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Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer

The E3 trailer is now available for Arcania: Gothic 4, the next installment in this role-playing series. The clip outlines the standard RPG conventions the game will offer, and shows off gameplay, including combat. Here's the embedded version.

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33. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 20, 2010, 01:21 StingingVelvet
 
Jerykk wrote on Jun 20, 2010, 00:40:
While there would probably be a rise in sales, I don't know how significant it would actually be. The most pirated games are the games with the most hype and the games with the most hype tend to be multiplatform games which almost always sell exponentially better on consoles anyway. Conversely, anticipated games that are PC-exclusive or at least designed for the PC tend to sell a lot better on the PC than ports, in spite of piracy.

When the PS3 came out most ports to it were terrible, but eventually it got enough sales that it got more attention for ports from the Xbox, despite still being much lower than Xbox on average. Same could be true for PC... if we sell 20% of the total rather than 10% of the total, companies might double the money for port costs as well, leading to better ports that feel more like PC games despite being console ports.

It's not an exact science of course, but I think the point is valid and thus every lost sale is hurting this improvement. How many of the pirated copies are lost sales is another matter, but I do believe a significant amount of them are, say 10-20%.

I don't think motion controllers will ever really catch on. They're gimmicks that simply don't work as well as traditional schemes. As for AAA games on the PC, I think it boils down to which genres sell best on PC. MMO and RTS games still sell best on PC so we still see AAA PC-exclusives in those genres. Until console makers loosen up their regulations and provide more versatile control schemes, I don't see those genres becoming prominent on consoles.

I don't mean the current ones, I think they are mostly gimmicks and don't work for FPS and RTS. People acted like the Wiimote would make FPS games work as good on console as PC, but I played Metroid Prime 3 and it controlled like ass... not nearly as precise and instead of moving the screen with the pointer you move a reticule around a static screen... horrible.

I mean next-gen, or maybe after that, when motion controls might be as precise as a mouse and as easy to use and hold as one too. It could happen... might not, but it could. If it does then RTS and FPS become as good on console control-wise as on PC, and if the graphics are being pumped out at 1080p with an AA requirement (for real this time) then I could see a ton more people flocking to the consoles from the PC, sadly.

It might never happen, I am just saying it is possible and would be a huge blow.
 
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32. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 20, 2010, 00:40 Jerykk
 
And if piracy ended tomorrow I doubt we would return to being the industry focus, if we ever were, but we would certainly see a significant rise in sales and perhaps better ports and support because of it.

While there would probably be a rise in sales, I don't know how significant it would actually be. The most pirated games are the games with the most hype and the games with the most hype tend to be multiplatform games which almost always sell exponentially better on consoles anyway. Conversely, anticipated games that are PC-exclusive or at least designed for the PC tend to sell a lot better on the PC than ports, in spite of piracy.

Personally I think the final death knell for AAA mainstream games on PC will be motion controllers like the Sony Move 2 or something that offer real pinpoint accuracy and 1080p native resolutions with 4xMSAA on every game.

I don't think motion controllers will ever really catch on. They're gimmicks that simply don't work as well as traditional schemes. As for AAA games on the PC, I think it boils down to which genres sell best on PC. MMO and RTS games still sell best on PC so we still see AAA PC-exclusives in those genres. Until console makers loosen up their regulations and provide more versatile control schemes, I don't see those genres becoming prominent on consoles.
 
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31. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 23:30 StingingVelvet
 
Jerykk wrote on Jun 19, 2010, 17:46:
Unfortunately, no amount of self-discipline can overcome the disparity in sales between PC and consoles right now. Consoles are simply more mainstream due to their convenience and accessibility. Even if piracy were to completely disappear tomorrow, publishers would continue to focus on consoles because that's where the most money can be made. I really wish this weren't the case and that people were concerned more with quality than accessibility and convenience but that's just not how it is.

I agree with that, but that's all the more reason to value every sale.

And if piracy ended tomorrow I doubt we would return to being the industry focus, if we ever were, but we would certainly see a significant rise in sales and perhaps better ports and support because of it. Multiplayer-focused games on PC still sell well enough to be quite lucrative. The reason singleplayer games sell much less is almost surely piracy related on a significant level, though not completely.

In short people who act like piracy is the PC's only problem are indeed delusional, but people who act like it is not a significant reason behind the PC's troubles are equally so.

