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Nickname Beamer
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Signed On Jan 9, 2003, 00:22
Total Comments 14220 (Ninja)
User ID 15739
 
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News Comments > Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming
96. Re: Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming Aug 23, 2014, 20:10 Beamer
 
ASeven wrote on Aug 23, 2014, 19:45:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAJYmrKR8WE

Rather awesome video on SJWs.

And the whole "sjw" thing is such bullshit. I'm sorry, using that term is a way of saying there is no issue with women in games

The issue is enormous. This thread repeatedly proves it. There's a huge lack of respect. From prominent users here. Plenty of men feel they're more deserving, and don't need to show respect, or that nature hardwired them to be asses so its ok.

What bugs me isn't that Zoe clearly seems to need mental help, but that so many here dismiss an entire, huge issue due to this, and in their dismissal seem to just verify the proble.
 
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News Comments > Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming
95. Re: Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming Aug 23, 2014, 20:05 Beamer
 
Prez wrote on Aug 23, 2014, 19:03:
How does having sex do this?

I'm not sure if you are just playing devil's advocate here or if you really don't get it. Having sex doesn't do this; having sex with select individuals in the gaming press to advance your career through promoting positive press and silencing negative press about oneself (with the implication being that women can only succeed by blowing their way to success) is clearly setting back women who would rather do it the legitimate way. Doubly so when it is sone by the s0-called champion of women's rights in gaming. Surely you can understand this?

No, I get that, but i don't see how every is so certain she slept with people for press. I haven't seen any evidence of that press.
 
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News Comments > Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming
88. Re: Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming Aug 23, 2014, 18:21 Beamer
 
Verno wrote on Aug 23, 2014, 17:22:
Redmask wrote on Aug 23, 2014, 16:53:
I could have dismissed it as pointless scandal with people I don't care about until all of the above started happening, no surprise the story has legs now and people aren't letting it go. Fucking your way to connections is one thing, using the bully tactics that you decry is another. It's how it was handled and the shocking amount of hypocrisy going on, especially from sites like Kotaku who have been lecturing people forever on many of these subjects.

That's really what interested me about this story. Who cares about a nerdy sex scandal? I don't care if she slept with 5 guys or 50. It's all of the bullshit surrounding the story that has shone a spotlight on how fucked up things are behind the scenes. I think I've read probably a dozen moralizing editorials on Polygon and Kotaku over the past year but magically they have nothing to say about this. Getting things removed from a top level Reddit is really hard yet this nonsense has that in spades.

They really should be throwing her to the wolves, she is setting back female oriented outreach in the gaming industry by years and not making the press look good either. Instead they've let personal relationships interfere and it makes all of their moralizing basically forfeit since they won't practice what they preach.

I guess I shouldn't be surprised that Phil Fish was involved in this either, albeit in a tangential way. In the past telling anyone criticizing Zoe that they were "essentially raping her" is classy stuff Phil.

But why?

How does any of this change her? How is having slept with 5 guys "setting back female oriented outreach?" This entire scandal came from her sleeping with 5 guys and her ex boyfriend claiming she did it for reviews and coverage.
But no one has yet shown what reviews and coverage she got. It appears to be minimal, and there's no sign that she slept with them for those reasons.
And how does a woman choosing to sleep with someone mean anything? How does it make the comments women repeatedly get, on this very board, ok? How does a woman choosing to sleep with someone make her moralizing wrong? This seems to confuse what women say. They say they shouldn't be called a slut for choosing to have sex, not that they shouldn't be choosing to have sex.

The arguments here are getting so convoluted as people rush in from so many different sides. "She slept her way to coverage!" Where? What coverage? Show me articles. Show me proof those articles only came due to sex. "She is setting back women's movements!" How does having sex do this?
 
