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Morning Consolidation

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17. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 29, 2010, 09:58  Blue 
 
nin wrote on Apr 29, 2010, 09:43:
Instead of Darth Maul jumping gracefully around doing acrobatics, it's gonna be you and me standing in the middle of our living rooms knocking over vases and looking ridiculous

You're right.

It MUST be bundled with a web cam that auto uploads.

Star Wars Kid: The Game.
 
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16. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 29, 2010, 09:43 nin
 
Instead of Darth Maul jumping gracefully around doing acrobatics, it's gonna be you and me standing in the middle of our living rooms knocking over vases and looking ridiculous

You're right.

It MUST be bundled with a web cam that auto uploads.
 
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15. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 18:27 peteham
 
The Half Elf wrote on Apr 28, 2010, 17:13:
I disagree Blue, all it will take is 1 good Star Wars Lightsaber combat game to sell it. I don't see Microsoft doing it with Natal, but Sony defiantly could pull it off with move.
A light-saber game sounds great in theory, but the reality is gonna be far less awesome. Instead of Darth Maul jumping gracefully around doing acrobatics, it's gonna be you and me standing in the middle of our living rooms knocking over vases and looking ridiculous If it's gonna look at all presentable on screen, it'll have minimal relation to your actual movements and all you'll be doing is, well, pressing buttons and flicking your wrist. And that is pure gimmick. Might as well use a regular gamepad.

I hope they'll prove me wrong and dazzle me with something great, but I highly doubt it.

But it'll look great in ads and the mainstream will probably love it..
 
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14. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 17:13 The Half Elf
 
I disagree Blue, all it will take is 1 good Star Wars Lightsaber combat game to sell it. I don't see Microsoft doing it with Natal, but Sony defiantly could pull it off with move.  
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13. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 15:59 peteham
 
PropheT wrote on Apr 28, 2010, 12:45:
The Wii -seems- cheaper, but it's not.
Verno wrote on Apr 28, 2010, 12:54:
People rarely look beyond the initial price tag unfortunately. It's how Microsoft is so successful at selling overpriced peripherals to people.
Microsoft may have picked up a few tricks here and there, but Nintendo practically invented the pay-through-the-nose-for-peripherals-scheme. Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles; don't even get me started Factor in the vastly inferior hardware of the Wii and the price-tag is easily the nastiest this generation. Hell, they're probably the only ones to make a profit on the actual console for the current gen, which is a good thing since they practically don't have any games to speak of.

But you're right that mainstream customers won't see past the price-tag in this respect. Even so, you'll get an Elite for practically the same amount of cash. So, yeah, I don't see how anyone but casual gamers or long-time Nintendo followers would consider getting a Wii (just for Mario/Zelda/Metroid). Everyone I know who has one falls into the latter category and the device is pretty much only brought out for the occasional party and 30-60 minutes of Wii sports.

As for Natal and Move, I'm not really excited about either one at the moment. I'm betting all we're gonna get are stupid gimmick-games designed to draw in the mainstream. Natal has by far the most potential if the technology actually works well, though. Move seems to be just a more accurate Wii-mote, though it will have the advantage of running on hardware capable of more than Gamecube-visuals..
 
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12. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 13:15 Verno
 
Cutter wrote on Apr 28, 2010, 13:08:
Yeah, but thanks if I wanted to learn semaphore I would have joined the navy, or if I want to be waving and jumping around I'll enter a Pride parade. And I would prefer to this over using a remote why? The only thing consoles need are a mouse and keyboard. I haven't seen anything that even remotely begins to interest me about the Natal. This is one of those useless toys that will make people go ooh-ahhh for a few hours, possibly a few days, and then most of them will suffer buyers remorse and want to take it back or just let it collect dust.

Actually using an on-screen interface for some stuff in XBMC or Boxee sounds pretty awesome, I don't know what you're going on about. Out of the two devices I'll take Natal any day because it's a tiny peripheral and cheap, not much to have buyers remorse over there. It's usable on the PC as well and there will be an SDK for messing around with it. If nothing else you can use it as a regular webcam.

In terms of it being a useful gaming peripheral, well that's going to depend too much on the software to really call accurately.
 
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11. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 13:12 Ray Marden
 
Eh, it's the Wii, but actually fairl responsive. Well, at least the Sony version is because it gives you buttons, but it's all hand gestures with Microsoft.

On one hand, I think realistic interaction beneifts some games - "I" can do it quicker/better than some poorly controlled, animation-limited geometrical construct can. On the other hand, games have a lot of tedious aspects (can you imagine having to bend over for every herb in some RPG?,) it's nice to chill out on a couch or chair from time to time, and often I play games to get away from reality.

I think an "all of the above" approach is good, but some of the price gouging needs to stop (make monty on good games, not plastic peripherals) and a tunnel vision-like focus on direct 1:1 hand motion control is going to create a lot of bad games.
Hype =/= great FPS.
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10. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 13:08 Cutter
 
“It’s a technology that we call Natal. It’s a little camera and microphone that sits on top of your TV set. And if you want to control the TV, you don’t go get some remote control or big fat gaming thing. If you want to look through TV channels, you just gesture, and the computer recognizes your voice, it recognizes your gestures. You want to see the next sports program, you go like this, it will cycle you through. You want to play a game and you need to jump, you jump. I’m not going to jump too hard; a little bit too high altitude here in Bogota for that, at least for me. But it recognizes you, it knows your voice, who you are, your gestures, what you’re doing."

