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Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M

The Double Fine Adventure Kickstarter Page shows this fundraising campaign has now surpassed the two million dollar mark. The original goal of this kickstart was $400K, so at this point the game should be five times better than originally anticipated.

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48. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 23, 2012, 12:15 Dades
 
eRe4s3r wrote on Feb 22, 2012, 23:48:
Thats fair enough, but I don't want to move or change nor would I. Make Kickstarter move, or suffer my constant bitching about their laziness. Because even Paypal would be my 2nd choice (debit cards would be my 5th, right after various pre-paid money cards ,p)

In Germany and on bank accounts here transactions can happen directly over my bank account - that means a retailer requests the money and as long as i don't deny it on my account details (online) it goes through. They could support that payment system via EC card / Delayed Bankeinzug. WoW supported it many years ago, and so does (funnily) Amazon.de . Its where you don't pay on order but rather.. later (whenever the seller charges the account).

So you see, i have no reason to use debit cards (and certainly not just to support Kickstarter projects, where for each $ payment I'd pay a 2% fine which is higher than Paypal, just FYI). If Kickstarter wants my money it's their problem to make sure thats easy for me to do.

Kickstarter is dragging their feet for over 2 years now on this issue. So its not like my complaints are new...

If you contact companies with this kind of volume then I would say Kickstarter probably wants your money as much as I wanted that incoherent exposition.
 
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47. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 22, 2012, 23:48 eRe4s3r
 
Thats fair enough, but I don't want to move or change nor would I. Make Kickstarter move, or suffer my constant bitching about their laziness. Because even Paypal would be my 2nd choice (debit cards would be my 5th, right after various pre-paid money cards ,p)

In Germany and on bank accounts here transactions can happen directly over my bank account - that means a retailer requests the money and as long as i don't deny it on my account details (online) it goes through. They could support that payment system via EC card / Delayed Bankeinzug. WoW supported it many years ago, and so does (funnily) Amazon.de . Its where you don't pay on order but rather.. later (whenever the seller charges the account).

So you see, i have no reason to use debit cards (and certainly not just to support Kickstarter projects, where for each $ payment I'd pay a 2% fine which is higher than Paypal, just FYI). If Kickstarter wants my money it's their problem to make sure thats easy for me to do.

Kickstarter is dragging their feet for over 2 years now on this issue. So its not like my complaints are new...
 
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46. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 22, 2012, 07:40 Dades
 
eRe4s3r wrote on Feb 21, 2012, 21:45:
Well i give you that US only may sound wrong to you (clearly American! ;p), but Amazon payments requires credit cards, i don't have credit card - i have a EC card which is the standard method of payment in Germany, and no reason to want another payment provider besides paypal (that again, links directly to my bank account, same the EC card links to).

Credit cards require a minimal flow of money, yet i have absolutely no reason to use a credit card for anything (in fact, most stores I frequently use don't accept them, EC only) . That is why i say that. Kickstarter would be VERY well advised to get their asses moving and use Paypal and require verified accounts, which HAS the payment method Kickstarter claims it does not have. I know, because i used it regularly for another (German) funding site.

The difference with movie studios by the way, is that I don't pledge them money ^^

That doesn't make it US only, it just means that you don't have a credit card and no one cares why. Paypal is a shitty service that charges large transaction fees and has a tendency to do dumb things like freeze vendor accounts for no reason. Maybe you should just be a grown up and get a credit card in case you ever have to leave the comfort of Germany.
 
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45. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 22, 2012, 05:59 Dev
 
eRe4s3r wrote on Feb 21, 2012, 21:45:
Credit cards require a minimal flow of money, yet i have absolutely no reason to use a credit card for anything (in fact, most stores I frequently use don't accept them, EC only) . That is why i say that. Kickstarter would be VERY well advised to get their asses moving and use Paypal and require verified accounts, which HAS the payment method Kickstarter claims it does not have.
Then go for a debit card. That requires nothing special, no minimum wage. Mostly one just has to have a bank account.

As for paypal, there are good reasons to stay away from paypal. They love to go around freezing paypal accounts for things like chargebacks. My guess is thats why they aren't using them.
 
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44. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 22, 2012, 01:03 Sepharo
 
You personally don't have an acceptable form of payment so obviously that translates as "US only."  
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43. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 21:46 eRe4s3r
 
perspective is relative  
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42. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 21:45 eRe4s3r
 
Well i give you that US only may sound wrong to you (clearly American! ;p), but Amazon payments requires credit cards, i don't have credit card - i have a EC card which is the standard method of payment in Germany, and no reason to want another payment provider besides paypal (that again, links directly to my bank account, same the EC card links to).

Credit cards require a minimal flow of money, yet i have absolutely no reason to use a credit card for anything (in fact, most stores I frequently use don't accept them, EC only) . That is why i say that. Kickstarter would be VERY well advised to get their asses moving and use Paypal and require verified accounts, which HAS the payment method Kickstarter claims it does not have. I know, because i used it regularly for another (German) funding site.

