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Still More on MW2 Servers

A post to Robert Bowling's Blog has further follow-up on the uproar over the absence of a dedicated server for Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2. He lists several areas they feel will benefit from their new approach: Matchmaking & Smoother Gameplay, Playlists and Private Matches, Party System and Friendslist, and Cheat / Hack Free Games. On that last topic, he seems to believe IWnet will eliminate aim-bots and such: "The biggest benefit of using IWnet by far is the fact that you don’t have to worry about joining a server full of aim-bots, wallhacks, or cheaters. Or relying on the server admin of the server to constantly be monitoring, banning, and policing it. Modern Warfare 2 on PC allows us to control the quality of the game much more than ever before as well as utilizing the VAC (Valve-Anti-Cheat) system to keep games clean of hackers and cheaters." Also, there's an interview with Bowling on IGN that discusses the game, but none of the recent controversy.

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95. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 25, 2009, 23:38 Dr. D. Schreber
 
But it's A-OKAY because they are a business after all, right?

Well, capitalism and free markets function on the philosophy of making as much money as possible. Large businesses with shareholders and investors are obligated by law to take actions they think will result in larger profits.

Problem is, when it gets to a certain point, things tend to plateau out, you've swerved everyone away from the competition so you don't need to make better products, and even if you do, you've already been noticed by anyone with an interest. Nickel-and-diming your customers for all they're worth is the last thing you can do to keep increasing your profits.

(This, incidentally, is why stories about major business "detaching" themselves from the United States are becoming increasingly common; we're "chasing them away" by being one of the last places with some laws that still give some measure of protection to consumers and low-wage employees. Protecting consumers makes it harder to turn a profit when a business gets to this stage.)

I don't think anyone would argue that it's morally okay, but the idea that for-profit business cares about morality as opposed to what's legal is just silly. Unfortunately, the word for making the market act based on what's best for the end-consumer instead of acting to continually funnel as much money up and up and up as possible is "Socialism," and we know how well that goes over. (It's also not at all the right word for anything Obama does, which actually bears some frightening parallels to how fascism works in its extreme infant form. But hey, a little fascism might be good for business.)

Back on topic...some places, like right in the I-Ward protest thread, are praising Penny Arcade for the comic, but am I the only one who doesn't see the tone it takes as anything but condescending and spiteful? It makes valid points, yes, but it's also suggesting that the consumer (in this case, PC gamers) should be held accountable for the amorality of business, which is patently absurd. For years, everyone's preached "don't like, don't give them your money." Are we finally now realizing that this strategy is flawed (don't give them your money, don't expect them to make what you like by default when other factors exist) only to turn around and say it's better to be at the devil's side than in his path?

This comment was edited on Oct 25, 2009, 23:45.
 
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94. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 25, 2009, 19:27 Sepharo
 
The "put out" portion was linked to an article on average DLC purchases by console gamers.

And that's what this all boils down to... IW thinks we should be buying their creations instead of the free ones offered by the community.

Mods will die because of the greed of publishers/developers.

But it's A-OKAY because they are a business after all, right?
 
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93. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 25, 2009, 12:09 Beamer
 
That's why I said it's hard.
But throwing hissy fits is not the way to do it. It just furthers the rift.

Interestingly, this is exactly what the Penny Arcade guys said in their most recent news update:
To read such lamentations, you'd get the impression that PC gamers still think they are the focus of the industry, when that hasn't been true for awhile. Indeed, hardcore gamers in general - and the dedicated PC enthusiast, which is a subset - haven't been the object of their desire for some time. I was under the impression this was well known, but it does require a willingness to perceive factual information, which is not a universal trait among cultists. Maybe if you had just put out, instead of becoming a signatories to a vow of consumer chastity, the old twinkle might return to his eye.
 
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92. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 24, 2009, 02:27 Sepharo
 
And remember, in 2007 industry analysts determined that the average profit of a PC sale is double that of a console sale, so a lost PC sale (theoretical as it may be) hurts twice as much.