Personally I think the final death knell for AAA mainstream games on PC will be motion controllers like the Sony Move 2 or something that offer real pinpoint accuracy and 1080p native resolutions with 4xMSAA on every game. That could be as soon as next-gen, whenever that happens. The only thing the PC will have left at that point is the open platform benefits, which few people seem to care about sadly.
 
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30. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 18:28 Eldaron Imotholin
 
Jerykk wrote on Jun 19, 2010, 17:46:
I completely agree that people should buy the PC games they enjoy but even if every person did that, console sales would still dominate PC sales.

Then you agree with his and my opinion. You want people to buy the PC games they enjoy plus you are aware that too little people share your self-discipline to hold true to your honest use of the "try before you buy" piracy practicality. Because, this or that, if there was no such thing as piracy.. my cousin would've bought Dragon Age and Mass Effect 2.
 
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29. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 17:46 Jerykk
 
I dislike the idea because our platform can't fuck around right now and I don't trust OTHER people to have your self-discipline.

Unfortunately, no amount of self-discipline can overcome the disparity in sales between PC and consoles right now. Consoles are simply more mainstream due to their convenience and accessibility. Even if piracy were to completely disappear tomorrow, publishers would continue to focus on consoles because that's where the most money can be made. I really wish this weren't the case and that people were concerned more with quality than accessibility and convenience but that's just not how it is.

I completely agree that people should buy the PC games they enjoy but even if every person did that, console sales would still dominate PC sales.
 
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28. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 17:33 Eldaron Imotholin
 
StingingVelvet wrote on Jun 19, 2010, 17:31:
Jerykk wrote on Jun 19, 2010, 16:42:
Yes, it does require a fair amount of self-discipline. This is why many people refuse to believe it can be done; they lack the discipline to do it themselves. They need the law to tell them what is right and wrong because it's much easier to follow the rules when you don't make them up yourself.

My disdain for the idea has little to do with you personally or even myself. I'm not following the rules because I have to, I break a ton of laws everyday from speeding to work to downloading television shows on the internet to skip the ads, because I will buy the DVDs later if I love the show. Hey look, I do what you do in a sense.

I dislike the idea because our platform can't fuck around right now and I don't trust OTHER people to have your self-discipline. I can't promote your ideology or act as if it is fine because I would estimate 80% of people would stop buying as many games as they do now, or eventually stop buying games all together, like the cousin mentioned below.

This is why "try before you buy" is not standard in any media industry, because once people get their experience very few would pay for it, because people are assholes on average.

This is, indeed, what I said or try to say. I agree with you completely.
 
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27. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 17:31 StingingVelvet
 
Jerykk wrote on Jun 19, 2010, 16:42:
Yes, it does require a fair amount of self-discipline. This is why many people refuse to believe it can be done; they lack the discipline to do it themselves. They need the law to tell them what is right and wrong because it's much easier to follow the rules when you don't make them up yourself.

My disdain for the idea has little to do with you personally or even myself. I'm not following the rules because I have to, I break a ton of laws everyday from speeding to work to downloading television shows on the internet to skip the ads, because I will buy the DVDs later if I love the show. Hey look, I do what you do in a sense.

I dislike the idea because our platform can't fuck around right now and I don't trust OTHER people to have your self-discipline. I can't promote your ideology or act as if it is fine because I would estimate 80% of people would stop buying as many games as they do now, or eventually stop buying games all together, like the cousin mentioned below.

This is why "try before you buy" is not standard in any media industry, because once people get their experience very few would pay for it, because people are assholes on average.
 
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26. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 16:42 Jerykk
 
Isn't your current stance a purely ideological one?

Not purely, no. Practicality plays a large role in it as well.

My cousin uses your statement for piracy aswell. Yet he couldn't be arsed buying Mass Effect 2 and Dragon Age - Origins after he played and finished the piracy versions although he freaking loved them, especially Mass Effect 2.

Then he's not really following my philosophy. I pirated both Dragon Age and ME2 before buying them at full price.

The step you have to take to spend money on something you have already consumed is way bigger than spending before using.

Yes, it does require a fair amount of self-discipline. This is why many people refuse to believe it can be done; they lack the discipline to do it themselves. They need the law to tell them what is right and wrong because it's much easier to follow the rules when you don't make them up yourself.
 
