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Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned

In spite of EA saying the original "under-performed," a sequel to Bulletstorm was in the works at People Can Fly before being cancelled by parent company Epic Games reports GameSpot, who hear from Epic president Mike Capps on the topic. Mike indicates they have put the Polish developer on a different project they will "be announcing pretty soon," though there is no clue if this is the recently revealed PC game Epic is planning. "We thought a lot about a sequel, and had done some initial development on it, but we found a project that we thought was a better fit for People Can Fly," he said. "We haven't announced that yet, but we will be announcing it pretty soon." He goes on to praise Bulletstorm and says he'd love to go back to the property, "but right now we don't have anything to talk about." Just to stir the pot a little, the story concludes with Capps' comment that sales of the PC version may have been harmed by piracy: "We made a PC version of Bulletstorm, and it didn't do very well on PC and I think a lot of that was due to piracy. It wasn't the best PC port ever, sure, but also piracy was a pretty big problem."

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239 Replies. 12 pages. Viewing page 4.
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179. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 12:39 Jerykk
 
On a somewhat unrelated note, I just got banned from Neogaf for mentioning you can pirate games on PC. I'm glad that Blue is so open-minded, otherwise we wouldn't be able to have discussions like these.  
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178. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 12:29 Chromius
 
Well you have to look at the big picture.

Yes, we realize piracy is bad and is happening a lot, buts its impact has been overall blown out of proportion(in terms of lost real profit). This in turn will be used against us in taking away from your rights and freedoms as the internet being used as a resource to share knowledge on things the govts and the rich do not want you to know. Period. It is shortsighted and narrow to cry poor me i lost sales and make it out to be 10 times worse than it is. (profit wise) and cause it to be a tool to be used to take away from your freedoms and rights which are unrelated. Im tired of the brainwashed monkeys jumping on the train and allowing it to careen out of control, as they want.

You need to wake up, browse real financial forums and see that real people are believing in the supposed conspiracy theories with real information to back it up concerning financial manipulation and war profiteering, and that the narrowsighted and selfish "Oh we lost pc sales and movie sales" and what not is going to be a large addition to us losing tools to share this real and factual knowledge.

Hey i know its unrelated, but look at the Carlyle groups profits in the last 4 years in a bad economy, 120 billion, lol the Guardian UK had an article about something funny going on with them at 15B in 2000 and the Obamas administration GDP to debt curve, something funny looking there.

So i have gone a little of topic, but this is the reason the Piracy card ticks me off. You should see the bills they keep attempting to pass every few weeks on the internet, you think the Patriot act is bad, lol. They want to be able to shut down anything they want full govt control like China. Oh the elite like the China model and are working to instill it here. Wake up and educate yourselves, it is NOT conspiracy theory, get yer heads out of yer butt.

Thomas Jefferson said the best tool we would have to combat a government that turns tyrannical in its power is to talk amongst yourselves and educate each other as to the state of things.

I dont give a damn about piracy, but hey if your in the 100k or more per year you will gladly vote Obama as the class divide widens.

But hey "Poor me I lost some potential profit" you wont even care in 5 or 10 years.
 
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177. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 11:34 Beamer
 
Jerykk wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 01:06:
Time after time you guys focus on the corporate bigwigs making profits and ignore the closed developers and failed franchises. The bigwigs are gonna make their money no matter what, that is never in doubt.

Piracy has a real effect on jobs and what is made.

To assume that piracy is the reason why studios and games fail is just silly. You'd have to ignore all the more obvious and logical factors to believe that. That said, the fundamental problem with debates about piracy is that there are no irrefutable statistics to draw upon. You can't prove or disprove the exact impact of piracy on sales. Piracy also evokes a strong ethical response and a person's moral fiber tends to be deeply ingrained. If someone believes piracy is inherently right or wrong, no amount of reasoning, logic or evidence will sway them. That's why we continue to have these exact same debates over and over and over again.

Yup. For those projects that just barely miss target then piracy is the single easiest thing to point to. "If just 50,000 of those pirates had bought!"
But it's not the true problem.

