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Nickname Beamer
Email Concealed by request - Send Mail
ICQ None given.
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Homepage None given.
Signed On Jan 9, 2003, 00:22
Total Comments 14106 (Ninja)
User ID 15739
 
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News Comments > Hatred Announced
40. Re: Hatred Announced Oct 17, 2014, 12:31 Beamer
 
Of course they have a "right" to make this. I have a right to eat 1,000 In-N-Out burgers in one sitting, or to eat a hot dog covered in broken glass. That doesn't make any of it a good idea.

Games is getting a huge black eye in the mainstream media right now. The only articles coming out are about sexism. This will shake that and bring it back to murder fantasies/simulators, excessive violence, and making people kill.

Great. Just what everyone needs.
 
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News Comments > etc.
94. Re: etc. Oct 17, 2014, 12:24 Beamer
 
Verno wrote on Oct 17, 2014, 12:15:
UHD wrote on Oct 17, 2014, 11:58:
Not to nitpick but the fact that video games are changing is in fact acknowledgement that they need to change. It's inevitable as the culture shifts. It's why you won't see a movie like Blazing Saddles made today. Sexism is a loaded subject and people get super emotional over it, whether it's warranted or not. It's complex, and probably not something worth tackling in a limited medium like video games. Again though, can't fault anyone for trying, only in how they go about it.

Need to change as in "oh my god the urgency, we need to do this now! You people are awful blahblahblah" is what I meant. I can absolutely fault people for trying when they go about it in a way that I don't feel is honest or representative.

I haven't played Mirror's Edge (it's one of those games I got on sale via Steam and then promptly never played it) but I was under the impression it tanked because it wasn't a very good game.

Insert any other perceived female driven game there, it was just 2 random examples off the top of my head. Since you mentioned it though, its an above average game that was hampered by some mid-to late game design issues.

Who is saying "oh my god the urgency, we need to do this now?" or even "you people are awful?"

What was said was:
1) The gamers obsessed with harassing women are awful. This is not all gamers, but this is certainly some gamers. Julio can't shut up about "burgers and fries," Cutter can't stop saying truly repulsive shit. Those things are awful (I don't think Julio is an awful person, but he says some misogynistic stuff. I do think Cutter is a computer that fails the Turing Test only because he's so much more repulsive than any human could ever be)

2) That some things should be changed. The volume and urgency only increased as people started saying "no, you're series about specific things is cherry picking specific things and you need to shut up and shouldn't be allowed to say this!" Anita never called for immediate change. Hell, she never really called for anything. She just pointed things out
 
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News Comments > etc.
53. Re: etc. Oct 16, 2014, 19:39 Beamer
 
Loopy wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 19:30:
Beamer wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 16:39:
She did not say all gamers are like that, but did say that person exists, is horrible, is constantly harassing and lashing out in fear of losing control of his hobby, and needs to be ignored.
Lots of gamers read this and said "I am not that person!" and began campaigns of harassment and lashing out in fear of losing control of their hobby.

Basically we need to turn the Reactionary dial back to zero for all involved, then distribute chill pills. In other words, we're screwed.

The main thing about the hobby, to me, is that so few of us have bothered with significant amounts of AAA games in the past few years. Yeah, we play some we love, but fewer and fewer. Outside of a tiny handful I've only played them on consoles.

But we've picked up so much more in indies, and the indies are getting more and more sophisticated and professional, much more rapidly than I anticipated.
In the past two years, I'd say the games I've played the most are FTL, OMD2, X-COM, Civ4 and maybe Far Cry 3. 2 of those are indies, 2 of those are not indie but kind of fringe AAA, and only one is a AAA graphics bonanza. I think this is true for most people on this board.
 
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News Comments > etc.
40. Re: etc. Oct 16, 2014, 17:53 Beamer
 
Creston wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 17:40:
Beamer wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 16:39:
She said that the group of "gamers" that fit the stereotypical description exists and that, while it may be a small group, it is the group that too many publishers still cater too.

Which is horseshit, because in her retarded universe in which she is the Queen Shit, all these 'gamer' neckbeards are guys who have been gaming since the 70s/80s, so all these guys are now in their late 30s, early 40s.

Which publishers target games at the 30-40 bracket exactly? Because pretty much every single AAA game is marketed at the male 14-24 crowd.

But hey, what's an extra straw man here or there?

Creston, I know it's hard to see, but read this CGW editorial from 1997. I found it randomly by flipping through an old CGW for another topic earlier this week.

Basically, it says the same thing. Gamers tend to be mature, reasonable, responsible individuals, but games are so often aimed at complete morons and nitwits. It was worse then, as the ads in that CGW are cringeworthy (I was mocking them before finding this editorial), but it's still true to an extent today.

