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On BF3 Cheating

There's an interesting article on Kotaku on cheating in multiplayer games, focusing on malfeasance in Battlefield 3, DICE's military shooter sequel. Well, malfeasance is our term, the article takes an almost sympathetic tone, characterizing the cheaters it specifically portrays as regular players, and relating their complex rationalizations of how they are somehow more justified than garden-variety cheaters. The article also takes a surprisingly informative approach to details on this, choosing to provide links to cheat providers, prices of various exploits, and even de facto reviews of their effectiveness.

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18. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 14:46 ItBurn
 
DG wrote on Jun 18, 2012, 14:40:
Thing that surprises me is the cheat abilities. Half that shit shouldn't even be possible - evidently the game is doing stuff client-side that any game with a half-assed consideration of security has done on the server.

  • uberdamage - Why is the client able to determine damage?

  • autospot - why does the client even KNOW where people are in order to spot them? Shit, no wonder the BF games are so laggy, every client knows everything about every other client that it has no need to know about!

  • massmurder - tell me this is some server exploit? Such weak sever code is bad enough, but if it's all in the ability of a client that's a total joke of a developer.


  • The response by the dev is a total joke as well. The best way to combat cheating is to look at stats? Wipe first then ban for second offence? They're only even trying to get the most flagrant to buy a second copy.

    The cheaters find a way to hack the game. DICE applies a fix. The cheaters find a new exploit.
    Well no shit when you're taking an approach where the client has all kinds of info it doesn't need and is making the determinations that should be done on the server.

    This is really confirming my suspicions about the quality of DICE development after my foray into the BF series with BF2142. They are totally and utterly shit.

    To me it definitely looks like hit detection is client side. If you go into cover while being shot at, you still get hit long after you're hidden. Because of the lag, your enemy still sees you even tho you just hid in your game. That or, it's really strange handling of hit detection or broken position interpolation. There's a LOT of data being transferred by the game and it's impressive that the lag is so invisible, perhaps it's exactly because a lot is handled by clients.
     
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    17. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 14:40 DG
     
    Thing that surprises me is the cheat abilities. Half that shit shouldn't even be possible - evidently the game is doing stuff client-side that any game with a half-assed consideration of security has done on the server.

  • uberdamage - Why is the client able to determine damage?

  • autospot - why does the client even KNOW where people are in order to spot them? Shit, no wonder the BF games are so laggy, every client knows everything about every other client that it has no need to know about!

  • massmurder - tell me this is some server exploit? Such weak sever code is bad enough, but if it's all in the ability of a client that's a total joke of a developer.


  • The response by the dev is a total joke as well. The best way to combat cheating is to look at stats? Wipe first then ban for second offence? They're only even trying to get the most flagrant to buy a second copy.

    The cheaters find a way to hack the game. DICE applies a fix. The cheaters find a new exploit.
    Well no shit when you're taking an approach where the client has all kinds of info it doesn't need and is making the determinations that should be done on the server.

    This is really confirming my suspicions about the quality of DICE development after my foray into the BF series with BF2142. They are totally and utterly shit.
     
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    16. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 14:25  Blue 
     
    TychoCelchuuu wrote on Jun 18, 2012, 12:51:
    What is a "de facto" review of a cheat's effectiveness? I mean, what other kind of review is there?

    The other kind would be if the site listed it as a review of cheating methods rather than as an analysis of why one player started cheating.

    Were you expecting a different explanation?
     
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    Stephen "Blue" Heaslip
    Blue's News Publisher, Editor-in-Chief, El Presidente for Life
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    15. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 14:22 ASeven
     
    Matshock wrote on Jun 18, 2012, 14:00:
    CommunistHamster wrote on Jun 18, 2012, 13:53:
    The more obvious "100-0 K/D" cheaters are actually pretty rare as people have to pay monthly fees for their hacks these days (comedy gold) so they're often smarter with them.
    What the fuck is wrong with competitive games these days? What kind of enjoyment can you get from winning an unfair game?

