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No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City?

It seems Batman: Arkham City will not use Games for Windows LIVE, after all, as GreenManGaming tweets: "We've just received notice from Warner's that Batman is Games for Windows but NOT a Games for Windows 'Live' title!" The box art for the stealth/action sequel was revealed in June showing the GFWL logo, suggesting the game would use Microsoft's service, like Batman: Arkham Asylum did. Thanks Eurogamer.

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57. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 30, 2011, 19:02 Mordecai Walfish
 
Duh, you're right. I was talking about a previous box shot that this discussion had surrounded previously which only showed "Games for Windows" on the box.. I just saw the updated box in question that clearly does have the logo..

What a disappointment! Sorry for doubtin' the 'news blue. ^_~
 
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56. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 30, 2011, 08:47 Verno
 
It's just a half assed client that is finally starting to die out. Microsoft seems to have finally given up on pretending it's worth a damn, I don't think they even have a single active developer working on it.  
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55. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 29, 2011, 21:35 ForgedReality
 
Ecthelion wrote on Aug 29, 2011, 14:15:
Verno wrote on Aug 29, 2011, 11:46:
Arkham Asylum was perfectly playable with both the gamepad and KB/M, which you choose is a matter of preference. I will say that I preferred the gamepad simply for some feedback in that game but a friend of mine using the KB/M was pulling off ridiculous combos that put most gamepad players to shame, so they each have their ups and downs.
I only used the KB/M, and I managed to get some pretty crazy combos in the challenge maps after tons and tons of practice (I ended up getting all the achievements actually, once of which involved getting a perfect string of combos). It's probably possible on gamepads as well, but they were perfectly doable with KB/M. In general I prefer KB/M to gamepads even when the game isn't really designed for KB/M. However, I can certainly understand the appeal of playing on the couch with a gamepad. I happen to like gaming at a desk, but I realize many people think that's crazy.

I found GFWL to be unobtrusive in AA, so I didn't really care one way or the other about its inclusion in AC. However, if it's removal gets more PC gamers to buy the game, I'm glad it happened. More people need to realize what a great game the original (and hopefully the sequel) was, and I'd like to see them make more sequels as long as they can keep the stories top-notch.

Also, the cover art I've seen in the past definitely included the GFWL logo, so its removal is certainly newsworthy.

I don't really understand why GFWL exists in the first place other than to place shackles on it and help prevent piracy. Really, it's just an annoying nuisance. With Arkham Asylum, it didn't intrude too much, but I have to wonder how much performance a thing like that saps away from a game. I never use it -- I always play with an offline account and not bother logging into a friggin game.

It's stupid to make you LOG IN. You're already AT YOUR COMPUTER. I can understand logging into an online account, but it's a single player game firstly, and secondly, WHY THE FUCK ARE YOU MAKING ME LOG IN TO PLAY A GAME ON MY COMPUTER?

Make me log in if I want to use an online service, so I can have access to my account, not to play a game on my computer. It's not like I could be somebody else on my own computer. Why the fuck do you want me to log in? So yeah, I ignored it and played offline or whatever the GWFL thing calls it. Even better to not have to worry about that stupid crap in the first place. I just might buy AC if it turns out reviewers like it. (What ever happened to shareware and demo versions of games so you can try before you buy???)
 
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54. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 29, 2011, 21:29 MattyC
 
Muscular Beaver wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 09:01:
TurdFergasun wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 07:57:
Jerykk wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 06:09:

You don't honestly believe that M/KB is the ideal control scheme for every genre of game, do you? Some genres (like racing and fighting) are simply better suited to alternate controllers. Technically, you don't need to use a gamepad for any PC game. However, if you refuse to use anything but M/KB, you won't be getting the optimal experience in some genres.

fighting and sports games are the only type of games that benefit from a control pad. racing, if you have been behind the wheel of an actual vehicle (which if you haven't your opinion is useless to begin with) should be done with a force feedback wheel. There are some racing games, that are crap with either wheel, kbm, or control pad, but those are incredibly shitty games to begin with and should be shunned like poison.

Agreed 100%.
I tried racing games with a gamepad for a while and then I got sick of it. I tried a joystick and it was much better, but then I got a wheel and its fantastic.

Its all about how the developer gets the controls done. If its a cheap console port, the controls with M/KB will suck, even on a shooter. That wont mean I will ever use a controller instead, just because the developer/publisher were too cheap to make a proper PC version.