However, it's very easy to see why developers say this. It isn't PR speak with them, and it isn't to spiky haired MBAs; developers put their heart and soul into a product. It bleeds their blood. To see it not doing well and to see how many people are playing it for free despite that is something people take very personally.
It becomes an emotional thing.

I don't really fault them for not being entirely rational about it.




Unrelated to Jerykk's post: that guy can ignore me all he wants, but Capps is very obviously NOT saying "PC piracy killed Bulletstorm" and anyone that disagrees is free to ignore me.
 
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176. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 11:10 avianflu
 
Dimitri nails it. C'mon guys dont fall for PR-speak.

Dmitri_M wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 22:05:
I think these statements of piracy are aimed at publisher shareholders and boardrooms of spiky haired MBAs and PR people. A believable excuse for devs to explain away poor sales on the stepchild platform.
 
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175. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 09:11 Verno
 
StingingVelvet wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 04:08:
Indeed, and the rate of piracy I see in the people around me gives me cause to believe it has a much greater impact than you are comfortable thinking about.

No one really has a problem with that, it's when people start talking about censoring the entire internet because the audience "cant be responsible" that becomes borderline self parody.
 
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174. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 08:12 ASeven
 
Kajetan wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 02:53:
ASeven wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 21:59:
in the end what we're talking about is non-commercial piracy of Bulletstorm and though commercial piracy does hurt, non-commercial piracy is a complex beast and not easily broken down into numbers.
And therefore we need more unbiased studies and research on that topic. Right now we can only make an educated guess about the potential influence of casual, non-commercial copyright infringement. We also have to look at cultural influences and social influences, not narrowing our view only on the economic ramifications in a small market.

100% agree.
 
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173. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 06:48 Kajetan
 
StingingVelvet wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 04:08:
Indeed, and the rate of piracy I see in the people around me gives me cause to believe it has a much greater impact than you are comfortable thinking about.
Your perception may be flawed or incomplete, not considerung all facts and influences. Thats why we need hard and provable facts. To KNOW and not to ASSUME. I can assume anything i want. But when i start making laws based only on assumptions, thats when things go wrong.
 
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172. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 04:08 StingingVelvet
 
Jerykk wrote on Apr 11, 2012, 01:06:
To assume that piracy is the reason why studios and games fail is just silly. You'd have to ignore all the more obvious and logical factors to believe that. That said, the fundamental problem with debates about piracy is that there are no irrefutable statistics to draw upon. You can't prove or disprove the exact impact of piracy on sales. Piracy also evokes a strong ethical response and a person's moral fiber tends to be deeply ingrained. If someone believes piracy is inherently right or wrong, no amount of reasoning, logic or evidence will sway them. That's why we continue to have these exact same debates over and over and over again.

Indeed, and the rate of piracy I see in the people around me gives me cause to believe it has a much greater impact than you are comfortable thinking about.
 
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171. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 02:53 Kajetan
 
ASeven wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 21:59:
in the end what we're talking about is non-commercial piracy of Bulletstorm and though commercial piracy does hurt, non-commercial piracy is a complex beast and not easily broken down into numbers.
And therefore we need more unbiased studies and research on that topic. Right now we can only make an educated guess about the potential influence of casual, non-commercial copyright infringement. We also have to look at cultural influences and social influences, not narrowing our view only on the economic ramifications in a small market.
 
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170. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 01:30 deqer
 
Beamer wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 22:56:
oh Jesus. Learn what a semi colon is
I know what a semi colon is, and I think I'm going to take in the people's advice now and put you on ignore now finally. Grats.
 
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169. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 01:06 Jerykk
 
Time after time you guys focus on the corporate bigwigs making profits and ignore the closed developers and failed franchises. The bigwigs are gonna make their money no matter what, that is never in doubt.

Piracy has a real effect on jobs and what is made.