    Well, when you're 14/280 lbs you'd be surprised what counts as entertainment.

    I can say that because I was 14/280 lbs back in 1991. Once I worked myself to a point I can enjoy mental/physical challenges I do.

    It's the nature of the beast OTOH other developers can/do stay a step ahead of most of the cheaters out there, but not DICE/EA.


    And the more I hear about cheating in BF3 the more I blame DICE. They seem to take an attitude of simply not giving a single fuck! I mean, with this kind of support who is willing to buy more games from them if they'll get so many cheats it kills fun but DICE won't move anything against them?

    Didn't DICE say before BF3 got released they would take an aggressive stance on cheating? DICE is killing its own game and their own reputation on the PC.
     
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    14. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 14:16 Verno
     
    ItBurn wrote on Jun 18, 2012, 14:00:
    CommunistHamster wrote on Jun 18, 2012, 13:53:
    The more obvious "100-0 K/D" cheaters are actually pretty rare as people have to pay monthly fees for their hacks these days (comedy gold) so they're often smarter with them.
    What the fuck is wrong with competitive games these days? What kind of enjoyment can you get from winning an unfair game?

    It's been like this since shooters have existed... Self confidance and inadequacy issues.

    It's like anything else, some people prefer to game the system as opposed to play the game. Some people get their kicks from other players enraged reactions. That element of society will always be around in some shape or form, cheating and bribery are actually pretty rampant in many legitimate sports too. It's all about enforcement, I don't really waste my energy blaming the cheaters because they will always be around no matter how many get banned or tarred/feathered.
     
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    13. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 14:00 ItBurn
     
    CommunistHamster wrote on Jun 18, 2012, 13:53:
    The more obvious "100-0 K/D" cheaters are actually pretty rare as people have to pay monthly fees for their hacks these days (comedy gold) so they're often smarter with them.
    What the fuck is wrong with competitive games these days? What kind of enjoyment can you get from winning an unfair game?

    It's been like this since shooters have existed... Self confidance and inadequacy issues.
     
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    12. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 14:00 Matshock
     
    CommunistHamster wrote on Jun 18, 2012, 13:53:
    The more obvious "100-0 K/D" cheaters are actually pretty rare as people have to pay monthly fees for their hacks these days (comedy gold) so they're often smarter with them.
    What the fuck is wrong with competitive games these days? What kind of enjoyment can you get from winning an unfair game?

    Well, when you're 14/280 lbs you'd be surprised what counts as entertainment.

    I can say that because I was 14/280 lbs back in 1991. Once I worked myself to a point I can enjoy mental/physical challenges I do.

    It's the nature of the beast OTOH other developers can/do stay a step ahead of most of the cheaters out there, but not DICE/EA.

     
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    11. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 13:53 CommunistHamster
     
    The more obvious "100-0 K/D" cheaters are actually pretty rare as people have to pay monthly fees for their hacks these days (comedy gold) so they're often smarter with them.
    What the fuck is wrong with competitive games these days? What kind of enjoyment can you get from winning an unfair game?
     
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    10. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 13:45 Verno
     
    It's pretty easy to tell- you can't even take very long range shots from a good, concealed position without instantly being spotted by either the person you took a shot at or someone you swept with your "pointer" near the person you took a shot at. It's especially bad with vehicles and their large hit boxes.

    Then all they have to do is only use their aimbots when they've got a clearly doable shot otherwise. Like ASeven said- it's easy to do subtly.

    Yeah exactly. There are several videos showing off the various multihacks for BF3 up on Youtube. Most are pretty subtle and due to the nature of the gameplay in BF3 people write off a lot of their deaths as random or lucky. One amusing video someone posted at reddit had a cheater observing other cheaters who otherwise looked like and had scores of a regular player using the multihacks built in "who is aiming at me" feature.

