what was the general consensus around here?

A bloody great game, surprisingly the consensus on the game being good was almost global here.
 
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2. Re: Legend of Grimrock Editor and Follow-up Plans Jun 20, 2012, 10:53 Beamer
 
Dades wrote on Jun 20, 2012, 10:44:
Never had a chance to play this, what was the general consensus around here?

General consensus around here is overwhelmingly positive. One of those rare games almost everyone here loves.

I did not love it. I found it an awful combination of FPS and old school dungeon crawler, like taking the worst parts of Zork, Nethack and Doom and throwing them into a pot. Every wall looks the same, you can only move in cardinal directions (it's tile based), combat is real time but turn based, and you find some things by mouse looking. I found combat annoying, I found the dungeons dull, and I really hated that I was in first person but had to move a tile at a time.

I'd prefer playing Zork, Nethack or Doom.
 
-------------
Music for the discerning:
http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
Reply Quote Edit Delete Report
 
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