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25. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 12:53 Sepharo
 
Eldaron Imotholin wrote on Jun 19, 2010, 10:29:
My cousin uses your statement for piracy aswell. Yet he couldn't be arsed buying Mass Effect 2 and Dragon Age - Origins after he played and finished the piracy versions although he freaking loved them, especially Mass Effect 2.

So, it sounds like he doesn't follow that philosophy...
 
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24. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 10:29 Eldaron Imotholin
 
Jerykk wrote on Jun 19, 2010, 03:52:
If someone uses piracy as a means to try games and buys the ones he enjoys, I don't see any downside. The developers who make the games you enjoy get rewarded and you don't waste money on crappy games. It's a win-win situation.

Isn't your current stance a purely ideological one?

My cousin uses your statement for piracy aswell. Yet he couldn't be arsed buying Mass Effect 2 and Dragon Age - Origins after he played and finished the piracy versions although he freaking loved them, especially Mass Effect 2. The step you have to take to spend money on something you have already consumed is way bigger than spending before using. Ever had to pay the bank back for a vacation you rented money for, back when you were young and full of impulsity? Man.. that sucks bigtime regardless of how epically awesome and godlike the vacation was. Problem there, of course, is that you can't "can't be arsed" with the bank.
 
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23. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 04:54 Jerykk
 
My point is simple: it is common sense that you shouldn't do so. Any witty dialogue on your part or even intelligent reasoning doesn't change that simple fact.

It's not really common sense if it's neither logical nor reasonable. Morality and common sense are very much opposites, in fact. Morality often requires that you defy common sense in order to uphold your personal values. If you see a blind man on the street sitting in front of a $100 bill, common sense dictates that you take the $100 for yourself. Morality, on the other hand, might persuade you to give that $100 to the blind man.

They make games, it costs a lot of money and takes a lot of time to do so, you are playing the games without contributing.

Except I do contribute. As I said, I buy the games I enjoy and thus, the developers who make good games are rewarded. Capitalism equates performance with success so it's only fitting that I reward the developers who make the games I like. Rewarding the developers who make the games I like will also increase the likelihood of them continuing to make games I like so it ultimately benefits both parties. My philosophy does not benefit developers who make games I dislike, as is only natural in a capitalist system.
 
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22. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 04:31 StingingVelvet
 
My point is simple: it is common sense that you shouldn't do so. Any witty dialogue on your part or even intelligent reasoning doesn't change that simple fact. They make games, it costs a lot of money and takes a lot of time to do so, you are playing the games without contributing. In a capitalist society, that is called common sense wrong.

Period.
 
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21. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 03:52 Jerykk
 
It's like having a discussion on the meaning of life and justification for killing in defense of another while your wife is being raped right next to you.

I'm not sure which analogy you're applying to your position. Your current stance is a purely ideological one, not a logical or practical one. You view piracy as inherently wrong regardless of context. That's basically like saying that murder is wrong, regardless of whether or not you're killing someone trying to rape your wife.

Simple answer: because company X made it and funded it, it is their property and you can't decide what to do with it and when.

Technically, I can since I already do. If you're going to try to convince someone of something, you're going to have to do better than "It's wrong." It's like if I told you to stop eating muffins because it's a heinous and despicable act. Would that really sway your opinion of muffins or make you stop eating them? Not really. Telling someone that something is wrong isn't going to work unless you back it up with logic and reason. If someone uses piracy as a means to try games and buys the ones he enjoys, I don't see any downside. The developers who make the games you enjoy get rewarded and you don't waste money on crappy games. It's a win-win situation.
 
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20. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 02:05 StingingVelvet
 
Jerykk wrote on Jun 19, 2010, 01:10:
Can't agree with you there. Why waste time doing research or placing your trust in the opinion's of others when you can just play the game yourself?

I'm not getting into this stupid debate with you again where you come up with all manner of analogies, justifications and distractions when the answer is common sense and right in front of your face. It's like having a discussion on the meaning of life and justification for killing in defense of another while your wife is being raped right next to you.

Simple answer: because company X made it and funded it, it is their property and you can't decide what to do with it and when.
 
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19. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 01:10 Jerykk
 
The idea that people need to play the entire product illegally and in a manner that harms our platform's image, for any reason, is complete B.S. justification.