I mean, people on this very board constantly bemoan how AAA publishers are putting out stupid shit for the lowest common denominator, so I really just don't get how this is so controversial.
 
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News Comments > etc.
34. Re: etc. Oct 16, 2014, 17:15 Beamer
 
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 17:09:
Beamer wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 17:07:
Because it was last minute and finding something like that and organizing it is nearly impossible?
Oh please. If last minute means "several days" then you've got a serious problem. I've seen speakers shift from one venue to another in a 12 hour period. The crowds were 500-2500 people.

Those were probably speakers that sold tickets they'd need refunds for and that had teams working with them. From what I understand, Anita was asked to be at the school and flew down. The only organizers were the school, not her.

At this point, I'm not even certain what you're trying to prove here. If she had rescheduled, what of it? You'd still be all pissy about whatever she said.
 
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News Comments > etc.
32. Re: etc. Oct 16, 2014, 17:07 Beamer
 
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 17:05:
UHD wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 16:43:

I have a really hard time finding fault with her decision. She could have waited for the official investigation, but I guess she felt the CCW law was more serious, because if you're going to conceal a weapon with intent to use it that day you're not going to warn the police beforehand.
So then, why didn't she move the venue to a private hall, theater or something else? She refused to do that, remember public place = CCW in force. But private buildings can restrict that. So now you have the answer, she simply didn't want to.

Because it was last minute and finding something like that and organizing it is nearly impossible?
 
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News Comments > etc.
30. Re: etc. Oct 16, 2014, 16:48 Beamer
 
UHD wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 16:43:
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 16:31:
UHD wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 16:25:
So if you were in charge of campus security, and you received a threat that someone was going to start shooting up your school during someone's presentation, what would you do?
Have it investigated, which was done. By the FBI no less, who declared it a non-credible threat and tell them to carry on. Remember she cancelled because of the CCW policy, not because of anything else.

Which honestly is pretty reasonable if you've been inundated with threats to your person. You also wouldn't necessarily insist on such tight security if you're making all these threats up, or you haven't received them in such number or graphic detail. You could just soldier on and look the brave activist standing up to those mean gamers.

I have a really hard time finding fault with her decision. She could have waited for the official investigation, but I guess she felt the CCW law was more serious, because if you're going to conceal a weapon with intent to use it that day you're not going to warn the police beforehand.

Question: would anyone frequenting these threads want to go somewhere and give a discussion about gender and games in front of an armed audience?
 
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News Comments > etc.
28. Re: etc. Oct 16, 2014, 16:39 Beamer
 
Loopy wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 16:34:
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 16:16:
Loopy wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 16:08:
THAT is the "gamers are dead" that got people so offended?! What in Jesus and Mohammed is so wrong with that?!!!!
No it wasn't "that article" it was 15 articles all in a 24hr period containing 35-45% of the same content.

Oh, well I can see how that would seem weird. But the content itself doesn't appear to be superbly offensive. The author wasn't saying literally "gamers are dead," just that games are played by so many that affixing a label to people who play them might be outdated.

Well, Leigh Alexander went beyond that. She said that the group of "gamers" that fit the stereotypical description exists and that, while it may be a small group, it is the group that too many publishers still cater too. There's no reason to act like everyone that plays games is a nerdy neckbeard virgin that drinks Bawlz and has the maturity level of a 2nd grader, and no reason to keep making games targeted at that individual.

She did not say all gamers are like that, but did say that person exists, is horrible, is constantly harassing and lashing out in fear of losing control of his hobby, and needs to be ignored.
Lots of gamers read this and said "I am not that person!" and began campaigns of harassment and lashing out in fear of losing control of their hobby.

She pretty clearly read the first editorial while angry and wrote a very angry creed with a lot of inflammatory language. But while some of us read it and said "yeah, those people do suck and I wish there were more games out there that weren't so tediously stupid" others read it and said "how can she claim I'm like that?!"
 
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News Comments > etc.
21. Re: etc. Oct 16, 2014, 16:02 Beamer
 
Jivaro wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 15:51:
The problem, aside from the ridiculous threats, is this term "gamer". It doesn't mean anything any more. In fact, I am not sure it ever really did...but that is a different topic. What I mean is that EVERYBODY games now. EVERYBODY is a lot of fucking people. Just like every other group of "a lot of fucking people" there are bound to be a vocal, visible, and sometimes dangerous group of assholes that seem absolutely determined to fuck everything up for everyone else.

