$25 Mil Left 4 Dead 2 Ad Campaign

It would be really great if they took that idea and made a sequel a year later too




Playing: Path of Exile, Animal Crossing, Tales of Graces F Watching: Survivorman, Justified, Silent Running

89.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 8, 2009, 02:59

Kosumo

I hope they do Dead 8 Living! as the follow up (so it's 8 player co-op or 2 teams of 4 against each other - maybe you could even traitor your own team and join the other - while playing thought the story mode) That could be fun if there was 8 on the team but only 4 places on the helicopter!

88.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 8, 2009, 01:29

Unless valve pulls another stunt with L4D3 like they did on L4D2, I get the feeling L4D2 will be the game L4D1 was supposed to be with extra content. Migrating content to L4D2, lots of DLC, etc. I expect more DLC on 2 than there was on 1.

87.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 8, 2009, 01:03

Prez

That's right. Forgot. That's a lot of instant content available at launch...




Prez on Soundclick http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=604888

86.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 7, 2009, 22:08

Prez: Remember, valve said that with a simple recompile maps made for L4D1 will easily work in L4D2. I.e. they are forward compatible.

85.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 7, 2009, 17:26

Prez

Sometimes, less is more. I read somewhere that many developers felt that programming on the original Xbox actually made them better PC developers because it forced them to be more creative in order to compensate with limited resources such as low memory and such.

On a side note, not completely off topic since this is a L4D thread, has anyone else noticed that L4D maps has been offline for 2 days now? I hope it didn't kick the bucket; I downloaded all my campaigns from there.

EDIT: Never mind; the site's back online now. They were making adjustments in preparation for L4D2. I wonder why, as it may be a while before any user-made campaigns come out for it. Is the SDK shipping with the game this time?

This comment was edited on Oct 7, 2009, 17:30.




Prez on Soundclick http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=604888

84.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 7, 2009, 15:34

Yes, yes it does. However, a good team can make a better game with $25 million than they could with $5 million.

Sometimes maybe, other times not so much. It's too dependent on factors we can't account for to really make a blanket statement about it. Some otherwise decent development teams have been mismanaged or distracted into the ground. The variables in the story change slightly(Flagship vs lets say Ion Storm for example) but in the end they always start out with a massive budget, get too comfortable with their deadlines and end up rushing at the end because they spent years on feature creep.

This comment was edited on Oct 7, 2009, 15:35.




Playing: Path of Exile, Animal Crossing, Tales of Graces F Watching: Survivorman, Justified, Silent Running

83.

Re: $25 Mil Left 4 Dead 2 Ad Campaign

Oct 7, 2009, 15:10

How many Katamari's have we had now? A few, none of which have come even close to selling a million units. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katamari_damacy#Reception It depends on the team, no? Yes, yes it does. However, a good team can make a better game with $25 million than they could with $5 million. No one is saying that you can make a blockbuster on a shoestring easily but alternatively you cannot simply spend throw money at a project to produce a better product in all cases either. Agreed. However, in most cases, a good team can make a better game with a larger budget. This comment was edited on Oct 7, 2009, 15:11.

82.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 7, 2009, 15:07

Beamer: Not enough. There's still not one for the DS (nearly the only console I own unless you can a very old SNES I have in the closet). So that means I've never had a chance to try Katamari. This comment was edited on Oct 7, 2009, 15:07.

81.

Re: $25 Mil Left 4 Dead 2 Ad Campaign

Oct 7, 2009, 14:05

Beamer

Zombie Land has been successful in the box office and is a critical success. You said it had no strong points.

Strong selling points.
Good reviews are not a strong selling point.
It's a box office success because of good marketing.

Psychonauts selling over a million? I really don't think that could ever happen. Advertising is all well and good but if the actual product is too weird the average joe, it won't make a difference.

How many Katamari's have we had now?

More time = more quality, unless you have extremely poor management (ala Daikatana).

It depends on the team, no?
If I gave you 25 million dollars today do you really think you can give me a flawless game? If anything I think there's a lot of proof, in almost every industry, that near-infinite budgets tend to lead to lesser product quality.




------------- Music for the discerning: http://www.deathwishinc.com http://www.hydrahead.com http://www.painkillerrecords.com

80.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 7, 2009, 13:04

Time IS money. There aren't many big-budget games that have a 1 year dev cycle.

Doesn't address anything I brought up. Employee time equates to money, yes. It doesn't change the fact that spending more time(and thus money) can have a negative effect on a product. More is not always better. Product management and a tight focus are both easier with smaller teams and less bloated budgets. No one is saying that you can make a blockbuster on a shoestring easily but alternatively you cannot simply spend throw money at a project to produce a better product in all cases either.