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News Comments > Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming
85. Re: Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming Aug 23, 2014, 16:54 Beamer
 
jdreyer wrote on Aug 23, 2014, 16:51:
Beamer wrote on Aug 23, 2014, 16:10:
Yes, I saw the lengthy blog. I did not see proof. The girl slept with five people, most of whom were journalists.
Nathan whatever was the most discussed, and he seems to have not only not reviewed her game but only mentioned it twice.

And, frankly, do you guys not think other industries have people that sleep with journalists? I'd imagine Erin Andrews has slept with a few athletes. Of course, to many of the men here, that would be her using her body to get access to exclusives, not, you know, the mirror of here and athletes using their bodies to get coverage.

Yeah, I didn't really see any quid pro quo with Grayson. I was not interested enough to check out anyone else. There's a bit of line skirting going on here, but no one has really crossed it yet. There are much more egregious examples of journalists sleeping with their subjects, like the John Edwards and David Petraeus scandals.

From what I can tell it's a woman familiar with depression doing self-destructive things and not valuing herself.

It's common. It's not exactly scandalous. And the insane coverage and commentary it's getting seems less due to anything wrong she did and more due to problems existing in the gaming community.

And whatever the hell Phil Fish did made everything worse, like everything Phil Fish always does.
 
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News Comments > Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming
80. Re: Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming Aug 23, 2014, 16:10 Beamer
 
HorrorScope wrote on Aug 23, 2014, 15:36:
Beamer wrote on Aug 23, 2014, 14:25:
Did any of the people she slept with review her game? I haven't seen allegations of that.

Somehow you then missed the whole premise, because that was the main story and the reason for the article. Not that I care much at all, just more blah blah.

Yes, I saw the lengthy blog. I did not see proof. The girl slept with five people, most of whom were journalists.
Nathan whatever was the most discussed, and he seems to have not only not reviewed her game but only mentioned it twice.

And, frankly, do you guys not think other industries have people that sleep with journalists? I'd imagine Erin Andrews has slept with a few athletes. Of course, to many of the men here, that would be her using her body to get access to exclusives, not, you know, the mirror of here and athletes using their bodies to get coverage.
 
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News Comments > Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming
71. Re: Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming Aug 23, 2014, 14:25 Beamer
 
And people keep burying their mostly abhorrent comments behind "games journalism sucks!"

Had anyone here actually heard of Zoe Quinn before this?
Had anyone here actually heard of whatever her game is?
Was it reviewed anywhere?

I only come to Blues. I never go to Kotaku, or any of those other sites that people here always say suck (yet the people saying they suck always seem to know what their top stories are), and I've never heard of any of this. It doesn't seem like she was getting much press at all. Did any of the people she slept with review her game? I haven't seen allegations of that.

This is going to end up with more comments than when Gamespot took down the Kane & Lynch video. Do you really think an insignificant game getting a few insignificant mentions is worse than that? Or is there something significantly deeper going on here that keeps getting aimed at almost all women (given that several people have made comments about other women lying, and that video kept going on weird tangents about other women.)
 
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News Comments > Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming
70. Re: Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming Aug 23, 2014, 14:12 Beamer
 
Prez wrote on Aug 23, 2014, 08:32:
I'd think "Waaaah, I can't even make a video game without guys calling me a stupid cunt" is a bit more valid than those.

Except when (as the video illustrates) the shit is orchestrated so the narcissistic SJW's can claim the moral high ground to bolster their faux noble image like this Zoe clown. I suspected she was full of shit with her first "look at me, the professional victim" bullshit piece.

Yeah, but she's not the only one this happens to, and we see it happen all the time.
Hell, any time even Jade Raymond is mentioned here the conversation turns to her looks, and then it turns to at least one person saying she's unqualified and only got where she got for sleeping her way there.
That video you mention (which strikes me as really fucking weird because this is the thing people decide they need a soapbox around? The guy starts off mentioning all the shitty things CNN, MSNBC and Fox News do, but this is what he decides to make a massive video on?) mentions some woman I've never heard of, couldn't even catch her name, and casually says "another chick that fucked her way to a job."

