Cutter wrote on Feb 24, 2013, 11:33:
I pity you foos that think advertising is a good thing. Advertising is evil, period. An entire industry predicated on lying and making people insecure and worthless if they don't use XYZ product. I block cookies. I use ABP. I use Tor and/or proxies for most browsing. It's none of any company's goddamned business who I am or why I'm on their site anymore than if I was to walk into a retail store and they were to insist that I may not do so without handing all my personal information to them first. You'd tell them to fuckoff, turn around and walk out. IF I decide to purchase from them then they can have the information - and NO - that is not expressed or even tacit approval meaning they can share it with ANYONE else!

For news related services they can charge for content as far as I'm concerned. However, if I'm paying for it I don't want to see a single goddamned ad anywhere. Its why I don't pay for cable. Most people have always hated advertising, yet companies refuse to adapt or couldn't because of technological limitations. We're way past that now and there are no more excuses. So adapt or fall by the wayside.

Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Feb 23, 2013, 02:44:

Beamer wrote on Feb 22, 2013, 09:58:
Except that this would have been written by people in PR/Corporate Communications, not marketers.

There's really that much of a difference? PR and Corperate comm, and marketers are all the same in my book. Soulless that all come out the same factory.

Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Feb 22, 2013, 07:04:

TheWitcher wrote on Feb 22, 2013, 06:11:
How do the people that come up with these BS slogans sleep at night?

Well that's simple, people in marketing have no souls.

Bhruic wrote on Feb 21, 2013, 05:35:
Yes, because he gets private stats on what "most PC gamers" are playing on. Funny how you dimiss Steam as being not representative of PC gamers, but then accept Rein's comment on face value.

Jivaro wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 20:54:
You have an amazing ability to read exactly what you want to and nothing else Beamer. In the same paragraph that I stressed not being awkward or uncomfortable you envision using a mouse, hunched over, on a coffee table. I said it wasn't expensive and yet you try to use cost as a factor. That is just arguing to argue at that point. I mean, I am not even one of these console hating PC master race people and somehow you drag that bit of crap into it.

Seriously man, browse the web a bit. I think you might be surprised what you find out there. Pro tip: Nothing like mousing, hunched over on a coffee table or on your ass is what I am referring to.

I am not doing furniture shopping for grown ups here, lol...I am trying to do the damn Neverwinter alpha Cutter gave me! This stuff isn't exactly hidden. Hell, we have had people link some of the more basic stuff on this very site before.

Example This isn't mine...I can't seem to find a link to mine at store site, but this is the website that someone linked here at Blues a few months back. This particular link goes to one of the simpler coffee tables that basically covers storage and ergonomics for a cheap price, but isn't exactly a looker. When I bought mine there was an oak table that looked much sturdier and had some hide-away storage that my wife liked because it allowed me to put all of the extra equipment somewhere out of sight. Only part of mine raises up so that the rest of the table can be used for drinks/food/etc. The rest of the site has some other things, chairs etc, as well as more options for the tables. If you want cheaper or modular, Ikea has a section...I personally am not a fan of the looks of that stuff though. Google for more. Back to Neverwinter!!

edit 2: If you are absolutely convinced that keyboard and mouse gaming can't be done in the living room in a fashion that is stylish, cost effective, and comfortable... *shrug*... ok. Your loss. I am loving it.

Jivaro wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 18:53:

It's simple ergonomics and technology.

In order to use a mouse, you need a good mousing surface. A soft, cushy, fluffy couch does not work well. You could put something on it, but in most cases you're mousing either down by your ass, if you put it on the cushion, or slightly higher, if you put it on the armrest. In both cases your wrist is at a terrible angle, and in the armrest case you likely have too little space.

The solution is to buy one of those tables that comes up, or a couch desk. Both are big and ugly.

Beamer, that is just ridiculous. I have a very comfortable setup that isn't big, ugly, awkward, or any less ergonomic then my office desk. In addition to that I have a fantastic oak coffee table with a glass top that stores all of my electronics. I am going to go ahead and assume, based on what you just said, that you haven't spent much more then a few minutes shopping around for modern living room furniture or accessories anytime in the last decade. The "ergonomic" frenzy, combined with a rigorous mainstream interest in working from home, that has been going on for the last 20 years is responsible for me being able to use a keyboard and mouse in my living room. The concept that somehow I am limited to big, awkward, and ugly options is...uninformed. My wife wouldn't let me have it in the living room, let alone actually use it with guests present, if it was some big and ugly thing.