The difference with movie studios by the way, is that I don't pledge them money ^^
 
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41. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 18:14 Prez
 
When I throw $10 at Kickstarter stuff I'm not looking for guaranteed contractual obligations and talking about opening up the books to prevent corruption. If I get a game great, if not then I'm less likely to fund future stuff, end of story.

Seriously. It's nice to be reminded occasionally that a sense of perspective still exists.
 
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40. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 11:54 Dev
 
eRe4s3r wrote on Feb 21, 2012, 11:14:
You misunderstood.. the scam is not to rip you off with no game, the scam is to make a game with the money it was designed for and make imaginary costs for the rest of the money that you funnel back to you via shell companies and false billing. Obviously this merely requires you to get funded on kickstarter, the game idea may even be worthwhile.

Besides, I am just pointing out that crowd funding can be easily scammed. I am not really worrying about this, because even if I wanted i couldn't use Kickstarter, its US only.
If the scam is to make a game in the first place, but make sure its crappy and pocket the money, one can do already even without kickstarter lol.

In fact, have you ever read about hollywood math or how the music industry operates? They do something similar, make up and inflate lots of costs. I recall that the studio that made Lord of the Rings trilogy claimed they didn't have to pay Peter Jackson his cut because they made $0 yes ZERO dollars on the trilogy. Those are concrete and real examples of what you are talking about, and far more money, and far more worthy to be concerned about.

Also, its NOT USA only. Obviously you haven't looked at many kickstarters, I continually see information on them about how shipping outside the USA is going to cost extra (for ones that have physical rewards). You just have to create an account on the amazon.com website, and you don't have to live in the USA to do that just like I don't have to live in germany to order from amazon.de. You WILL need a credit/debit card though to do the funding. In fact the official kickstarter webpage even mentions this.

Can people from outside the US pledge to projects?

Yes! Anyone, anywhere (with a major credit card) can pledge to Kickstarter projects.
This is yet another thing I'm pretty sure I've covered in previous replies.

BTW, tim increased the number of $10,000 lunches with him (it was originally just 1 which sold out quickly) and there's only a couple left. Some people are willing to pay lots of money to have lunch with a sorta video game celeb who is likely their hero. Shocking eh?

This comment was edited on Feb 21, 2012, 12:44.
 
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39. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 11:21 Verno
 
eRe4s3r wrote on Feb 21, 2012, 11:14:
You misunderstood.. the scam is not to rip you off with no game, the scam is to make a game with the money it was designed for and make imaginary costs for the rest of the money that you funnel back to you via shell companies and false billing. Obviously this merely requires you to get funded on kickstarter, the game idea may even be worthwhile.

Besides, I am just pointing out that crowd funding can be easily scammed. I am not really worrying about this, because even if I wanted i couldn't use Kickstarter, its US only.

I'm pretty sure people are going to know the difference in the quality if its telling and I don't really care if the developer took a few buddies out to lunch on my dime or whatever. The quality of the game is all that matters and everyone is well aware of the many ways consumers can get scammed in the gaming industry, no need to ring the alarm bells man
 
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38. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 11:16 Beamer
 
wtf_man wrote on Feb 21, 2012, 09:54:
Prez wrote on Feb 21, 2012, 00:32:
At what point does this game need to be completely redefined because it got TOO MUCH money?

It can't have too much... two things that constantly are "short" due to funding are amount of content and polish. Since oldschool adventures are fairly straight-forward... they are easy to polish (may add a little more graphical detail here and there)... so that leaves extending the content... whether it's adding more plot-twists, more side-plots, more puzzles, or hopefully - more humor.

Sure it can. How much can a 2D adventure game cost? You can add more content, but when does that stop making sense? When does that become content for the sake of spending money rather than because it's fun and fits the plot. You can polish, but how much polish can you put onto a 2D adventure game? You can't really add humor with money, though I guess you can repeatedly test humor.
All of this also takes time, and a small team burning through a lot of money takes a lot of time.

The really interesting question is what happens if nearly everyone that would buy this buys this via Kickstarter. Then there's a guarantee of not going in the red, but not much guarantee of going decently into the black. It's a no-risk no-reward project. That seems unlikely, given that so many people will have this and everyone will be talking about it, but it's an interesting thing.
 
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37. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 11:14 eRe4s3r
 
You misunderstood.. the scam is not to rip you off with no game, the scam is to make a game with the money it was designed for and make imaginary costs for the rest of the money that you funnel back to you via shell companies and false billing. Obviously this merely requires you to get funded on kickstarter, the game idea may even be worthwhile.

Besides, I am just pointing out that crowd funding can be easily scammed. I am not really worrying about this, because even if I wanted i couldn't use Kickstarter, its US only.
 
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36. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 10:53 Dev
 
Verno wrote on Feb 21, 2012, 10:44:
I don't know how anyone manages to buy retail games these days if they have a problem with a variable kickstarter fund, they are just as big of a risk.
IMHO, more of a risk. Every kickstarter I've thought worth funding you can tell the creators really care about the project. Looking at the video, the description, sometimes the alpha or prototype, their webpages, some have done interviews about how its been a 10 year dream they've been working on (interviews that aren't even on kickstarter or were done years prior). They are the types you know that they can make a good end result.