Oh and I sold my controller again as well. I simply dont have any games on the PC that justify it. And I wont buy em either.

Interesting. I have used a few wheels before and maybe they just sucked, but I didn't much care for them. I have always enjoyed racing games on a gamepad. Then again that may reflect that (other than a bit of Need For Speed) most serious racing game play started with Gran Tourismo on a PS1 dual shock.
 
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53. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 29, 2011, 14:15 Ecthelion
 
Verno wrote on Aug 29, 2011, 11:46:
Arkham Asylum was perfectly playable with both the gamepad and KB/M, which you choose is a matter of preference. I will say that I preferred the gamepad simply for some feedback in that game but a friend of mine using the KB/M was pulling off ridiculous combos that put most gamepad players to shame, so they each have their ups and downs.
I only used the KB/M, and I managed to get some pretty crazy combos in the challenge maps after tons and tons of practice (I ended up getting all the achievements actually, once of which involved getting a perfect string of combos). It's probably possible on gamepads as well, but they were perfectly doable with KB/M. In general I prefer KB/M to gamepads even when the game isn't really designed for KB/M. However, I can certainly understand the appeal of playing on the couch with a gamepad. I happen to like gaming at a desk, but I realize many people think that's crazy.

I found GFWL to be unobtrusive in AA, so I didn't really care one way or the other about its inclusion in AC. However, if it's removal gets more PC gamers to buy the game, I'm glad it happened. More people need to realize what a great game the original (and hopefully the sequel) was, and I'd like to see them make more sequels as long as they can keep the stories top-notch.

Also, the cover art I've seen in the past definitely included the GFWL logo, so its removal is certainly newsworthy.
 
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52. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 29, 2011, 11:56  Blue 
 
Mordecai Walfish wrote on Aug 29, 2011, 05:27:
The box they were talking about did not, in fact have a "Games for Windows LIVE" branding on it. It was just "Games for Windows", a program Microsoft has run for a long time.

I have no idea why you would say that. The box are we are talking about does, in fact, have the "Games for Windows LIVE" branding on it.

http://www.bluesnews.com/screenshots/games/batmanarkhamcity/20110616/

Don't even know why this is newsworthy.

It would be newsworthy anyway since Arkham Asylum was a GFWL title. But that point is moot, the gigantic GFWL logo is right there for anyone to see.
 
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51. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 29, 2011, 11:46 Verno
 
Arkham Asylum was perfectly playable with both the gamepad and KB/M, which you choose is a matter of preference. I will say that I preferred the gamepad simply for some feedback in that game but a friend of mine using the KB/M was pulling off ridiculous combos that put most gamepad players to shame, so they each have their ups and downs.  
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50. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 29, 2011, 05:27 Mordecai Walfish
 
The box they were talking about did not, in fact have a "Games for Windows LIVE" branding on it. It was just "Games for Windows", a program Microsoft has run for a long time. Don't even know why this is newsworthy.  
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49. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 29, 2011, 00:55 Stolk
 
Slashman wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 20:36:
Stolk wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 19:32:
So, what does everyone here plan on doing when the PC dies? Slit wrist?

What do you plan on doing when it's still around more than a decade from now? Jump off bridge?

Probably check my email and facebook, etc, etc. Maybe play a video game. But then again, things most likely won't work out that way. Cute comment though.
 
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48. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 28, 2011, 23:44 Jerykk
 
If a PC and an Xbox can run the exact same game, and, let's be honest here, it doesn't look all that different, why WOULDN'T I switch if I had a KBM option? The differences in visuals are minutae.

Eh? I notice a pretty significant difference between 30 FPS (or lower) and 60+ FPS. Same with 720p (or less) and 1080p. And 2xAA (or less) vs 8xAA. And 2xAF (or less) vs 16xAF. When I can choose to have the objectively superior visual experience, why would I choose otherwise?

And the advantage of playing in a bigger screen with a better sound system is very compelling.

You can hook up your PC to your big screen and better sound system.

The hardware is cheaper. The games can be sold/traded. There are far fewer bugs. I can rent a game before I buy it...or choose only to rent it for a once- through.

