83 Replies. 5 pages. Viewing page 2.
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| 63. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 18:00 |
MadBoris |
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Smellfinger wrote on Jun 9, 2012, 17:28:
The evolution of the MMO model: No more expansions to buy, new content on a regular basis. The new content will come later because we need to fix the bugs first. Actually, we're making an expansion.
The evolution of DLC: It's only cosmetic. Now it's gameplay, but think of it as an expansion that you can download. We work on it after the original game is done. Actually, we withhold content and sometimes put it on the disc.
F2P is the culmination of 15 years of bullshit.
hehe, yeah.
Someone should write an article an all the awesome developers from the last 15 years:
That gave you modest up front cost...but years of "real free" support to earn your repeat business for a modest $20-$30 expansion (that is like some of today's games).
Years of tremendous "real free" support, free patches, free maps, free actual game play updates...Not DLC'g, not charging to download game updates/patches.
The quality for it's time was often far superior to most anything we have these days.
Several come to mind that were stellar and amazing...
Where are they now? I wish I could pay them more for that value, too bad you often don't know what you had till you lost it.
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| 62. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 18:00 |
netnerd85 |
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Prez wrote on Jun 9, 2012, 09:13:
If it weren't for F2P, we would have significantly fewer multiplayer-only games.
You say that like it's a bad thing. Indeed! |
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| 61. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 17:28 |
Smellfinger |
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The evolution of the MMO model: No more expansions to buy, new content on a regular basis. The new content will come later because we need to fix the bugs first. Actually, we're making an expansion.
The evolution of DLC: It's only cosmetic. Now it's gameplay, but think of it as an expansion that you can download. We work on it after the original game is done. Actually, we withhold content and sometimes put it on the disc.
F2P is the culmination of 15 years of bullshit.
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| 60. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 16:34 |
MadBoris |
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Aero wrote on Jun 9, 2012, 15:45:
I don't want that shit infecting my game play. I will happily pay up front, or pay a subscription, or pay for new REAL content, but I want a game that is designed primarily to entertain me, not engineered by some psychologist to manipulate me into paying out bit by bit with little promises of entertainment to come.
Well, I felt like you did many years ago when subscriptions first hit the scene many years ago, altering the desire for best quality, in how they changed it to a psychological mind game.
I just want to add because people forget, it's the subscriptions mechanics that began the mind games. How do we keep a human feeling the necessity to pay for 6 months, 1 year, etc? When do we shut it down or put our focus to the next project, letting people think we are still focused on the old?
F2P can help turn this corner around for some quality games(see Valve), if it stays off consoles and away from M$, otherwise it's doomed. Valve, which still has a good outlook on the medium, publicized F2P a while back by making like 1000% off it's F2P model with Team Fortress2(I think) rather than the usual shrink wrap model. So everyone, including MS, listened. Money grabbers are coming to F2P too, no doubt.
It sometimes revolves around utilizing social mechanics like peer pressure, promoting ideas that kids should look cool to their so-called 'friends' online, trying to outdo each other beyond healthy competitiveness, etc, etc.
Reading your comments felt like I was reading something I myself would have written. It's both disappointing and discouraging to see what has come of the industry when it once used to be about making quality immersive entertainment.
People want to be in the gaming business, because they want chunks of the big pie. That's not why modders and the great gaming pioneers made games. This new breed often lack the quality, talent, skill or disciplined drive to achieve the high level of quality that excellent teams do. That leaves them with an alternative...make it look like something it is not, since we can't make it what it should be. Along the way, lets lower people's expectations by focusing on minimalism for a while. It's going from finding ways to monetize, to making actual Vegas like digital slot machines.
This comment was edited on Jun 9, 2012, 16:43. |
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| 59. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 15:45 |
Aero |
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Free-to-Play, as it tends to be implemented, could very well kill gaming for people like me. I'm happy to pay for content, and games like Rise of Flight have a good free to play model where the base product with two planes is free but you can buy additional planes. I've probably put at least $100 into that and don't feel ripped off at all. A thoroughly researched, well modeled and simulated airplane is something I don't mind paying for. They put a lot of effort into making something, and I pay them for that effort. It's perfectly natural.
Other games though, where you're paying for what amounts to changing a few variables to increase the stats on some weapon or something are not at all for me. It doesn't matter if you don't have to pay and can earn it through grinding or some other mechanism, the game will be designed around getting people to pay out a little bit at a time, to make it inconvenient not to do so.
I don't want that shit infecting my game play. I will happily pay up front, or pay a subscription, or pay for new REAL content, but I want a game that is designed primarily to entertain me, not engineered by some psychologist to manipulate me into paying out bit by bit with little promises of entertainment to come.