Can't agree with you there. Why waste time doing research or placing your trust in the opinion's of others when you can just play the game yourself? Playing the game saves you time and gives you the most accurate measure of the game's appeal to you.

You may not like piracy but you can't really argue that it isn't the most efficient and accurate way to determine whether or not you enjoy a game. However, I do agree that pirates shouldn't use torrents, as those are easily tracked and provide numbers to publishers trying to make excuses for poor sales. If you have to pirate, use less visible methods.
 
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18. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 19, 2010, 00:33 StingingVelvet
 
Walkthrough video at gametrailers, starting here: http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-2010-arcania-gothic/700809

Looks quite rough, but then it is the 360 version. He starts off praising accessible games, but then it seems like the same Gothic gameplay just with quest markers and a map on the screen, which maybe we can turn off? I hope so.
 
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17. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 18, 2010, 22:21 StingingVelvet
 
Eldaron Imotholin wrote on Jun 18, 2010, 21:50:
And way too often I've realized, lately, how a fucking waste of time it is to read a review in the first place and how epically retarded you must be to take anything that is written/said in a review for granted.

Reviewers fail miserably at reviewing games, thinking people give a rats fuck about their opinion. The problem is most do and completely fail to notice how hard the reviews fail. People shouldn't give an ass about the reviewer's opinion but about the facts he can sum up about the game.

Then again, people are ignorant and the majority forgot to think for themselves the moment they started to believe democracy exists. But that's another story.

I agree with that in general, but I think the trick is to find a reviewer that you see eye to eye with on games and then listen to or read his comments thoroughly and with full attention. For instance if you want to know if Alpha Protocl is good don't read the Destructoid review from "shoot everything constantly or I'm bored" Jim Sterling, but read a review from an RPG appreciator who might not throw a game in the trash right away for being unpolished.

By actually researching games before I play them using these common sense methods I think I have been burned maybe a few times in the last decade, and I buy a LOT of games. One of those times was Star Trek Online, and my issue there was actually ignoring my usual common sense methods and buying the game anyway.

The idea that people need to play the entire product illegally and in a manner that harms our platform's image, for any reason, is complete B.S. justification.
 
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16. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 18, 2010, 21:50 Eldaron Imotholin
 
And way too often I've realized, lately, how a fucking waste of time it is to read a review in the first place and how epically retarded you must be to take anything that is written/said in a review for granted.

Reviewers fail miserably at reviewing games, thinking people give a rats fuck about their opinion. The problem is most do and completely fail to notice how hard the reviews fail. People shouldn't give an ass about the reviewer's opinion but about the facts he can sum up about the game.

Then again, people are ignorant and the majority forgot to think for themselves the moment they started to believe democracy exists. But that's another story.

/rant
 
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15. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 18, 2010, 19:03 StingingVelvet
 
Surf wrote on Jun 18, 2010, 13:56:
@Stinging Velvet

And you are a biased fucking idiot. You have never bought Gothic 3 obviously as many of us did, and we got fucking robbed! Therefore this particular game deserves to be evaluated by any means necessary, including piracy.

Too many people like you blindly side with all game publishers, believing the rhetoric that they spew that their industry is on the verge of collapse due to piracy. This same tactic has been used by the movie and record industries despite record billion dollar profits.

So open you're god damn eyes nimwit.

If you don't trust the game to be good at launch then wait to play it and see what the reviews, community and walkthrough videos show. There is no reason to pirate the damn thing, you just find a way to justify it to yourself because you lack patience and understanding of how those download numbers effect our platform.

And I did buy Gothic 3 the day it came out for $50, thank you very much. It sucked, boy-howdy. The fan patches have made it awesome though.
 
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14. Re: Arcania: Gothic 4 Trailer Jun 18, 2010, 13:56 Surf
 
@Stinging Velvet

And you are a biased fucking idiot. You have never bought Gothic 3 obviously as many of us did, and we got fucking robbed! Therefore this particular game deserves to be evaluated by any means necessary, including piracy.

Too many people like you blindly side with all game publishers, believing the rhetoric that they spew that their industry is on the verge of collapse due to piracy. This same tactic has been used by the movie and record industries despite record billion dollar profits.

So open you're god damn eyes nimwit.
 
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