Buying a new HD for your X360 is significantly more expensive than buying an HD with the same capacity for your PC. You also have to pay for Xbox LIVE and the MSRP of console games is typically $10-20 higher than the PC versions of those games. PC games also go on sale more quickly and more often. Just recently, people could get DX:HR for only $30 and that's before it was even released. As for rentals/used sales, you have a point. You can't do those with PC. However, if you don't care about giving money to publishers/developers (and if you rely on used sales or rentals, you obviously don't), then piracy is an even cheaper and more convenient option on PC. Try the full game for free, then buy it if you enjoy it at the price you feel it is worth. Publishers/developers actually make more money if you do that instead of buying used games or renting them.
 
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47. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 28, 2011, 20:36 Slashman
 
Stolk wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 19:32:
So, what does everyone here plan on doing when the PC dies? Slit wrist?

What do you plan on doing when it's still around more than a decade from now? Jump off bridge?
 
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46. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 28, 2011, 19:32 Stolk
 
So, what does everyone here plan on doing when the PC dies? Slit wrist?  
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45. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 28, 2011, 14:45 Krovven
 
Slashman wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 11:47:
Just Cause 2 is a perfect example of a console game that was vastly superior on the PC.

Very very true. I've played 29 hours in JC2, on my PC, sitting on my couch with a gamepad. JC2 is also an exception for me, as an action filled shooter like this, I'd normally play with mouse & keyboard. But because of the auto aim that cannot be turned off, it hindered the mouse control significantly because you were rarely hitting what you were aiming at. So the only factor for me was comfort.

Normally a game like JC2 with autoaim that cant be turned off, I wouldnt bother with it at all. But it's just too good of a game to pass up, and I thoroughly enjoyed it (with a gamepad), and still probably have 50+ hrs of side missions to play over time.

In the end...it's not a matter of being a snob...to me it's just common sense.

Right, but when common sense fails and the reasoning with it, I refer to them as snobs

 
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44. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 28, 2011, 14:38 Krovven
 
^Drag0n^ wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 10:03:
Sorry, Krovven, but I'd have to agree with El Pit on this. If a PC and an Xbox can run the exact same game, and, let's be honest here..

I'm not debating anything to do with consoles vs pc's. If you read, the debate is about using a gamepad on my pc from the comfort of a couch, for the games that are best suited for gamepads.

The point I've been making is there is no reason for me to have a 360 at all, when I can play those same games on my PC using a gamepad. El Pit suggests that those games that require a gamepad shouldnt even be on a PC, they should stay on consoles.

Arkham City imo, is one of those games. It's great that the m/k controls are good, but using a gamepad for a fighting game is just better. Being able to sit on my couch, with 1080 graphics, using a gamepad on the pc version is going to win everytime over getting a game like this for my PS3. And yes anyoen that wants to tell me I'm wrong, that gamepad games don't belong on PC's...I am simply going to refer to them as idiots, especially when their reasonings make no sense and contradict themselves.

 
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43. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 28, 2011, 14:24 Krovven
 
El Pit wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 07:16:
I hate this "Press X and double press O" stuff. A great thing about Batman: AA is, that the kb/m controls were amazing. And not "inferior" at all.

Now if you stop and actually think about what you are saying for just a second...

It doesn't matter whether you use the keyboard & mouse or gamepad. You are still doing the same thing in Batman, except with a different controller.

Your hypocrisy is laughable. You think "Press X and double press O" is ok as long as you are doing it with a keyboard & mouse? /facepalm

Clearly you aren't "bright" as none of your reasoning makes any sense at all. You say you want superior controls. Guess what, mouse & keyboard are not superior controls in every case, but you just completely ignore those games because you are afraid of a gamepad. You have no real rational justification for it. So yes, that makes your reasoning idiotic, and yes you aren't very bright for not seeing past it.

 
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42. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 28, 2011, 11:47 Slashman
 
^Drag0n^ wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 10:03:
Krovven wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 04:24:
El Pit wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 03:32:
If I could control the games on a PS3 or X360 with kb/m, I'd buy a console

Why would I waste money on a 360 when I can play the majority of those games on the PC with better graphics and still be using either kb/mouse or the 360 gamepad depending on the game?

Your reasoning is simply idiotic.


Sorry, Krovven, but I'd have to agree with El Pit on this. If a PC and an Xbox can run the exact same game, and, let's be honest here, it doesn't look all that different, why WOULDN'T I switch if I had a KBM option? The differences in visuals are minutae. And the advantage of playing in a bigger screen with a better sound system is very compelling.

The hardware is cheaper. The games can be sold/traded. There are far fewer bugs. I can rent a game before I buy it...or choose only to rent it for a once- through.