Piracy has a negligible effect on jobs and what is made. Publishers will always stick with safe bets, regardless of piracy. That's why we continue to see a new CoD each year, even though each one is pirated more than almost every other game released in that same year. The financial failure of games like Psychonauts, Brutal Legend, Mirror's Edge, etc, was a result of consumer apathy. Even if those games had had zero piracy, that apathy would still prevent them from selling well.

And no, piracy isn't the reason why publishers focus on consoles. Publishers focus on consoles because consoles have the larger market share. Consoles have the larger market share because they are more accessible and mainstream. Again, these things would not change if piracy ceased to exist.

If they haven't already, I'm sure someone will bring up Iron Lore and how they got shut down because Titan Quest was pirated. Titan Quest got pirated, yes. But that's not the reason why it didn't sell well. It didn't sell well because most consumers had no interest in it. Not enough interest to pay the initial asking price, at least. Those that were interested were probably turned off by the reviews and word of mouth reporting that the game was a buggy mess and that its DRM scheme could break the game, even for some legitimate users. Maybe some of these users waited until the game was sufficiently patched before buying it, at which point it was already too late for the game to be profitable.

To assume that piracy is the reason why studios and games fail is just silly. You'd have to ignore all the more obvious and logical factors to believe that. That said, the fundamental problem with debates about piracy is that there are no irrefutable statistics to draw upon. You can't prove or disprove the exact impact of piracy on sales. Piracy also evokes a strong ethical response and a person's moral fiber tends to be deeply ingrained. If someone believes piracy is inherently right or wrong, no amount of reasoning, logic or evidence will sway them. That's why we continue to have these exact same debates over and over and over again.
 
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168. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 00:44 Beamer
 
Bhruic wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 23:50:
also, more people here need to fucking learn that when someone says "Probably" they are not stating a fact. Both sides keep saying "where do you get your numbers, douche" to shit that is clearly speculation.

Then don't be a douche? There's a difference between numbers that are likely accurate, but not backed up by hard facts, and numbers that are nothing but pure guesses. What you've done here is the latter.

Or, to put it differently, you can claim that 10% of the people who pirate games would buy them, and I could claim that 0.00001% of the people who pirate games would buy them, and there's no way either of us could be proven wrong. So why invent numbers in the first place? If you want to argue, you bring facts. If you want to speculate, well, fine, but don't expect anyone to take your argument seriously.

I'm not the only one people are doing it to. Others are putting their own speculation out there as discussion points. How about challenging it with your own speculation rather than stupidly acting like it's being stated as fact?

Not sure why speculation isn't taken seriously? Fake facts are worth tossing out, speculation is not. Speculation is meant to be debated. Fake facts are not. And it isn't like this board is a bastion of proper arguing - people LOVE to go 150% to one side rather than actually think clearly. Just look at how many people think Mike Capps said "PC piracy canceled Bulletstorm 2" when he never actually said that. He said low sales canceled Bulletstorm. He also said piracy lowered PC sales. He never said that without piracy the PC sales would be strong enough for a sequel. I mean, fuck, I don't get how anyone with a brain is reading it that way. We all know PC sales were expected to be a drop in the bucket and that PC sales do not make or break a console-oriented release. Capps is not saying that.
The entire discussion is on youtube.
 
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167. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 00:05 StingingVelvet
 
EricFate wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 20:15:
Why does EA find it so hard to believe that a buggy console port which contained less than eight hours worth of gameplay and one-note multiplayer that got boring after 5 rounds didn't garner many sales at their $60 dollar price point? The game was fun, but not $60 worth of fun. More like $15 worth of fun.

Every single console boxed release is $60 at release really, with few exceptions. I don't see how price is relevant when comparing the sales to general expectations.

They could have made it cheaper on PC, sure, but why?
 
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166. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 11, 2012, 00:01 StingingVelvet
 
Eirikrautha wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 16:48:
Dear God! I've been lurking on this site for ten years, and your comment finally made me sign up!