It will be interesting to see how bad this gets. Selling addiction can be pretty good business. |
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| 58. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 15:39 |
MadBoris |
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Microsoft XBOX360 has been talking allowing F2P for a year.
At E3 2012 Microsoft announced Ascend: New Gods on the show stage.
This is an XBOX F2P title.
Yes they will charge the hell out of it I'm sure, like everything that the kids will pay for without principals guiding them
It will then be near impossible to make a truly Free to Play game without underlying coercion.
With Valve and it's recent F2P games, Microsoft is likely working with these guys to get popular F2p games to console, to get a cut.
My prediction?
Microsoft will twist and destroy the F2P model, just as it was starting to be able to get back to quality gameplay 'earning' money, not coercing it out. |
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| 57. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 15:02 |
eunichron |
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theyarecomingforyou wrote on Jun 9, 2012, 14:44:
eunichron wrote on Jun 9, 2012, 14:07:
Uh, the "credits" needed to use vehicles in T:A are the credits that you earn in-game by scoring kills, repairing the base, capping/returning flags etc. The same credits that are used for supply station drops, tactical and orbital strikes. It has absolutely nothing to do at all with purchasing anything. But it's part of the whole grind-to-win philosophy that pervades every design decision in F2P games. In T2 I didn't have to deal with any of that nonsense and it was a better game for it. I could spawn a carrier vehicle, wait for team mates to fly in and go storming off into enemy territory - now I have to kill some people or repair stuff to earn fictional points before being able to do anything.
As I'm not familiar with it, can you purchase those credits? If so then you're rewarding people for paying, which was exactly my point. If not it's still a tedious grind that I don't have any patience for.
No, you can't purchase the in-game credits. They are very easy to get though, certain skill shots and getting double/triple kills will earn you more, but there is nothing you can purchase from the store to increase your credit earnings. The Shrike is the most expensive at 4000 credits, which should take a skilled player a matter of minutes to earn, and if you're good enough you shouldn't have a problem earning 4000 more while flying it to buy a new one if you lose it.
But, that's just the vehicles. The most expensive thing is Orbital Strikes at 10,000 credits, of which I've seen players use 3-4 in a single game. |
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| 56. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 14:44 |
theyarecomingforyou |
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eunichron wrote on Jun 9, 2012, 14:07:
Uh, the "credits" needed to use vehicles in T:A are the credits that you earn in-game by scoring kills, repairing the base, capping/returning flags etc. The same credits that are used for supply station drops, tactical and orbital strikes. It has absolutely nothing to do at all with purchasing anything. But it's part of the whole grind-to-win philosophy that pervades every design decision in F2P games. In T2 I didn't have to deal with any of that nonsense and it was a better game for it. I could spawn a carrier vehicle, wait for team mates to fly in and go storming off into enemy territory - now I have to kill some people or repair stuff to earn fictional points before being able to do anything.
As I'm not familiar with it, can you purchase those credits? If so then you're rewarding people for paying, which was exactly my point. If not it's still a tedious grind that I don't have any patience for. |
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Core i7 2600-K (4.6GHz) | 12GB DDR3 | GTX680 SLI (1215/1605) | OCZ Vertex 3 120GB SSD | Windows 8 Pro
Hazro HZ30Wie 30" | Saffire PRO 40 | Razer Mamba | Coolermaster RP1000W
SteamID: theyarecomingforyou |
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| 55. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 14:31 |
ledhead1969 |
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BOTA:99 wrote on Jun 8, 2012, 23:29:
You can end up paying far more under the laughable "free to play" model. Why do you think they are all moving in this direction.
^^
Nothing is free. These games should be called POT. Pay Over Time.
Crytek is going the Pay Over Time route. |
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| 54. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 14:07 |
eunichron |
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theyarecomingforyou wrote on Jun 9, 2012, 10:25:
T:A pissed me off when I went to spawn a vehicle or pick a different class and I didn't have enough credits - I have no interest in grinding or paying to access features that were freely available in previous games.
Uh, the "credits" needed to use vehicles in T:A are the credits that you earn in-game by scoring kills, repairing the base, capping/returning flags etc. The same credits that are used for supply station drops, tactical and orbital strikes. It has absolutely nothing to do at all with purchasing anything. |
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| 53. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 13:01 |
Gib007 |
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| *Raises glass in the hope they fail as a company!* |
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| 52. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 10:25 |
theyarecomingforyou |
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F2P is great when its for cosmetics. Other than that it always breaks the balance of a game. More importantly, it usually ends up costing more to get all the content than simply buying a game outright. It's a complete scam. It's even worse on the mobile scene, as some of the 'free' games cripple the core functionality and charge upwards of $60 for unlocks (and they're specifically aimed at kids). Check out games like Dragon Fly! or Small Town - both are sick examples of today's super-capitalism.