Has a single man in this industry been accused of fucking his way to a job without any evidence being shown? No, probably not. But hey, if the guy that made that video can throw an unsubstantiated aside out, and if people on Blues can say things about her like:
xXBatmanXx wrote on Jul 1, 2014, 10:12:
Well she cleaned up nice (used to be a meth face).

She is just a pretty face that says what she is told for clicks.

Cutter wrote on Jun 30, 2014, 12:12:
Why do the PR people keep allowing her to speak when she's only there to be pretty? Everything she just stated only shows why she should have never been promoted in the first place. That's the problem when companies choose looks over talent.

This is the woman that basically made Assassin's Creed and Watch Dogs, she runs one of the largest and most successful studios out there, but any time she's mentioned she gets dismissed because she's pretty.

Yup, every woman in the industry is an alleged liar like Zoe, and people aren't jumping on this despite there being no proof she did anything other than cheat five times because it's about having journalistic standards, not because it's fun for them to see a woman get knocked down repeatedly.
 
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News Comments > Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming
49. Re: Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming Aug 23, 2014, 03:25 Beamer
 
1badmf wrote on Aug 23, 2014, 02:40:
Prez wrote on Aug 23, 2014, 00:21:
LOL not sure but it's probably pretty close.

apparently it's a thing where people pick a flavor of the month cause and spew (usually fake) outrage on the internet in the name of popularity and clickbait. talk about your first world problems. don't have one? make one up! man why can't kids these days just be happy. they really have no idea how good they have it compared to the rest of the world, or even past generations of americans.

Dude, have you clicked on another thread on this board? Ever?
"Waaaaah, EA is giving a free game but it requires Origin!"
"Waaaaah, Zenimax is discounting DLC, but only 50%!"
"Waaaaah, Epic used to make PC games, then made console games, now may make PC games again and thinks we'll buy them!"
"Waaaaah, people keep buying $900 ships in Space Citizen, they're fucking it up!"
"Waaaaah, Crytek once implied that the PC platform has a larger percentage of pirates than other platforms!"

I'd think "Waaaah, I can't even make a video game without guys calling me a stupid cunt" is a bit more valid than those.
 
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News Comments > Op Ed
16. Re: Op Ed Aug 22, 2014, 21:12 Beamer
 
Icewind wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 20:40:
No evidence?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BvmxnjOIcAAxVy5.jpg:large

Not all gaming journalists are unreliable or untrustworthy. There are good sites out there, such as RPGWatch, the Codex, Nichegamer, and maybe N4G.

Is there a version of that that's legible and cited?
I mean, I can't read 90% of it, but what's different there than the relationship any of these sites have with any other dev?
 
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News Comments > etc.
44. Re: etc. Aug 22, 2014, 19:44 Beamer
 
Redmask wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 17:25:
No, I am not wasting anymore time on you as its clear you have nothing to offer here other than nitpicking.

You're missing my point entirely.
It was a compliment to you, and a reminder that certain words void an entire argument, like anyone using "thugs and animals" to discuss Ferguson.
 
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News Comments > Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming
28. Re: Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming Aug 22, 2014, 18:31 Beamer
 
Fish really does find himself in the middle of stuff like this... often.  
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News Comments > etc.
41. Re: etc. Aug 22, 2014, 17:24 Beamer
 
Redmask wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 17:15:
As if you're in a place to judge me here. Maybe before you start making assumptions next time you should realize that many of those people use that term for themselves, quite literally the people in this story. It's funny how its not important when its a woman but when people make broad assumptions about mens behavior we get countless editorials and lectures instead of it being a few mentally challenged idiots misrepresenting others. And before you go there, I have nothing to do with MRA bullshit, the inherent hypocrisy of this whole situation just stinks to high heaven.

If you don't think its important then no one is asking you stick around. I happen to think someone using their gender to both curry favor, silence critics and literally damage their own supposed cause is worth talking about.

Can you please link me to someone unironically using SJW in a non-perjorative way?
I can't find it anywhere.



