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Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc?

A forum thread on GameFAQs has indications that Risen 2: Dark Waters may be the latest game to ship with what's supposed to be future DLC included on the retail disc. The thread outlines the discovery, and spawns one of those heated discussions over the ethics of making content on the game disc dependant on a future. Thanks Blend Games.

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75 Replies. 4 pages. Viewing page 1.
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75. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 8, 2012, 01:46 Sepharo
 
Beamer wrote on May 8, 2012, 01:14:
Sepharo wrote on May 8, 2012, 01:00:
It's likely because this specific laser is rare. Only one in Michigan, and the doc was tellin me how he gets out of staters discounts at the nearby hotels.

It's much more than just that. For instance, there's a new optical device out there that lets you see 12 layers of the retina without dialating. It's pretty revolutionary. But it's got a click fee of several dollars. It's also selling below cost, I believe, so we're looking at the video game console model.

I meant that's why he might not have heard that, other places could be using lasers that don't require a physical one-time-use card.

Unless he was just blowing smoke up my ass this guy really knows his shit and has patents in the retinal tracking/locking software used in the technology. Says he's actually in the process of shopping around his latest one right now, that's kind of what prompted his bitching about the company and the cards.

It's neat stuff, I don't know if he tells everyone that stuff or just people with jobs/interest in technology.
 
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74. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 8, 2012, 01:14 Beamer
 
Sepharo wrote on May 8, 2012, 01:00:
Kitkoan wrote on May 7, 2012, 22:55:
Sepharo wrote on May 7, 2012, 18:59:
Beamer wrote on May 7, 2012, 09:06:
What's fun is that this isn't unique to video games.

Want to buy a machine for a factory or even a doctor's office? There's a click fee involved, so every time you use that machine you send some cash to the company that made that machine.

I'm getting laser eye surgery and when I was in for my consultation the doctor was telling me all about the scheme for his laser as you describe. He was showing me these cards that are one time use that cost him some ridiculous amount of money. My mind immediately jumped to DRM/DLC and I had to stop myself from chuckling as I listened to his rage which was along the lines of "These greedy fucking assholes already charged me $5 million for the laser and now they want another $500 every time I use it!"


When I got laser eye surgery, they didn't tell me that... awww...

Granted when they were describing what would happen and they mentioned that I won't be able to blink and they will having something to hold my eye open I immediately said "So it'll be like in Clockwork Orange?" Needless to say they quickly told me no, but was a new one they would have to tell the surgeons.

It's likely because this specific laser is rare. Only one in Michigan, and the doc was tellin me how he gets out of staters discounts at the nearby hotels.

It's much more than just that. For instance, there's a new optical device out there that lets you see 12 layers of the retina without dialating. It's pretty revolutionary. But it's got a click fee of several dollars. It's also selling below cost, I believe, so we're looking at the video game console model.

And when you get your rx and go to get your glasses made? Odds are at least one of the machines used, if not several, also has money going back to the manufacturer for each job done.
 
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73. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 8, 2012, 01:00 Sepharo
 
Kitkoan wrote on May 7, 2012, 22:55:
Sepharo wrote on May 7, 2012, 18:59:
Beamer wrote on May 7, 2012, 09:06:
What's fun is that this isn't unique to video games.

Want to buy a machine for a factory or even a doctor's office? There's a click fee involved, so every time you use that machine you send some cash to the company that made that machine.

I'm getting laser eye surgery and when I was in for my consultation the doctor was telling me all about the scheme for his laser as you describe. He was showing me these cards that are one time use that cost him some ridiculous amount of money. My mind immediately jumped to DRM/DLC and I had to stop myself from chuckling as I listened to his rage which was along the lines of "These greedy fucking assholes already charged me $5 million for the laser and now they want another $500 every time I use it!"


When I got laser eye surgery, they didn't tell me that... awww...

Granted when they were describing what would happen and they mentioned that I won't be able to blink and they will having something to hold my eye open I immediately said "So it'll be like in Clockwork Orange?" Needless to say they quickly told me no, but was a new one they would have to tell the surgeons.