Interestingly, here's the original "gamers are dead" article.
"On the evidence of the last few weeks, what we are seeing is the end of gamers, and the viciousness that accompanies the death of an identity. Due to fundamental shifts in the videogame audience, and a move towards progressive attitudes within more traditional areas of videogame culture, the gamer identity has been broken... Today, videogames are for everyone. I mean this in an almost destructive way. Videogames, to read the other side of the same statement, are not for you. You do not get to own videogames. No one gets to own videogames when they are for everyone. They add up to more than any one group.That was written and published hours before Leigh Alexander's, and served as her launching off point. And here's an article from 2013 that she linked to:
""Gamer" is a marketing term used to put you in a box. If you agree with that, maybe you can stop reading right here and never use the word again. But let's continue for the rest of us... The word "gamer" is regressive. It accepts the portrait of us painted by the mainstream news media, and every time I hear it or read it it actually makes me feel a little sick. I believe in this art form, and I believe in the people who make it. That's why I am so hard on this industry, because I believe that as great as it sometimes is, it can get better."

The initial premise, which Leigh Alexander mentions while she sets things on fire, is basically what you said. Well, you said it doesn't mean anything anymore, I agree with these articles that it does mean something but what it means doesn't really exist. It's a derogatory term outside of game sites, and that's unfair, because these days every person games.
 
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News Comments > etc.
14. Re: etc. Oct 16, 2014, 14:59 Beamer
 
ASeven wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 14:49:
http://www.usu.edu/ust/index.cfm?article=54179

According to Utah State Today, the threats against Anita Sarkeesian were a hoax. She cancelled the talk because she "was concerned about the fact that state law prevented the university from keeping people with a legal concealed firearm permit from entering the event. University police were prepared and had a plan in place to provide extra security measures at the presentation."

Well well well, who would have guessed??

Uh, did you read that? Nowhere does it say it was a hoax. And Anita said from the start that she canceled it due to concerns about the University security.

edit - I mean, there were real threats. There was no intention to act on them, but ASeven makes it out to seem like Anita made them herself, not that some nutjob called them in.
 
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News Comments > etc.
5. Re: etc. Oct 16, 2014, 11:43 Beamer
 
Seventyfive wrote on Oct 16, 2014, 11:24:
You should update the Washington Post link to say "- Washington post" so that I don't waste my time clicking on the link

As far as mainstream coverage goes, this one pays the most credence to ethics, but still makes it mostly about gender.

Which is how everyone not supporting it sees it b
 
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News Comments > etc., etc.
42. Re: etc., etc. Oct 16, 2014, 10:27 Beamer
 
Ah thunderf00t, another guy with no history of discussing games but a long history of shitting on women. But this is about games and ethics!  
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News Comments > etc., etc.
8. Re: etc., etc. Oct 15, 2014, 22:49 Beamer
 
The New York Times jumps into it.

And, still, people that think #gamergate is a revolution will say it isn't about women, but to everyone not in their movement that's all it is about.

The Verge, the only other site I go to regularly that discusses this (and usually I try to avoid the discussion there) linked to a tweet I found funny:
1999: gamers demand we stop blaming school shootings on videogames. 2014: gamers threaten a school shooting because videogames.

What I have learned from skimming The Verge, though, is how many people decry being misogynists while saying things that are blatantly misogynistic, or supporting people like The Amazing Atheist who is clearly a misogynist. You start seeing things like you do with homophobia, where people get very literal. "I am not a homophobe because I do not fear gay people, I just think they do not deserve equal rights."

Saying something misogynistic may not make you a misogynist (but it may), but it's shocking how many people don't even realize they're saying something misogynist. Again, I'll point to Cutter, since he's the easiest target, and all his "broads shouldn't run tech companies" or "they're all sociopathic bitches." There's no way he's anything but a misogynist, but he wouldn't agree. Harlock is another one that repeatedly uses the "psycho bitch" terminology to describe women he doesn't agree with, and I'm sure he doesn't think he's a misogynist, either. Maybe he isn't, but he certainly says plenty of things that are.
 
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News Comments > Into the Black
8. Re: Into the Black Oct 15, 2014, 22:34 Beamer
 
jdreyer wrote on Oct 15, 2014, 22:19:
Cutter wrote on Oct 15, 2014, 22:10:
That clip is US only.

Yeah, we closed the borders. Just in case Ebola is contagious over the internet.

And we'll get another rare Beamer use of emoticons!
Thumbsup
 
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News Comments > Evening Metaverse
6. Re: Evening Metaverse Oct 15, 2014, 20:24 Beamer
 
Prez wrote on Oct 15, 2014, 20:18:
Speaking of HBO on Amazon, what on there is worth watching? I watched Band of Brothers on DVD a couple of years ago - I'm looking for something new. How is "The Wire"?

