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4. Re: Torchlight 2 Free Weekend Jan 9, 2014, 19:27 Suppa7
 
PHJF wrote on Jan 9, 2014, 18:55:
TL2 was especially boring where a majority of the attacks just feel like re-skinned basic attacks.

Really thought they'd pull it off. TL1 was a great start but they utterly failed to move forward in any capacity. A boring game with coop is still a boring game.

TL2 was a lot better then TL1 and it had some improvements over diablo (like pets don't get me wrong), but it had issues. Especially towards the end of the game. After I went through on normal difficulty I had no urge to play it again like I did with diablo 2. The loot design wasn't good, most of the stuff you found in Torchlight was crap or only marginally better. The level requirements on loot were poorly designed, the designers were 'obsessed' with balance to a negative degree. Part of the fun of the original diablo 1 (and Diablo 2 before they patched in all the level req) was twinking your character with overpowered weapons.

Now I don't mind level limited equipment but if you're going to put in level limits then the loot design better be perfected. Remember how many set items in diablo 2 became worthless after they put the level requirements in to stop twinking? So special/set items in diablo 2 juts became worthless. Torchlight 2 never learned from all the stupid shit the devs did with diablo 2.

So it's just lots of little things that the developers didn't notice about diablo and diablo 2. They never really put a lot of effort into researching what made diablo so addictive. Thats why developers tend to get frustrated - they didn't know enough about what made the game a success.

All the ARPG developers are totally missing the fundamental connection between fighting/action games and their combat system because of the isometric camera perspective and tradition blind them when they look at the game as "RPG first" instead of "action game first".

Consider the paladin as a melee class in diablo 2. The melee class in TL2 is exceedingly boring because the developers didn't understand that diablo 2 (whether the original devs of diablo knew it or not) were borrowing heavily from the fighting game genre.

You could take soul-calibur 2 (a swords and shields fighting game) force the fighting game camera to isometric and you'd have a great foundation for a sequel to traditional action RPG's with some minor tweaks. In soul calibur 2 you had dungeons where you took on enemies 1 v 1, if you free'd up the combat system from being locked on a single opponent you'd be setup for a great game.

It took me years to figure out why I didn't like Titan's quest even though I wanted to like it. I knew that technically Iron lore had made almost all the right decisions totally replicating diablo but unconsciously I knew there was something wrong with Titan's quest and I finally found an answer.

Titan's quest by all measures in theory should have been addictive and as successful as diablo. One part of my brain kept telling me "It's almost exactly the same as diablo, so why am I not finding it fun?". So there was something titan's quest didn't replicate from the original series that everyone was missing. I'm sure Iron lore was scratching their heads after the flat response and really slow burn with the sales.

The problem with ARPG's is they never realized the were just fighting games in the vein of Soul calibur with a fixed isometric camera. IT took me the better part of a decade to figure it out. In theory I should have loved titan's quest to pieces, but I got bored of it and the addictiveness factor wasn't there. IT had no replayability. Almost all ARPG's lack the replayability the original d1 and d2 had where we lost weekends to the game without interruption. Where modern ARPG's we can take them or leave them even when they are first released. There's not that 'pull' that really good games have (diablo, civilization, alpha centauri, etc).

This comment was edited on Jan 9, 2014, 20:43.
 
 
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