Depends on who is making the profit, but I believe it.

PC games aren't tied up with the same agreements console games are. Doesn't a large percentage of the retail price of a console game go to Microsoft/Sony/Nintendo depending on which system the game is release for?
 
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91. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 23, 2009, 09:56 Prez
 
I'm not trying to be a jerk Prez, I respect that you believe it or at least believe you heard it but you can't drop a bombshell like that without some data.

Questioning unsupported (as in, without a clickable link) information isn't being a jerk; it's being prudent. I don't usually get called on it when I cite it, because I THINK that most people find it somewhat credible. Either that, or no one generally pays any attention to me...

This comment was edited on Oct 23, 2009, 09:57.
 
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90. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 23, 2009, 08:53 Verno
 
Well, I can't vouch for the context or the data itself, as I haven't seen it; I'm willing to trust it somewhat though based on my (limited) understanding of the way the PC and console markets work.

When I get time, I'll do some digging; this would be interesting to pursue. To me, anyway.

I'm not trying to be a jerk Prez, I respect that you believe it or at least believe you heard it but you can't drop a bombshell like that without some data. I don't really see how it can be true and neither do the publishers for the majority of the market apparently. I think you misunderstood someone talking about digital vs retail profit ratios.
 
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89. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 23, 2009, 00:36 Dr. D. Schreber
 
The question is whether IW thinks the community is better with or without those 50,000 people. Just because you have money doesn't mean you're wanted. I'm guessing IW doesn't want those people, believing those 50,000 are griefers, cheaters, whiners, complainers, or just people that hang out in one server that they dominate. For the record I disagree. Those people will show up anyway.

That's not the point I'm trying to make, though. They've pretty much said out-loud that they don't care about the dedicated community. The point is that there is, potentially if not realized in the end, a noticeable hole in sales. Matchmaking depends on having as many people as possible to function with any sense of normalcy and desireability; case in point, when I start up Uncharted 2's multiplayer and the game reports 11, 000 players on, it still takes at least three minutes for the matchmaker to go through the process of finding players and putting me in a game. If this hurts sales, it will hurt their backend irrevocably because no amount of effort they put into IWNET can compensate for the poor functionality of a matchmaker with less-than-ideal numbers of players to match with each other.
 
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88. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 22, 2009, 13:56 Prez
 
Well, I can't vouch for the context or the data itself, as I haven't seen it; I'm willing to trust it somewhat though based on my (limited) understanding of the way the PC and console markets work.

When I get time, I'll do some digging; this would be interesting to pursue. To me, anyway.
 
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87. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 22, 2009, 12:38 Verno
 
Still not seeing it, console games are typically priced $10 higher to compensate for this and certification fees already. Maybe if you compare digital distribution to console retail but retail to retail the disparity shouldn't be that high with the mentioned factors.  
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86. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 22, 2009, 11:16 Prez
 
Unfortunately I don't have a link, because it's a number I read in magazines. Oddly enough, it was not only cited in PC Gamer (this month in an editorial by Dan Stapleton), but it also was published in the Official Xbox magazine. FWIW, the disparity is attributed to the lack of royalties on PC, while console games typically have a royalty payment of between 8 and 15 dollars per game.

This comment was edited on Oct 22, 2009, 11:17.
 
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85. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 22, 2009, 11:13 Verno
 
And remember, in 2007 industry analysts determined that the average profit of a PC sale is double that of a console sale, so a lost PC sale (theoretical as it may be) hurts twice as much.

Haha wait, what? Which analysts, how did they come to that conclusion and where is the data? That one really must be seen to be believed, it sounds like Michael Pachter bullshit. Licensing and certification are simply not that high to double your profit, assuming we are comparing PC retail to console retail here.
 
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84. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 22, 2009, 11:02 Prez
 
Just a thought, at this point the petition is getting close to 140k signatures...we can reasonably assume that not everyone signing it will boycott, but as a wild guess, I figure a lot will.

By the same token, I would guess that a lot of people who won't bother signing the petition won't buy the game because of IW's bad judgment.