It's likely because this specific laser is rare. Only one in Michigan, and the doc was tellin me how he gets out of staters discounts at the nearby hotels.
 
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72. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 22:55 Kitkoan
 
Sepharo wrote on May 7, 2012, 18:59:
Beamer wrote on May 7, 2012, 09:06:
What's fun is that this isn't unique to video games.

Want to buy a machine for a factory or even a doctor's office? There's a click fee involved, so every time you use that machine you send some cash to the company that made that machine.

I'm getting laser eye surgery and when I was in for my consultation the doctor was telling me all about the scheme for his laser as you describe. He was showing me these cards that are one time use that cost him some ridiculous amount of money. My mind immediately jumped to DRM/DLC and I had to stop myself from chuckling as I listened to his rage which was along the lines of "These greedy fucking assholes already charged me $5 million for the laser and now they want another $500 every time I use it!"


When I got laser eye surgery, they didn't tell me that... awww...

Granted when they were describing what would happen and they mentioned that I won't be able to blink and they will having something to hold my eye open I immediately said "So it'll be like in Clockwork Orange?" Needless to say they quickly told me no, but was a new one they would have to tell the surgeons.
 
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*automatically refuses to place horse heads in anyone's bed*
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71. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 22:42 Jerykk
 
Shoddy hit detection for one, and I honestly thought the reaction time from button press to actual animation just doesn't feel solid. But then again, I'm not a fan of PB much to begin with.

I've never really had an issue with either the hit detection or control responsiveness in any of PB's games. The player's attack animations aren't as quick as Ninja Gaiden's or Devil May Cry's but those games have much faster-paced combat in general. As for hit detection, it seems pretty accurate to me. The fact that you can't interrupt enemy attacks and/or not all enemies play hit reactions may make it seem like the hit detection is inconsistent, but it's working as intended.
 
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70. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 22:12 RollinThundr
 
Jerykk wrote on May 7, 2012, 19:02:
Not really, I get what stunlock is. The combat itself is unresponsive is what I'm getting at.

Except it is responsive. The only time your controls don't respond is when you're playing a fully-committed animation. If a push a button and I'm not in an attack or hit reaction, the controls respond accordingly. If I get hit by an enemy, the hit reaction will stop whatever animation I was previously in. Conversely, this is not the case for enemies, so you can hit them but it won't interrupt their attack animations. Some enemies don't even have hit reactions so you'll never be able to interrupt whatever they're doing.

If you understand that this is how the combat works, what specifically do you find unresponsive about it?

Shoddy hit detection for one, and I honestly thought the reaction time from button press to actual animation just doesn't feel solid. But then again, I'm not a fan of PB much to begin with.
 
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69. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 19:02 Jerykk
 
Not really, I get what stunlock is. The combat itself is unresponsive is what I'm getting at.

Except it is responsive. The only time your controls don't respond is when you're playing a fully-committed animation. If a push a button and I'm not in an attack or hit reaction, the controls respond accordingly. If I get hit by an enemy, the hit reaction will stop whatever animation I was previously in. Conversely, this is not the case for enemies, so you can hit them but it won't interrupt their attack animations. Some enemies don't even have hit reactions so you'll never be able to interrupt whatever they're doing.

If you understand that this is how the combat works, what specifically do you find unresponsive about it?
 
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68. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 18:59 Sepharo
 
Beamer wrote on May 7, 2012, 09:06:
What's fun is that this isn't unique to video games.

Want to buy a machine for a factory or even a doctor's office? There's a click fee involved, so every time you use that machine you send some cash to the company that made that machine.

I'm getting laser eye surgery and when I was in for my consultation the doctor was telling me all about the scheme for his laser as you describe. He was showing me these cards that are one time use that cost him some ridiculous amount of money. My mind immediately jumped to DRM/DLC and I had to stop myself from chuckling as I listened to his rage which was along the lines of "These greedy fucking assholes already charged me $5 million for the laser and now they want another $500 every time I use it!"

