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The Old Republic Delay?

The Star Wars: The Old Republic Website has a new trailer to highlight Warzones, a PvP element in BioWare's upcoming Star Wars MMORPG. The clip depicts the battle for Alderaan, the home planet of Princess Leia that eventually became a target drone for the Death Star. They also offer fans the chance to come up with a name for one of the Advanced Classes for the Jedi, as they equivocate about the name Jedi Wizard. They are conducting a poll to see if that name should be kept as it is, or changed to either Jedi Sage, Jedi Seer, or Jedi Adept. There's also a Star Wars: The Old Republic preview on GameSpot that looks at PvP as well as crafting in the game. Finally, there's a BioWare interview on Eurogamer.net where doctors Zeschuk and Muzyka discuss The Old Republic, as well as EA Louse and Mass Effect 3. One of Ray Muzyka's answers about The Old Republic's due date indicates the game's previously confirmed spring 2011 release window may be in jeopardy, as he now says of the game's release: "We're just saying 2011."

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47. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 9, 2010, 14:48 Eldaron Imotholin
 
Verno wrote on Nov 9, 2010, 12:24:
You can't dodge projectiles in WoW, some raid bosses have scripted objects but for the most part the combat is very tame and simple. Line of sight isn't really a game mechanic so much as it is a limitation construct for the combat

Didn't kxmode proved differently by describing how he plays his Warlock, or do you have him on ignore aswell? Also... there might've been a reason why kxmode said "another form of dodging".

Dodge.. another word for avoidance. The way kxmode described how he dodges, he's sure as hell right that there's ways of avoiding hits.

Also, that you can't literally dodge the way I understand you guys mean it... is a very smart decision. If you had that ability, they might aswell remove the mage class and change the agility attribute to simply "crit chance".

WoW is an MMORPG. Thank god you can't dodge projectiles and melee attacks that are in range unless you do a "success roll" on dodging. Seriously, nobody would wanna play a hunter or mage/warlock/shaman no more.

The combat system of WoW works.
 
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46. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 9, 2010, 12:24 Verno
 
You can't dodge projectiles in WoW, some raid bosses have scripted objects but for the most part the combat is very tame and simple. Line of sight isn't really a game mechanic so much as it is a limitation construct for the combat.  
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45. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 23:06 Kxmode
 
mag wrote on Nov 7, 2010, 12:07:
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2010, 10:35:
Did someone here actually call WoW combat "kinetic?"


My biggest complaint about that game was I felt like I just hit a number on the keypad then watched my guy do an animation until the thing in front of him was dead.

Hahaha, I know. That line just blew my mind. Sure, you can move around in Wow, but it doesn't actually have any impact on whether or not you and the other guy can hit one another. There's no such thing as dodging.

Yes there is. There are other forms of dodging but we call them distance and line of sight. Having played a Warlock I know all about distance and line of sight. I use my portal to teleport away, sometimes in places my target cannot reach thanks to portal's non-LOS teleporting. I then fear my target, DOT them up, and drain their health... with my target unable to attack me I usually win. This whole time I'm able to run around applying DOTs, and teleport and keep myself in motion while fighting. If players couldn't do this WOW would be pretty boring and its subscriber base would die. So how in the world can SW:TOR compete against WOW, when WOW's combat by its very nature is fun, fast, and full of kinetic movement? Please don't bring up balance and class issues. My point isn't about that, it's about a simple concept of being about to move and fight at the SAME time. Most MMOs don't do this that I've seen.
 
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44. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 22:18 Sepharo
 
Tumbler wrote on Nov 7, 2010, 18:09:
Game looks great, it has a nice take on crafting where you can have companions doing it partly for you or in teams with other player, warzones having an actual part in the story, and not having you meeting in arenas fighting for a stupid flag that makes no sense... With focus on story where every other MMO has has none. This will rock most SW fans world. The only thing they really need to work on are animations like running and day and nightcykles.

Do you have any links to video clips that show gameplay for long periods of time? Everything I can remember see has been really short, like seconds in most cases, it looks like someone is editing it HEAVILY and it would be nice to see someone simply playing the game for 10 min doing the things you're talking about.

Has they made any clips like this?

I managed to find some shaky cam from conventions but they all had little to no combat.

Like this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZZLRcqb4bs


edit: actually I guess that one does have some good combat scenes, must not have made it that far in last time I watched.
 
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43. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 18:09 Tumbler
 
Game looks great, it has a nice take on crafting where you can have companions doing it partly for you or in teams with other player, warzones having an actual part in the story, and not having you meeting in arenas fighting for a stupid flag that makes no sense... With focus on story where every other MMO has has none. This will rock most SW fans world. The only thing they really need to work on are animations like running and day and nightcykles.