I don't know what's worse... your faulty analogy or your appeal to it in order to support restricting human freedom! First, it wouldn't take you more than five minutes to research the "Wild" West and find out that it was far from "wild." The most homicides ever recorded in Tombstone, AZ in one year? Three (and that was so extraordinary/infamous that they have made books and movies about it ever since). How about Dodge City? Five. Deadwood? Seven. Hell, seven murders is a slow WEEKEND in Detroit!

So, you conclude, based on a false, media-driven stereotype turned analogy, that people cannot be expected to behave on the internet, so we need to regulate it?!?! Please!

'Sup.

I like how you consider murder rate the only important thing there. You completely ignore theft, homelessness, poverty, lack of defense and infrastructure, etc. In any case, it was just a phrase, not the deep and well thought-out analogy I guess you pretended I said it was.

The point is a lack of regulation is not gonna jive in today's world. And no matter what libertarians think, most people don't want that anyway.
 
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165. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 10, 2012, 23:50 Bhruic
 
also, more people here need to fucking learn that when someone says "Probably" they are not stating a fact. Both sides keep saying "where do you get your numbers, douche" to shit that is clearly speculation.

Then don't be a douche? There's a difference between numbers that are likely accurate, but not backed up by hard facts, and numbers that are nothing but pure guesses. What you've done here is the latter.

Or, to put it differently, you can claim that 10% of the people who pirate games would buy them, and I could claim that 0.00001% of the people who pirate games would buy them, and there's no way either of us could be proven wrong. So why invent numbers in the first place? If you want to argue, you bring facts. If you want to speculate, well, fine, but don't expect anyone to take your argument seriously.
 
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164. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 10, 2012, 23:42 StingingVelvet
 
Verno wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 13:51:
A fairly lame comparison, people aren't murdering each other to steal copies of the latest Kelly Clarkson album on rapidshare. Your anecdotal account doesn't really justify internet wide censorship by corporations, many of which continue to post record profits year after year.

Time after time you guys focus on the corporate bigwigs making profits and ignore the closed developers and failed franchises. The bigwigs are gonna make their money no matter what, that is never in doubt.

Piracy has a real effect on jobs and what is made.

Has the internet made things easier to share? Sure but that's always been a problem. Sometimes that sharing is perfectly innocent, sometimes its "piracy". People love to create and we love to share. Most entertainment industries real problem with piracy was their continued obsession in fighting technological change in the face of consumer demand.

I agree with this, but still at the end of the day unregulated freedom is pretty opposed to the modern standard. It will be regulated, one way or the other.
 
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163. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 10, 2012, 23:29 xXBatmanXx
 
Dmitri_M wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 22:05:
I think these statements of piracy are aimed at publisher shareholders and boardrooms of spiky haired MBAs and PR people. A believable excuse for devs to explain away poor sales on the stepchild platform.
*DING*DING*DING*

We have a winner!
 
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162. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 10, 2012, 22:56 Beamer
 
deqer wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 18:43:
Beamer wrote on Apr 10, 2012, 17:59:
For clarification, he's not saying piracy doomed Bulletstorm 2
That's not what this thread's title is saying.

oh Jesus. Learn what a semi colon is, learn how journalist's use them to create misleading headlines, and learn ti read the fucking article.



also, more people here need to fucking learn that when someone says "Probably" they are not stating a fact. Both sides keep saying "where do you get your numbers, douche" to shit that is clearly speculation.

 
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161. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 10, 2012, 22:05 Dmitri_M
 
I think these statements of piracy are aimed at publisher shareholders and boardrooms of spiky haired MBAs and PR people. A believable excuse for devs to explain away poor sales on the stepchild platform.  
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160. Re: Bulletstorm Sequel Cancelled; PC Piracy Mentioned Apr 10, 2012, 22:01 Overon
 
Seriously? Bulletstorm is not even a proper PC game. It's designed for consoles, a new franchise, and piracy was the problem? Right give us some numbers or you are just speculating on piracy. Who pirated this piece of shit game, seriously?  
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239 Replies. 12 pages. Viewing page 4.
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