Yeah, but thanks if I wanted to learn semaphore I would have joined the navy, or if I want to be waving and jumping around I'll enter a Pride parade. And I would prefer to this over using a remote why? The only thing consoles need are a mouse and keyboard. I haven't seen anything that even remotely begins to interest me about the Natal. This is one of those useless toys that will make people go ooh-ahhh for a few hours, possibly a few days, and then most of them will suffer buyers remorse and want to take it back or just let it collect dust.
 
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9. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 13:05 Verno
 
Keep in mind that the Wii is largely limited by technical short comings that prevent developers from doing genuinely neat stuff with it. Natal and Move are far more flexible. I wouldn't call it "Wii2" or something silly, they just need to be utilized properly. Whether that is done or not remains to be seen.

That being said I wouldn't be one of those launch day buyers of either products. Wait a year and see how it shakes out.
 
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8. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 12:55 xXBatmanXx
 
Taking the comments below into consideration (casual stuff) I don't see this being a "gamers" addition. I agree with Blue - grab up the people you currently don't have "gaming".

So it is Wii2+

No thanks.
 
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7. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 12:54 Verno
 
People rarely look beyond the initial price tag unfortunately. It's how Microsoft is so successful at selling overpriced peripherals to people. Many of the people purchasing consoles are families and have regular family related cashflow issues too. They can't always afford to spend $600 at once but they can afford to spend $600 over three months if they piece it out which is what many people end up doing.

I wish more people were like you and I but we are sadly a minority in the gaming industry.
 
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6. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 12:45 PropheT
 
Verno wrote on Apr 28, 2010, 12:32:
The Wii is cheap and it's one of the biggest reasons people get into it along with Nintendo's incredibly successful first party franchises that have deep casual audience penetration.

Having just bought one, I'm not sure I agree with that.

The controllers are stupidly expensive considering you need to buy an additional one at about $50, then another $15 for the nunchuk, and then for other games you need the motion plus add-on for another $20. Mario Kart requires another $10-$15 controller add-on, since we're looking at first person games...you can easily spend $100 on an additional controller for a Wii, too.

The Wii -seems- cheaper, but it's not.
 
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5. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 12:32 Verno
 
I'm just not sure their market research is accurate about people adopting an entirely new console just for motion control. The Sony Move is especially dubious given that most of the software seems to require 2 Moves to be useful and that's a significant investment(~$100) on top of the console itself.

The Wii is cheap and it's one of the biggest reasons people get into it along with Nintendo's incredibly successful first party franchises that have deep casual audience penetration. Microsoft and Sony are going to need some big name software to sell this stuff, simply having the peripherals available isn't enough in my opinion. I'm not sure a lot of the casual audience is ready to go multi-console, judging by the Wii's poor third party attach rate it would appear many Wii owners don't really buy a lot of software after their initial purchase anyways. The launch titles demonstrated so far don't have quite same reach as something like Mario or Zelda.

In any case it will be interesting to see it all shake out. I just worry about the kinds of games I like being affected. I can see both companies trying to rope casual audiences in by shoehorning the controls into titles where it isn't necessarily a benefit or even appropriate.

This comment was edited on Apr 28, 2010, 12:40.
 
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4. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 12:11  Blue 
 
Both it and Move will succeed or fail based on the libraries and I'm disappointed to see that many approaches seem to be casual in nature so far.

In my opinion casual gamers are the holy grail behind all this motion control stuff in the first place. Sony and MS envy the old folks bowling with their Wiis, and want to grab some of that market in addition to the more hardcore gamers they already attract. I sense a belief that the controller itself is a barrier to entry for some people, and they think this is how to grab them.
 
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3. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 11:55 Verno
 
No, Natal and the PS Move are far more advanced and refined. The Wii is a literal child's toy by comparison, the WiiMotion+ is a different story but I haven't really seen many cases of compelling software for it. Both it and Move will succeed or fail based on the libraries and I'm disappointed to see that many approaches seem to be casual in nature so far. The Wii has a largely casual audience already but I'm not sure those are the kind of people who will suddenly run out and buy a 360/PS3 just because it has motion control.

Motion control opens up a lot of restricted genres on the consoles though but it remains to be seen whether developers can really work with them. I think consumer fatigue will eventually set in too, both figuratively and literally. Sit on your couch and try waving your arms around for an hour straight, it's tiring even if you're in good shape.

If you want to know more about the technology behind Natal, you can read up on that here.
 
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2. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 11:38 xXBatmanXx
 
Someone clue me in - but isn't Natal just Wii2?  
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1. Re: Morning Consolidation Apr 28, 2010, 09:34 nin
 
Fourteen Halo 2 Fans Refuse to Let It Die.


Was reading about that last night...very cool!
 
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