There are really only 2 things holding me back:

1. They don't have KBM controls.
2. Customized matchmaking such that I play people I want to.

And (1) leads (2) by far as (2) is more application dependent.

Right now I have both. I play probably 95% of my games on a PC, but I do enjoy Red Dead Redemption on my 360.

Just my $0.02

^D^

The thing is that with the Batman games, this whole argument is pointless.

Mouse and keyboard were excellent for the PC in the first game. In fact, I was doing combos and stuff that my console friend couldn't even with his gamepad. The controls are so simple that I'd say there is no advantage of one over the other. I owned using M/KB.

On PC the graphics are better, you'll have more options to tune the look of the game and you can choose your control scheme. You have no choices on the console. There is only the couch argument, which is really not that big of a deal if you have a modern PC. You can hook it up to your tv.

In general, I don't play fighting games or racing games. I won't argue that those are best played on a console. With fighting games...most of them don't get made for PC...so that is a big + for consoles right off the bat.

But for every game that gets ported to PC, if the port is decent, there is no way that a console beats it on any level unless the developers purposely gimped the PC.

Just Cause 2 is a perfect example of a console game that was vastly superior on the PC. Darksiders, IMO, was also great on the PC. There were no downsides to those games on PC. Controllers were fully supported, if you thought they were better, and mouse and keyboard worked very well.

In the end...it's not a matter of being a snob...to me it's just common sense.
 
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41. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 28, 2011, 11:37 nin
 
let's be honest here, it doesn't look all that different,

Unless you're referring to just one certain game, that's certainty open for debate.

 
http://store.nin.com/index.php?cPath=10
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40. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 28, 2011, 11:10 Dades
 
The differences in visuals are minutae.

I would dispute this as heavily subjective at best, if not outright exaggeration. There is no reason beyond budgetary or port related concerns that someone should choose a console version over a PC version. The majority of the time the PC version lets you use the input device of your choice, has far better visuals, better framerates and lets you choose where to play it physically.
 
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39. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 28, 2011, 10:03 ^Drag0n^
 
Krovven wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 04:24:
El Pit wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 03:32:
If I could control the games on a PS3 or X360 with kb/m, I'd buy a console

Why would I waste money on a 360 when I can play the majority of those games on the PC with better graphics and still be using either kb/mouse or the 360 gamepad depending on the game?

Your reasoning is simply idiotic.


Sorry, Krovven, but I'd have to agree with El Pit on this. If a PC and an Xbox can run the exact same game, and, let's be honest here, it doesn't look all that different, why WOULDN'T I switch if I had a KBM option? The differences in visuals are minutae. And the advantage of playing in a bigger screen with a better sound system is very compelling.

The hardware is cheaper. The games can be sold/traded. There are far fewer bugs. I can rent a game before I buy it...or choose only to rent it for a once- through.

There are really only 2 things holding me back:

1. They don't have KBM controls.
2. Customized matchmaking such that I play people I want to.

And (1) leads (2) by far as (2) is more application dependent.

Right now I have both. I play probably 95% of my games on a PC, but I do enjoy Red Dead Redemption on my 360.

Just my $0.02

^D^
 
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38. Re: No GFWL for Batman: Arkham City? Aug 28, 2011, 09:01 Muscular Beaver
 
TurdFergasun wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 07:57:
Jerykk wrote on Aug 28, 2011, 06:09:

You don't honestly believe that M/KB is the ideal control scheme for every genre of game, do you? Some genres (like racing and fighting) are simply better suited to alternate controllers. Technically, you don't need to use a gamepad for any PC game. However, if you refuse to use anything but M/KB, you won't be getting the optimal experience in some genres.

fighting and sports games are the only type of games that benefit from a control pad. racing, if you have been behind the wheel of an actual vehicle (which if you haven't your opinion is useless to begin with) should be done with a force feedback wheel. There are some racing games, that are crap with either wheel, kbm, or control pad, but those are incredibly shitty games to begin with and should be shunned like poison.

Agreed 100%.
I tried racing games with a gamepad for a while and then I got sick of it. I tried a joystick and it was much better, but then I got a wheel and its fantastic.

Its all about how the developer gets the controls done. If its a cheap console port, the controls with M/KB will suck, even on a shooter. That wont mean I will ever use a controller instead, just because the developer/publisher were too cheap to make a proper PC version.

Oh and I sold my controller again as well. I simply dont have any games on the PC that justify it. And I wont buy em either.

This comment was edited on Aug 28, 2011, 09:08.
 
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