    The more obvious "100-0 K/D" cheaters are actually pretty rare as people have to pay monthly fees for their hacks these days (comedy gold) so they're often smarter with them.

    I hope SOE protects Planetside 2 very aggressively, Dice's lazy approach to anti-cheat in BF3 was one of the big reasons I've stopped playing.
     
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    9. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 13:44 Wildone
     
    I have seen one on a punkbuster server (I only play on those) he was flying an AA Vehicle around Wake Island...  
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    8. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 13:42 Matshock
     
    It's pretty easy to tell- you can't even take very long range shots from a good, concealed position without instantly being spotted by either the person you took a shot at or someone you swept with your "pointer" near the person you took a shot at. It's especially bad with vehicles and their large hit boxes.

    Then all they have to do is only use their aimbots when they've got a clearly doable shot otherwise. Like ASeven said- it's easy to do subtly.

    Tribes Ascend is still pretty good though, I think the first aimbots made an appearance a few weeks ago but were quickly squashed.

     
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    7. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 13:40 ItBurn
     
    ASeven wrote on Jun 18, 2012, 13:30:
    Crustacean Soup wrote on Jun 18, 2012, 13:28:
    I've never seen cheating, though it may be I'm just not attentive enough (and I haven't been playing a lot of BF3). I noticed it all the time in COD:MW2; at least one aimbot and/or wall hack every time played.

    From what I read the problem with BF3 cheating is that it's not on your face, it's actually quite subtle. It's rare for cheaters to have a 300K-0D sessions but rather a 40K-5D kind of sessions. Verno here read the same article in reddit I did about that self-confessed cheater and what he saw when he used the cheat.

    I've actually never seen a cheater either, except on non-punkbuster servers, where my whole team was killed in a loop at our spawn for 10 minutes. I've seen a bunch of people with 50-0 and stuff like that, and it does sound almost impossible, but I used to be pretty good at Farcry and I could manage things like that. Everyone called me a cheater. I have yet to actually see a clear cheat in BF3 tho.
     
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    6. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 13:30 ASeven
     
    Crustacean Soup wrote on Jun 18, 2012, 13:28:
    I've never seen cheating, though it may be I'm just not attentive enough (and I haven't been playing a lot of BF3). I noticed it all the time in COD:MW2; at least one aimbot and/or wall hack every time played.

    From what I read the problem with BF3 cheating is that it's not on your face, it's actually quite subtle. It's rare for cheaters to have a 300K-0D sessions but rather a 40K-5D kind of sessions. Verno here read the same article in reddit I did about that self-confessed cheater and what he saw when he used the cheat.
     
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    5. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 13:28 Crustacean Soup
     
    I've never seen cheating, though it may be I'm just not attentive enough (and I haven't been playing a lot of BF3). I noticed it all the time in COD:MW2; at least one aimbot and/or wall hack every time played.  
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    4. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 13:23 Verno
     
    When Planetside 2 comes out I suspect BF3 will be dead to me anyway. The cheating is just way too prevalent, I see it even on servers with good administration.  
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    3. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 13:07 NegaDeath
     
    The guy tries to come off as sympathetic, despite the fact he pays money to make my attempts to play the game less enjoyable.

    So in conclusion may he fall ass first onto a long piece of rusty rebar.
     
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    2. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 13:00 ASeven
     
    An unusual article from kotaku, it's actually informative and rather fascinating. Still I feel no sympathy for cheaters though I wish a system could be put in place, a global system, where MP games would send cheaters to a specific server. This way cheaters would only play with cheaters, kinda like Max Payne 3 is going to do through matchmaking.

    If we can't beat them, let them play all together in the same place then.
     
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    1. Re: On BF3 Cheating Jun 18, 2012, 12:51 TychoCelchuuu
     
    What is a "de facto" review of a cheat's effectiveness? I mean, what other kind of review is there?  
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