I hate unlock systems at the best of times, let alone ones that reward players who pay rather than play. I would much, much rather buy a game outright than deal with F2P. T:A pissed me off when I went to spawn a vehicle or pick a different class and I didn't have enough credits - I have no interest in grinding or paying to access features that were freely available in previous games. I prefer games that are based on player skill rather than the amount of time that you play them for. |
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Core i7 2600-K (4.6GHz) | 12GB DDR3 | GTX680 SLI (1215/1605) | OCZ Vertex 3 120GB SSD | Windows 8 Pro
Hazro HZ30Wie 30" | Saffire PRO 40 | Razer Mamba | Coolermaster RP1000W
SteamID: theyarecomingforyou |
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| 51. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 10:06 |
Creston |
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That's exactly the decision I would make when every previous game I've made has done so well in the mp department...
Oh wait, this is just Cevat's next attempt to stop piracy. I'm not quite sure that just killing your company is the answer there, Cevat.
Creston |
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| 50. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 09:13 |
Prez |
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If it weren't for F2P, we would have significantly fewer multiplayer-only games.
You say that like it's a bad thing. |
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| 49. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 08:07 |
StingingVelvet |
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| Sell the Crysis IP then please, because it is only worth a damn for singleplayer. |
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| 48. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 07:27 |
Fletch |
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| Another one bites the dust. F2P... die. Goodbye, Crytek. |
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| 47. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 07:21 |
JaguarUSF |
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Dmitri_M wrote on Jun 8, 2012, 22:13:
Who plays Free to Play games? I do not pay attention to anything that's free to play. My basic presumption is that they're rubbish titles. Especially the shooters.
Tribes Ascend is not rubbish. |
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| 46. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 07:18 |
Jerykk |
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It is. F2P is a scam. To be profitable, the game has to trick you, lure you into spending money. Its completely intransparent, how much money this game will cost you. This business model feeds on weak minded gamers. Yes, its morally corrupt.
It's morally corrupt to offer paying customers the ability to unlock stuff faster, even if that same stuff can be unlocked by just playing the game? Hate to tell you, but most businesses take advantage of lazy people. That's why consoles are so popular.
Really, there's no trickery involved. It's clearly evident that you can spend money to unlock stuff faster. If you don't want to spend money, you don't have to and you can still unlock everything for free. If you enjoy playing the game, I don't see why this would be problematic.
Sure. But the company does not need people like you. It needs customers to make money. Which is only possible with people who spend money.
The whole point of F2P is to establish a large player base. Even if the vast majority of the player base doesn't spend a penny, their presence on the servers leads to a thriving community and word of mouth helps that community grow. So yes, even players that don't spend any money are an integral part of the business model.
If it weren't for F2P, we would have significantly fewer multiplayer-only games. Publishers are not going to fund a PC-exclusive, multiplayer-only game. Without F2P, there would be no Tribes: Ascend or Planetside 2 or Mechwarrior Online or Hawken. The business model is by no means perfect, as it revolves around unlockables, but it's better than the alternative of these games not existing at all.
This comment was edited on Jun 9, 2012, 07:26. |
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| 45. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 06:05 |
Kajetan |
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yuastnav wrote on Jun 9, 2012, 06:02:
On the other hand F2P games are also good for people who do not have much time to play. Sure. But the company does not need people like you. It needs customers to make money. Which is only possible with people who spend money. |
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| 44. |
Re: Crytek Going Entirely Free-to-Play |
Jun 9, 2012, 06:02 |
yuastnav |
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Kajetan wrote on Jun 9, 2012, 04:27:
netnerd85 wrote on Jun 9, 2012, 03:33:
Morally corrupt business model. It is. F2P is a scam. To be profitable, the game has to trick you, lure you into spending money. Its completely intransparent, how much money this game will cost you. This business model feeds on weak minded gamers. Yes, its morally corrupt.
[...]
On the other hand F2P games are also good for people who do not have much time to play. I could have never played Planetside 1 because I don't have a credit card and I also couldn't justify paying a monthly fee because I cannot anticipate how big the workload is going to be in the next few weeks/months so it could be the case that the money would completely go to waste. I also loved the idea of Planetside, though, and it was the only MMO next to Eve Online and Dark Age of Camelot that I had any interest in.
So it's actually really great for people like me that Planetside 2 is going to be f2p because I can actually try it out without having to worry about wasting money and microtransactions will not expire after a month (at least I hope so). |
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83 Replies. 5 pages. Viewing page 2.
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