Do you have any links to video clips that show gameplay for long periods of time? Everything I can remember see has been really short, like seconds in most cases, it looks like someone is editing it HEAVILY and it would be nice to see someone simply playing the game for 10 min doing the things you're talking about.

Has they made any clips like this?
 
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42. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 13:25 Gambit_2K
 
If you have'nt seen combat and running at the same time you haven't looked at many clips at all.

Running and firing is in. Running and using force powers is in (not all power but forcelightning for the Inquisitor for example). Although syncing animations where lighsabers clash would be impossible while running (ad look stupid) without a real physicsengine don't you think? and what would be better, a WOW like take on melee fighting where weapons never touch? Or having the iconic lighsaber clash in the game... ?

Game looks great, it has a nice take on crafting where you can have companions doing it partly for you or in teams with other player, warzones having an actual part in the story, and not having you meeting in arenas fighting for a stupid flag that makes no sense... With focus on story where every other MMO has has none. This will rock most SW fans world. The only thing they really need to work on are animations like running and day and nightcykles.
 
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41. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 12:18 Beamer
 
Hahaha, I know. That line just blew my mind. Sure, you can move around in Wow, but it doesn't actually have any impact on whether or not you and the other guy can hit one another. There's no such thing as dodging.

And, correct me if I'm wrong, but if the thing you were attacking was moving, didn't you just rubber band? You'd start your attack animation at point X then stutteringly follow the moving target?
 
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40. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 12:07 mag
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2010, 10:35:
Did someone here actually call WoW combat "kinetic?"


My biggest complaint about that game was I felt like I just hit a number on the keypad then watched my guy do an animation until the thing in front of him was dead.

Hahaha, I know. That line just blew my mind. Sure, you can move around in Wow, but it doesn't actually have any impact on whether or not you and the other guy can hit one another. There's no such thing as dodging.
 
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39. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 11:16 Fion
 
Beamer wrote on Nov 7, 2010, 10:35:
Did someone here actually call WoW combat "kinetic?"


My biggest complaint about that game was I felt like I just hit a number on the keypad then watched my guy do an animation until the thing in front of him was dead.

I'm currently playing wow and while it doesn't seem quite that bad to me (on all but a few classes) I do agree. One of the things I really liked about AoC was that the combat felt at least somewhat realistic. You couldn't hit a target from five yards in melee and when you swung a weapon it connected realistically and if there were several targets in front of you, a wide swing would hit all of them. The rest of the game wasn't as polished or fun as the combat (though it has improved greatly) but IMHO the combat was easily the best I've seen in a traditional style MMOG to date.
 
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38. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 11:14 Fion
 
Nothing to see her people. Every MMOG is delayed at least once. There has never been one released without a single delay to my knowledge and any that didn't I'm sure were complete messes.  
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37. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 10:35 Beamer
 
Did someone here actually call WoW combat "kinetic?"


My biggest complaint about that game was I felt like I just hit a number on the keypad then watched my guy do an animation until the thing in front of him was dead.
 
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36. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 05:46 Jonny
 
Wallshadows wrote on Nov 7, 2010, 01:55:
I hope for the sake of being placeholder animations that those movements and motions do not stick around. If so, they are the most awkward and rigid animations I have seen in recent memory. Pair that off with what looks like boring PVP and it leaves me scratching my head with who is drinking the kool aid.

They seem to be exactly the same animations that were in Kotor six or seven years ago. I'm hoping that they're placeholders, because despite nearly everything about TOR looking shit, the on-rails space shooter and awkward combat, I'm hoping it turns out good. The crafting system sounds interesting, I'd like having a ship to wander around in, proper objective based PvP could be interesting if done right and I, well, liked KotoR 1&2 and want another one, basically.
 
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35. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 05:36 Sepharo
 
Though a longshot, it could also be possible that these trailers are showing some heavily scripted stuff where things look less natural.

Are there pure gameplay videos out? I admittedly have watched very little footage.
 
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34. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 05:31 Jackplug
 
Im the same who thinks that the fighting scenes are stiff, but i think its players vs Ai in sp mode or even co-op, well ok Im hopin it is. I cant wait to get my hands on it though...  
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33. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 04:56 StingingVelvet
 
ColoradoHoudini wrote on Nov 6, 2010, 16:17:
Why would anyone play a massive MP game and expect it to support a SP game style?
I sure as hell wouldn't.