Lastly, come on. You're now getting defensive. Women don't make broad assumptions about men. They discuss the things they deal with every single day. Men take issue to it when they assume they're being lumped into it. Which you're doing. Stop thinking it always includes you and look at what many men around you are doing.

I know you have nothing to do with the MRA bullshit, which is why you using the term surprises me.
And, again, I only called you out on using that term. Not your opinions on other things. You keep bringing those opinions up, as if I was judging you on that. I was just trying to point out that using a term like "SJW" makes it very easy to completely destroy any point you're making by lumping yourself in with people like Mad Max.

 
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News Comments > Op Ed
8. Re: Op Ed Aug 22, 2014, 17:21 Beamer
 
Creston wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 17:11:
Beamer wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 16:16:
Actually, Forbes is probably much less betrothed to the publishers.
But still almost definitely is.

Forbes has a slight benefit of the doubt, since they don't solely deal with games. Their entire income isn't tied to "How many ad banners is EA buying from me this year."

Then again, if you read the article below the linked one, one of their writers makes this argument:

Do video game journalists serve as consumer advocates, diligently informing consumers of the problems with upcoming games, business practices, and so forth, or are we simply an extension of the hype machine, legitimizing PR efforts by the industry? Are we critics or salespeople?

Naturally, the answer is “both.”

No. Naturally the answer is NOT both. The answer SHOULD be that you are consumer advocates etc etc, and that you are critics. You should NEVER fucking be an extension of the hype machine and a sales person.

The very fucking idea that this guy thinks he could be BOTH shows the extent of the problem. How the fuck could you be both a critic and a salesperson? The two are diametrically opposed!

tl;dr: Forbes is fucking terrible as well, for trying to pretend they can just sit on both sides of the fence.

Yeah, I came back and made the second line as an edit. Because odds are their team isn't supported by the industry, but still very close and still doing all the events and getting the freebies, plus you never know on Forbes who is a paid contributor with an editor and who is some random jackass contributing on his own.
 
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News Comments > etc.
39. Re: etc. Aug 22, 2014, 17:02 Beamer
 
Redmask wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 16:40:
I give up, you didn't even bother to read up on this before coming in here and talking to me about being lumped in with anyone.

Talk about taking the fucking piss, what a waste of time.

No, because what I called you out on was using the term "SJW." I said you were a better poster than that, as the other posters using it are, well, not exactly the kindest, most thoughtful or compassionate people.

I didn't say your opinion was wrong.
I didn't say you were dumb.
I didn't say you were a bad person.

I said I expected better of you than to use a term like that. It's a term mostly used by the MRA people. You don't strike me as one of them.

I did not comment at all on this situation because, frankly, it doesn't seem like a terribly important one. Someone has emotional problems, film at 11.
 
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News Comments > etc.
35. Re: etc. Aug 22, 2014, 16:31 Beamer
 
Redmask wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 16:18:
There have been several stories and editorials related to female presence in the gaming industry and the supposed hostility they face, several of which you commented including the rape threats related one. This was an alarming example of people just assuming that men are automatically guilty. This woman manipulated both her fans and the media using her gender, made false accusations, invented threats to her personal safety then tried to censor people when she was found out.

At the very least I'd expect some fucking rumination on how far back this is going to set things and that maybe there was a lesson to be learned here. But no instead you just tried to quibble about terminology and bait other posters. And yes, there are people who call themselves social justice warriors, including Zoe and her ex who exposed much of this.

An alarming amount of people assume women are automatically lying, even though that happens in an infinitesimally tiny amount of cases.

But now you're the one bringing this into broader territory that it shouldn't be. One woman ends up having some mental disorders, and is accused of sleeping with people in exchange for coverage (no proof of that, by the way), and now you're making wide sweeping statements.

What were her false accusations? I haven't paid attention. Again, I don't know who she is and, frankly, couldn't care less. One moron having an opinion doesn't make that opinion wrong.
 