And remember, in 2007 industry analysts determined that the average profit of a PC sale is double that of a console sale, so a lost PC sale (theoretical as it may be) hurts twice as much. I would think that they would rather have those sales than lose them, regardless if the console sales earn them new Ferraris or not.
 
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83. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 22, 2009, 10:59 Beamer
 
Yeah, thanks for nothing then. I think most people would rather do something to express their dissatisfaction than nothing.

Well, it'll make you feel better, but it won't change anything. It's like screaming at a girl when she tells you "we need to talk." You're just proving to her that she made the right decision. There are ways that you probably could have gotten her back, but they require effort and creativity and still might fail. It's just easier to call her a slut and tell her you never loved her, anyway, right?

That's fifty-thousand less players for the matchmaking service to actually function with, so even if p2p was suddenly much better with IWNET than it is...well, everywhere else (it's not and will only compound this problem,) the service is already crippled by the bad publicity alone causing a huge division in the player-base, except the division isn't Modders Vs Casuals, it's Bought The Game Vs Didn't.

The question is whether IW thinks the community is better with or without those 50,000 people. Just because you have money doesn't mean you're wanted. I'm guessing IW doesn't want those people, believing those 50,000 are griefers, cheaters, whiners, complainers, or just people that hang out in one server that they dominate. For the record I disagree. Those people will show up anyway.
 
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82. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 22, 2009, 08:04 Dr. D. Schreber
 
Just a thought, at this point the petition is getting close to 140k signatures...we can reasonably assume that not everyone signing it will boycott, but as a wild guess, I figure a lot will.

So let's make a guess and say 50k won't be buying the game. Now, there's the lost revenue argument, which is pretty pointless because at the rate PC games sell, it's a drop in the bucket to how much they're going to make with the console versions.

What sticks out more to me is Bowling's statement about how this is being done soas not to divide the community in half. That's fifty-thousand less players for the matchmaking service to actually function with, so even if p2p was suddenly much better with IWNET than it is...well, everywhere else (it's not and will only compound this problem,) the service is already crippled by the bad publicity alone causing a huge division in the player-base, except the division isn't Modders Vs Casuals, it's Bought The Game Vs Didn't.
 
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81. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 21, 2009, 22:20 Sepharo
 
I decided to make use of my Steam community:

http://steamcommunity.com/groups/detroitgamers/announcements/detail/55327971730546035
 
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80. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 21, 2009, 21:11 The PC Warrior
 
Totally agree with you TIP.  
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79. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 21, 2009, 18:19 Wowbagger_TIP
 
That's why I said it's hard.
But throwing hissy fits is not the way to do it. It just furthers the rift.
So you're saying that we shouldn't "throw hissy fits" and we shouldn't pirate the game, but have no other recourse to offer in place of those things. Yeah, thanks for nothing then. I think most people would rather do something to express their dissatisfaction than nothing.

The only thing worse than furthering the rift is to allow them to believe there is no rift.

This comment was edited on Oct 21, 2009, 18:20.
 
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78. Re: Still More on MW2 Servers Oct 21, 2009, 14:25 Kxmode
 
If you torrent the game, then by your very actions, you consider the game to have some sort of value, that it's worth your time to play it, and are therefore a hypocritical douchebag whose statistics Activision will only use to validate their decisions.

If you want to speak with your wallet, then don't buy it, and don't fucking pirate it either. Buy something else, or else you're doing absolutely jack shit to make your opinion known.

Amen LMN8R!
 
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77. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 21, 2009, 13:02 Beamer
 
I'm not sure how they'll know we're pissed off without telling them we're pissed off.

The question is whether they care that you're pissed off. More likely than not they did this knowing exactly who would be pissed off and therefore not buy the game.
 
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76. Re: More on MW2 Servers Oct 21, 2009, 12:59 Sepharo
 
But throwing hissy fits is not the way to do it. It just furthers the rift.

I'm not sure how they'll know we're pissed off without telling them we're pissed off.
 
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