Playing: Path of Exile, Animal Crossing, Tales of Graces F Watching: Survivorman, Justified, Silent Running

79.

Re: $25 Mil Left 4 Dead 2 Ad Campaign

Oct 7, 2009, 12:40

Do you want to argue that Rotten Tomato scores have even a tiny correlation to box office results? Zombie Land has been successful in the box office and is a critical success. You said it had no strong points. But a 25 million dollar advertising campaign would have pushed it sales up beyond a million. Psychonauts selling over a million? I really don't think that could ever happen. Advertising is all well and good but if the actual product is too weird the average joe, it won't make a difference. How much better can most games really get? You can add polish. You can fix bugs. But the flaws most games have go beyond just that. Games with larger budgets typically have longer dev cycles. More time = more quality, unless you have extremely poor management (ala Daikatana).

78.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 7, 2009, 12:37

The most prized commodity in the gaming industry from a development standpoint is time, not money. Time IS money. There aren't many big-budget games that have a 1 year dev cycle.

77.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 7, 2009, 10:32

I don't think anyone can really argue that having a bigger development budget doesn't make games better.

The budget isn't everything. The most prized commodity in the gaming industry from a development standpoint is time, not money. Throwing money at bodies in an effort to get more out of a game is a great way to end up with a mess as history has shown us time and time again in the gaming industry. The more bodies you add, the more management they need and the less focused the end product becomes.




Playing: Path of Exile, Animal Crossing, Tales of Graces F Watching: Survivorman, Justified, Silent Running

76.

Re: $25 Mil Left 4 Dead 2 Ad Campaign

Oct 7, 2009, 09:45

Beamer

The movie has an 87% average on Rotten Tomatoes. That's a pretty good score and seems to suggest that the movie does in fact have some strong points.

Do you want to argue that Rotten Tomato scores have even a tiny correlation to box office results? I wish that were true. Even when a movie is surprisingly good it usually doesn't result in big one-weekend box office business, it just ends up giving the movie long legs.

Weird games simply don't sell.

Mostly true.
Many Japanese games completely buck this trend, and occasionally Western games. Weird, ugly games tend to not sell, that's for sure. But a 25 million dollar advertising campaign would have pushed it sales up beyond a million.

I don't think anyone can really argue that having a bigger development budget doesn't make games better.

Diminishing returns. How much better can most games really get? You can add polish. You can fix bugs. But the flaws most games have go beyond just that. Extra money won't fix design flaws, particularly when the team doesn't think they're flaws or doesn't have a clue why they're wrong. You're just throwing money down a hole there. Much like you eventually do with marketing. A 25 million dollar campaign might make sense for L4D2. A 50 million dollar campaign likely wouldn't. A 100 million dollar campaign absolutely wouldn't.




------------- Music for the discerning: http://www.deathwishinc.com http://www.hydrahead.com http://www.painkillerrecords.com

75.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 7, 2009, 08:49

In the USA, the campaign will include Monday Night Football and UFC television broadcasts

Valve certainly knows it's audience if nothing else.




Playing: Path of Exile, Animal Crossing, Tales of Graces F Watching: Survivorman, Justified, Silent Running

74.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 7, 2009, 06:34

Jerykk: He was talking sales not game quality. More developement time would probably not have increased psychonauts sales, I mean as you say its a weird game. You'd end up with a slightly more polished weird game. However, I definately think more advertising would have increased sales. The game was basically unknown to most people, word of mouth helped it sell a little but it wasn't enough. This comment was edited on Oct 7, 2009, 06:43.

73.

Re: $25 Mil Left 4 Dead 2 Ad Campaign

Oct 7, 2009, 04:06

Zombieland is a movie with no strong points yet is massively successful due to a very strong and intelligent marketing spend. The movie has an 87% average on Rotten Tomatoes. That's a pretty good score and seems to suggest that the movie does in fact have some strong points. Would a game like Psychonauts have sold better with more money spent on development? Almost definitely no. Would it have sold better with a $25 million dollar advertising budget. Heck yes. Honestly, I don't think a big marketing budget would have helped sales much. Weird games simply don't sell. It's an established fact. If you want big sales, you have to cater to the masses and this means familiar settings, characters, stories, gameplay, etc. I don't think anyone can really argue that having a bigger development budget doesn't make games better. Hell, imagining Age of Decadence with a $25 million budget makes me cream my pants. If Psychonauts had a larger budget, they would have had more time to polish the game and add more content. I'm pretty sure the ending would have been a lot better too. This comment was edited on Oct 7, 2009, 04:18.

72.

Re: $25 Mil on L4D2 Ads

Oct 7, 2009, 04:02