Because they're trying to sell that it does? They keep saying "story focused" and "companions for solo play" and all that kind of shit. They know that a massive number of people play WoW solo, probably the majority.
 
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32. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 03:19 Verno
 
kxmode wrote on Nov 7, 2010, 01:29:
entr0py wrote on Nov 7, 2010, 00:20:
kxmode wrote on Nov 6, 2010, 19:06:
Something needs to be done about that combat! It's slow! I said this many times... combat needs to be kinetic and on par with WOW. Anything less dooms this game to failure. In WOW you can run and fight at the same time! I'm not seeing this in any of these gameplay clips!

I don't get it. From the gameplay clips I've seen so far, you're always fighting at least half a dozen dudes, and each one of them is quick enough to dispatch. There are some big baddies that take more work, but most of the time it's numerous small mobs. Or do you mean the animations are two slow? Or just the apparent rate of things to click per second?

For me slow simply means having to stop to fight and not being allowed to move around. Combat needs to be dynamic, and full of kinetic motion. That's what makes WOW PVP so much fun. You can move around. Even melee classes can move and fight at the same time. Virtually all the gameplay videos I've seen of this game shows combat to be a stationary bore.

I have to agree, the combat in that video looked stiff and boring.
 
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31. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 02:03 entr0py
 
I think I see what you're saying. I've always thought it was cool how the melee animations in TOR were in sync between the characters, so they actually looks like a sword fight - complete with parries and blocks that connect. But that means you can't run around the way you can with MMOs where the animations are almost completely independent. Personally I don't mind the loss of strafing and dodging while fighting in melee, but I can see how you might if you're used to that sort of thing.

Also,they've pointed out that "Jedi wizard" is faithful to the expanded universe IP. Hopefully they'll change it due to the complaint among geeks that it's too geeky. But still, it's a minor thing.

This comment was edited on Nov 7, 2010, 02:12.
 
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30. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 01:55 Wallshadows
 
I hope for the sake of being placeholder animations that those movements and motions do not stick around. If so, they are the most awkward and rigid animations I have seen in recent memory. Pair that off with what looks like boring PVP and it leaves me scratching my head with who is drinking the kool aid.

Furthermore, they actually need a poll to find out whether Jedi Wizard is good or not? Seriously? It must be a nightmare working in that studio when you need something as small as a class name to be figured out.
 
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29. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 01:29 Kxmode
 
entr0py wrote on Nov 7, 2010, 00:20:
kxmode wrote on Nov 6, 2010, 19:06:
Something needs to be done about that combat! It's slow! I said this many times... combat needs to be kinetic and on par with WOW. Anything less dooms this game to failure. In WOW you can run and fight at the same time! I'm not seeing this in any of these gameplay clips!

I don't get it. From the gameplay clips I've seen so far, you're always fighting at least half a dozen dudes, and each one of them is quick enough to dispatch. There are some big baddies that take more work, but most of the time it's numerous small mobs. Or do you mean the animations are two slow? Or just the apparent rate of things to click per second?

For me slow simply means having to stop to fight and not being allowed to move around. Combat needs to be dynamic, and full of kinetic motion. That's what makes WOW PVP so much fun. You can move around. Even melee classes can move and fight at the same time. Virtually all the gameplay videos I've seen of this game shows combat to be a stationary bore.

How can they get combat wrong in a game called Star WARS? I mean gees. There were plenty of scenes in the movies that show the characters moving and fighting at the same time. Remember when Han is being chased by Stormtroopers on the Death Star? Remember when Chewbacca shoots at the escaping Landspeeder? Remember the huge Arena pit battle in Attack of the Clones? It's not that hard. Make motion and fighting integral part of combat mechanics so you can do both at the same time! They're not going to win WOW players over if the combat isn't the same or better than WOW!

This comment was edited on Nov 7, 2010, 01:47.
 
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28. Re: The Old Republic Delay? Nov 7, 2010, 01:25 Kxmode
 
The Half Elf wrote on Nov 6, 2010, 22:32:
kxmode wrote on Nov 6, 2010, 19:06:
Something needs to be done about that combat! It's slow! I said this many times... combat needs to be kinetic and on par with WOW. Anything less dooms this game to failure. In WOW you can run and fight at the same time! I'm not seeing this in any of these gameplay clips!

Towards the end, looks like a female commando in white clone armor with a yellow stripe from top to bottom is running at a sith using lightning and is firing and moving towards him.

She comes to a stop to fire.

At least in WOW you can actually run and fight at the same time. I'm simply not seeing it in this game.
 
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