This time of year I would kill for Tales from the Crypt.
Many are on YouTube, but it's nowhere near the same.
 
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News Comments > etc.
75. Re: etc. Oct 15, 2014, 19:36 Beamer
 
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Oct 15, 2014, 19:31:
But if we're so terrible that isis finds it deplorable, I guess that means #stopgg2014 and gamerghazi(who is also using that hash) support rape, murder, genocide, slavery, and ethnic cleansing right? Then again, being "worse" than isis would mean that we're the polar opposite of them. My, my...how telling that is.

You have absolutely zero sense of humor.
 
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News Comments > etc.
71. Re: etc. Oct 15, 2014, 19:03 Beamer
 
Julio wrote on Oct 15, 2014, 18:49:
Beamer wrote on Oct 15, 2014, 18:39:
This is why I've said they should change their hashtag.

Squirmer wrote on Oct 15, 2014, 18:34:
what's the actual point of sticking with a label that can never possibly be salvaged? (Answer: it's not really about journalism ethics, and even if it were, no one wants to put in the effort required to effect any measurable change, oh well.)

There is no need to abandon the #Gamergate tag. It's working quite well. I can see why the anti-GG movement would like that to happen though. Why don't the anti-GG people abandon Sarkessian and Zoe Quinn?

Because people only support them in the "harassing them is idiotic" sense.
 
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News Comments > etc.
70. Re: etc. Oct 15, 2014, 19:02 Beamer
 
Mashiki Amiketo wrote on Oct 15, 2014, 18:56:
Beamer wrote on Oct 15, 2014, 18:39:
This is why I've said they should change their hashtag.
So I guess that means that #stopgg2014 should change their hashtag now, after all they have people who called us "worse than isis" supporting them, and actual isis related tweets in there. I suggest they take #meow.

You're right. I should have used "name," not "hashtag." As far as I know, no large group of people is identifying as "stopgg2014." But I also haven't seen many people actually call themselves "anti-gg." There's really no organized "anti-gg." There's the stupid gameghazi, but that's 1/10th of the KotakuInAction.

Also, if your movement is so terrible that even ISIS finds it deplorable... ha!

 
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News Comments > etc.
67. Re: etc. Oct 15, 2014, 18:39 Beamer
 
Squirmer wrote on Oct 15, 2014, 18:34:
It kind of astounds me that anyone would still claim to support gamergate at this stage, considering the actual mainstream coverage of it. Outside of the distorted view of reality in gamergate circles, the mainstream coverage should make people realize that the rest of the world sees gamergate supporters as either 1) childish internet trolls, or 2) actual psychopaths.

If you actually care about journalism ethics, what's the actual point of sticking with a label that can never possibly be salvaged? (Answer: it's not really about journalism ethics, and even if it were, no one wants to put in the effort required to effect any measurable change, oh well.)

This is why I've said they should change their hashtag. At this point #gamergate is doing far more damage to the outside opinion of "gamers" than Jack Thompson ever could. Gamers always hated the outside opinion being unfair, well, now the outside opinion is of grown men throwing tantrums and threatening women because they're unwilling to share their toys.

Screw talk of "controlling the narrative," that's the mainstream narrative. Outside of, maybe, a 26 minute HuffPo video no one that doesn't already care would ever devote time to.

Leigh Alexander very stupidly worded an article that tried to say the outside stereotype of "gamers" being society's rejects was wrong, and as a result, a small but very vocal minority of gamers has gone and proven it exactly right. And people stick with it. No matter how many times they're told that everyone not a part of #gamergate (and it's only a small number that's a part of it) thinks it's about hating women, they stubbornly insist it's about ethics. And then whine about SJWs censoring things.
If no one outside of your cause thinks your cause is for what you claim, it probably isn't and it's probably time to do some rebranding.
 
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News Comments > etc.
60. Re: etc. Oct 15, 2014, 17:42 Beamer
 
The Wikipedia article for TFYC isn't very conclusive, but it looks like a female-only dev competition that Zoe Quinn disliked and, after 4chan exploded against Zoe Quinn, it decided it did like?

Who cares? Zoe Quinn doesn't seem like the sharpest nail in the drawer. She doesn't speak for everyone, or really, anyone other than herself. She isn't always right. Who knows if she's often right? I've never played her game, never seen a screenshot of her game, don't know what she did before that game, and don't know if she's done other games.

I do know that her sex life didn't deserve to be made public, picked over, laughed at, and turned into a meme.
 
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14106 Comments. 706 pages. Viewing page 19.
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