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News Comments > Op Ed
3. Re: Op Ed Aug 22, 2014, 16:16 Beamer
 
Creston wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 16:10:
We want to report the news, share our opinions and pretend they're fact, and have fun playing games that were freely given to us, along with consoles and other swag in return for a favorable opinion (which we pass off as fact) even though we'll deny this to the fullest when you call us out on it.

You made your fucking bed. You then jammed that bed so far up the publishers' asses that it's impossible to ever extract again, and now you're whining that when you try to sleep on said bed, it stinks of shit. You'll forgive me for not shedding a tear for you poor underpaid peons in the "gaming press."

At least bloggers never called themselves fucking journalists.


Actually, Forbes is probably much less betrothed to the publishers.
But still almost definitely is.
 
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News Comments > Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming
13. Re: Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming Aug 22, 2014, 16:05 Beamer
 
SimplyMonk wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 15:57:
Beamer wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 15:39:
Stimpack wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 15:16:
What happened to him was really terrible, and no one deserves it. Regardless of your personal opinion of the guy.

http://i.imgur.com/oS54fpp.png

This isn't cool, and the guys who attacked him are far worse than Phil himself.

For those who weren't paying attention, that's from the polytron website.

"Don't fuck with /v/"

And people wonder why game devs rarely talk to the public anymore (wait, there was a .plan update in 2013!?) and why so many devs absolutely loathe the loud minority of their fanbase.

At the same time, Phil's also a fedora wearing jackass, so...

Lot of stuff going around about this being a false flag. Plus, "leader of 4chan.org and Anonymous"? Yeah. That sounds believable.

I mean, he's a jackass, but I'm guessing /v/ has similar MRA jackasses as Reddit is known for, although worse, so I wouldn't be surprised if they not only do it but try to blame Fish for doing it. This is the same (admittedly very diverse) board that, for a while, was creating fake twitter accounts of minority females in order to try to discredit the viewpoint of a fairly large segment of the population.

Basically, they're scum. Fish is also scum. Shame innocent customers are caught up in a war of entitled morons.
 
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News Comments > etc.
33. Re: etc. Aug 22, 2014, 15:41 Beamer
 
Redmask wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 14:08:
For the third time, the people following this person have used that term to describe themselves and no one fucking cares because there is a much bigger story going on here that you are ignoring because its inconvenient to your views.

1) I still think you're wrong that anyone describes themselves as such
2) How is this story "inconvenient?" One person has some serious emotional problems. One person. So what? How is an entire viewpoint aimed at 53% of the population get shattered by one person? One person that, prior to this, was never even discussed on this website. Seriously, you accused me of being on the wrong side of her editorials, but she's not once been mentioned on Blues prior. I'd never heard her name. I'm guessing you probably hadn't, either. Who fucking knew, or cared, who she was?
 
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News Comments > Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming
9. Re: Phil Fish Re-Quits Gaming Aug 22, 2014, 15:39 Beamer
 
Stimpack wrote on Aug 22, 2014, 15:16:
What happened to him was really terrible, and no one deserves it. Regardless of your personal opinion of the guy.

http://i.imgur.com/oS54fpp.png

This isn't cool, and the guys who attacked him are far worse than Phil himself.

For those who weren't paying attention, that's from the polytron website.

"Don't fuck with /v/"

And people wonder why game devs rarely talk to the public anymore (wait, there was a .plan update in 2013!?) and why so many devs absolutely loathe the loud minority of their fanbase.

At the same time, Phil's also a fedora wearing jackass, so...

This comment was edited on Aug 22, 2014, 15:52.
 
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News Comments > etc.
31. Re: etc. Aug 22, 2014, 13:10 Beamer
 
Hell, even Urban Dictionary defines "social justice warrior" as a pejorative term.

I don't think anyone uses it as a badge of honor. It's just a buzzword people try to use to defeat arguments. Kind of like how many people here don't believe you can think women deserve any kind of fair treatment unless you're trying to sleep with them.
 
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