A lot of other games I see nowadays are buggy crap that are rushed out the door.

Heck, just walking into a sears store you can get defective crap off the shelf. I got a craftsmen tool set that had 2 wrong parts inside. I would have expected craftsmen to be top quality and have people that make sure you get WTF you are supposed to get inside a tool set.

There was the bernie madoff ponzi scheme that cost people what, $20 to $100 billion? Just ONE guy cost millions of people billions of bucks. Thats the kinda stuff that's worth worrying about.

Use some common sense about kickstarter projects. If there's 2 equally priced similar items on amazon do you buy the one that has a 1 star review average from a bunch of people because they say its a cheap chinese knockoff that catches fire? Or do you buy the 4 star review average reviewed by 100 people that say its works great?

If you can't afford to lose money on something, DONT INVEST IN IT. Also, if you are the type that stays awake at night and worries about a stock investment in a blue chip stock, its NOT WORTH THE STRESS. Put the money into a bank or a CD or a treasury, or something else that won't keep you awake. I know people like this. I've seen them literally destroy their health and drive themselves into a mental breakdown over something like that.

This comment was edited on Feb 21, 2012, 11:10.
 
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35. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 10:44 Verno
 
I don't know how anyone manages to buy retail games these days if they have a problem with a variable kickstarter fund, they are just as big of a risk.  
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34. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 10:39 Dev
 
eRe4s3r wrote on Feb 21, 2012, 10:15:
Yet these arguments are based on the morality of all involved. The world teaches us that where there is money, there is corruption.

Heck, you could set up shell companies and scam the payout process with imaginary costs like rent, when you live in your own property, etc. Unless the guys at Kickstarter are financial experts they would never notice, nor could they tell what is legit expense and what scam or simply "waste".

I don't think it'd be difficult to exploit. All it requires is a mild level of criminal intent and some intelligence.
And again, I addressed this in previous replies. I even gave an example of a kickstarter project that I wouldn't fund because it looked like crap.

BTW, there's FAR FAR more likelihood something like that goes on when you buy a $60 game like the latest game with CoD in its title. I'm sure there's a lot more wasted money when something is up near a billion bucks. Yet how many people who buy that game worry about what the company or dev studio is wasting the money on?

If you feel uncomfortable with kickstarter, you are welcome to not fund any projects. I'll enjoy my exclusive bonuses and discounted pre-orders thanks. There's been many proven and delivered kickstarter projects that had a good end result and good deliverables.

This comment was edited on Feb 21, 2012, 10:58.
 
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33. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 10:24 Verno
 
Ok, if you want to spend your life worrying about that then go right nuts eraser. I'm pretty sure Tim is in it for creating things, not money, otherwise he'd be in a different part of the industry. When I throw $10 at Kickstarter stuff I'm not looking for guaranteed contractual obligations and talking about opening up the books to prevent corruption. If I get a game great, if not then I'm less likely to fund future stuff, end of story.  
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32. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 10:15 eRe4s3r
 
Yet these arguments are based on the morality of all involved. The world teaches us that where there is money, there is corruption.

Heck, you could set up shell companies and scam the payout process with imaginary costs like rent, when you live in your own property, etc. Unless the guys at Kickstarter are financial experts they would never notice, nor could they tell what is legit expense and what scam or simply "waste".

I don't think it'd be difficult to exploit. All it requires is a mild level of criminal intent and some intelligence.
 
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31. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 09:54 wtf_man
 
Prez wrote on Feb 21, 2012, 00:32:
At what point does this game need to be completely redefined because it got TOO MUCH money?

It can't have too much... two things that constantly are "short" due to funding are amount of content and polish. Since oldschool adventures are fairly straight-forward... they are easy to polish (may add a little more graphical detail here and there)... so that leaves extending the content... whether it's adding more plot-twists, more side-plots, more puzzles, or hopefully - more humor.
 
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30. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 00:32 Prez
 
At what point does this game need to be completely redefined because it got TOO MUCH money?  
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29. Re: Double Fine Kickstart Hits $2M Feb 21, 2012, 00:09 Dev
 
eRe4s3r wrote on Feb 20, 2012, 22:51:
You just explained with your thinking why this is not that way. The money has to be used FULLY on the project. Any profit possibility by sales exists only after full use of kickstart funds by real sales. No matter how much money is left when the project is done it is not THEIRS to use once it is done - in fact, legally Kickstarter could limit payouts to actual back-checked bills to prevent abuse. This is why i look at this whole thing stumped. I sure as hell hope Kickstarter has a milestone based payout plan and a proper design document to plan the milestones with. Otherwise this is so ripe for exploitation that.. it'd be beyond words.
I've written extensive responses to this before about why it would be difficult to exploit, I think at least some in reply to you

 
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