 
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67. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 14:22 RollinThundr
 
Jerykk wrote on May 7, 2012, 12:34:
I have no issues with more complex combat, it's just never been pulled off well in PB games. Shoddy hit detection, unresponsiveness, you name it. They as a studio have essentially zero quality control and never polish anything. You'd think after using essentially the same type of combat system for 5 games now it should be better than it is.

I think you're mistaking fully committed enemy attacks and player hit reactions for bugs. The enemy attack animations are fully-committed, meaning the player cannot interrupt them. Same with the player's hit reactions. So, if you begin an attack and then get hit, your attack will get canceled and you'll be put into a hit reaction. Conversely, if you hit an enemy while he's in an attack animation, his attack will continue anyway. Understanding how these things works is the key to victory in combat.

Many people have trouble wrapping their heads around the idea of fully-committed attacks and hit reactions, which is why Witcher 2's combat received much of the same criticism that you're giving PB's games right now. Most people expect to be able to interrupt their attacks and hit reactions at any moment, as that's what more mainstream games allow.

Not really, I get what stunlock is. The combat itself is unresponsive is what I'm getting at.
 
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66. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 12:34 Jerykk
 
I have no issues with more complex combat, it's just never been pulled off well in PB games. Shoddy hit detection, unresponsiveness, you name it. They as a studio have essentially zero quality control and never polish anything. You'd think after using essentially the same type of combat system for 5 games now it should be better than it is.

I think you're mistaking fully committed enemy attacks and player hit reactions for bugs. The enemy attack animations are fully-committed, meaning the player cannot interrupt them. Same with the player's hit reactions. So, if you begin an attack and then get hit, your attack will get canceled and you'll be put into a hit reaction. Conversely, if you hit an enemy while he's in an attack animation, his attack will continue anyway. Understanding how these things works is the key to victory in combat.

Many people have trouble wrapping their heads around the idea of fully-committed attacks and hit reactions, which is why Witcher 2's combat received much of the same criticism that you're giving PB's games right now. Most people expect to be able to interrupt their attacks and hit reactions at any moment, as that's what more mainstream games allow.
 
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65. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 09:47 Verno
 
hello newman wrote on May 7, 2012, 03:42:

You moron!

Here's a free insult for you sir.
Use it to wreak havok on the interwebs.
Let no one escape thee.
For there can be only one lord of the morons.
And he does not share p0wah.

Hahaha, well played sir.
 
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Playing: Fire Emblem, Diablo 3, Bravely Default
Watching: The Machine, After the Dark, Devils Due
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64. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 09:40 Ravor
 
I bought it and enjoyed it. Took me about 30 hours to finish. All in all I thought it was a decent game.

My only complaint was, as usual; the combat. It's basically a click fest and monsters with fast repeating attacks will absolutely destroy you. Also the "normal" difficulty is basically impossible early on. There was standard fights that I had to do just go advance in the game and I couldn't get past them without going to easy mode.

That being said, if they made combat so when you took damage it didn't reset your swing then the whole combat model would be just fine.

I had no bugs or other issues other then those.

I'd still recommend buying the game, just not for 50$. Wait for the 50 or more % off deals.
 
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63. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 09:26 RollinThundr
 
Jerykk wrote on May 7, 2012, 01:07:
Slashman wrote on May 7, 2012, 01:01:
Jerykk wrote on May 7, 2012, 00:51:
None of that sounds especially appealing. And this is from someone who actually likes complex combat systems.

I haven't played any of the games though, so I can'/t swear to it. It just doesn't sound very fun.

It's definitely an acquired taste. You basically can't make any mistakes, which in turn makes the combat much more intense. You have to scout your enemies and think carefully about when and where to engage. I find this more appealing than the combat in other action RPGs like Kingdoms of Amalur or Elder Scrolls, where you just wade in to battle and mash LMB as quickly as possible.

