about the competition between Valve's Steam service and Microsoft's Games for Windows,

Warskull wrote on Oct 10, 2010, 14:58:

Muscular Beaver wrote on Oct 10, 2010, 14:25:
The only service I like is D2D or similar. Steam is only hurting PC gaming, and so are any other similar forms of DRM, dressed like "advantages for the customer".

You know those huge sales you enjoy buying games through D2D? Steam came up with that and via competition forced all the other digital delivery services to start using aggressive sales. PC Gamers as a whole won out.

Steam actually does add a lot of value.

CannibalBob wrote on Oct 10, 2010, 14:51:

ochentay4 wrote on Oct 10, 2010, 13:59:
Well, If I could choose I would opt for no service.

Why we need Steam of GFWL? How gamers have been playing online and getting updates beforce this services?

I do hate GFWL and do not hate Steam, but why do I need to have Steam and be Online to play Secret Monkey Island (for example).

Have you played any games that don't have an auto-patching system? It's a huge pain in the butt updating those games and you typically don't know about those patches unless you look for them. Steam allows those games to be automatically updated and gives developers easy to use tools for those patches.

The only real advantage GFWL has over steam is that it is more integrated into the game. It can be painful with steam when you have to start it first before being able to play anything.

Brumbek wrote on Oct 10, 2010, 16:55:
Well said! GFWL is a joke. The silly Gearbox employee is just trying to make a backhanded insult at Steam like Pitchford did a while back. Steam is awesome and is the best thing to ever happen to PC gaming.

space captain wrote on Oct 10, 2010, 15:46:

People, I just want to say, you know, can we all get along? Can we get along? Can we stop making it, making it horrible for the older people and the kids?...It’s just not right. It’s not right. It’s not, it’s not going to change anything. We’ll, we’ll get our justice....Please, we can get along here. We all can get along. I mean, we’re all stuck here for a while. Let’s try to work it out. Let’s try to beat it. Let’s try to beat it. Let’s try to work it out.

- Rodney King

Tumbler wrote on Oct 10, 2010, 14:51:
Civ V at this point is a tough pill to swallow, the game needs a lot of work and if it wasn't tied to a steam account so I couldn't trade it then I'd put it up on ebay at this point because I think it's going to be months before it's worth my time again. Dev/pubs might see this as an advantage but to consumers this is simply another reminder to never buy these games at release that you can't resell. I got it for $40 so it's a bit easier to live with but if I'd bought the game at $50 I'd be furious that I'm stuck with this product as is.

People, I just want to say, you know, can we all get along? Can we get along? Can we stop making it, making it horrible for the older people and the kids?...It’s just not right. It’s not right. It’s not, it’s not going to change anything. We’ll, we’ll get our justice....Please, we can get along here. We all can get along. I mean, we’re all stuck here for a while. Let’s try to work it out. Let’s try to beat it. Let’s try to beat it. Let’s try to work it out.

Paketep wrote on Oct 10, 2010, 14:16:
Yeah, because Valve and MS are the same, have done the same damage to PC gaming, and have the same potential to do damage in the future.

You amaze me, sCary. Didn't you learn anything in all your years running the Shack?

"[We] want people to be able to play together and right now if a guy buys a game on Games for Windows and a guy buys a game on Steam - they can't play together, If another guy bought it in a retail store, he can't play with the first two guys."

"Right now we're like 'Please, work together'. Our big concern right now is that these silos are being built. Everybody's separating out and it's really... as a developer who just wants gamers to be able to play games together, it's frustrating right now. Things like that are hurting the PC industry for gamers. This is frustrating for everybody right now."

Muscular Beaver wrote on Oct 10, 2010, 14:25:
The only service I like is D2D or similar. Steam is only hurting PC gaming, and so are any other similar forms of DRM, dressed like "advantages for the customer".

Tumbler wrote on Oct 10, 2010, 14:51:
Civ V at this point is a tough pill to swallow, the game needs a lot of work and if it wasn't tied to a steam account so I couldn't trade it then I'd put it up on ebay at this point because I think it's going to be months before it's worth my time again. Dev/pubs might see this as an advantage but to consumers this is simply another reminder to never buy these games at release that you can't resell. I got it for $40 so it's a bit easier to live with but if I'd bought the game at $50 I'd be furious that I'm stuck with this product as is.

Steam is a great service for discount games, but for full price retails games it's a big step backward for consumers. It has everything in place to offer rentals for a few bucks or even free trials of any game for a limited time...but that isn't happening, the industry is still very much a pay first, in full, no refunds, to try these games, with luck you'll like it and enjoy owning it, if not, oh well, no refunds.

There is a reason consoles have become so popular by comparison, pc games lash out developers and publishers for jumping ships but that is where the most customers are, more people would buy on the pc if it's wasn't a big scam most of the time. Let us have trial periods of 24 hours after we purchase a game on steam. (full refund in first 24 hours if requested) offer multi day rentals for a few bucks.

If those things will cost pubs/devs too much then your products suck and you're going to go out of business anyway.

ochentay4 wrote on Oct 10, 2010, 13:59:
Well, If I could choose I would opt for no service.

Why we need Steam of GFWL? How gamers have been playing online and getting updates beforce this services?

I do hate GFWL and do not hate Steam, but why do I need to have Steam and be Online to play Secret Monkey Island (for example).