My point was that most people simply don't take the time or spend the money to find out whether an alternative option would be better for their usage. The concept that somehow they shouldn't bother because it's all just awkward and big is ridiculous. The options are out there. There has been a growing market focused on it for some time and lapdesks aren't even scratching the surface as to all the possibilities. I do own a small lapdesk or two because it allows me to use it with my toddler grandchildren and their games, but that is something else all together. One of my buddies, who has no children, has this positively futuristic coffee table and reclining chair that straight up transforms from classy & traditional to a gaming cockpit of awesomeness.

Every friend or family member that comes to my place asks me about my setup as if I must either be rich or some kind of engineer. (and they know I am neither) Most of them don't game like I do, but the few that do have all gone and bought similar setups when they find out how easy and cheap it can actually be.

Have you really tried to use a mouse down by your ass? Seriously? lol...

Asmo wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 19:20:

Beamer wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 11:26:
Do you know why? Because few people will use the mouse (again, it's an impossibility on a couch without either ruining your wrist or buying additional furniture), and even just 1 person on a server using a mouse against everyone else using a pad will ruin the fun for everyone.

Why would you cater to the few? It drives me nuts when people say "you're dumb for not letting me use a mouse!" No. That's like organizing a bike race and then allowing someone to bring a motorcycle. Yeah, the guy that prefers his motorcycle is happy but all the bikers are angry and won't come back the next year.

Umm, but everyone can go out and get their own motorcycle...

Jivaro wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 16:20:

Hyatus wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 16:12:
Why does everyone keep saying you can't game on a couch with a mouse and keyboard? That's what I do. Optical Wireless Mouse + Wireless Keyboard.

Because there are a lot of people that just refuse to think "outside the box". Literally. They see the box that the console comes in, it has a couple of controllers on the outside, and they use them. I am going to go ahead and hazard a guess that this is the reason that most people use the remotes that come with their TV unless their cable or satellite provider does the programming for them at install. They think its too complicated or they just don't think of it at all. yet...give just about anybody a Logitech Harmony or something similar and it gets hard to go back to a standard remote.

Most users here base their preferences on experimentation. Even if someone does use a controller when they could use a mouse/kb...it is because they have tried it both ways and like it better that way. That isn't true for the mainstream at large, at least I don't think it is. I listen to many friends, family members, and co-workers talk about their electronics and very rarely do they think outside of whatever that box is that the device came in. Touch screens are popular for casual gaming despite their obvious limitations for this very reason....you have even LESS to think about or plug in.

Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 15:26:

Beamer wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 11:26:
and even just 1 person on a server using a mouse against everyone else using a pad will ruin the fun for everyone.

Wait, so because everyone is dumbed down to the point where they need the game to autoaim for them, no one should get their feelings hurt when PC master race comes along with a mouse and wtfpwns them using fine control. Gotcha.

Bodolza wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 12:48:

Axis wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 12:26:
The "mouse" on past consoles have SEVERE limitations which is immediately apparent to any PC gamer who would prefer it.

The mouse on PS3 is very similar to a PC, but very few games allow it. Unreal Tournament did, with predictable hilarity. My very first time playing the game I went on-line with gamepad/mouse (gamepad for movement) and completely dominated, and I'm not a very good player. I stopped after a couple more rounds because it was just getting silly.

HorrorScope wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 10:19:
Take all players in all pc games that allow mouse-look. That is the comparative # vs those playing 3rd person/1rst person on consoles. And whatever the result, it would just show which is more popular. To me mouselook goes well beyond shooters.

But now this is starting to sound like a MS backed agenda here, instead of giving users (at least a good #) a choice of mouse on a console, they force you to a pad. Then instead of adding a mouse, they give you Kinect. On the pc, they are trying to make us go touch, even though we aren't complaining about the mouse. What in gods name is your issues with Mice MS? The damn things just work very intuitively.

The best devices are one's that feel natural and you don't need to feel handicapped using. The gamepad is general purpose but in many games for me it brings input frustration.

Creston wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 11:09:

Beamer wrote on Feb 19, 2013, 09:33:
Man, even that URL misspells judgment.

It's not a misspelling. Judgement or Judgment are both accepted spellings, according to multiple dictionaries. The Americans got lazy at some point and decided to ditch the first e.

Crston