I think I'd prefer a middle ground. Interesting combat shouldn't necessarily be so painstaking that you can't sometimes just go with your instincts and rain blows down on the enemy(within reason and depending on the enemy).

That's the main reason why the combat in PB's games is loathed by so many people. There isn't really any middle-ground. Every fight is slow and methodical (until you basically become a god at the end of the game) and you will inevitably die many, many times. Since each enemy has its own distinct attack patterns, it takes a while to memorize them all and become good enough to consistently counter them.

I have no issues with more complex combat, it's just never been pulled off well in PB games. Shoddy hit detection, unresponsiveness, you name it. They as a studio have essentially zero quality control and never polish anything. You'd think after using essentially the same type of combat system for 5 games now it should be better than it is.
 
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62. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 09:06 Beamer
 
What's fun is that this isn't unique to video games.

Want to buy a machine for a factory or even a doctor's office? There's a click fee involved, so every time you use that machine you send some cash to the company that made that machine. In return you get service should you need it and maybe some weird kind of support that you'd never use.

One-time purchases are limited damn near only to food these days.
 
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http://www.deathwishinc.com
http://www.hydrahead.com
http://www.painkillerrecords.com
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61. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 09:03 Quboid
 
vrok wrote on May 7, 2012, 07:48:
No. It only means the game is too hard for frustrated casualfag reviewers and that no one paid them to inflate the score. Why the fuck are you listening to anything reviewers have to say anymore anyway?

It's a solid RPG. Unmeasurable quantities better than the much fawned over Skyrim.

If I wasn't already convinced by your gamer hipster attitude to Skyrim, your casual homophobia would certainly swing it for me!
 
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- Quboid
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60. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 08:51 avianflu
 
As a giant fan of Gothic 2 (played it 3 times and with the excellent 'Raven' add-on) I have no interest in Risen 2. Risen 1 had a tiny world and far too many tedious fetch quests. Difficulty was never issue -- boredom was.
 
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59. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 07:48 vrok
 
No. It only means the game is too hard for frustrated casualfag reviewers and that no one paid them to inflate the score. Why the fuck are you listening to anything reviewers have to say anymore anyway?

It's a solid RPG. Unmeasurable quantities better than the much fawned over Skyrim.
 
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58. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 07:11 Overon
 
69 on metacritic with 37 critic reviews means the game is dick.  
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57. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 06:57 Ray Marden
 
I am not shocked that PB released yet another buggy, mediocre game. the reviews repeatedly talking about this being a worse overall game - again, it fails to significantly learn from and build upon its earlier works. The day this developer closes will be a good day for gaming.
Where is my refund for Gothic 3?
Release day DLC and on-disk DLC is insulting. Very rarely are they anything close to an expansion and then they go from being a cash grab all the way to game breaking/imbalancing. DLC has become a way to push up the price of games that are already being sold for $60.00, to screw over people that do not preorder, and to create special deals with retailers. Where was the focus on the game in those? Oh, right... Most/all of these already have incredibly suspect cost to depth issues and day one releases just compound the matter. Whatever happened to making a good core game, letting people purchase a complete product on launch day, and giving gamers a complete experience? Hell, for $60.00, the developers/publishers cannot even give you the full DVD - they have to steal some of it for their imaginary alternate-team DLC?

And what is PB's excuse? The usual bugs are due to their small size? Then they should be focusing on making a good game with less issues than some crappy DLC. This wasn't from the main team? Given the state of the game, those people should have been working on improving the game. It wasn't taken from the main game? Then how and when did this small team find the time and when was the quality bar set so low than the game was deemed sufficient for launch?

Willing to pay for quality; tired of theft-by-DLC,
Ray
 
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56. Re: Risen 2 DLC Already on Disc? May 7, 2012, 05:17 vrok
 
These were already enabled in the superior Digital Deluxe SKIDROW edition that came out 1 weeks ago.  
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75 Replies. 4 pages. Viewing page 1.
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